Probably some of your provincial clergymen have a few wives/concubines too, and the ones from the rest of Europe got jealous/complained to the Pope.
After all it's one thing for a servant of God to have a secret wive, and wholly another to have several of them.
The only source for Lilith as Adam's wife is the Alphabet of Ben Sira from the 8th-11th century. Before that, she is mentioned in the Talmud as a demon.
The only source for Lilith as Adam's wife is the Alphabet of Ben Sira from the 8th-11th century. Before that, she is mentioned in the Talmud as a demon.
Nope, not in the Old Testament or new. It’s not against any rules, some of the Israelite kings had multiple wives, but over time it became culturally accepted to only have one wife, probably from the Romans or something, and eventually that got morphed into a hardcore christian rule
Med vs nord shit is gay and israeli. Usually perpetrated by North Africans claiming to be “meds” even though when people say “med” we exclusively mean Mediterranean EUROPEANS
1 month ago
Anonymous
It's definitely one of the more obvious D&C tactics and I don't think 've ever seen an argument about it that was in good faith.
polygamy and civilization are mutually exclusive
it was figured out thousands of years ago that if a privileged class holds multiple wives (by attracting them through their wealth), a militant class of single men emerges that have 0 evolutionary incentive not to ape out and encourage societal collapse or betray their tribe
thus polygamy tends to be a societal taboo the more advanced a civilization is
even those at the absolute top are expected to only have 1 legitimate wife, even if they fool around outside of marriage
Yeah, and it was ended by Arabic incels who were so angry about having their women stolen by the richer and more masculine Turks that they allied with the British, the enemies of the world.
single men weren't incels when there were prostitutes available, which was 99% of human history
one woman can easily satisfy lust of 10+ men
some men would be upset but that's what war was for
in Greece men were only allowed to marry after finishing military service and many men died for "their tribe" before even having a chance for legal marriage
polygamy and civilization are mutually exclusive
it was figured out thousands of years ago that if a privileged class holds multiple wives (by attracting them through their wealth), a militant class of single men emerges that have 0 evolutionary incentive not to ape out and encourage societal collapse or betray their tribe
thus polygamy tends to be a societal taboo the more advanced a civilization is
even those at the absolute top are expected to only have 1 legitimate wife, even if they fool around outside of marriage
The extent to which Romans were the manlet incel army conquering Europe powered by sheer virgin rage is sadly unappreciated by both history and the strategy games based on it.
You could buy yourself a bunch of slaves you could frick(women or men alike because Rome was such a tolerant and progressive society) as long as you had enough money, which imo is way better than a bunch of concubines competing against each other.
Extrapolation that women are temptresses to sin and so clerics should cloister themselves apart to stay pious. While I'm sure there were chaste monks, the amount of satires from the period about priests placing their 8 year old bastard sons in charge of a church would lead me to believe it was more difficult in practice to abstain for earthly pleasures
It was something that the Gregorian Reforms absolutely tried to smash, since there were a number of officially married priests, and, while it did work in the short term, it only later resurfaced as mistresses and "adopted orphans" brought in by clergy.
>Does it actually say anywhere that you can't have multiple wives in the bible?
No. In fact several highly notable and pious figures in the bible are directly awarded with multiple wives by God himself, and several instances explicitly make clear that if your brother dies you must take his wife as your own, then after you impregnate her you name the first kid with her after your brother so his name carries on.
Several of the israeli revolts against the Roman empire were literally motivated by the Romans trying to ban polygamy lmao
Most Christians don't actually read the bible so what is or isn't acceptable changes depending on the time and particular type of christianity regardless of what the bible says.
Despite what morons the don't actually read the Bible say, in the new testament you find various instances of how a husband (singular) and a wife (singular) should carry they marriage in a holy way. >but le king! >but le ancient custom
Kind of, yeah. The Bible essentially says that all sex is immoral, but that you can't be expected to restrain entirely. So the Bible advises us to take a single wife and moderate our impulses.
