He's right though. Its not any more impressive than starting a fire in under a second or translating any language on Earth into English or moving at 60 miles an hour. Technology has completely trivialized art. The only time its actually impressive is when a person does it.
Look at your mind set of a fricking caveman. What, you clinging to some idea of gigachad big floppa not using antichrist ai or something? Do you not take in mind that this AI was created by men and also took a lot of time? You take instant translation for granted, imagine how powerfull you could have been if only you could have it like 100 years ago. Going 60 miles was surreal for humans we even thought you can't survive such speeds.
>The only time its actually impressive is when a person does it.
That's crap. What matters is the end result. And AI currently filters 90% of the "artists". And it will get better. Art is no longer a gated community of snobbish autists.
If it establishes a standard it certainly isn't impressive anymore. Manual art can be (but isn't always) impressive simply because anyone can do it. Eventually, AI art (and the people who grow up learning how to use it) will be accessible to everyone - at which point it's definitely not impressive.
It's comparable to having encyclopedic trivia knowledge in an age where anyone can use a search engine from their pocket. Being able to have "the answer" is not impressive at all when you use a machine to do it for you.
Yeah, it's called future anon.
No one gives a frick about being impressive, i am more worried about the societal fallout when machines take over but i am all in about AI doing everything, you will always need a human to clean up the result anyways.
>Luddite Black person
Stop taking medicine and antibiotics, and utilizing advanced medical treatment. It trivializes the natural immune system and micro-organisms.
So what if the immune system can't cure broken bones. It's more impressive when you can just walk off a broken/mangled arm and have it dangle for the rest of your life, not curing yourself of cancer, or suffering lifelong from easily curable diseases.
It's not fear, it's annoyance at the sheer arrogance of people who spam their aiart. It'd be one thing if you simply enjoyed it, no, instead you have to show the whole wide world the thing you generated in around a minute or so.
You are projecting. The people being all "haha artists are finished lol" are a minority and it's usually just a reaction to people going into AI threads just to shitpost about it. You are the one who is arrogant and you're mad when people are just using a neat new tool, don't project that anger onto them.
Not only are you just outright lying about what I've said, but you're using projection and arrogance incorrectly. I wasn't refrencing the baiters, I was refrencing the sheer volume of ai shit being pushed here alone.
The main issue with AI-art is that there is no meaning or purpose behind any of it.
When you see the night watch by Rembrandt you know that every single detail has some meaning or at minimum serves a purpose in the composition, the artist organizing the mise-en-scene. Everything is there for a reason, and even if you don't know the full context you understand that there is some. This gives the artwork depth.
The polar opposite of this is AI artwork. Nothing in the artwork has purpose or meaning behind it, since the AI is not capable of thinking and fundamentally have no concept of any of the things in image they themselves produce. They don't know what "a man" looks like. They recognize the codewords for "man" and through analyzing hundreds of thousands of human made artworks they can produce a visual representation of something that we might say "that looks like a man", but we instinctively known in the same moment that there is no meaning or purpose behind the representation we are looking at.
Don't care. Artists purposely follow trends and build their art style around simplicity and cheap throwaway pieces to ride popular characters. It's all fanart on twitter to advertise Patreon porn. Artists will also refuse to emulate and learn old techniques. Everything is flat now.
With ai we can revive the works of frank frazetta. Artists today have failed to have any ambition, or respect. So we must rely on machines to revive the greats.
I don't think you got my point. Can humans blindly follow trends and produce generic artwork which is completely uninteresting and has no artistic value? Of course, but even in those artworks everything you see is the result of a conscious choice and by default has some meaning or purpose behind it, no matter how banal or bland.
AI art is the marvel slop of visual media, it's functional and can look pretty but that's it. It's like watching Marvel flicks only, because "who cares about narrative, themes and interesting characters, I'm just here for the pretty visuals".
That's fine if that's all you want, but understand why others think AI art is completely uninteresting.
No you're missing the point, and you leap to conclusions without any elaboration.
You immediately say ai is just skip because there's no intention. But that's just incorrect. Besides, there are no artists today capable of doing half the shit people are generating in ai.
Ai can emulate the intention of past artists better than today's crop. Your point is moot.
You call ai junk food but that's ridiculous because artists today don't spend more than a week on a single piece of art because they're slaves to fast paced internet trends. Meanwhile ai art can produced something that could only be possibly after months of effort, all done within minutes, emulating the masters of before. You can't call that marvel slop.
does an artwork get its meaning and purpose only through the creation process? If the same artwork was drawn by a human and generated by an AI, would only one of them have a meaning?
7 months ago
Anonymous
No but these ais do not contain artistic vision in the same way they dont contain knowledge
they make aesthetically pleasing images that inherently lack meaning due to how the process works. People pretend its different with art but a the exact same thing happens when you tell an ai to write you a paper or do your homework for you, these things arent art they just generate images that it thinks you think looks like art.
though they are pretty nice looking from time to time
7 months ago
Anonymous
It's monkey typewriter with filtration so you only see the shit that has recognisable words.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Its not even that original, this is more like taking a bag full of random stamps and depending on the prompt choosing which ones to put on the canvas
7 months ago
Anonymous
Pretty much the same, the monkeys can't put anything on the page other than the letters stamped on the keys, and they have no concept of any of its meaning.
>everything you see is the result of a conscious choice
Completely wrong. Many artist rely on the subconscious, rather than the conscious. Even if they attempted to construct everything consciously it is very unlikely that they would even be able to perceive every single detail in their own art.
Using AI to create patchwork skinsuits of the long-dead masters is no great ambition but a mockery of their talent. You're a husk with no perspective of the work and thought behind it of the artists you think you're venerating or those you're attempting to denigrate.
Pretentious self huffing fart shitters like you are the reason everyone is laughing at doodle drawing homosexuals right now.
Maybe AI will humble them.
>artists don't even try, they just follow trends and make shit art for consoomers >so i'm going to revive great art with even less effort in an even lazier format, and also not learn a thing about "old techniques". the same thing i shat on the artists of today for.
you are either clinically insane and need to be put in a padded room or unplugged because this feels like it was written by a bot. either way this reads like bait.
I don't think you got my point. Can humans blindly follow trends and produce generic artwork which is completely uninteresting and has no artistic value? Of course, but even in those artworks everything you see is the result of a conscious choice and by default has some meaning or purpose behind it, no matter how banal or bland.
AI art is the marvel slop of visual media, it's functional and can look pretty but that's it. It's like watching Marvel flicks only, because "who cares about narrative, themes and interesting characters, I'm just here for the pretty visuals".
That's fine if that's all you want, but understand why others think AI art is completely uninteresting.
No but these ais do not contain artistic vision in the same way they dont contain knowledge
they make aesthetically pleasing images that inherently lack meaning due to how the process works. People pretend its different with art but a the exact same thing happens when you tell an ai to write you a paper or do your homework for you, these things arent art they just generate images that it thinks you think looks like art.
though they are pretty nice looking from time to time
Unfortunately you are right but you can't expect normoids to know or care about art and the "mentality" of producing and appreciating art. Tons of people nowadays in arguments involving AI seems to either pretend to know about art and it's process, or show complete disdain for artists for seemingly no reason (legit no idea where that mentality comes from, maybe it's like american mental illness)
I am an artist myself, aspiring to be a pro, and I'm not some huge anti AI nut like other artists are. In fact I am experimenting with AI now to see if I can use it as reference material for learning purposes. But defending AI under the idea it is just as valid as a human artist is ridiculous. This shit should be a tool for creatives, it has incredible potential for that, but it just ended up as a method for bitter c**ts, techbros and third worlders to hate on real artists.
>Rembrandt
You need to resort to the most known artists to shit over AI when 99% of "artists" this days are people that just draw shit, not artists at all just merchants.
Hence Ai in a few years will kill the mediocre and give true art a second chance, you should be happy.
when do you think we'll finally have graphics that look as good as a well-drawn fantasy painting? i'm thinking it's probably still a couple of decades away.
During the industrial revolution workers tried to destroy the machines in the factories.
In the AI revolution people post negative stuff on Ganker and twitter.
Surely this new strategy will be more effective bro
>only took 2nd post for artpajeet to cry about "stealing ur job!!§§"
If only you spent a quarter of that time improving your art instead of seething against the competition, you wouldn't be so close to be replaced.
fire is obviously quite different in dark souls and there are obviously different types of fire in the games but if you actually object to reffering to it as fire entirely you are just being pendantic
You see literal fire in the same game and it's completely different. Estus is something else, it's never made entirely clear what but it pretty obviously only sort of resembles fire and obviously has totally different properties
when they use words like "the age of fire", "the first flame, "bofire", and in the intro cinematic say "then there was fire" i have no clue why you would feel the need to call it anything other than fire
7 months ago
Anonymous
"Fire" refers to a lot of different things in the game that are all clearly visually different and behave differently
7 months ago
Anonymous
not really, its the fire that ended the age of dragons and the regular fire that dragons breathe which for all we know might just be the same sort of fire
still its fire nonetheless
7 months ago
Anonymous
There's regular fire, the "first flame" that the lord souls were found in and literally created the second age, chaos flame which is unnatural and has lava and weird runic script rising from it, and estus which is slow moving orange ribbons of something that the undead can ingest to repair their bodies. Estus is the only "fire" that doesn't hurt you
7 months ago
Anonymous
not really, its the fire that ended the age of dragons and the regular fire that dragons breathe which for all we know might just be the same sort of fire
still its fire nonetheless
I forgot there's also black flame, which seems to be a pyromancy that uses humanity instead of normal fire. It's completely different from bonfire "fire" and has physical weight to it like the other dark sorceries that are based on the dark soul, which kind of kills the idea that bonfires are just burning humanity
7 months ago
Anonymous
Could be that the bonfires are using humanity as fuel, but dark pyro chucks humanity directly...?
7 months ago
Anonymous
All souls can seemingly be burned, but the method in which they're burned seems to vary a lot because fire isn't a singular thing in this setting
7 months ago
Anonymous
I actually just started a new game, and if you talk to Petrus in Firelink and give him 500 souls he tells you that he's there on a mission to help the thorolund b***h find the art of kindling, and he explicitly says "kindling is the art of feeding bonfires with humanity." He doesn't tell you that if you don't pay him, so it's clearly some kind of Thorolund secret meaning that bonfires don't regularly use humanity as fuel but doing so increases their strength, as we find out by doing it ourselves
7 months ago
Anonymous
>i have no clue why you would feel the need to call it anything other than fire
Because its referring to light, you might also consider translation frick ups, the series are full of them.
You can pinpoint if art is AI generated or not by how generically lit it is. AI art always has this 'perfect' lighting and shading to it. It's also always from above.
You will develop a sense of detecting "AI vibes" sooner or later.
Until then, just assume that every photograph you have never seen before is AI.
Pajeets are going rampant right now and mods don't do shit against the spam.
They aren't.
Soon-to-be-burger-flipper "artists" just have no other argument against AI users, so they resort to racist ad hominem (but without the balls to just say Black person).
... which tell a lot about their famous "creativity".
Estus Flask description from dark souls 1 says that you fill it with "Estus" and that the flask is made from the soul of a fire keeper which tracks since you use fire keeper souls to upgrade them. Presumably you fill them with fire from the bonfire, but the bonfire isn't made of normal fire but instead specifically burning humanity. Fire Keeper soul description also details how each fire keeper is a corporeal manifestation of the bonfire and a vessel for the humanity that is burned at bonfires, and that their souls are "gnawed by infinite humanity".
So Estus is basically the humanity that gets sacrificed at bonfires.
No. There's nothing particularly special about the chosen undead. Even npcs care about harvesting humanity, Lautrec outright mentions using humanity to reverse your hollowing at a bonfire when you first talk to him as a hollow, and he also talks about Rhea being a good source of humanity when she gets lost in the catacombs.
