trick room is a move not a mechanic. people refuse to grind for bottle caps and mints and ability patches so why would that change with rusty bottlecaps? cheaters and competitive players should want it removed so it increases "accessibility"
I'm not against the candy, mind. But the trend has been making it easier and easier, especially with the 4iv dittos. Were talking fringe cases at best with a lot of the complaints. It isnt gen 3 anymore.
They literally did you fricking Black person. It’s completely effortless to max IVs. EV training is also effortless now because of encounter power lv 1 making literally localize all encounters in an area to 1 pokemon. You can remember any one move except for egg moves. You can pass egg moves to any one pokemon without actually making eggs as many times as you want. Every consumable and held item is now easily purchaseable.
You can make any pokemon even your starter perfect now extremely east”y, almost insultingly so.
The excuses these subhumans are giving is that they don’t want to play the game they just want to use an editor and sliders to build the pokemon they want to use because they can’t be assed to play or buy the games.
Nobody wants to grind out 100 hours for the chance at getting a 0IV mon. Definitely not when it's PLA and you can only check the IVs after transferring it. So if your Enamorus isn't perfect, you have to restart the entire fricking game from the beginning.
>1% edge case
An edge case that ends up being a really fricking good Pokemon on its own and is good to have. >embarrassingly exaggerated times
You have to play through almost all of PLA in order to get the genies, and you only get 1 shot to catch it. It's so unlikely you'll get it the first time, or even the second. Legends is a pretty long and grindy game.
10 months ago
Anonymous
You can catch the Genies in Swsh.
10 months ago
Anonymous
Not the girl one. Do you even play these games?
10 months ago
Anonymous
Yes I do, clearly YOU don't.
Enamorus isn't relevant. Do you even know why the Genies are being used more? or do you need someone to spoonfeed that to you too?
10 months ago
Anonymous
So you can neither read nor play the games, interesting why you're here.
10 months ago
Anonymous
You didn't answer my question. I'll give you one more chance, next time you reply, you answer properly or I'm going to assume you're a braindead moron.
10 months ago
Anonymous
Nobody was talking about Lando-I's Intimidate or Prankster.
10 months ago
Anonymous
I'm still waiting for you to tell me how a 0 IV speed Enamorus is relevant at all. Why none was seen at worlds and why it has abyssal usage rate on ladder. But for some reason it's constantly brought up if only to fit your narrative to justify genning.
10 months ago
Anonymous
It's an edge case, but that doesn't discount its usefulness in those cases. Why does usage rate matter? Should I just list every legendary that wants a non-maxed IV spread? Or any paradox that may want to boost a stat it normally wouldn't without imperfect IVs?
10 months ago
Anonymous
>Why does usage rate matter?
If you actually played the games, you would know the the importance of usage rates - especially in competitive Pokemon. But why bother? You guys are going to keep bringing up Enamorus because that's the only thing you have. A weak argument, and ultimately pointless since genning will never be legal.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>>1% edge case >An edge case that ends up being a really fricking good Pokemon on its own and is good to have.
Oh no! A legendary powerful Pokémon is rare and hard to obtain in its optimal stats! We never heard of a case like this!
>You have to play through almost all of PLA in order to get the genies, and you only get 1 shot to catch it. It's so unlikely you'll get it the first time, or even the second. Legends is a pretty long and grindy game.
Legends as a game shouldn't care that you want to use a Pokémon you catch there for a very specific purpose. Again, either be ready to work for it, trade from people you know and trust and check if they have one with the stats you want, or drop it.
10 months ago
Anonymous
if cheaters were actually banned you wouldn't need a 0IV speed enamorus. people who went out of their way to get one deserve to win in that matchup
10 months ago
Anonymous
>people who spend the most time not battling or get a favorable enough dice roll should win at battling
You don't see the flaw in that logic?
10 months ago
Anonymous
NTA but he didn't say that. He said that people who own an Enamorous like that most likely cheated, and people who didn't cheat didn't deserve to someone who injected.
It's a principle thing, not a practical thing.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>he didn't say that
Yes he did. >people who went out of their way to get one deserve to win in that matchup
10 months ago
Anonymous
stuff that happens outside the battle like catching and training matter in battles. battles are decided largely by who trained their pokemon better more than dice rolls. An EV trained pokemon with 31 IVS in both defenses will win against another pokemon with no EVs and low attack IVs even if they're critted and paralyzed. I accept random dice rolls influencing my luck in the speed I train pokemon and deciding the outcome of a match because it's a part of the game.
10 months ago
Anonymous
Anon... It's also part of The Game to train them...
10 months ago
Anonymous
EV training isn't randomized, and even finding a 1% encounter Pokemon takes less time than finding a specific IV.
10 months ago
Anonymous
Here’s a thought experiment for bootlickers.
Does the game ultimately changes if genning is allowed so long as you use legal sets (ie no Slaking with Huge Power and Extreme Speed)?
All 5 legitgays that actually genuinely care can now gen as well with no consequence. Anyone who doesn’t gen just does so solely because they felt like wasting time after the theoretical unbanning.
Pokémon isn't chess. you don't buy the table and get all the pieces. it's a monster collecting game.