From 1 Corinthians 7:1-2 >Now for the matters you wrote about: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.” But since sexual immorality is occurring, each man should have sexual relations with his own wife, and each woman with her own husband.
The Bible also defines "one wife" as a requirement for being a Christian leader, such as in 1 Tim 3:2 >A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
Multiple wives is defined as greedy: >Deu 17:17 Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away: neither shall he greatly multiply to himself silver and gold.
It's actually a little vaguer than you would think, but it's hard to read all of the verses together and not get the obvious implication that you are meant to limit to one wife.
Jacob, also known as Israel, got both Rachel and Leah as wives and God never had a problem with it. That being said, Jacob only wanted the one wife, Rachel, but got tricked into consumating his marriage with Leah. Becuase Jacob didn't really love Leah like he did Rachel, he made the latter's womb barren and the first's womb fertile. Not once does God mention that he dislikes the fact that Jacob had to wives, but God does prefer that the husband of multiple women have love to distribute to them all equivalently. This begs the question: what is marriage according to God? Remember how I said Jacob got tricked into marrying Leah? How does a man get tricked into marrying a different woman? Sex. In the eys of God, it is when a man and a woman, with or without a worldly ceremony, become one (literally) and are, therefore, married. Thus, when Jacob unkowningly had sex with Leah because the room was too dark to see in, he married Leah even though the ceremony was supposedely for his marriage with Rachel. Essentially, all women you have sex with are technically married to you in the eyes of God unless she had already married another man before you. To the furthest extreme, Solomon had, according to the Bible, seven hundred wives. all as part of his reward concerning his promise to great wealth given to him by God. If polygamy was sinful, it would be very strange why it was a reward to Solomon by God.
All in all, the Bible isn't against polygamy as long as all members of the marriage are treated appropriately as wives. Ironically, Solomon fell from grace because of his wives, but not because of the whole number of them, but because among them some were foreigners, and like any foolish man, decides to listen to his foreign wives and began to follow their idolatry instead of asserting his authority over them and chastising them for attempting to corrupt him intentionally or not.
Fun fact, this was actually a huge problem IRL, to the point Irish priests had "Priestly Concubines" with 10 ladies
But since Ireland was so Isolated, this really never came up until the Normans arrived
I don’t know how it was in the rest of Europe but french kings always had one wife and many mistresses, so it was just like polygamy except not, and the church didn’t really care
The only difference with actual polygamy was that only a son born from the queen could claim the throne
Not quite, here is Martin Luther's thoughts on the matter: >I confess that I cannot forbid a person to marry several wives, for it does not contradict the Scripture. If a man wishes to marry more than one wife he should be asked whether he is satisfied in his conscience that he may do so in accordance with the word of God. In such a case the civil authority has nothing to do in the matter (De Wette II, 459, 329-330).
I would say the fact that Jesus calls remarriage adultery is a good sign from the bible that having multiple wives in the new covenant (Matthew 19) is not permissible. Also, early Christians such as Tertullian, Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Augustine, etc. all condemned polygamy.
>Jesus calls remarriage adultery
I can go on a schizo rant that would get me called an incel loser virgin by the worst part of the internet and even I think that's going too far. What even is this.
This is because marriage cannot be undone by man. So even if a divorce takes place, you have only changed legal status, not your actual spiritual reality. It is a covenant between a man and a woman to God.
So if you marry someone and she turns out to be evil you are just fricked on both this earth and spiritually forever?
Well damn, now I feel even more sorry for my uncle
Remarriage being adultery has absolutely nothing to do with polygamy you moron. If a marriage is permanent and consecrated in the eyes of god, you can't divorce somebody and marry someone else, that doesn't mean you can't have multiple wives who are all properly consecrated and permanently bound together in the eyes of god. Muslims also frown on divorce, they're still in favor of Polygamy.
Jesus is saying that if two people "divorce" and then go on to start fricking other people, it's still adultery because their marriage was never dissolved in the eyes of god. Marriage is forever, no take-backsies. But if you lawfully marry multiple women in the eyes of god and don't try divorcing any of them, nothing in the Old or New testament says jack shit about that.