Homeward Bone description also tells us: >Bonfires are fueled by the bones of the Undead
So the humanity doesn't even necessarily have to be offered up, you need to be burning human bones to even make a bonfire in the first place.
So, it’s people?
Yes. They expand on it more deliberately in Dark Souls 3 but even just in Dark Souls 1 alone, disregarding the later games, Humanity was always "the dark soul" mentioned in the intro and the whole crux of the game is the dichotomy of souls/humanity, and the whole working of the bonfire is part of that. Why do you think Humanity even looks the way that it does, or heals you when you use it?
>what distinguishes our humanity from souls??!!11 >the human soul… humanity… is le speshul…
God this lore is gay as frick. It’s basically real life. “Humans are special because we’re human :)”.
Yeah, I get it, Gwyn offered his (light) soul to the “gods” (possibly just uplifting another race), the witch of Izalith had the life soul (quite redundant when souls are already the source of life—until she effectively birthed demonic life—but even Seath already perfected making life), Nito offered his soul to death, and the Pygmy gambled on absolute garbage (humans), waiting for Gwyn’s light/power to fade, and for humans (garbage) to take over. The cycle was apparently stalled out of complete butthurt. Thanks Gwyn.
What’s even gayer is how UNEVEN the four lord souls are. Notice how Seath’s lord soul shard is bigger than that of the four kings? It actually equals Nito’s and Izalith’s by the time of the game. I’m pretty sure Gwyn’s soul was enormous.
Seath's shard being so big makes perfect sense when you consider that both Nito and Izalith are in terrible shape by the time we encounter them with Nito getting his power drained by pinwheel cultists and Izalith fricking everything up and becoming the Bed of Chaos. Meanwhile Seath didn't actually suffer any loss of power at all. If anything he got even stronger with all his magical research and crystal immortality, he just went completely insane doing it. Presumably at the height of their power Gwyn, Nito, and Izalith's souls would've all been fricking gigantic but Gwyn is a burnt crisp who splintered his soul several times and Nito and Izalith are both completely fricked up.
Seath appeared to care more about the nature of crystals and souls than souls themselves. The Primordial Crystal effectively made him the one boss/entity in the entire Souls series that’s impossible to beat/kill without finding the story-critical macguffin object.
You will also notice in the opening cinematic intro that Gwyn’s soul is rather enormous in comparison to Nito’s and the Witch’s. The light and dark souls appear to be polar, one enormously powerful, waning, the other weak, with enormous potential.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah well the opening cinematic also says that Gwyn and his soldiers had to throw a frickton of lightning bolts to deal with the dragons while Nito only had to unleash one ONE O N E (1) miasma of death and destruction so who's stronger now, HUH?
7 months ago
Anonymous
I’m convinced that Seath’s theft of the primordial crystal is what enabled their defeat, along with the changing nature of the world. It is too suspiciously coincidental. Something is there. I’m not convinced lightning was a true weakness, rather than just a weakness. Were there no thunderstorms in the time of the ancient dragons? I highly, highly doubt that. It even appears that Gwyn had forebears. Civilizations like Izalith existed. The ancient dragons may even have been ancient sorcerers themselves if they were the original holders of the primordial crystal (and their stone/crystal themes were brought over to Elden Ring).
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Were there no thunderstorms in the time of the ancient dragons
Probably. As soon as a thunderstorm happened lightning would've struck somewhere and created fire and with fire came disparity and you know how that goes.
7 months ago
Anonymous
All elements can do damage to mineral beings, but it is lighting that is the most effective as it splits stone.
I’d actually argue that the Witch of Izalith is in a much more powerful shape than her original humanoid appearance, given the explosive “”success”” of birthing an entire new bed of life, and her possible fusing with two of her daughters. But she’s clearly just a bug in mentality now.
7 months ago
Anonymous
That's like saying Gwyn is more powerful than before because he "successfully" extended the Age of Fire. Sure, the Witch birthed all the demons, but all that really means for her is that she's a burnt up piece of shit that can't do anything.
7 months ago
Anonymous
She’s a giant plant fire monster that you can’t even attack anon. She’s invulnerable much like Seath, except for her bug core. Much like how Seath can’t be beaten without taking out his crystal phylactery. Both founders of their respective magics are eerily similar, one is just more successful, the other more disastrous.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah except gee Seath can still move around and do shit and even fight you way the frick away from his immortality crystal while the Witch can't do a fricking thing but sit there being a burnt up tree. They are not the same. Seath is objectively superior.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Seath is objectively superior
Well, yes, Seath’s successes are there to contrast with the failures of the Witch of Izalith, and you can safely conclude that Seath would likely have been the Witch’s sorcerous superior even before her demise/change. Probably anyway.
The entire game more or less compares the two, showing Seath’s refined successes in the form of his created life forms and gardens, and maddening insights (we went mad, he didn’t blow himself up), while the Witch’s creations are entirely unintentional and horrifically disastrous.
Of course Seath is her superior. I always wonder how they interacted too.
One is also way at the top of Lordran, the other is also way at the bottom of it. That’s another contrast.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The witch also raped/devolved her magic into something else, while seath advanced/evolved his own.
7 months ago
Anonymous
On the other hand, the Witch's frickup was so catastrophic that Gwyn had to wage an entire war against her demon creations because they were so powerful, while Seath's underlings are all pissants
7 months ago
Anonymous
>while Seath's underlings are all pissants
I think that’s just contrasting the delicate, beautiful, sophisticated, and contained nature of Seath’s creations, while the Witch’s disaster produced chaotic and deformed and hideous creatures that went all over the place.
He (Seath) also somehow gave his serpent men lightning sorceries, possibly created the hydra, and his crystals appear to be alive, or act as some form of cancer or disease, if those poor crystal covered hollows anything to go by.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Literally what the hell can a Capra demon, a Taurus demon, or even a fat frick Asylum demon, do to a bunch of moonlight butterflies bombarding them from hundreds of meters above?
(I’m just being silly and making up silly hypotheticals right now)
7 months ago
Anonymous
Butterflies are dumb bugs and can’t perform battlefield tactics
7 months ago
Anonymous
Wait for them to land to do their little bomb AoE and wail on them like the player does if you don't have any ranged attacks
7 months ago
Anonymous
Taurus demon jump good
7 months ago
Anonymous
Taurus demon jump good
Stray demon/demon firesage also have big magic
7 months ago
Anonymous
Are you aware the demons had an army of thousands of those demons that are boss fights in the game? Theres only a few of them left alive after the war
7 months ago
Anonymous
>he went mad, he didn’t blow himself up
Humanoid cope, they're just mad he stole some of their women. Seath is calmly progressing his plans for true immortality right until he dies and is never shown to act irrationally unlike Logan. The only thing he ever did wrong was job to the Chosen Undead.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Anon. There is nothing wrong with being mad as long as you’re based. Madness and genius go hand-in-hand like peanut butter and grape jam. You see this all over the place in history.
The difference is Logan became a naked b***h trying to emulate the Pale Naked One.
7 months ago
Anonymous
While I'm sure you could land a better fitting definition, Seath is none of these things. Madness is a description made by fools who don't understand his true greatness.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Madness is relative. This is true. If you gave a meerkat human knowledge, it is suddenly insane relative to its own kind.
7 months ago
Anonymous
What happens quo ke when madness is destroyed? Is it gone forever time speaking wisa?
t. SensibleWizard3688
7 months ago
Anonymous
Seath could have easily lived by talking to the chosen undead or putting a pull door infront of his boss arena
He was a dumbass but he did invent magic and his daughter is smokin thats pretty based
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Seath could have easily lived by talking to the chosen undead
He was long insane at that point and we need his soul to open the door to the kiln, he could not have lived
7 months ago
Anonymous
>his daughter
His child is Gwyndolin.
7 months ago
Anonymous
no its priscilla but the point stands either way
7 months ago
Anonymous
>his daughter
The damage youtube has done to the dark souls fanbase is irreparable.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Explain Priscilla and Yorksha then anon.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>putting a pull door infront of his boss arena
If you don't look at this from a meta gameplay perspective, having to get through a bunch of moonlight butterflies and invisible pathways to even get to his crystal is an hard challenge. There's nothing a shitty door could do to stop such a person.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I think he was making a joke about all doors being push ones, so the chosen undead wouldn't know what the frick to do in that case autist kun
7 months ago
Anonymous
>the Witch’s creations are entirely unintentional and horrifically disastrous.
While demons are visually grotesque, in the end Izalith achieved the result she wanted and that was to have a flame outside of the First Flame.
7 months ago
Anonymous
They aren't even all visually grotesque, capra demons and taurus demons are pretty normal looking and they're the most populous of her spawn, the really fricked up ones are her children and the handful of other freaks like Ceaseless Discharge and the Centipede Demon
7 months ago
Anonymous
>the really fricked up ones are her children and the handful of other freaks like Ceaseless Discharge and the Centipede Demon
Because they came into being when Izalith didn't have her Chaos flame fully under her control. It even says it in the lore along the lines of "not yet stable", meaning it became stable eventually.
7 months ago
Anonymous
We literally see her state in the game anon, it never became stable. Her domain became a destroyed, uninhabited volcanic hellhole full of monsters, Izalith is gone by the events of the game, Quelaag and her sister are mutated beyond recognition and slowly dying. Quelaana is the only one that escaped and she lives hiding in the swamp with an invisibility spell cast on her so no one can find her
7 months ago
Anonymous
Whatever happened to quelana?
7 months ago
Anonymous
You find what is implicitly her next to the Fair Lady, along with her pyromancy tome
7 months ago
Anonymous
>We literally see her state in the game anon, it never became stable.
Yes it fricking does. Just shut the frick up with your nonsense. I've already told you that Izalith's tribe is doing fine, they just have undesirable looks.
The aim was to extend the Age of Fire. The Witch wasn't trying to create an age of demons, she explicitly made a massive mistake that resulted in the literal creation of Hell
Her aim was to create a copy of the First Flame. Instead she created a bed of chaotic life. Not what she hoped for but better than failure.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Yes it fricking does.
No it fricking doesn't you autist, the witches all became horrific lava mutants except for Quelana >Her aim was to create a copy of the First Flame
In order to extend the Age of Fire, which she failed at. Her chaos flame did not rekindle the First Flame, which was her express intent. This is the entire point of her character, the First Flame was fading and she tried to use her lord soul to recreate it and failed so cataclysmically that Gwyn had to wage war on her to suppress the hellish horror she accidentally created
7 months ago
Anonymous
>the witches all became horrific lava mutants except for Quelana
Literally wrong, there's still a perfectly normal sister guarding the Bed of Chaos.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Oh yeah the unnamed one that has zero characterization or lore about her, how could I have forgotten. Would you like to tell me which of her other children that are actually part of the story did not become mutant freaks?
7 months ago
Anonymous
I'm just saying you were literally, objectively wrong you stupid homosexual. I'm not even the guy you were arguing with.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I'm literally done debating you on this. It feels like I'm arguing with someone who's lore is ten years out of date.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>UH JUST BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T ACCOMPLISH ANY OF HER GOALS AND DESTROYED HER OWN CIVILIZATION AND MUTATED HER DAUGHTERS AND THE SINGULAR SURVIVING DAUGHTER OF HERS THAT ISN'T INSANE OR ATTACKS YOU ON SIGHT CAUTIONS AGAINST HER MISTAKE EVER HAPPENING AGAIN THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT SHE FAILED
You haven't debated shit. All you've done is post moronic bullshit.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Again, you're lore is ten years out of date.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You're going to get dismissed offhand for linking a video, although having seen it I'll say the only thing that is conclusively proved is that demon society was complex and advanced, but not necessarily that the witch didn't make a mistake or failed.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You're ten years out of date. Get with the program.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>but muh retcons
You're wrong and the witch fricked up
7 months ago
Anonymous
Nearly everyone in the lore community agrees with the idea that Izalith succeeded, except you.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>source: dude trust me/youtube
What did the Witch succeed in? I'm all ears
7 months ago
Anonymous
Stabilizing her Chaos Flame, a twisted duplication of the First Flame.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The flame that reduced her entire realm to a crumbling volcanic ruin inhabited only by aggressive mutated demons and statues? The ruin that she's trapped in as a gigantic fricked up burning tree monster hiding her true form as a pathetic little bug hiding inside it?