You want a highly specific thing that only makes sense in the context of a competitive meta game, and doesn't really make sense in terms of how the rest of the game works. Just don't use it if it's that hard to get. Use another easier to manipulate chess piece.
>it's a monster collecting game.
That is directly at odds with its competitions. They've already added 90% of what is needed to make a competitive-ready Pokemon straight out of the box, but that last 10% is still a needless and tedious grind.
10 months ago
Anonymous
They didn't have to make it easier, and yet they did.
And you're complaining about the only hard thing you have left to do.
I'm sorry but I'm not even a compgay, I'm a shinygay and I never had troubles sitting for days to get the results I want.
You want something very nice and rare, you work for it. You don't complain about it.
I'll be happy if the SV DLC adds an item to make IVs 0, but at this point you already have half the work done anyway.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>They didn't have to make it easier, and yet they did.
They did for the sake of competitive, but didn't go far enough. If they want people to stop genning their mons, they should make competitive less shit to get into. This season in particular is moronic because it requires you to own past-gen games for some of the best Pokemon. >And you're complaining about the only hard thing you have left to do.
Because it shouldn't be there at all. >I'm not even a compgay
It shows.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>If they want people to stop genning their mons, they should make competitive less shit to get into.
The competitive scene would be very different anyway if people didn't cheat in the first place.
And again, you have 1 Pokémon that's really hard to get. Out of the selected roster that you can pick. Going through all that trouble for 1 mon instead of going through the trouble for all your team members doesn't seem that dramatic.
You can simply not use the mon, or put up with low IVs that aren't 0.
I'm not against more QoL but you're sounding super entitled. >"How do they expect us to not [insert long description of learning to use a program in your computer and find ways to inject the mon in the game, can even generate a discord bot to make a trade, and go through all that trouble]"
Normal people don't do that. That's what compgays teach each other to do.
>It shows.
Likely the best compliment I got in the past week.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>The competitive scene would be very different anyway if people didn't cheat in the first place.
But I thought it was so easy for people to get perfect Pokemon now. That's what you said, right?
10 months ago
Anonymous
And it is. because people genned so much, they made a way to make it easier to raise stats. And I'm also not opposed to them adding a way to add a way to 0 an IV.
I'm just very opposed to the mentality that you don't ever have to go through any trouble, because raising Pokémon is just as part of the game as battling.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>raising Pokémon is just as part of the game as battling.
Getting a lucky catch on a one-time Pokemon isn't raising anything.
10 months ago
Anonymous
Anyone with a Marked and/or shiny Pokemon would disagree
10 months ago
Anonymous
>people with sunk cost fallacy would consider RNG raising anything
10 months ago
Anonymous
No matter how hard you try to separate battles from the main game, the official battles happen in the game. If we had a Pokemon Stadium to battle on, then sure. But since we don't, you're stuck also playing the game.
Bottlecaps were way too rare in gen 7 and didn't effect breeding so I never got into competitive. Maybe gen 8 or 9 made it easier get Pokémon but the dexcut happened so I don't want to get more into Pokémon by entering the competitive scene.
Laughing at VGC players who defended the dexcut. I still want fully editable IVs. I don't have the ability to not give a shit about the series so I stopped fighting it but I'm not going to cuck out and give Gamefreak money either.
10 months ago
Anonymous
my friend, you can just be free, pirate the games and edit the pokemon values there
it's a kill 2 birds with 1 stone situation
10 months ago
Anonymous
I want legit editing and legit national dex. I also don't have the dosh for a good gaming PC.
I am a vgc player and I havent defended the dexcut. Nobody I know irl has either. Can you name 4 people that has? I'll gove you Wolfe Glick, being a poketuber of that callibur I wonder hoe much of a shill you need to be to be in good standing with tPCi, but regardless I just 3 others.
"The dexcut was good for the meta/vgc" is take I saw on Twitter multiple times over the years even though the Pokémon could be blanket banned. I didn't care to remember names of miniscule accounts.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>I want legit editing and legit national dex.
Okay, I kind of understand wanting to play the game vanilla.
>I also don't have the dosh for a good gaming PC. >Pokémon game >requiring a good pc
You're a moron and you're not my friend anymore >:(
10 months ago
Anonymous
Emulating 7th gen hardware is difficult for a PC that's like 8 years old.
10 months ago
Anonymous
The Switch is just as heavy on your pc as a GameCube game
It's the emulators that can be a bit slow to load up scenes in the game
8 years is a lot for a PC though, you'll need replacing soon anyway. A normal range laptop can run these games fine. Had a normie ass laptop run SSB without a problem back when it came out, so computers have no issue running Switch games.
10 months ago
Anonymous
*SSBB
10 months ago
Anonymous
So you let tertiary literally whos affect your view of the vgc scene and meta at large?
10 months ago
Anonymous
> big vgc eceleb defends the dexcut > smaller vgc accounts defend the dexcut > another vgc player just now in this thread defended the dexcut > "why do you just assume vgc players by and large defend the dexcut because of Literally whos"
10 months ago
Anonymous
I dont know of any VGC player other than Wolfe doing it. And saying "well that sucks, this ruins pokemon, well at least I dont have to worry about Smeargle" isnt endorsing it, its a silver lining
10 months ago
Anonymous
>at least I dont have to worry about Smeargle
For another month, at least.