In fricking GENESIS, LITERALLY THE CORE BOOK OF EVERY ABRAHAMIC RELIGION, God directly rewards Leah with another child after she consents to letting Jacob take her siser Rachel as a second wife.
The bible doesn't need to condemn polygamy for people to logically understand it's a bad idea.
You already see with modern dating that women all try to date up. If you make polygamy legal then the top10% of men will just marry 50% of the women.
90% of you guys don't even have one wife. Why do you think polygamy would somehow benifit you?
No, the actual injustice is not being allowed to arrange yourself a marriage with a 10 year old girl like our forefathers did.
i actually think the church of that time is misrepresented in the game, in the 10th century europe still had many barbaric customs from their pagan ancestors
He’s Irish
Probably some of your provincial clergymen have a few wives/concubines too, and the ones from the rest of Europe got jealous/complained to the Pope.
After all it's one thing for a servant of God to have a secret wive, and wholly another to have several of them.
Does it actually say anywhere that you can't have multiple wives in the bible?
Adam had Lilith and Eve.
The only source for Lilith as Adam's wife is the Alphabet of Ben Sira from the 8th-11th century. Before that, she is mentioned in the Talmud as a demon.
Stop liking evil girls
No.
I understand the female attraction to male serial killers now
men are shameless hypocrites
who are those girls
Stop watching anime.
Nope, not in the Old Testament or new. It’s not against any rules, some of the Israelite kings had multiple wives, but over time it became culturally accepted to only have one wife, probably from the Romans or something, and eventually that got morphed into a hardcore christian rule
No, this is a cultural matter not a religious matter. Came out of Roman beliefs on marriage.
>noooo you can't have a harem you stinky barbarians that's unfair to us manlet incels!
Why were Romoids like this?
Perhaps if the stinky barbarians had spent more time studying military logistics and less with their wives, they could have dictated their own laws.
medlet cope
Med vs nord shit is gay and israeli. Usually perpetrated by North Africans claiming to be “meds” even though when people say “med” we exclusively mean Mediterranean EUROPEANS
It's definitely one of the more obvious D&C tactics and I don't think 've ever seen an argument about it that was in good faith.
illyria was also conquered by germanic tribes though
chariots are gay tho
what is dark ages
polygamy and civilization are mutually exclusive
it was figured out thousands of years ago that if a privileged class holds multiple wives (by attracting them through their wealth), a militant class of single men emerges that have 0 evolutionary incentive not to ape out and encourage societal collapse or betray their tribe
thus polygamy tends to be a societal taboo the more advanced a civilization is
even those at the absolute top are expected to only have 1 legitimate wife, even if they fool around outside of marriage
The Ottoman Empire lasted for 623 years.
Yeah, and it was ended by Arabic incels who were so angry about having their women stolen by the richer and more masculine Turks that they allied with the British, the enemies of the world.
they also had legalized brother slaying for succession
Ottomans were a parasitic Empire. And yes I don't count them as civilization.
All Empires are parasitic by their very nature as Empires.
Everything we enjoy today can be attributed to the Roman, Mongol and British Empires so I disagree but this is not the place for that discussion.
>British
Literally the most evil empire in human history.
You are speaking their evil language and eating the fruits of empire right now. stfu
fruits so harsh and bitter
nonsense
in Europe Greeks were first to discover many things
and there was lot of things created outside Europe
We have the Romans and British to thank for globohomo
Don't forget the biggest ally ever: America.
we have the bongoloids to thank for amerimutts
good morning sir
Unironically what have mongols done that wasn't destroying things and traumatizing entire cultures
>traumatizing
Go back to
they brought chinese fireworks along the silk road into Europe
Why do you have an image trying to justify being mindless saved?
single men weren't incels when there were prostitutes available, which was 99% of human history
one woman can easily satisfy lust of 10+ men
some men would be upset but that's what war was for
in Greece men were only allowed to marry after finishing military service and many men died for "their tribe" before even having a chance for legal marriage
>one woman can easily satisfy lust of 10+ men
But can 10+ men satisfy the lust of a single woman?