7 months ago
Anonymous
So again, having seen the video and since he wont bother to explain his position in his own words, I'll say the argument is that the Witch did have control over the flame for a period of time before some event happened (Hawkshaw argues she was cucked) that caused shit to get fricked up. I don't remember the specifics of the argument so it'll be up to him to use his big boy words to prove your inevitable counterargument wrong.
7 months ago
Anonymous
She had control over fire for a period of time, sure. She invented pyromancy and burned the archtrees down with her daughters, but the frickup came when she tried to use her lord soul to make another first flame, which is explicitly what created chaos and demons. I genuinely don't understand how this guy can argue against that, it's directly described in text in the game
7 months ago
Anonymous
The argument is specifically that the Witch controlled the Chaos Flame.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Which she very obviously did not because Izalith was reduced to an abandoned destroyed volcanic ruin full of demons run amock, she herself transformed into a defenseless little maggot, and her children all turned into mutant lava monsters that live in a state of constant agony
7 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, Hawkshaw's argument is that she controlled the Chaos Flame perfectly fine until tragedy made her unhinged and then all that shit you mentioned happened afterwards. I'm just not going to rewatch the video to remember the justification. None of it really changes the reality that she did indeed fail.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The chaos flame didn't exist until she tried to use her lord soul to recreate the first flame
7 months ago
Anonymous
>The argument is specifically that the Witch controlled the Chaos Flame.
"the fire wasn't yet stable"
From Miyazaki's himself.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Okay, I'm starting to remember now. I think there might've been a part of the video where the phrase "yet stable" implies she did stabilize it at some point. I think Hawkshaw argues that she was pregnant with Ceaseless when she made the flame or something.
7 months ago
Anonymous
And it never became stable, the Witch's children are all in constant pain because of her frickup. Ceaseless Discharge endlessly leaks lava and his sisters crafter the orange charred ring to ease his pain, the Daugher of Chaos spidergirl is the most pitiful and sympathetic character in the game and constantly cries and expresses extreme pain, Quelaag kills undead that approach her to thieve their humanity in order to ease her sister's suffering. The Witch fricked up worse than nearly anyone else in the game and her children suffer for it
7 months ago
Anonymous
I'd say ceaseless is in as bad if not worse state than spider lady. He's horrifically mutated, constantly bleeds an ocean of lava which he's not immune to, the ring that was made to ease his pain is so small compared to him he can't keep hold of it, and he spends his whole life staring at his dead sister a few feet from a hidden death pit that will kill him if he tries to move.
7 months ago
Anonymous
It didn't reduce her realm to a crumbling volcanic ruin, the war with Gwyn resulted in Izalith's realm being ruined and her civilization banished.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>It didn't reduce her realm to a crumbling volcanic ruin
Holy frick you cannot be serious with this shit
7 months ago
Anonymous
that wasnt her goal
her goal was explicitly to rekindle the first flame and extend the age of fire. Which she failed to do on all accounts.
The state of the chaos flame or how advanced demon society was is completely irrelevant to her primary goal.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>that wasnt her goal
Yes it was.
7 months ago
Anonymous
She did it to try to extend the Age of Fire because the First Flame was fading. How are you this dumb? I feel like I'm being trolled
7 months ago
Anonymous
I literally showed you the lore of Izalith's soul and it says right there that she attempted to duplicate the First Flame, not save it.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You literally do not understand the plot of the game and are autistically focused on one sentence. The Wtich of Izalith attempted to duplicate the First Flame because the flame was fading and the Age of Fire was coming to an end. She sought to find a solution, and attempted to use her lord soul to create a new Age of Fire, and she failed apocalyptically. You keep denying this and it's truly bizarre
7 months ago
Anonymous
Yes duplicate it to extend the age of fire and then it went out of control and didnt bring about any kind of age
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Ass pulled theory
7 months ago
Anonymous
It's literally what happened you fricking spastic
7 months ago
Anonymous
>she tried to do A, but INSTEAD got B
yeah clearly that implies her goal was B all along and not the exact fricking opposite
7 months ago
Anonymous
Not him but demon society can be as advanced as it wants, it still doesn't rekindle the first flame which was why the Witch tried her idea in the first place. She wasn't trying to create a new world of chaos and demons, it was literally an accident and it did nothing to stop the fading of the first flame
7 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, I would agree with you. He's trying to argue that demon society isn't all that bad and that most of the sisters supported it and therefore the witch didn't "fail", which becomes a bit subjective. He's just a bit of a dipshit.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The Witch tried to use her lord soul to make another First Flame to extend the Age of Fire. It's described exactly this way in the game, and she failed to make another First Flame or extend the Age of Fire. All she succeeded in doing was creating a fricked up race of mutant demons that threatened the world, and were subsequently quelled by Gwyn. The flame continued to fade as all this happened
7 months ago
Anonymous
There's nothing to debate, you're grasping at straws. The Witch's lore in Dark Souls 1 is crystal clear, she tried to make another first flame to extend the Age of Fire and failed catastrophically, resulting in a war. This is explicitly explained in the game
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Seath can still move around and do shit and even fight you way the frick away from his immortality crystal
He can clearly teleport just like his Channelers (who he sees out of), given that there is literally no other method of entering and leaving that room of his. > while the Witch can't do a fricking thing but sit there being a burnt up tree
To be fair, she is writhing around like a dumbass june bug in the back of the roots. Or like a turtle on its back.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Being a big plant that can't even move from one place where it can't reach anything seems rather pathetic to how the Witch was in the intro, conjuring up titanic fire nukes that reached up to the sky.
7 months ago
Anonymous
If you look closely at that cinematic, those trees are actually a lot fricking smaller than you remember. Also her daughters are all of different heights/sizes. I think the smallest is Quelana.
7 months ago
Anonymous
God I wanna rub my dick all over Quelana's tiny feet
7 months ago
Anonymous
Quelana just can't resist human men.
Are you literally me
7 months ago
Anonymous
I mean, even so. It still seems like a downgrade. Being a mighty pyromancer lady with a superhuman body who can actually move around and interact with the world seems to be far superior to being a wooden Cthulhu at the bottom of the world. (Which can just be killed by any undead who can dodge its slow ass attacks and get to its core)
7 months ago
Anonymous
That’s just Firestorm x8, possibly from a greater range/distance given that they used to be sorcerers.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>given that they used to be sorcerers.
Don't think this is ever stated, they invented pyromancy but to my knowledge they never had anything to do with sorcery. They're totally separate things
7 months ago
Anonymous
…….it’s explicitly stated in all three games that they were once fire sorcerers
were they taught by seath? who can really know for sure
7 months ago
Anonymous
Not interested in 2 or 3's retcons, and in 1 "fire sorcery" is pyromancy, it's completely distinct from regular sorcery
7 months ago
Anonymous
…it’s stated all the way in ds1 lol, and this is from the daughter of chaos you fight before the bed
> Catalyst of the Witch of Izalith of long ago, when her daughters were still flame witches, before they were engulfed by the Chaos Flame. Before the birth of pyromancy, their wands were mediums for sorcery, but knowledge of this flame sorcery has long since vanished."
it’s actually a funny little lore-ish nod to demon’s souls for why they removed fire spells from soul sorceries, turning it into its own thing
7 months ago
Anonymous
Doesn't seem to add up since Seath invented sorcery after the age of archtrees ended, and the Witches were among the first living beings to ever exist
7 months ago
Anonymous
Eh. It appears that four primeval persons were just lucky. Gwyn has forebears, like his uncle Allfather Lloyd, and Izalith appeared to be a civilization all on its own (the xanthous prince is from there).
It’s also possible that Seath taught the Witch of Izalith. We don’t really know what lead up to the war.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Gwyn, Nito, and the Witches all seemed to be more or less isolated from one another, they banded together to defeat the ancient dragons in the age if archtrees but after that it feels like they each kinda just went their own way judging by how distinct and different each of their respective realms are
7 months ago
Anonymous
Seath invented crystal sorcery you homosexual
Logan invented a lot of the basic b***h soul sorcery stuff
7 months ago
Anonymous
He invented crystal sorcery way, way later on in the timeline doofus, he wasn't always an insane crystal covered freak. The Duke's Archives used to be the most respected college in the world until he went nutter butters from trying to figure out how to gain immortality
7 months ago
Anonymous
Considering that the primordial crystal was arguably a bigger prize than his lord soul shard, which he stole from the dragons during or before or after the war, he probably started studying crystal sorcery right away.
7 months ago
Anonymous
He did, the Anor Londo firekeeper tells you he began his research after being granted dukedom and becoming Gwyn's bestie, but also that the Archives were once a respected place of learning before Seath lost his marbles so it doesn't seem to have happened until much later on
7 months ago
Anonymous
You can literally see the witches use fire sorcery in the intro cinematic
Speaking of cinematics, why the frick didnt we get an animated cinematic intro in Elden Ring, when they made like 10 minutes of good looking CGI for trailers? Why not just put all of that in the games intro instead of concept art, the trailer cinematics are literally about the Shattering which Gideon is talking about in the intro anyway... What the frick
7 months ago
Anonymous
They invented pyromancy by raping the nature of fire and making it into a pseudo living thing. Pyromancers are compared to “shamans as well as witches”.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Right, which is separate from sorcery
7 months ago
Anonymous
Pyromancy is a PRODUCT of sorcery. But also probably fire sorcery itself, just raped into a gaygier form.
You also have ‘witch’ gods like Velka who cast miracles through intelligence, or gods like Gwyndolin (possibly taught by Seath of you look at all the sus hints) who cast sorcery through faith.
>Nito getting his power drained by pinwheel cultists
why the frick didn't he do anything about it though
7 months ago
Anonymous
He was sleepy.
>given that they used to be sorcerers.
Don't think this is ever stated, they invented pyromancy but to my knowledge they never had anything to do with sorcery. They're totally separate things
>Before the birth of pyromancy, their wands were mediums for sorcery, but knowledge of this flame sorcery has long since vanished.
Izalith Catalyst description. A couple of pyromancy spells and the gold-hemmed robes also mention Quelana being the originator of pyromancy, which then spread after she taught her first pupil Salaman.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Why did a female teach a male a magic known for being a woman’s thing? Notice how in DS3 you explicitly need a woman’s touch to unlock/learn the magic? Was Salaman a crossdresser?
>Izalith fricking everything up and becoming the Bed of Chaos.
Izalith didn't frick up though, she succeeded. What has done Izalith in was the war with Gwyn that resulted in her civilization being partially ruined. Even in the Demon Ruins there's the demon civilization thriving just before the Demon Firesage, who is effectively their priest.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>she succeeded
No she didn't. Her goal was to address the fading first flame by making a new one to prolong the Age of Fire and instead she turned herself into a tree that shat out a bunch of demons that do absolutely nothing to stall the fading flame.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>No she didn't.
Yes she did. Her success didn't come out as intended but she succeeded. You seem to be under the impression that Izalith was in league with Gwyn after the defeat of the Dragons. Izalith couldn't give a shit about Gwyn. As far as she was concerned, her clan was going to exist outside of the fading of the First Flame.
>Izalith didn't frick up though, she succeeded.
The witch was trying to recreate the first flame, and she failed catastrophically
She did not fail. She succeeded but the end result is not exactly what she intended.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>She did not fail
She literally did, her aim was to reignite the first flame with her lord soul, and she failed to reignite the first flame. She created an explosion of lava and demons, but she did not rekindle the first flame, which was her objective
7 months ago
Anonymous
Izalith's plan was to make a duplicate, only Gwyn truly cared about the First Flame.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The aim was to extend the Age of Fire. The Witch wasn't trying to create an age of demons, she explicitly made a massive mistake that resulted in the literal creation of Hell
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Izalith's plan was to make a duplicate
lol
Izalith plan was to continue the age of fire linking the first flame, stop being dense.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Izalith didn't frick up though, she succeeded.