10 months ago
Anonymous
True. How are my VGC bros planning to cope? I've been embracing full broken pokemon this year so I finally plan to run it myself. Skill swap moody is all Im thinking but maybe some moronic moves like Coaching, Spicy Extract or Decorate added since gen 8 could be good
10 months ago
Anonymous
I am a vgc player and I havent defended the dexcut. Nobody I know irl has either. Can you name 4 people that has? I'll gove you Wolfe Glick, being a poketuber of that callibur I wonder hoe much of a shill you need to be to be in good standing with tPCi, but regardless I just 3 others.
10 months ago
Anonymous
why are you laughing at them I don't get it. the dex cut made competitive more accessible by requiring you to buy less games and transfer less pokemon. you said you didn't want to get into pokemon because of the dex cut. they made the game more accessible for you and your hurt feelings prevented you from getting into competitive. you should laugh at yourself for being a hypocrite.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>why are you laughing at them >proceeds to defend dexcut with "the dex cut made competitive more accessible by requiring you to buy less games and transfer less pokemon"
you're the village idiot and deserve to be laughed at
10 months ago
Anonymous
I'm countering the argument vgc players are using to justify cheating. it is absolutely true that the dexcut increased accessibility for competitive play. regardless if you are salty that your favorite mon got cut it reduced the number of pokemon you needed to transfer and number of games you had to own. this anon
Bottlecaps were way too rare in gen 7 and didn't effect breeding so I never got into competitive. Maybe gen 8 or 9 made it easier get Pokémon but the dexcut happened so I don't want to get more into Pokémon by entering the competitive scene.
says he wanted the game to be more accessible then says the dexcut made him lose interest in competing. he is flip flopping on caring and not caring about accessibility and I called him out on it.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>he is flip flopping
he's not flip flopping, he's a normal person like me who likes to bring his pokébros with him or find his old time favorites in the game. The dexcut didn't even deter people from cheating as other anons pointed out.
10 months ago
Anonymous
you guys are flip flopping on wanting the games to be more accessible and working to make the game less accessible based on your dexcut stance. if the dexcut didn't happen you guys would have had to transfer more pokemon to compete which would have decreased accessibility. you guys are against the increase of accessibility through the dex cut so the issue preventing you from competing is something else. if it's not laziness what else is it?
10 months ago
Anonymous
I don't know who that person is you created in your head but my entire stance is: the rules say no modified mons, so you don't use modified mons.
Training your Pokémon is part of the game. It's all connected. If I'm defending something is that part of raising a team to compete includes trading with friends for exclusives, hatching eggs, sometimes soft resetting if you want something very specific from a legendary. Can it be improved? Yes. Is the lack of QoL in some aspects enough to excuse people to compete in an official competition where you can earn money with spoofed Pokémon? Not really.
But I don't really care that much if people spoof them as long as the moves and info are legal. But if you're moronic enough to get caught, that's 100% on you and you deserved it. Not only you can't be assed to play the videogame you're competing to be a "champion" in, you can't even hack the values correctly. In the end, competitors should just play the goddamn game.
10 months ago
Anonymous
> flip flopping
I want the dexcut to be undone and I want IVs to be changeable on a point by point basis via some sort of non rng grinding system. No flip flopping.
10 months ago
Anonymous
I'm not a hypocrite and making VGC more accessible isn't worth the dexcut especially since people still cheat and complain about it being pay to win because of one transfer only Pokémon.
You can breed mons with IVs you want, right?
Then just be a fricking trainer and breed them. Prepare your teams for competition.
Harsher bans. Lifetime bans for me.
Well practicing league of legends 14 hours a day also isn’t fun but pro teams do that shit. And they can’t spend one hour a day to prepare their mons? Pro players in Pokémon are such fricking manchildren holy shit
I would like to be able to optimize any Pokémon I have by grinding.
I'm not against the candy, mind. But the trend has been making it easier and easier, especially with the 4iv dittos. Were talking fringe cases at best with a lot of the complaints. It isnt gen 3 anymore.
Even if things are easier. Letting me grind dittos into perfect breeding machines would be preferable to just spawning 4IV dittos in special cases in my opinion.
breeding is not practice, though. battling is practice. you could breed for a billion hours but that wont help you impove your strategic skills one bit. if you want to get good at the game you need to actually put time in battle and watch other battles when you are not doring so.
remove IVs. the only reasons to have less than 31 are "muh foul play" which is pointless minmaxing for something that comes up in 0.01% of matches, and "muh trick room" where you only need 0 because the other guy can have 0.
just rip them out already.
I will accept nothing less than the removal of IVs entirely. They've removed everything else from the games, why not the one mechanic that everyone hates?
Anyone caught cheating gets a lifetime VGC ban, with an appeal. Those bragging online about how they gladly cheated, cheated at past events, and think cheating is fine get lifetime bans with no appeal and their previous VGC W/L records voided. If they won any tournaments in those previous years, they forfeit their titles and should be made to repay their ill-gotten winnings.
you don't understand anon, I love looking at my rattata's stats and spending an afternoon comparing it to the rattata my friend caught, and seeing how mine is worse. Don't tell me that you didn't spend your childhood comparing stats with your friends instead of playing the game?
>What's the solution to how IVs encourage cheating in VGC?