Anon don't project your mother on the internet, please
But how else can I use my super wide, telescopic projector?
The extent to which Romans were the manlet incel army conquering Europe powered by sheer virgin rage is sadly unappreciated by both history and the strategy games based on it.
You could have infinite slavewives as long as you could afford and mantain them.
Like in Islam tradition.
You could buy yourself a bunch of slaves you could frick(women or men alike because Rome was such a tolerant and progressive society) as long as you had enough money, which imo is way better than a bunch of concubines competing against each other.
It says you're not to have multiple wives if you're a preacher or a deacon IIRC
Extrapolation that women are temptresses to sin and so clerics should cloister themselves apart to stay pious. While I'm sure there were chaste monks, the amount of satires from the period about priests placing their 8 year old bastard sons in charge of a church would lead me to believe it was more difficult in practice to abstain for earthly pleasures
It was something that the Gregorian Reforms absolutely tried to smash, since there were a number of officially married priests, and, while it did work in the short term, it only later resurfaced as mistresses and "adopted orphans" brought in by clergy.
>Does it actually say anywhere that you can't have multiple wives in the bible?
No. In fact several highly notable and pious figures in the bible are directly awarded with multiple wives by God himself, and several instances explicitly make clear that if your brother dies you must take his wife as your own, then after you impregnate her you name the first kid with her after your brother so his name carries on.
Several of the israeli revolts against the Roman empire were literally motivated by the Romans trying to ban polygamy lmao
Most Christians don't actually read the bible so what is or isn't acceptable changes depending on the time and particular type of christianity regardless of what the bible says.
Despite what morons the don't actually read the Bible say, in the new testament you find various instances of how a husband (singular) and a wife (singular) should carry they marriage in a holy way.
>but le king!
>but le ancient custom
Jesus also said there are no husbands and wives in Heaven, but only brothers and sisters, so he's hardly an authority on the sanctity of marriage.
>The King
>The ancient custom
Yes.
Kind of, yeah. The Bible essentially says that all sex is immoral, but that you can't be expected to restrain entirely. So the Bible advises us to take a single wife and moderate our impulses.
From 1 Corinthians 7:1-2
>Now for the matters you wrote about: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.” But since sexual immorality is occurring, each man should have sexual relations with his own wife, and each woman with her own husband.
The Bible also defines "one wife" as a requirement for being a Christian leader, such as in 1 Tim 3:2
>A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
Multiple wives is defined as greedy:
>Deu 17:17 Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away: neither shall he greatly multiply to himself silver and gold.
It's actually a little vaguer than you would think, but it's hard to read all of the verses together and not get the obvious implication that you are meant to limit to one wife.
>The Bible essentially says that all sex is immoral
>Be fruitful and multiply
Literally the first thing told to humans is to frick moar.
>"The Bible says"
>in the collection of letters written by a Roman who never even met Jesus
Jacob, also known as Israel, got both Rachel and Leah as wives and God never had a problem with it. That being said, Jacob only wanted the one wife, Rachel, but got tricked into consumating his marriage with Leah. Becuase Jacob didn't really love Leah like he did Rachel, he made the latter's womb barren and the first's womb fertile. Not once does God mention that he dislikes the fact that Jacob had to wives, but God does prefer that the husband of multiple women have love to distribute to them all equivalently. This begs the question: what is marriage according to God? Remember how I said Jacob got tricked into marrying Leah? How does a man get tricked into marrying a different woman? Sex. In the eys of God, it is when a man and a woman, with or without a worldly ceremony, become one (literally) and are, therefore, married. Thus, when Jacob unkowningly had sex with Leah because the room was too dark to see in, he married Leah even though the ceremony was supposedely for his marriage with Rachel. Essentially, all women you have sex with are technically married to you in the eyes of God unless she had already married another man before you. To the furthest extreme, Solomon had, according to the Bible, seven hundred wives. all as part of his reward concerning his promise to great wealth given to him by God. If polygamy was sinful, it would be very strange why it was a reward to Solomon by God.