The witch was trying to recreate the first flame, and she failed catastrophically
"Humanity" is just a word, nothing in the stuff called humanity in DS1 has any particular relation to what "humanity" means IRL except that it can turn a hollowed undead into a fleshy human-looking one.
The description for Pursuers sums it up pretty succinctly, and reflects the black humanity sprite enemies you find in the chasm of the abyss >Sorcery of Manus, Father of the Abyss. Grant a fleeting will to the Dark of humanity, and volley the result. >The will feels envy, or perhaps love, and despite the inevitable trite and tragic ending, the will sees no alternative, and is driven madly towards its target.
You can see the parallel. Might be cheesy, but it's still pretty poetic in its way
this is moronic
DS1 bonfires looked different, and that's because the "fire" was literally some weird viscious material
an estus flask is filled with this fire from the bonfire, which an undead then drinks to heal
btw "estus" comes from "aestus" which literally fricking means HEAT
12 years and loregays still haven't realized how simple this shit is meant to be
This, estus isn't fire and was never supposed to be. Original DaS1 bonfires were slow moving curving strands of orange shit that was meant to be kind of nebulous in nature
Estus is fire, you are a moron absolutely the guy you replied to was saying its fire, learn to read.
You can literally see the fire in the bottle in the image.
That doesn't contradict anything the post says. Bonfire isn't normal fire and you fill the estus with it and drink it. You basically just agreed with him.
this is moronic
DS1 bonfires looked different, and that's because the "fire" was literally some weird viscious material
an estus flask is filled with this fire from the bonfire, which an undead then drinks to heal
btw "estus" comes from "aestus" which literally fricking means HEAT
12 years and loregays still haven't realized how simple this shit is meant to be
>You fricking moron it's not abnormal fire, it's abnormal fire
Given how you can see a bunch of maidens turned into slugs one building away, there must be tons of fricked up experimentation or requirements to get those results. DS3 helps it by having the king trying to turn himself into a dragon and being fricking crazy.
Duke Tseldora in DS2 also went mad and became obsessed with lifeforms and crystals simply from owning the Paledrake Soul. Seath’s mind/intellect may as well be a magical hazard.
Probably the ancient dragons, since it turns you to stone and the only way to "cure" it is to transfer it into another human being who has been turned into a stone receptacle
You know Hawkshaw's schizo grand conspiracy theory? It kinda answers this if you accept it. The basilisks come from Ash Lake (a place obviously associated with the Ancient Dragons) and were brought up to the depths to protect the Gaping Dragon along with the Chaneller. So you could reasonably assume they're related to dragon in some way.
Yeah, that's the whole point of Hawkshaw's schizo theory. Seath crushed the plot against the gods in Ash Lake and Domhnall was the traitor, which is why he knows about Ash Lake and things related to it when nobody else does, except Sieglinde whose mother died as a part of the plot.
True. It is peak schizokino though which makes it entertaining. The evidence for Domhnall being the traitor is very compelling since a good portion of it is cited through the direst words of Miyazaki and his team which is a very rare kind of evidence for Souls theorizing.
The clams also being outside of Seath's crystal is one of the pieces of evidence for the grand conspiracy, or at least Seath's relationship to Ash Lake. There's a lot of curious coincidences if you go down the schizo rabbit hole.
And then he hurled crystal dildos up their tight stone asses, piling their bodies high, as you saw in the opening of the game. No way Seath did that with his strength alone. School shooter vibes, honestly.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Of course not, he needed Gwyn, Nito, and the Witches to start the fight for him and then he came in at the last minute to help finish the job
7 months ago
Anonymous
Wrong. Sorceries are a metaphor for guns. Look at Vinheim’s militant focus.
Jokes aside, I recently read Abyssal Archive, which theorized on Gwyn’s family tree. The argument went that Crossbreed Priscilla is Seath and Velka’s bastard child after Seath cucked Gwynevere and that Gwyn then got his rocks off in the Painted World with Priscilla, which lead to Gwyndolin, who’s 1/4th dragon. His moon affinity and tentacles were inherited from Priscilla. Interesting, if nothing else.
People have been theorizing that Priscilla was Seath's lovechild for over a decade, there isn't really anything solid to suggest it but it seems like the most logical explanation for her existence. The prevailing notion is that Seath fricked Gwynevere before she left Anor Londo and Priscilla was a bastard child left behind after the gods left and Seath lost his mind, and she recused herself to the painted world to live with other undesirables
Pretty definitive then, she's Seath's bastard daughter. The remaining mystery is who the mother is, Gwynevere seems like the most obvious answer but it's never stated
it's a portal that links to miyazaki's lower intestine since he thinks shitting is for lesser beings so he wants to shit directly into player's mouths for sustenance
If he doesn’t like shitting why does he have a headless monster fist a shinobi in Sekiro, or have a literal Dung Eater clean the Erd taint out of a persons anus? Okay that last one was probably Martin, and the former is Japanese folklore (the japs believe the soul is stored in the butt), but he STILL incorporated them, and all too explicitly I might add.
When was the last time you had your humours drained anon
7 months ago
Anonymous
I don't know, should I ask a jap to look up my butthole to check my soul
7 months ago
Anonymous
The soul is unrelated to the humours, you probably have a bile/blood imbalance. See a doctor immediately for leech bloodletting
7 months ago
Anonymous
meanwhile in reality the people you're calling backwards could walk into the woods and find a plant for every ailment while subhumans today rummage through the garbage for food
7 months ago
Anonymous
I didn't call anyone backwards, I'm drawing a parallel to archaic beliefs people had about the nature of the human body >find a plant for every ailment
lmao >subhumans today rummage through the garbage for food
Do you actually think that's a strictly modern problem and no one starved or lived off discarded scraps in antiquity
7 months ago
Anonymous
The wealth of knowledge we've lost from the bloodletters is many more times the intellectual worth of the entire asian pantheon
7 months ago
Anonymous
Maybe if you're going per capita since there are billions of moronic insectoid pajeets and changs, but Japan and to a lesser extent Korea have had some pretty intelligent and innovative people
7 months ago
Anonymous
I mean there's that jap that studied tornadoes
7 months ago
Anonymous
Japs have done a lot to advance electronics and robotics too
7 months ago
Anonymous
who cares about robots
7 months ago
Anonymous
Tons of people, particularly in manufacturing. Robotics are a huge part of what's made production so expedient
7 months ago
Anonymous
eh not nearly everything they've done was things america and europe did in labs 20 years ago.
To their credit they put a fresh coat of paint on it and where all gung ho about applying it to everything they could but thats a different topic.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Actually no they just copy and mass produce things Whites invented
Like cell phones etc, they have huge industries into making these, but White man invented it
Why does Nito come across as the only lord who isn’t an butthole in some way? All he wants is to sleep in his comfy coffin cave and for causality to go along its course. Literally nothing dickish about him. Meanwhile Gwyn is a total butthole.
Because he's dead, and death doesn't give a frick. As loathe as I am to cite DaS2 "lore," the fenito Agdayne in the Undead Crypt had a bit of dialogue that always stuck with me >countless souls rest here, some of them from ages long ago >some were rich, others poor, some wise, some dull >but now, they are all just dead >death is equitable, accepting >we will all one day be welcomed by her embrace
There's a strange sort of comfort in it, and it sums up what I think Nito is pretty well
Seethe sees out of his Channelers six eyes. They ‘channel’ Seath. He put the chosen undead (player) in a library prison that somehow blocked the Lordvessel’s quick travel, with a bonfire in the player’s prison, effectively implying he KNEW the player wouldn’t stop coming for him, and has been spying on them since the church/depths.
He may have acknowledged Logan’s pure and honest appreciation for him, however, since he put the old big hat in the biggest, nicest cell, in front view of his molested women.
The only one seething is mediocre "artists" that wont be able to squeeze any more money from coomers, the real innovative talented artists doesn't give a frick.
Who the frick would give any answer other than Orange Juice, it's clearly fricking orange juice it works like Dead Rising which also features zombies lol.
You could say it's fire juice but that would be gay. Vitamin C for life hahaha
Frickin' ton of them. Nearly any soulslike, 2d soulslikes/metroidvanias, stone shard, arx fatalis, exanima, grim dawn, dark messiah, witcher, even frickin dragon age origins.
So what happened to the demons after ds1? I can't remember if they made an appearance in ds2 but they had a king in ds3 which implied they managed to survive and forge their own path without their maker.
Demons were going to die out now that Izalith was dead. The only thing that makes you a demon is being symbiotic with a bottom feeder creature. They're really just a representation of the crossbreed creatures we find in religions and mythologies.
There's six demons left in DS3
You killing the Bed of Chaos in DS1 effectively doomed them to extinction and you end up finishing all six of those demons off in DS3
>one in undead settlement, by Siegward >one in catacombs, near the mimic chest >the old king boss in ash lake >stone demon on the bridge >two demon princes
That's literally it?
People fear AI art because art itself has no intrinsic value. The debate is more on human artists losing commission and jobs and I think trying to deflect the debate onto the question of "What is art?" is cowardly
aside from the bald fricker that is patches, does anyone get a happy end in the DS series ?
Spidersis and lucatiel broke me
ladderbro was done dirty by fromsoft
I love AI, never has something so malicious been tactfully disguised and placed before crowds of blind enthusiasm. In coming times imagination and creativity will be simply that, imaginary. Ironically, art will plateau because of this and thus so will AI image generation. This is the final nail of stagnation. Now it just needs to be driven in.
Do your part and indulge without concern, eat from the trough.
Firekeeper's bath water
I was going to say pusy juice
It's Fire Keeper urine, dumbasses.
This would be impressive if it wasnt AI slop
Midwits and Luddites fear technology
He's right though. Its not any more impressive than starting a fire in under a second or translating any language on Earth into English or moving at 60 miles an hour. Technology has completely trivialized art. The only time its actually impressive is when a person does it.
Look at your mind set of a fricking caveman. What, you clinging to some idea of gigachad big floppa not using antichrist ai or something? Do you not take in mind that this AI was created by men and also took a lot of time? You take instant translation for granted, imagine how powerfull you could have been if only you could have it like 100 years ago. Going 60 miles was surreal for humans we even thought you can't survive such speeds.
Yes, of course, the work of the people who created such machines is pretty impressive. But using those machines isn't impressive, anybody can do it.
So OP the painting isn't beautiful or what?
the image is appealing, the process of its creation is not impressive even if the process to create the tool used to create the image was
>art is only art when it's made by a biological machine instead of a silicon machine made by a biological machine
Okay
>The only time its actually impressive is when a person does it.
That's crap. What matters is the end result. And AI currently filters 90% of the "artists". And it will get better. Art is no longer a gated community of snobbish autists.
If it establishes a standard it certainly isn't impressive anymore. Manual art can be (but isn't always) impressive simply because anyone can do it. Eventually, AI art (and the people who grow up learning how to use it) will be accessible to everyone - at which point it's definitely not impressive.
It's comparable to having encyclopedic trivia knowledge in an age where anyone can use a search engine from their pocket. Being able to have "the answer" is not impressive at all when you use a machine to do it for you.
Yeah, it's called future anon.
No one gives a frick about being impressive, i am more worried about the societal fallout when machines take over but i am all in about AI doing everything, you will always need a human to clean up the result anyways.
Books used to be valued and impressive, then they became allowed to be owned by everyone.
This is no different.
Any kind of moral argument you want to make is piss in the wind, it's not going to stop because people want it and there is money to be made.
>Luddite Black person
Stop taking medicine and antibiotics, and utilizing advanced medical treatment. It trivializes the natural immune system and micro-organisms.