GF should just add a zero IV item to the game like they have bottle caps for 31 IVs
Would solve literally every possible issue. They can still ban cheaters but you also stop having to hear about people going "waaah waaah I got banned for cheating even though it was explicitly stated in the rules =~~*((" because people can just use zero IV items now
The only argument against it would be that it gives you way too much control over your Pokemon stats when they're supposed to be animals with varying stats but we passed the point of no return in that regard a long ass time ago back when they introduced Hyper Training
There isn't one because there's nothing wrong with IVs. It's the meta that's wrong. Normally I'd jump at the chance to shit on modern Pokemon games, but the IV system is actually fine. Best scenario for fixing that would be rather than removing them or anything else. This is an issue specifically with the way people play this game at a competitive level, though. No one wants to do work, they all want to cheat and get away with it, but they're lazy a absolute frick or just downright moronic. GF slapped hands over this shit and made the game actively worse for everyone else to try and curb this behavior ("HOME removing non standard moves), but the people who were being punished clearly didn't even notice. What needs to happen is that TPC needs to start handing out bans from tourneys after this. If you're caught cheating or you get DQ'd they should hand you a 5 year ban. This is a video game, if you aren't playing it then you don't deserve to compete in it at a competitive level. Actually play the fricking game and don't cheat, it's an easy fricking solution. If you don't have the time to play it correctly, then don't compete. You clearly don't have the time.
I guess if you want something even more complicated for some reason: They can change the way breeding works. Currently breeding has a chance to take a certain number of IVs from each parent (with items that increase or decrease this chance) and then the rest are determined by RNG. Breeding could be that all IVs are determined by the parents randomly (50/50 chance any specific IV is taken from a parent) and the trainer can just use hold items to force specific stat IVs to be taken. Then the only random IVs you get are in wild Pokemon. I guess that would work. This would also mean bred Pokemon would be by and large stronger than wild ones. But a "Rusty Bottlcap" (like Hyper Training but 0 IVs) would still be an easy way to shut people up, too.
You might not like it but it's the truth. The addition of Hyper Training literally fixed any issue you should've ever had with IVs and if they didn't, it's because you were just too dumb to understand the system to begin with or too autistic to accept that the system is fine.
Then tell me. Why do you not like IVs, Anon? Now's your chance to lay this shit out. Prove to us you aren't a moron autist who just hates it because he doesn't understand them or doesn't want to understand them.
10 months ago
Anonymous
10 months ago
Anonymous
Hyper Training only lets you go to 31, you have no control over the exact number. So trying to hit any other specific thresholds for Beast Boost or Protosynthesis or 0 for Trick Room just means tediousness that is exactly the same as it's always been. Either let people set their IVs exactly when hyper training, or automatically assume they're all 31 in competition.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>other specific thresholds for Beast Boost or Protosynthesis
Shithead. Fricking EV train correctly.
10 months ago
Anonymous
EVs aren't enough in some cases.
10 months ago
Anonymous
Probably extremely fringe cases that you will rarely do. So you might have to spend 30 minutes finding a mon with the right iv to breed for those extremely fringe cases. >but i dont have one
So you didn’t play the game and you didn’t complete the pokedex in none of the games.
Also, frick this competitive scene and frick the meta. Pokemon is so fricking terrible for this shit because no one playing it at tournament level has any interest in doing anything but playing a cookie cutter team. What they should do is work toward fixing that shit in a competent way. Like, I assume shit like Tera was meant as a solution to that shit, but it clearly didn't work. There are a ton of ways they can fix this shit, though. Ways that don't involve banning specific Pokemon or just sliding the strength curve up every time a new game gets released.
Nobody fricking breeds in modern comp it's just a waste of time for anything but 0 speed idk why so many people talk about the games like we are in fricking Gen 3
Yeah, I know. I don't expect anyone to breed for anything outside of 0 IVs. But if they well and truly want that shit, they should have to put in work for it.
Frick 0 IV items, that's thinking way too small.
Just make the IVs customizable anywhere from 0-31. We don't need any more 17 DEF IV Lonely Statatakas being optimal for the ATK Beast Boosts.
>How is it cool?
I like my guys being individualised. I like comparing my pokemon to my friend’s pokemon and seeing that his Petilil has naturally more SpATK but my Petilil is faster. It gives my pokemons even more soul, together with their natures.
I like IVs and some homosexual manchildren won’t remove them from me.
I'm asking (you) to prove your bullshit argument that never happened.
10 months ago
Anonymous
Good, they don't like cheaters right? Showdown is cheating.
10 months ago
Anonymous
rent free
10 months ago
Anonymous
I'm not the original anon. I'm just wondering why anon would take a random picture just to post it online to someone who wants proof they had said conversation. For what purpose?
10 months ago
Anonymous
>schizo makes straw man >ok prove it >WTF WHY ARE YOU ASKING HIM TO PROVE IT
10 months ago
Anonymous
>straw man
it's literally the best argument against removing ivs i've ever heard
10 months ago
Anonymous
No one ever talks like that. Same reason they've provided nothing.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>mindbroken this fast
I wasn't even trying to troll, I was just genuinely curious.
No one ever talks like that. Same reason they've provided nothing.