All in all, the Bible isn't against polygamy as long as all members of the marriage are treated appropriately as wives. Ironically, Solomon fell from grace because of his wives, but not because of the whole number of them, but because among them some were foreigners, and like any foolish man, decides to listen to his foreign wives and began to follow their idolatry instead of asserting his authority over them and chastising them for attempting to corrupt him intentionally or not.
Fun fact, this was actually a huge problem IRL, to the point Irish priests had "Priestly Concubines" with 10 ladies
But since Ireland was so Isolated, this really never came up until the Normans arrived
No, never, it's actually a Greco-Roman thing. israelites only banned polygamy in 10th-11th century.
What the bible says is irrelevant, the church says one wife and the church wrote the bible.
>What the bible says is irrelevant
Heresy! Burn the bastard!
That's why I choosed to be a muslim in CK3, that way I can have as many wifes as I want. ma'a salama
I don’t know how it was in the rest of Europe but french kings always had one wife and many mistresses, so it was just like polygamy except not, and the church didn’t really care
The only difference with actual polygamy was that only a son born from the queen could claim the throne
Not quite, here is Martin Luther's thoughts on the matter:
>I confess that I cannot forbid a person to marry several wives, for it does not contradict the Scripture. If a man wishes to marry more than one wife he should be asked whether he is satisfied in his conscience that he may do so in accordance with the word of God. In such a case the civil authority has nothing to do in the matter (De Wette II, 459, 329-330).
I would say the fact that Jesus calls remarriage adultery is a good sign from the bible that having multiple wives in the new covenant (Matthew 19) is not permissible. Also, early Christians such as Tertullian, Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Augustine, etc. all condemned polygamy.
meant for
>Jesus calls remarriage adultery
I can go on a schizo rant that would get me called an incel loser virgin by the worst part of the internet and even I think that's going too far. What even is this.
This is because marriage cannot be undone by man. So even if a divorce takes place, you have only changed legal status, not your actual spiritual reality. It is a covenant between a man and a woman to God.
So if you marry someone and she turns out to be evil you are just fricked on both this earth and spiritually forever?
Well damn, now I feel even more sorry for my uncle
No your uncle just has to say the magic words to Rabbi israelitesus on his deathbed and he will be forgiven.
That relates to divorce though, not marrying while married.
Remarriage being adultery has absolutely nothing to do with polygamy you moron. If a marriage is permanent and consecrated in the eyes of god, you can't divorce somebody and marry someone else, that doesn't mean you can't have multiple wives who are all properly consecrated and permanently bound together in the eyes of god. Muslims also frown on divorce, they're still in favor of Polygamy.
Jesus is saying that if two people "divorce" and then go on to start fricking other people, it's still adultery because their marriage was never dissolved in the eyes of god. Marriage is forever, no take-backsies. But if you lawfully marry multiple women in the eyes of god and don't try divorcing any of them, nothing in the Old or New testament says jack shit about that.
In fricking GENESIS, LITERALLY THE CORE BOOK OF EVERY ABRAHAMIC RELIGION, God directly rewards Leah with another child after she consents to letting Jacob take her siser Rachel as a second wife.
Martin Luther was a gay moron.
seething cathocuck love to see it
The bible doesn't need to condemn polygamy for people to logically understand it's a bad idea.
You already see with modern dating that women all try to date up. If you make polygamy legal then the top10% of men will just marry 50% of the women.
90% of you guys don't even have one wife. Why do you think polygamy would somehow benifit you?
No, the actual injustice is not being allowed to arrange yourself a marriage with a 10 year old girl like our forefathers did.
>the top10% of men will just marry 50% of the women.
Why do you think they'd want to deal with all those b***hes?
Why does the Italian fear the Irish so much?
yet priests themselves had harems, unofficially
i actually think the church of that time is misrepresented in the game, in the 10th century europe still had many barbaric customs from their pagan ancestors
>thinking that's going to stop me from cucking every king, duke, earl, and emperor in diplomatic range.