So what if the immune system can't cure broken bones. It's more impressive when you can just walk off a broken/mangled arm and have it dangle for the rest of your life, not curing yourself of cancer, or suffering lifelong from easily curable diseases.
>he thinks anyone but artists care about how much technical skill a piece of art takes to make
i do fear soulless mass-produced slop,yes
Just feed it humanity
You wouldn't even know what a soul was if you had one
>SLOP EVERYTHING IS SLOP SLOP SLOP
That word is going to lose its meaning someday because it the new trend here
It's not fear, it's annoyance at the sheer arrogance of people who spam their aiart. It'd be one thing if you simply enjoyed it, no, instead you have to show the whole wide world the thing you generated in around a minute or so.
You are projecting. The people being all "haha artists are finished lol" are a minority and it's usually just a reaction to people going into AI threads just to shitpost about it. You are the one who is arrogant and you're mad when people are just using a neat new tool, don't project that anger onto them.
Not only are you just outright lying about what I've said, but you're using projection and arrogance incorrectly. I wasn't refrencing the baiters, I was refrencing the sheer volume of ai shit being pushed here alone.
Drop it your dealing with ai generated responses now
>little piss-baby cries
Checks out
The main issue with AI-art is that there is no meaning or purpose behind any of it.
When you see the night watch by Rembrandt you know that every single detail has some meaning or at minimum serves a purpose in the composition, the artist organizing the mise-en-scene. Everything is there for a reason, and even if you don't know the full context you understand that there is some. This gives the artwork depth.
The polar opposite of this is AI artwork. Nothing in the artwork has purpose or meaning behind it, since the AI is not capable of thinking and fundamentally have no concept of any of the things in image they themselves produce. They don't know what "a man" looks like. They recognize the codewords for "man" and through analyzing hundreds of thousands of human made artworks they can produce a visual representation of something that we might say "that looks like a man", but we instinctively known in the same moment that there is no meaning or purpose behind the representation we are looking at.
Don't care. Artists purposely follow trends and build their art style around simplicity and cheap throwaway pieces to ride popular characters. It's all fanart on twitter to advertise Patreon porn. Artists will also refuse to emulate and learn old techniques. Everything is flat now.
With ai we can revive the works of frank frazetta. Artists today have failed to have any ambition, or respect. So we must rely on machines to revive the greats.
I don't think you got my point. Can humans blindly follow trends and produce generic artwork which is completely uninteresting and has no artistic value? Of course, but even in those artworks everything you see is the result of a conscious choice and by default has some meaning or purpose behind it, no matter how banal or bland.
AI art is the marvel slop of visual media, it's functional and can look pretty but that's it. It's like watching Marvel flicks only, because "who cares about narrative, themes and interesting characters, I'm just here for the pretty visuals".
That's fine if that's all you want, but understand why others think AI art is completely uninteresting.
No you're missing the point, and you leap to conclusions without any elaboration.
You immediately say ai is just skip because there's no intention. But that's just incorrect. Besides, there are no artists today capable of doing half the shit people are generating in ai.
Ai can emulate the intention of past artists better than today's crop. Your point is moot.
You call ai junk food but that's ridiculous because artists today don't spend more than a week on a single piece of art because they're slaves to fast paced internet trends. Meanwhile ai art can produced something that could only be possibly after months of effort, all done within minutes, emulating the masters of before. You can't call that marvel slop.
>t. I have no good arguments so I will compare it to something dogshit to make myself sound better
does an artwork get its meaning and purpose only through the creation process? If the same artwork was drawn by a human and generated by an AI, would only one of them have a meaning?
No but these ais do not contain artistic vision in the same way they dont contain knowledge
they make aesthetically pleasing images that inherently lack meaning due to how the process works. People pretend its different with art but a the exact same thing happens when you tell an ai to write you a paper or do your homework for you, these things arent art they just generate images that it thinks you think looks like art.
though they are pretty nice looking from time to time
It's monkey typewriter with filtration so you only see the shit that has recognisable words.
Its not even that original, this is more like taking a bag full of random stamps and depending on the prompt choosing which ones to put on the canvas
Pretty much the same, the monkeys can't put anything on the page other than the letters stamped on the keys, and they have no concept of any of its meaning.
>everything you see is the result of a conscious choice
Completely wrong. Many artist rely on the subconscious, rather than the conscious. Even if they attempted to construct everything consciously it is very unlikely that they would even be able to perceive every single detail in their own art.
holy shit, is there a dunning kruger for soul?
you are pathetic
Using AI to create patchwork skinsuits of the long-dead masters is no great ambition but a mockery of their talent. You're a husk with no perspective of the work and thought behind it of the artists you think you're venerating or those you're attempting to denigrate.
Pretentious self huffing fart shitters like you are the reason everyone is laughing at doodle drawing homosexuals right now.
Maybe AI will humble them.
>artists don't even try, they just follow trends and make shit art for consoomers
>so i'm going to revive great art with even less effort in an even lazier format, and also not learn a thing about "old techniques". the same thing i shat on the artists of today for.
you are either clinically insane and need to be put in a padded room or unplugged because this feels like it was written by a bot. either way this reads like bait.
>don't care
thanks for letting us know you don't care about art. figures.
Unfortunately you are right but you can't expect normoids to know or care about art and the "mentality" of producing and appreciating art. Tons of people nowadays in arguments involving AI seems to either pretend to know about art and it's process, or show complete disdain for artists for seemingly no reason (legit no idea where that mentality comes from, maybe it's like american mental illness)
I am an artist myself, aspiring to be a pro, and I'm not some huge anti AI nut like other artists are. In fact I am experimenting with AI now to see if I can use it as reference material for learning purposes. But defending AI under the idea it is just as valid as a human artist is ridiculous. This shit should be a tool for creatives, it has incredible potential for that, but it just ended up as a method for bitter c**ts, techbros and third worlders to hate on real artists.
>Rembrandt
You need to resort to the most known artists to shit over AI when 99% of "artists" this days are people that just draw shit, not artists at all just merchants.
Hence Ai in a few years will kill the mediocre and give true art a second chance, you should be happy.
Artistic skill is owned by a tiny % of the population.
AI art is socialized art, everyone can do it.
should a government stop its citizens from using well known chemistry and physics to build an atomic reactor in their basement, anon?
False analogy.
when do you think we'll finally have graphics that look as good as a well-drawn fantasy painting? i'm thinking it's probably still a couple of decades away.
until you look at the chainmail and see it devolve into pixelated noise
During the industrial revolution workers tried to destroy the machines in the factories.
In the AI revolution people post negative stuff on Ganker and twitter.
Surely this new strategy will be more effective bro
>only took 2nd post for artpajeet to cry about "stealing ur job!!§§"
If only you spent a quarter of that time improving your art instead of seething against the competition, you wouldn't be so close to be replaced.
Fire, dumbass
this, you refill it at bonfires, the thing that brought humans life was the first flame, gwyn lives in a kiln
how is it even a question
Bonfires aren't fire
fire is obviously quite different in dark souls and there are obviously different types of fire in the games but if you actually object to reffering to it as fire entirely you are just being pendantic
You see literal fire in the same game and it's completely different. Estus is something else, it's never made entirely clear what but it pretty obviously only sort of resembles fire and obviously has totally different properties
when they use words like "the age of fire", "the first flame, "bofire", and in the intro cinematic say "then there was fire" i have no clue why you would feel the need to call it anything other than fire
"Fire" refers to a lot of different things in the game that are all clearly visually different and behave differently
not really, its the fire that ended the age of dragons and the regular fire that dragons breathe which for all we know might just be the same sort of fire
still its fire nonetheless
There's regular fire, the "first flame" that the lord souls were found in and literally created the second age, chaos flame which is unnatural and has lava and weird runic script rising from it, and estus which is slow moving orange ribbons of something that the undead can ingest to repair their bodies. Estus is the only "fire" that doesn't hurt you
I forgot there's also black flame, which seems to be a pyromancy that uses humanity instead of normal fire. It's completely different from bonfire "fire" and has physical weight to it like the other dark sorceries that are based on the dark soul, which kind of kills the idea that bonfires are just burning humanity
Could be that the bonfires are using humanity as fuel, but dark pyro chucks humanity directly...?
All souls can seemingly be burned, but the method in which they're burned seems to vary a lot because fire isn't a singular thing in this setting
I actually just started a new game, and if you talk to Petrus in Firelink and give him 500 souls he tells you that he's there on a mission to help the thorolund b***h find the art of kindling, and he explicitly says "kindling is the art of feeding bonfires with humanity." He doesn't tell you that if you don't pay him, so it's clearly some kind of Thorolund secret meaning that bonfires don't regularly use humanity as fuel but doing so increases their strength, as we find out by doing it ourselves
>i have no clue why you would feel the need to call it anything other than fire
Because its referring to light, you might also consider translation frick ups, the series are full of them.
sunny D
Is this legit or AI? Artist name?
Obviously AI.
people gotta get better at spotting AI and fast
or maybe you can all stay moronic and ill get a job as professional ai spotter
Why does it matter
You can pinpoint if art is AI generated or not by how generically lit it is. AI art always has this 'perfect' lighting and shading to it. It's also always from above.
You will develop a sense of detecting "AI vibes" sooner or later.
Until then, just assume that every photograph you have never seen before is AI.
Pajeets are going rampant right now and mods don't do shit against the spam.
>Pajeets are going rampant right now
why? why specifically indians, and why are they using AI to shit up multiple boards
They aren't.
Soon-to-be-burger-flipper "artists" just have no other argument against AI users, so they resort to racist ad hominem (but without the balls to just say Black person).
... which tell a lot about their famous "creativity".
One day we will play a game with these graphics and aesthetics
Salty coins and milk
Estus Flask description from dark souls 1 says that you fill it with "Estus" and that the flask is made from the soul of a fire keeper which tracks since you use fire keeper souls to upgrade them. Presumably you fill them with fire from the bonfire, but the bonfire isn't made of normal fire but instead specifically burning humanity. Fire Keeper soul description also details how each fire keeper is a corporeal manifestation of the bonfire and a vessel for the humanity that is burned at bonfires, and that their souls are "gnawed by infinite humanity".
So Estus is basically the humanity that gets sacrificed at bonfires.
but who is willing to give up humanity at a bonfire? wouldn't it only be the chosen undead that's capable?
No. There's nothing particularly special about the chosen undead. Even npcs care about harvesting humanity, Lautrec outright mentions using humanity to reverse your hollowing at a bonfire when you first talk to him as a hollow, and he also talks about Rhea being a good source of humanity when she gets lost in the catacombs.
Homeward Bone description also tells us:
>Bonfires are fueled by the bones of the Undead
So the humanity doesn't even necessarily have to be offered up, you need to be burning human bones to even make a bonfire in the first place.
Yes. They expand on it more deliberately in Dark Souls 3 but even just in Dark Souls 1 alone, disregarding the later games, Humanity was always "the dark soul" mentioned in the intro and the whole crux of the game is the dichotomy of souls/humanity, and the whole working of the bonfire is part of that. Why do you think Humanity even looks the way that it does, or heals you when you use it?
wouldn't that imply that there are undead in the bonfire just endlessly burning in agony? seems fricked up
Welcome to Dark Souls.
>DS2 secondary
>what distinguishes our humanity from souls??!!11
>the human soul… humanity… is le speshul…
God this lore is gay as frick. It’s basically real life. “Humans are special because we’re human :)”.
Yeah, I get it, Gwyn offered his (light) soul to the “gods” (possibly just uplifting another race), the witch of Izalith had the life soul (quite redundant when souls are already the source of life—until she effectively birthed demonic life—but even Seath already perfected making life), Nito offered his soul to death, and the Pygmy gambled on absolute garbage (humans), waiting for Gwyn’s light/power to fade, and for humans (garbage) to take over. The cycle was apparently stalled out of complete butthurt. Thanks Gwyn.