A few years ago, me and my friends were playing Pokemon Pearl at the same time. From time to time, we were giving each other our reactions to our playthroughs, however we made an effort to not say what we catch and use. After beating the game we shared our teams and, to our surprise, three out of four people had Drifblim in their teams. We had fun comparing them. Mainly movesets but natures and overall stats as well.
This activity made me realize that one of my friends is a complete madman who always EV trains his in-game team. You can easily see who it is on the screenshot.
10 months ago
Anonymous
Cute
10 months ago
Anonymous
Aren't those types of people just the best? The super autistic motherfrickers that suck any and all fun out of every single game by zoning in on the core mechanics and exploiting them so they can have bragging rights about some small thing in their pathetic lives. Gee, I wonder why those types of people don't tend to have any friends? Hmm...
10 months ago
Anonymous
>mindbroken this fast
I wasn't even trying to troll, I was just genuinely curious.
>I like my guys being individualised.
This isn't the Game Boy era anymore, there are ways to individualize Pokémon without having it affect battles. IVs are nice in theory, but in practice almost every mon meant for competitive level play will just end up the same, defeating the purpose.
Natures are fine. 1/25 roll isn't too bad and we can get the desired nature through Synchronize and breeding or stats for competitive thanks to mints.
It has a purpose outside of competitive. Specifically to create the grinding loop for monster raising sim that you do at the end of the game. Thats all that matters. Its super trivial to maximize them now as well so who cares?
Aren't they adding a mechanic that lets you change your ivs to exactly what you want them to be with mochi? It's going to let you change the base stats of your pokemon. Is that not ivs?
how did that work again? I remember using it but I never understood how it translated over or what it actually did
It boosts stats and can max all of them, similar to (but better than) candies in Lets Go. Kinda like being able to give 200 EV to all stats.
But grit system just masked IVs. They were all there and intact under the hood. Only way to estimate was grit started at 0-3 depending on base IVs you had.
IVs are motte and Bailey bullshit, people are primarily cheating to get Urshifu who is just fine with a gold bottle cap. Unless GF straight up puts pkHex in the game people will always cheat because it's faster and GF is never going to put pkHex in the games because it goes against the spirit of the game. The only "real" solution is harsher punishments, hacking Pokemon is just part of the culture of the scene.
>Allow genning of teams >Suddenly everyone who was genning (previously cheating) is no longer cheating (still genning (now legal))
Yeah it would result in less cheating. It would also result in less money too.
>Hurr If cheating is legal, then it’s not cheating
But it never will be legal, you fricking moron. That's why it's called cheating.
Was this suppose to be a Gotcha moment?
10 months ago
Anonymous
Then why talk about it? Not the checkmate you think it is
10 months ago
Anonymous
>Then why talk about it?
Please take a long look at OP's image and see who's actually talking about it and come back to me. Afterwards I want you to get on your knees and apologize to me for being a fatherless waste of life and go back to twitter where you belong.
10 months ago
Anonymous
I will apologize because now reading the reply chain it appears we are saying the same thing and think anyone entertaining the idea of legal genning becoming possible is moronic. Was lost in the sauce
They're concern trolling, less than half of them even still play the games. Those same people saying how IVs should be untouched will be the first ones when DLC drops to shit talk them and brag how they didn't spend a dollar on it. It's not about what's right or wrong, it's about their autist brains needing to feel a sense of superiority.
>cause less cheating
Even if there was a "rusted bottlecap" that sets an IV to 0...
These people would still cheat.
Because they can't be assed to get their shiny Cresselia legitimately.
Cause it can't be a Cresselia.
It HAS to be shiny.
With the perfect IVs.
The only good thing about the removal of Hidden Power is that it removed the excuse from cheaters they used with how they "have" to cheat for the right IVs.
Well thats the stuff we want weeded out. Doesnt mean they didnt kick my ass fsir and square in a battle, but the integrity of entering a tourney that way is whats thought of as the problem
This thread is a complete waste of time. IV's will never be removed, and I expect harsher punishments for people caught genning and better Pokemon checks.
Genning will never be legal, no matter how much you b***h and moan. You're pretty much here to circle jerk over things you have zero control over. Maybe go start a strike or something, let us know how that turns out. Stop Cheating.
>Rusty Bottle Cap for 0IV >Increase drop rates for Ability Patches and increase the amount of Tera shards earned at the end of raids or offer them for money
>Worst they could do is tell them to stop using Pokemon names/sprites/models from the games.
Exactly. They can't claim ownership over the actual math or stat numbers.
This. I want to see people who have molded their entire lives around cheating at video games just get lifetime banned from competition, rendering their entire "lives" pointless.
Set them all to 31. Yes it means you lose out on some Beast Boost or Protosynthesis shenanigans, but it prevents all this autism. It's no different than level. You used to be able to under level and run level 49 or 48 mons to underspeed in Trick Room, because sacrificing 2 1-2 def and hp is worth it to gain efectively 1-2 speed. They got rid of that, and while it simplified the game and quashed a valid and creative strategy, it kept things neat and easy.
I don't care what normies do, even though I recognize they make up most of Pokemon's sales.
Normies don't play Pokemon for competition, they play Pokemon for the RPG elements. Normies don't even have a ball in this fight. It's why a PBR style game with Showdown qualities would never work even if it's what comp players want.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>Normies don't play Pokemon for competition, they play Pokemon for the RPG elements.
This is a massive franchise and that's quite the bold statement. but you seem to forget for Pokemon, competitive is part of that RPG experience. Always have been. Many Normies do play competitive / battle, to say no Normies do is completely illogical.
>I don't care what normies do
And TPCI doesn't care what you want specifically. This game is for everyone to play, not for sweaty tryhards who gen and think they are above the rules.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>Many Normies do play competitive / battle, to say no Normies do is completely illogical.
If you asked the average Pokemon buyer to explain the difference between an EV and an IV, I can almost guarantee they wouldn't be able to tell you.
If you do know the difference, then you're probably not a normie >tryhard
just because you settled for being mediocre in life doesn't mean I have to
10 months ago
Anonymous
It's funny you say this. I can go right now to Pokemon normie plebbit, type in "IV" in search and see threads going back 10 years of normies discussing IV spreads. I know people irl who play pokemon who are normies and they know what IV's are. You can ignore everything I just said, and still the idea that no normies know what IV's are is ridiculous and not realistic.
>just because you settled for being mediocre in life doesn't mean I have to
Cool story sister. Just remember you're not above the rules. Genning will never be legal and IV's aren't going anywhere.
10 months ago
Anonymous
I'm not really following this convo but I always think it's funny how /vp/ will simultaneously try to hold the positions that "the games need to be harder because not only casuals play these games" and "Gamefreak needs to stop putting so much effort into comp because casuals don't care about that"
The common sense solution would be to add an item that let's you reset IVs and to reduce the mmo tier grind for all the comp shit
A pie in the sky dream is for GF to implement granularity in customizing mons and some sort of battle resort side area type thing for comp to get a hand on mons (temporarily) you otherwise would have difficulty obtaining yourself legally (make it something like 'you need to register the mon in your dex first' if you really want to commit to it). This all is for naught when you recognize that GF doesn't even acknowledge natures and their tie to stats more than it has to much less IV and EV mechanics beyond a few blurbs of text.
The expected solution is that they're going to add an item that costs 10 trillion Pokeshekels that reduces your IVs by 10. But hey at least then you just need to hack in the money.
No, they'll just cheat smarter. They'll start sending their rentals to people with hack checking software outside of TPCI.
Absolutely nothing will come of this.
>See someone fall into a pit trap >stare at them flailing around >walk in and fall as well >Blame the trees
Sounds like your Average VGCplayer to me.
10 months ago
Anonymous
>stare at them flailing around
how do you stare at someone in front of you if they're in a hole? >Blame the trees
what do trees have to do with pit traps? how do you frick up greentexting like this?
>They'll start sending their rentals to people with hack checking software outside of TPCI.
In 99% of the cases it's more effort than breeding and training a mon legitimately.
The solution is to make the mechanic transparent. In gen 3 IV range was doubled to make it even more random, which is moronic. Then you got these natures and abilities and all that other crap as well, and the hidden abilities and all the gift and event crap, breed moves, and so on. And of course there are shinies as well.... Basically, they made it so that it is impossible to get *exactly* the mon you want. AND this is why the cheaters cheat. Because they are too lazy to compete with japanese AUTISM.
Now, over time they've added a bunch of garbage to try and change a pokemon you do not want to one you actually want. This is good, but it's still very poorly designed. They could have simplified the entire procesd by just having you farm mcguffins to a power a single machine you placed your mon in that could change all the aspects. They could have made all information you needed easily available so you would know how many mcguffins you needed. Sadly, pokemon is owned by game freak..
>Any other monster raising franchise. >Players will gladly put in the work to build that one perfect mon, no matter how obtuse the mechanics are. >Pokemon >"noooooooooooooo remove ivs remove natures remove egg moves remove leveling i want my godmon and i want it RIGHT NOW!!!1!"
Why would there being national tourneys for other monster franchises be an argument in favor of genning?
Why do you think the existence of a more popular, official competition method would have people excuse generating? If anything they'd say it's a stronger argument against genning.
I play other monster raising games and the first reaction people have at hacking in these RPGs is cringing and having 2nd-hand-embarrassment.
Not according to the creators that just banned morons like you. Learn to have fun and actually enjoy video games for more than being the best on the playground, ya frickin soulless frick.
Wveryone loves pointing out pvp battling was an afterthought of gen 1. It was designed as a single player rpg primarilly. But at this point can you argue raising and training arent integral design desicions when >so many of them exist and some are required to be used if you want to optimize
and >GF seems adamant they must be done by the books withint thier definition of "legit" or else the player is subjected to disqualification
?
Ban Legendaries and Mythicals. Now no one can b***h about the Pokemon they want being unbreedable and you also cut out cancer like the Forces of Nature out. Maybe Paradox Mon too since they seem to be very ultra centralizing "pick Long Misdreavus/Metal Hariyama to win" mon atm.
Force homies to get creative again. Every damn team is the same.
What happened to my gimmick teams? Weather? Baton Passing? Meme magic? Shit like this is lame and fricking bogus.
We ain't gonna get no Pachirisu tanking Draco Meteor in a massive upset-tier shit ever again. Just the same 4-6 Legendaries/Mythicals/Paradoxes on every team.