What’s even gayer is how UNEVEN the four lord souls are. Notice how Seath’s lord soul shard is bigger than that of the four kings? It actually equals Nito’s and Izalith’s by the time of the game. I’m pretty sure Gwyn’s soul was enormous.
Seath's shard being so big makes perfect sense when you consider that both Nito and Izalith are in terrible shape by the time we encounter them with Nito getting his power drained by pinwheel cultists and Izalith fricking everything up and becoming the Bed of Chaos. Meanwhile Seath didn't actually suffer any loss of power at all. If anything he got even stronger with all his magical research and crystal immortality, he just went completely insane doing it. Presumably at the height of their power Gwyn, Nito, and Izalith's souls would've all been fricking gigantic but Gwyn is a burnt crisp who splintered his soul several times and Nito and Izalith are both completely fricked up.
Seath appeared to care more about the nature of crystals and souls than souls themselves. The Primordial Crystal effectively made him the one boss/entity in the entire Souls series that’s impossible to beat/kill without finding the story-critical macguffin object.
You will also notice in the opening cinematic intro that Gwyn’s soul is rather enormous in comparison to Nito’s and the Witch’s. The light and dark souls appear to be polar, one enormously powerful, waning, the other weak, with enormous potential.
Yeah well the opening cinematic also says that Gwyn and his soldiers had to throw a frickton of lightning bolts to deal with the dragons while Nito only had to unleash one ONE O N E (1) miasma of death and destruction so who's stronger now, HUH?
I’m convinced that Seath’s theft of the primordial crystal is what enabled their defeat, along with the changing nature of the world. It is too suspiciously coincidental. Something is there. I’m not convinced lightning was a true weakness, rather than just a weakness. Were there no thunderstorms in the time of the ancient dragons? I highly, highly doubt that. It even appears that Gwyn had forebears. Civilizations like Izalith existed. The ancient dragons may even have been ancient sorcerers themselves if they were the original holders of the primordial crystal (and their stone/crystal themes were brought over to Elden Ring).
>Were there no thunderstorms in the time of the ancient dragons
Probably. As soon as a thunderstorm happened lightning would've struck somewhere and created fire and with fire came disparity and you know how that goes.
All elements can do damage to mineral beings, but it is lighting that is the most effective as it splits stone.
I’d actually argue that the Witch of Izalith is in a much more powerful shape than her original humanoid appearance, given the explosive “”success”” of birthing an entire new bed of life, and her possible fusing with two of her daughters. But she’s clearly just a bug in mentality now.
That's like saying Gwyn is more powerful than before because he "successfully" extended the Age of Fire. Sure, the Witch birthed all the demons, but all that really means for her is that she's a burnt up piece of shit that can't do anything.
She’s a giant plant fire monster that you can’t even attack anon. She’s invulnerable much like Seath, except for her bug core. Much like how Seath can’t be beaten without taking out his crystal phylactery. Both founders of their respective magics are eerily similar, one is just more successful, the other more disastrous.
Yeah except gee Seath can still move around and do shit and even fight you way the frick away from his immortality crystal while the Witch can't do a fricking thing but sit there being a burnt up tree. They are not the same. Seath is objectively superior.
>Seath is objectively superior
Well, yes, Seath’s successes are there to contrast with the failures of the Witch of Izalith, and you can safely conclude that Seath would likely have been the Witch’s sorcerous superior even before her demise/change. Probably anyway.
The entire game more or less compares the two, showing Seath’s refined successes in the form of his created life forms and gardens, and maddening insights (we went mad, he didn’t blow himself up), while the Witch’s creations are entirely unintentional and horrifically disastrous.
Of course Seath is her superior. I always wonder how they interacted too.
One is also way at the top of Lordran, the other is also way at the bottom of it. That’s another contrast.
The witch also raped/devolved her magic into something else, while seath advanced/evolved his own.
On the other hand, the Witch's frickup was so catastrophic that Gwyn had to wage an entire war against her demon creations because they were so powerful, while Seath's underlings are all pissants
>while Seath's underlings are all pissants
I think that’s just contrasting the delicate, beautiful, sophisticated, and contained nature of Seath’s creations, while the Witch’s disaster produced chaotic and deformed and hideous creatures that went all over the place.
He (Seath) also somehow gave his serpent men lightning sorceries, possibly created the hydra, and his crystals appear to be alive, or act as some form of cancer or disease, if those poor crystal covered hollows anything to go by.
Literally what the hell can a Capra demon, a Taurus demon, or even a fat frick Asylum demon, do to a bunch of moonlight butterflies bombarding them from hundreds of meters above?
(I’m just being silly and making up silly hypotheticals right now)
Butterflies are dumb bugs and can’t perform battlefield tactics
Wait for them to land to do their little bomb AoE and wail on them like the player does if you don't have any ranged attacks
Taurus demon jump good
Stray demon/demon firesage also have big magic
Are you aware the demons had an army of thousands of those demons that are boss fights in the game? Theres only a few of them left alive after the war
>he went mad, he didn’t blow himself up
Humanoid cope, they're just mad he stole some of their women. Seath is calmly progressing his plans for true immortality right until he dies and is never shown to act irrationally unlike Logan. The only thing he ever did wrong was job to the Chosen Undead.
Anon. There is nothing wrong with being mad as long as you’re based. Madness and genius go hand-in-hand like peanut butter and grape jam. You see this all over the place in history.
The difference is Logan became a naked b***h trying to emulate the Pale Naked One.
While I'm sure you could land a better fitting definition, Seath is none of these things. Madness is a description made by fools who don't understand his true greatness.
Madness is relative. This is true. If you gave a meerkat human knowledge, it is suddenly insane relative to its own kind.
What happens quo ke when madness is destroyed? Is it gone forever time speaking wisa?
t. SensibleWizard3688
Seath could have easily lived by talking to the chosen undead or putting a pull door infront of his boss arena
He was a dumbass but he did invent magic and his daughter is smokin thats pretty based
>Seath could have easily lived by talking to the chosen undead
He was long insane at that point and we need his soul to open the door to the kiln, he could not have lived
>his daughter
His child is Gwyndolin.
no its priscilla but the point stands either way
>his daughter
The damage youtube has done to the dark souls fanbase is irreparable.
Explain Priscilla and Yorksha then anon.
>putting a pull door infront of his boss arena
If you don't look at this from a meta gameplay perspective, having to get through a bunch of moonlight butterflies and invisible pathways to even get to his crystal is an hard challenge. There's nothing a shitty door could do to stop such a person.
I think he was making a joke about all doors being push ones, so the chosen undead wouldn't know what the frick to do in that case autist kun
>the Witch’s creations are entirely unintentional and horrifically disastrous.
While demons are visually grotesque, in the end Izalith achieved the result she wanted and that was to have a flame outside of the First Flame.
They aren't even all visually grotesque, capra demons and taurus demons are pretty normal looking and they're the most populous of her spawn, the really fricked up ones are her children and the handful of other freaks like Ceaseless Discharge and the Centipede Demon
>the really fricked up ones are her children and the handful of other freaks like Ceaseless Discharge and the Centipede Demon
Because they came into being when Izalith didn't have her Chaos flame fully under her control. It even says it in the lore along the lines of "not yet stable", meaning it became stable eventually.
We literally see her state in the game anon, it never became stable. Her domain became a destroyed, uninhabited volcanic hellhole full of monsters, Izalith is gone by the events of the game, Quelaag and her sister are mutated beyond recognition and slowly dying. Quelaana is the only one that escaped and she lives hiding in the swamp with an invisibility spell cast on her so no one can find her
Whatever happened to quelana?
You find what is implicitly her next to the Fair Lady, along with her pyromancy tome
>We literally see her state in the game anon, it never became stable.
Yes it fricking does. Just shut the frick up with your nonsense. I've already told you that Izalith's tribe is doing fine, they just have undesirable looks.
Her aim was to create a copy of the First Flame. Instead she created a bed of chaotic life. Not what she hoped for but better than failure.
>Yes it fricking does.
No it fricking doesn't you autist, the witches all became horrific lava mutants except for Quelana
>Her aim was to create a copy of the First Flame
In order to extend the Age of Fire, which she failed at. Her chaos flame did not rekindle the First Flame, which was her express intent. This is the entire point of her character, the First Flame was fading and she tried to use her lord soul to recreate it and failed so cataclysmically that Gwyn had to wage war on her to suppress the hellish horror she accidentally created
>the witches all became horrific lava mutants except for Quelana
Literally wrong, there's still a perfectly normal sister guarding the Bed of Chaos.
Oh yeah the unnamed one that has zero characterization or lore about her, how could I have forgotten. Would you like to tell me which of her other children that are actually part of the story did not become mutant freaks?
I'm just saying you were literally, objectively wrong you stupid homosexual. I'm not even the guy you were arguing with.
I'm literally done debating you on this. It feels like I'm arguing with someone who's lore is ten years out of date.
>UH JUST BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T ACCOMPLISH ANY OF HER GOALS AND DESTROYED HER OWN CIVILIZATION AND MUTATED HER DAUGHTERS AND THE SINGULAR SURVIVING DAUGHTER OF HERS THAT ISN'T INSANE OR ATTACKS YOU ON SIGHT CAUTIONS AGAINST HER MISTAKE EVER HAPPENING AGAIN THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT SHE FAILED
You haven't debated shit. All you've done is post moronic bullshit.
Again, you're lore is ten years out of date.
You're going to get dismissed offhand for linking a video, although having seen it I'll say the only thing that is conclusively proved is that demon society was complex and advanced, but not necessarily that the witch didn't make a mistake or failed.
You're ten years out of date. Get with the program.
>but muh retcons
You're wrong and the witch fricked up
Nearly everyone in the lore community agrees with the idea that Izalith succeeded, except you.
>source: dude trust me/youtube
What did the Witch succeed in? I'm all ears
Stabilizing her Chaos Flame, a twisted duplication of the First Flame.
The flame that reduced her entire realm to a crumbling volcanic ruin inhabited only by aggressive mutated demons and statues? The ruin that she's trapped in as a gigantic fricked up burning tree monster hiding her true form as a pathetic little bug hiding inside it?
So again, having seen the video and since he wont bother to explain his position in his own words, I'll say the argument is that the Witch did have control over the flame for a period of time before some event happened (Hawkshaw argues she was cucked) that caused shit to get fricked up. I don't remember the specifics of the argument so it'll be up to him to use his big boy words to prove your inevitable counterargument wrong.
She had control over fire for a period of time, sure. She invented pyromancy and burned the archtrees down with her daughters, but the frickup came when she tried to use her lord soul to make another first flame, which is explicitly what created chaos and demons. I genuinely don't understand how this guy can argue against that, it's directly described in text in the game
The argument is specifically that the Witch controlled the Chaos Flame.
Which she very obviously did not because Izalith was reduced to an abandoned destroyed volcanic ruin full of demons run amock, she herself transformed into a defenseless little maggot, and her children all turned into mutant lava monsters that live in a state of constant agony
Yeah, Hawkshaw's argument is that she controlled the Chaos Flame perfectly fine until tragedy made her unhinged and then all that shit you mentioned happened afterwards. I'm just not going to rewatch the video to remember the justification. None of it really changes the reality that she did indeed fail.
The chaos flame didn't exist until she tried to use her lord soul to recreate the first flame
>The argument is specifically that the Witch controlled the Chaos Flame.
"the fire wasn't yet stable"
From Miyazaki's himself.
Okay, I'm starting to remember now. I think there might've been a part of the video where the phrase "yet stable" implies she did stabilize it at some point. I think Hawkshaw argues that she was pregnant with Ceaseless when she made the flame or something.