>Ban Legendaries
That format exists, it's called Series 1 of a new Gen. It'd be boring if the rules didn't change for three years. >What happened to my gimmick teams?
Open team sheets. >Weather?
Weather has and continues to be viable. Most teams have at least some weather component, even if it's slotting in a weather move to potentially overwrite enemy weather. >Baton Passing?
Outside of Extreme Eevoboost in Gen 7 this was never a thing in VGC.
>add an item that gives 0IV on a stat >even much better give an IV and EV item that allows users to manipulate how much of each they need specifically >a new Key Item where you can change Pokeballs for your shitters, this would eliminate Ball autismo overnight >keep mints and bottle caps >instead of an IV judge, make both IVs and EVs visible so there will be no need to download Pkhex (outside of finding out your SID)
I'm not against QOL for regular players. But the excuses created are never going to go away. Why take ten minutes when you could take eight and cheat will always be a thing for these people.
>Jap kids were just using cookiecutter meta teams you find easily online >Jap teenager mogged a Smogontard NPC with his unique team >Jap Master competitor mogged another Smogontard NPC with a cookiecutter meta team that he devised
how come this was never a problem when i competed
if you're too dumb to cheat you deserve to get banned
if you just want to play sims then stick to showdown
Why don’t they stick to simulators since they clearly prefer that anyway? It probably cost more to travel to japan than whatever winnings they could have gotten
I will never get caught or banned for genning my teams. I don’t care if I scrub out of every regional I go to. The point is I will not stop and no one can make me stop. Seethe harder you concern trolling homosexuals
you're gonna get banned for cheating and cry about on X when they look at your low play time x999 of every item and box full of competitive pokemon. tell us how you demand respect please
The first one is to have a way to generate pokemon directly in game. GF will never do it, because they evidently think that competitive is side content at best and not worth ruining the "lore" of the game for it.
The second one is removing IVs, which again won't happen for the same reason. This would also frick over some pokemon since you couldn't have 0 ivs in speed for trick room or atk for that dark move that uses the atk of the pokemon hit, I forgot its name.
option 3 would be to ban people with a 0 ATK and SPD IV Cresselia and 0 SPD IV Enamorous since they're impossible to get. option 4 would be to remove foul play and trick room
>The second one is removing IVs, which again won't happen for the same reason.
Multiplayer can already automatically set your levels to 50, lore is meaningless in pvp.
The solution to IVs? Make them cosmetic values. No more of that stat bullshit, IVs will now determine the slight color variation of your pokemon like how Spinda have different spots based on their IVs.
How about we actually keep things as intended so people who grind really hard earn the perk of having a properly IVed mon? Prepwork for strat planning is already rewarded as intended, and 99% of the rest of the game's teambuilding works (grind money for vitamins or EV train as normal, grind for bottle caps and TM ingrediants) fine. For those autistic enough to breed for 0 attack 0 speed or reset for legends kind of earned those, didnt they?
>How about we actually keep things as intended so people who grind really hard earn the perk of having a properly IVed mon?
Because it’s completely arbitrary to the actual meat of the competition. EV training would be like requiring athletes to watch paint dry or to play that saving baby easter egg in Stanley Parable. Doing so would let them earn their Jersey that they need to replace every season. Not a single other competitive game in the world requires you to do a bunch of arbitrary tasks in order to simply prepare for the competition.
Saying this is like saying the Halo or COD campaigns are part of the multiplayer.
>I have to..play...le game?
So what are your thoughts on teamsharing? You don’t have to “play the game (doing a bunch of arbitrary chores)” if you only use teams someone else made and handed to you.
I disagree because (unless Im mistaken) the campaigns have no bearing on the pvp, clearly not the same here. In Splatoon 1 you needed to beat the campaign to unlock the Dynamo Roller, the only weapon unable to be purchased from Sheldon. That is a more apt comparison because its a built in game requirement. Helps thatbyou technically have 8 other generations of games, Home, Go, and VC releases to also pull from, but ultimatley still needs the prepwork in any combination to function.
>Saying this is like saying the Halo or COD campaigns are part of the multiplayer.
Whether you like it or not, it's part of the same campaign.
We're unfortunately not using a game like Stadium or Battle Revolution or Showdown to compete. And it'd likely not gonna change that much if we competed in a Stadium model because you'd likely still have to use the Pokémon from the game.
The point of the game is to compete with your pokébros. It's a tamagotchi-like thing. You're not supposed to turn it into a souless "I bought this race dog with tons of drugs and I'll have a fair chance now".
I agree with most of your point but the "pokebro" point combined with the Karengay pic makes me think you're now leaning too far in the other direction, careful anon. Sure I can with with my imperfect Flutter Mane with 31 attack IVs, but that's not the same as saying "I can just use shitmons without context or strategy and make it to the top"
10 months ago
Anonymous
Nah of course. I mean to say you can still get properly trained mons, but it's important you're the one doing the work (game design wise). As in you're the trainer who proudly caught the mon and trained it or minted, or hypertrained, whatever.
Consider the point you're trying to make against the replies before; its clear that Pokemon is emphasizing how they only want legit nongenned pokemon regsrdless of them meeting battle-relevant legal attributes. Does this not indicate they value the training and prepwork as much as the battles themselves?