And it never became stable, the Witch's children are all in constant pain because of her frickup. Ceaseless Discharge endlessly leaks lava and his sisters crafter the orange charred ring to ease his pain, the Daugher of Chaos spidergirl is the most pitiful and sympathetic character in the game and constantly cries and expresses extreme pain, Quelaag kills undead that approach her to thieve their humanity in order to ease her sister's suffering. The Witch fricked up worse than nearly anyone else in the game and her children suffer for it
I'd say ceaseless is in as bad if not worse state than spider lady. He's horrifically mutated, constantly bleeds an ocean of lava which he's not immune to, the ring that was made to ease his pain is so small compared to him he can't keep hold of it, and he spends his whole life staring at his dead sister a few feet from a hidden death pit that will kill him if he tries to move.
It didn't reduce her realm to a crumbling volcanic ruin, the war with Gwyn resulted in Izalith's realm being ruined and her civilization banished.
>It didn't reduce her realm to a crumbling volcanic ruin
Holy frick you cannot be serious with this shit
that wasnt her goal
her goal was explicitly to rekindle the first flame and extend the age of fire. Which she failed to do on all accounts.
The state of the chaos flame or how advanced demon society was is completely irrelevant to her primary goal.
>that wasnt her goal
Yes it was.
She did it to try to extend the Age of Fire because the First Flame was fading. How are you this dumb? I feel like I'm being trolled
I literally showed you the lore of Izalith's soul and it says right there that she attempted to duplicate the First Flame, not save it.
You literally do not understand the plot of the game and are autistically focused on one sentence. The Wtich of Izalith attempted to duplicate the First Flame because the flame was fading and the Age of Fire was coming to an end. She sought to find a solution, and attempted to use her lord soul to create a new Age of Fire, and she failed apocalyptically. You keep denying this and it's truly bizarre
Yes duplicate it to extend the age of fire and then it went out of control and didnt bring about any kind of age
>Ass pulled theory
It's literally what happened you fricking spastic
>she tried to do A, but INSTEAD got B
yeah clearly that implies her goal was B all along and not the exact fricking opposite
Not him but demon society can be as advanced as it wants, it still doesn't rekindle the first flame which was why the Witch tried her idea in the first place. She wasn't trying to create a new world of chaos and demons, it was literally an accident and it did nothing to stop the fading of the first flame
Yeah, I would agree with you. He's trying to argue that demon society isn't all that bad and that most of the sisters supported it and therefore the witch didn't "fail", which becomes a bit subjective. He's just a bit of a dipshit.
The Witch tried to use her lord soul to make another First Flame to extend the Age of Fire. It's described exactly this way in the game, and she failed to make another First Flame or extend the Age of Fire. All she succeeded in doing was creating a fricked up race of mutant demons that threatened the world, and were subsequently quelled by Gwyn. The flame continued to fade as all this happened
There's nothing to debate, you're grasping at straws. The Witch's lore in Dark Souls 1 is crystal clear, she tried to make another first flame to extend the Age of Fire and failed catastrophically, resulting in a war. This is explicitly explained in the game
>Seath can still move around and do shit and even fight you way the frick away from his immortality crystal
He can clearly teleport just like his Channelers (who he sees out of), given that there is literally no other method of entering and leaving that room of his.
> while the Witch can't do a fricking thing but sit there being a burnt up tree
To be fair, she is writhing around like a dumbass june bug in the back of the roots. Or like a turtle on its back.
Being a big plant that can't even move from one place where it can't reach anything seems rather pathetic to how the Witch was in the intro, conjuring up titanic fire nukes that reached up to the sky.
If you look closely at that cinematic, those trees are actually a lot fricking smaller than you remember. Also her daughters are all of different heights/sizes. I think the smallest is Quelana.
God I wanna rub my dick all over Quelana's tiny feet
Are you literally me
I mean, even so. It still seems like a downgrade. Being a mighty pyromancer lady with a superhuman body who can actually move around and interact with the world seems to be far superior to being a wooden Cthulhu at the bottom of the world. (Which can just be killed by any undead who can dodge its slow ass attacks and get to its core)
That’s just Firestorm x8, possibly from a greater range/distance given that they used to be sorcerers.
>given that they used to be sorcerers.
Don't think this is ever stated, they invented pyromancy but to my knowledge they never had anything to do with sorcery. They're totally separate things
…….it’s explicitly stated in all three games that they were once fire sorcerers
were they taught by seath? who can really know for sure
Not interested in 2 or 3's retcons, and in 1 "fire sorcery" is pyromancy, it's completely distinct from regular sorcery
…it’s stated all the way in ds1 lol, and this is from the daughter of chaos you fight before the bed
> Catalyst of the Witch of Izalith of long ago, when her daughters were still flame witches, before they were engulfed by the Chaos Flame. Before the birth of pyromancy, their wands were mediums for sorcery, but knowledge of this flame sorcery has long since vanished."
it’s actually a funny little lore-ish nod to demon’s souls for why they removed fire spells from soul sorceries, turning it into its own thing
Doesn't seem to add up since Seath invented sorcery after the age of archtrees ended, and the Witches were among the first living beings to ever exist
Eh. It appears that four primeval persons were just lucky. Gwyn has forebears, like his uncle Allfather Lloyd, and Izalith appeared to be a civilization all on its own (the xanthous prince is from there).
It’s also possible that Seath taught the Witch of Izalith. We don’t really know what lead up to the war.
Gwyn, Nito, and the Witches all seemed to be more or less isolated from one another, they banded together to defeat the ancient dragons in the age if archtrees but after that it feels like they each kinda just went their own way judging by how distinct and different each of their respective realms are
Seath invented crystal sorcery you homosexual
Logan invented a lot of the basic b***h soul sorcery stuff
He invented crystal sorcery way, way later on in the timeline doofus, he wasn't always an insane crystal covered freak. The Duke's Archives used to be the most respected college in the world until he went nutter butters from trying to figure out how to gain immortality
Considering that the primordial crystal was arguably a bigger prize than his lord soul shard, which he stole from the dragons during or before or after the war, he probably started studying crystal sorcery right away.
He did, the Anor Londo firekeeper tells you he began his research after being granted dukedom and becoming Gwyn's bestie, but also that the Archives were once a respected place of learning before Seath lost his marbles so it doesn't seem to have happened until much later on
You can literally see the witches use fire sorcery in the intro cinematic
Speaking of cinematics, why the frick didnt we get an animated cinematic intro in Elden Ring, when they made like 10 minutes of good looking CGI for trailers? Why not just put all of that in the games intro instead of concept art, the trailer cinematics are literally about the Shattering which Gideon is talking about in the intro anyway... What the frick
They invented pyromancy by raping the nature of fire and making it into a pseudo living thing. Pyromancers are compared to “shamans as well as witches”.
Right, which is separate from sorcery
Pyromancy is a PRODUCT of sorcery. But also probably fire sorcery itself, just raped into a gaygier form.
You also have ‘witch’ gods like Velka who cast miracles through intelligence, or gods like Gwyndolin (possibly taught by Seath of you look at all the sus hints) who cast sorcery through faith.
It’s all sorcery.
sorcery is seath's creation
>Nito getting his power drained by pinwheel cultists
why the frick didn't he do anything about it though
He was sleepy.
>Before the birth of pyromancy, their wands were mediums for sorcery, but knowledge of this flame sorcery has long since vanished.
Izalith Catalyst description. A couple of pyromancy spells and the gold-hemmed robes also mention Quelana being the originator of pyromancy, which then spread after she taught her first pupil Salaman.
Why did a female teach a male a magic known for being a woman’s thing? Notice how in DS3 you explicitly need a woman’s touch to unlock/learn the magic? Was Salaman a crossdresser?
Quelana just can't resist human men.
>Izalith fricking everything up and becoming the Bed of Chaos.
Izalith didn't frick up though, she succeeded. What has done Izalith in was the war with Gwyn that resulted in her civilization being partially ruined. Even in the Demon Ruins there's the demon civilization thriving just before the Demon Firesage, who is effectively their priest.
>she succeeded
No she didn't. Her goal was to address the fading first flame by making a new one to prolong the Age of Fire and instead she turned herself into a tree that shat out a bunch of demons that do absolutely nothing to stall the fading flame.
>No she didn't.
Yes she did. Her success didn't come out as intended but she succeeded. You seem to be under the impression that Izalith was in league with Gwyn after the defeat of the Dragons. Izalith couldn't give a shit about Gwyn. As far as she was concerned, her clan was going to exist outside of the fading of the First Flame.
She did not fail. She succeeded but the end result is not exactly what she intended.
>She did not fail
She literally did, her aim was to reignite the first flame with her lord soul, and she failed to reignite the first flame. She created an explosion of lava and demons, but she did not rekindle the first flame, which was her objective
Izalith's plan was to make a duplicate, only Gwyn truly cared about the First Flame.
The aim was to extend the Age of Fire. The Witch wasn't trying to create an age of demons, she explicitly made a massive mistake that resulted in the literal creation of Hell
>Izalith's plan was to make a duplicate
lol
Izalith plan was to continue the age of fire linking the first flame, stop being dense.
>Izalith didn't frick up though, she succeeded.
The witch was trying to recreate the first flame, and she failed catastrophically
>“Humans are special because we’re human :)”.
How is that any different than "Gods are special because they're gods"?
"Humanity" is just a word, nothing in the stuff called humanity in DS1 has any particular relation to what "humanity" means IRL except that it can turn a hollowed undead into a fleshy human-looking one.
The description for Pursuers sums it up pretty succinctly, and reflects the black humanity sprite enemies you find in the chasm of the abyss
>Sorcery of Manus, Father of the Abyss. Grant a fleeting will to the Dark of humanity, and volley the result.
>The will feels envy, or perhaps love, and despite the inevitable trite and tragic ending, the will sees no alternative, and is driven madly towards its target.
You can see the parallel. Might be cheesy, but it's still pretty poetic in its way
Why do human effigies in DS2 not heal you
Because they are effigies and not humanity.
That's a vagronde.
The fire keepers, infinite humanity and it's in their name.
So, it’s people?
>estus green
this is moronic
DS1 bonfires looked different, and that's because the "fire" was literally some weird viscious material
an estus flask is filled with this fire from the bonfire, which an undead then drinks to heal
btw "estus" comes from "aestus" which literally fricking means HEAT
12 years and loregays still haven't realized how simple this shit is meant to be
This, estus isn't fire and was never supposed to be. Original DaS1 bonfires were slow moving curving strands of orange shit that was meant to be kind of nebulous in nature
Estus is fire, you are a moron absolutely the guy you replied to was saying its fire, learn to read.
You can literally see the fire in the bottle in the image.
That doesn't contradict anything the post says. Bonfire isn't normal fire and you fill the estus with it and drink it. You basically just agreed with him.
You just repeated what he said while acting like you disagreed, lol wut
Why don't you say "makes sense"? Why do you say tracks? Is it because you're a heroin junkie?
>You fricking moron it's not abnormal fire, it's abnormal fire
It's bottled fire smart guy.
Bit it's better to call it Sunny D.
Fanta
I hate what they've done to orange fanta
Gourd seeds. Did you not play Sekiro?!?!
damn AI looking good
Liquid fire aka vodka. ou were playing as rushit zigger all along
Just like stalker
>Drink vodka
>Become immune to radiation
Can anyone make more ultra-real dark souls ai stuff? I fricking love it
Meant to be Anor Londo. Close enough, I guess.
Combination of Demon Area and Tomb of the Giants.
Anyway, enough ai slop.
Thats cool as shit. Thanks anons. I'll cherish them forever.
It is the fire from the bonfire my guy
What's so madness-inducing about crystal magic anyway? Fricking Logan lost his mind in ten seconds after reading Seath's scribblings.
I think it has something to do with reflections in the crystals… Or perhaps he merely looked at Seath’s dirty Pisaca notes.
Something something the forbidden secrets of immortality
Seath's crystals also curse you so it may have something to do with that
It's probably the first given how much "Immortality bad (or at least actively striving for it)" and "Stasis bad" come up in Miyazaki's works.
It may also literally just be crystals infecting your mind like syphilis or a tumor, since the crystals seem to be spreading like a fungus
Given how you can see a bunch of maidens turned into slugs one building away, there must be tons of fricked up experimentation or requirements to get those results. DS3 helps it by having the king trying to turn himself into a dragon and being fricking crazy.
Duke Tseldora in DS2 also went mad and became obsessed with lifeforms and crystals simply from owning the Paledrake Soul. Seath’s mind/intellect may as well be a magical hazard.
>king trying to turn himself into a dragon
Estrus
no
Pure life-fire.
Have you praised the sun today, Anon?
aborted human fetuses.
Okay. Is curse shit from the basilisks / eyes of death, or the ancient dragons like Seath’s White Dragon Breath spell says?
Are basilisks related to dragons? Why do they have testicular eye sacks on their heads?
Probably the ancient dragons, since it turns you to stone and the only way to "cure" it is to transfer it into another human being who has been turned into a stone receptacle
You know Hawkshaw's schizo grand conspiracy theory? It kinda answers this if you accept it. The basilisks come from Ash Lake (a place obviously associated with the Ancient Dragons) and were brought up to the depths to protect the Gaping Dragon along with the Chaneller. So you could reasonably assume they're related to dragon in some way.
Channelers are Seath's underlings though
Yeah, that's the whole point of Hawkshaw's schizo theory. Seath crushed the plot against the gods in Ash Lake and Domhnall was the traitor, which is why he knows about Ash Lake and things related to it when nobody else does, except Sieglinde whose mother died as a part of the plot.
Sounds like a lot more headcanon than the story allows for
True. It is peak schizokino though which makes it entertaining. The evidence for Domhnall being the traitor is very compelling since a good portion of it is cited through the direst words of Miyazaki and his team which is a very rare kind of evidence for Souls theorizing.
What's the schizo grand conspiracy?
Those crab things from Ash Lake are also in his cave lair. Maybe they’re to remind him of home?
>crab
Clam*
They also drop purging stones
The clams also being outside of Seath's crystal is one of the pieces of evidence for the grand conspiracy, or at least Seath's relationship to Ash Lake. There's a lot of curious coincidences if you go down the schizo rabbit hole.
I mean he is an ancient dragon, he was just the loser dweeb one that the other dragons gave swirlies to and shoved into lockers
And then he hurled crystal dildos up their tight stone asses, piling their bodies high, as you saw in the opening of the game. No way Seath did that with his strength alone. School shooter vibes, honestly.
Of course not, he needed Gwyn, Nito, and the Witches to start the fight for him and then he came in at the last minute to help finish the job
Wrong. Sorceries are a metaphor for guns. Look at Vinheim’s militant focus.
Estus Cum
That's Cinnabon frosting
Gwyn and Seath were gay lovers
Gwyndolin is their love child
Gay lovers can't have kids even in fantasy settings.
Seath appears to be pregnant in his concept art :^)
Pregnant with crystals
Anyone ever stated in game that Seath is male?
Jokes aside, I recently read Abyssal Archive, which theorized on Gwyn’s family tree. The argument went that Crossbreed Priscilla is Seath and Velka’s bastard child after Seath cucked Gwynevere and that Gwyn then got his rocks off in the Painted World with Priscilla, which lead to Gwyndolin, who’s 1/4th dragon. His moon affinity and tentacles were inherited from Priscilla. Interesting, if nothing else.
People have been theorizing that Priscilla was Seath's lovechild for over a decade, there isn't really anything solid to suggest it but it seems like the most logical explanation for her existence. The prevailing notion is that Seath fricked Gwynevere before she left Anor Londo and Priscilla was a bastard child left behind after the gods left and Seath lost his mind, and she recused herself to the painted world to live with other undesirables
Her soul in japanese describes her has half white dragon the only other time white dragon is ever mentioned is in relation to seath
Pretty definitive then, she's Seath's bastard daughter. The remaining mystery is who the mother is, Gwynevere seems like the most obvious answer but it's never stated
it's a portal that links to miyazaki's lower intestine since he thinks shitting is for lesser beings so he wants to shit directly into player's mouths for sustenance
If he doesn’t like shitting why does he have a headless monster fist a shinobi in Sekiro, or have a literal Dung Eater clean the Erd taint out of a persons anus? Okay that last one was probably Martin, and the former is Japanese folklore (the japs believe the soul is stored in the butt), but he STILL incorporated them, and all too explicitly I might add.
>the japs believe the soul is stored in the butt
just when I thought my opinion on them couldn't get any lower
I mean we used to think when we ate food it went to the liver and was turned into blood
that's basically what happens
When was the last time you had your humours drained anon
I don't know, should I ask a jap to look up my butthole to check my soul
The soul is unrelated to the humours, you probably have a bile/blood imbalance. See a doctor immediately for leech bloodletting
meanwhile in reality the people you're calling backwards could walk into the woods and find a plant for every ailment while subhumans today rummage through the garbage for food
I didn't call anyone backwards, I'm drawing a parallel to archaic beliefs people had about the nature of the human body
>find a plant for every ailment
lmao
>subhumans today rummage through the garbage for food
Do you actually think that's a strictly modern problem and no one starved or lived off discarded scraps in antiquity
The wealth of knowledge we've lost from the bloodletters is many more times the intellectual worth of the entire asian pantheon
Maybe if you're going per capita since there are billions of moronic insectoid pajeets and changs, but Japan and to a lesser extent Korea have had some pretty intelligent and innovative people
I mean there's that jap that studied tornadoes
Japs have done a lot to advance electronics and robotics too
who cares about robots
Tons of people, particularly in manufacturing. Robotics are a huge part of what's made production so expedient
eh not nearly everything they've done was things america and europe did in labs 20 years ago.
To their credit they put a fresh coat of paint on it and where all gung ho about applying it to everything they could but thats a different topic.
Actually no they just copy and mass produce things Whites invented
Like cell phones etc, they have huge industries into making these, but White man invented it
Oh look the Soulskino hating schizo woke up, well time for another 16 hours of this brown mutt seething about god tier games
Why does Nito come across as the only lord who isn’t an butthole in some way? All he wants is to sleep in his comfy coffin cave and for causality to go along its course. Literally nothing dickish about him. Meanwhile Gwyn is a total butthole.
>All he wants is to sleep in his cave
this is every boss in fromsoft history by the way
Because he's dead, and death doesn't give a frick. As loathe as I am to cite DaS2 "lore," the fenito Agdayne in the Undead Crypt had a bit of dialogue that always stuck with me
>countless souls rest here, some of them from ages long ago
>some were rich, others poor, some wise, some dull
>but now, they are all just dead
>death is equitable, accepting
>we will all one day be welcomed by her embrace
There's a strange sort of comfort in it, and it sums up what I think Nito is pretty well
Sun-infused horse urine.
Netflix adaptation of Dark Souls when?
>SEETHE the Scaless
>betrays dragons because he's SEETHING over his lack of scales and immortality
amazing
>Seethe starting seething because his friend Cope the Scaleful told him to cope
Yes it’s funny. But Elden Ring’s incel/simp virgin focus is even funnier. LOL YOUR MAIDENLESS
>Maidenless on a Friday night? God you're pathetic
Seethe sees out of his Channelers six eyes. They ‘channel’ Seath. He put the chosen undead (player) in a library prison that somehow blocked the Lordvessel’s quick travel, with a bonfire in the player’s prison, effectively implying he KNEW the player wouldn’t stop coming for him, and has been spying on them since the church/depths.
He may have acknowledged Logan’s pure and honest appreciation for him, however, since he put the old big hat in the biggest, nicest cell, in front view of his molested women.
>in front view of his molested women.
Are all of the pisaca women?
Yes. Some less deserving than others.
Doesn't look anything like it lol, looks asian
AI SH(ART)
You will never have real talent, keep seething
The only people who are seething are the artists getting btfo by me typing a sentence
AI had already surpassed the likes of Botticelli, Vermeer, Rembrandt, and Andy Warhol. It's unironically ogre.
The only one seething is mediocre "artists" that wont be able to squeeze any more money from coomers, the real innovative talented artists doesn't give a frick.
Don't use Power to shitpost, homosexual
Aw, gonna cry?
Who the frick would give any answer other than Orange Juice, it's clearly fricking orange juice it works like Dead Rising which also features zombies lol.
You could say it's fire juice but that would be gay. Vitamin C for life hahaha
i assume estus is derived from the latin word aestus which means fire
That armor is epic
post the sunny d dark souls 1 video
I'd rather post a good one
?si=GhoYP5We5ljw0bL5
what game to play for the dark fantasy feel?
Frickin' ton of them. Nearly any soulslike, 2d soulslikes/metroidvanias, stone shard, arx fatalis, exanima, grim dawn, dark messiah, witcher, even frickin dragon age origins.
Drakan
Lmaoooo
None of those have that "it" that Dark Souls 1 has
There's just an unparalleled amount of SOVL to this game
piss
I think it tastes like cinnamon tea
>those israeli looking dudes
So what happened to the demons after ds1? I can't remember if they made an appearance in ds2 but they had a king in ds3 which implied they managed to survive and forge their own path without their maker.
Literally doesn't matter, DS2/3 aren't canon
Demons were going to die out now that Izalith was dead. The only thing that makes you a demon is being symbiotic with a bottom feeder creature. They're really just a representation of the crossbreed creatures we find in religions and mythologies.
There's six demons left in DS3
You killing the Bed of Chaos in DS1 effectively doomed them to extinction and you end up finishing all six of those demons off in DS3
>one in undead settlement, by Siegward
>one in catacombs, near the mimic chest
>the old king boss in ash lake
>stone demon on the bridge
>two demon princes
That's literally it?
Yes, but it's literally the end of all things, so if you count all the corpses which should be relatively recent, they're still pretty populous.
>What is Estus made of
the devs never got that far. lol. lmao.
They did, its explained in the game, its flame
I'm literally done showing you homosexuals that are ten years out of date when it comes to the lore.
Capra demon
Tfw no Capra demon bf
Capra and taurus demons are fricking hot
You won’t survive the Taurus dick, is the only difference/problem.
I can't take it inside me but I can sure jerk him off and cuddle with his huge fluffy bovine muscles afterward
>check the thread
>nobody yet posted that art of DaS2 firekeeper filling the flask straight from the source
cowards
>DaS2
Not canon
cope
you know all of them do that and dragon bawd is just the one depraved enough to do it openly
estusgen
I occasionally wonder what Seath thought of the Witch’s attempt at duplicating the First Flame.
Did he laugh when he heard she exploded?
sunny D and rum
yum yum
Probably fire?
Fire from the first flame? Does that sound right?
Estrus.
piss
Look it up. They didn't make up that word. It's Latin for "burning". It's the essence of fire.
cum
People fear AI art because art itself has no intrinsic value. The debate is more on human artists losing commission and jobs and I think trying to deflect the debate onto the question of "What is art?" is cowardly
femboy cum
>tfw no demon titty knight
aborted baby spinal cord fluid, same stuff that keeps billionaires alive so long
Fanta
literal fire in a bottle
>What is Estus made of
It's generated by an AI
It's bottled bonfire.
Of fire, are you dumb?
She desires even the last drop of it.
aside from the bald fricker that is patches, does anyone get a happy end in the DS series ?
Spidersis and lucatiel broke me
ladderbro was done dirty by fromsoft
ROLLINGGGG
Agdayne is literally me
Agdayne down to a fricking T, mainly the hair and drinking shittons of tea
Requsting a stipulation added to this. All anons that identify with agdayne are secretly gay.
I love AI, never has something so malicious been tactfully disguised and placed before crowds of blind enthusiasm. In coming times imagination and creativity will be simply that, imaginary. Ironically, art will plateau because of this and thus so will AI image generation. This is the final nail of stagnation. Now it just needs to be driven in.
Do your part and indulge without concern, eat from the trough.
It is made out of U and I.