>Consider the point you're trying to make against the replies before; its clear that Pokemon is emphasizing how they only want legit nongenned pokemon regsrdless of them meeting battle-relevant legal attributes. Does this not indicate they value the training and prepwork as much as the battles themselves?
It really fricking doesn’t.
Unlike Teambuilding, real training is limitless. An Athlete can always train to become faster, stronger, and endure more. With teambuilding you just hit a hard cap until your Pokemon’s stats are all maximized.
The actual training of Pokemon is practicing strategy, against real people. Not “I walked around an empty area all day and mashed A at certain locations”, against literally nobaby because you’re not competing against anyone.
Have you ever played the bug catching contest in gsc? You actually are competing to find the best catch. This is the same thing in an irl context. Only difference is you have a near unlimited time before an event to find your maximum efficient pokemon to use. >The actual training of Pokemon is practicing strategy, against real people. Not “I walked around an empty area all day and mashed A at certain locations”, against literally nobaby because you’re not competing against anyone.
How you get there is irrelevant as long as its legal in game, but that aside it seems Pokemon disagrees, otherwise they wouldnt care about genning pokemon that are mechanically legal but hacked
I’ve been watching more competitive Pokemon lately and the younger divisons are way more fun to watch than the Masters division. The competitive matches as a whole would be more accessible to watch if they were forced to use rentals/fan favorites. A 4v4 with 6 rentals could be really compelling.
Masters division pros get their pokemon hacked, gifted from fans, or they say "gifted from fans" when really they're hacked. Junior divisions get their pokemon from older players like siblings or madter division players they get help from, ironically not too different.
Why do we care about IVs? those are a lot easier to get than fricking tera crystals. 50 of those for 1 mon is AIDS. you have to grind an entire day just for 1 mon. while IVs/EVs are fairly easy
Because even though hyper training exists now before gen 6 and even during gen 6 IVs created the incentive to cheat thus normalizing cheating with the Pokémon community. Even non vgc players had hacked 6IV dittos to make breeding for Battle chateau easier for themselves. That's kinda why I want editable IVs that effect breeding even though hyper training is a thing so, less egregious cheaters can retroactively earn that what they cheated for.
>What's the solution to how IVs encourage cheating in VGC?
Remove IVs >But muh trick room
Remove IVs >But muh 0 atk vs foul play
Remove IVs >But what if hidden power returns
Remove IVs
Defend or refute this
Personally, he lost me hard at the tourism and money talk; in one breath he says the Hawaiians dont want us there and dont need our money because it leads to gentrification, and yet in another he advocates to donate to a charity for a relief fund regarding the wildfires, seeming to contradict himself, but that has nothing to do with his arguments cheating, genning, and accesibility of pokemon.
It's weird that a white guy is taking the actual center stage from the people he's trying to defend and not letting the speak...oh wait. No it isn't. That's par the fricking course for this sort of shit. I find it hard to believe that this guy has ever in his life spoken to a Hawaiin person ever, but if he had I would've given way more pause and interest if he had gotten that person to talk about this stuff instead of himself. If he wants to change this and speak up for a group of minority people, the least he could do is give them a voice instead of talking over them for them. It's a super white colonizer thing to do.
Lifetime Bans
First post best post.
Hand down one way tickets for few spoiled e-celebrites and other shitters will either calm down or leave.
Ban trick room, no need for 0 speed anymore
What about 0 ATK?
What about 0 Def to retaliate more damage by Counter or Mirror Coat?
Now that we brainstormed, only sp attack does not need a 0IV streamlined solution
As a power trick mirror coat user this post offends me
>banning a game mechanic
>instead of simply adding a "rusty bottlecap" that reduces the IV stat to 0.
classic vp low iq take
trick room is a move not a mechanic. people refuse to grind for bottle caps and mints and ability patches so why would that change with rusty bottlecaps? cheaters and competitive players should want it removed so it increases "accessibility"
>smogon hands typed this post
The point of VGC is so I don't have to run away from a scary strat with bans, I learn to adapt and fight it
>official showdown version
>get rid of VGC
Topkek, tPC and tPCi would totally go for this.
>ban strategies for non shillmons
Kys, smogontroony
there's no other choice. I don't see them adding a rusted bottle cap ever it's too weird of a concept
>grown men mad at child’s game for not allowing cheating
Even the added some currency to manually set an iv, people would cheat anyway. The solution is to ban cheaters and let them cry.
While this is true why not make things easier for people who do play legit or newcomers to VGC?
I'm not against the candy, mind. But the trend has been making it easier and easier, especially with the 4iv dittos. Were talking fringe cases at best with a lot of the complaints. It isnt gen 3 anymore.
They literally did you fricking Black person. It’s completely effortless to max IVs. EV training is also effortless now because of encounter power lv 1 making literally localize all encounters in an area to 1 pokemon. You can remember any one move except for egg moves. You can pass egg moves to any one pokemon without actually making eggs as many times as you want. Every consumable and held item is now easily purchaseable.
You can make any pokemon even your starter perfect now extremely east”y, almost insultingly so.
The excuses these subhumans are giving is that they don’t want to play the game they just want to use an editor and sliders to build the pokemon they want to use because they can’t be assed to play or buy the games.
Nobody wants to grind out 100 hours for the chance at getting a 0IV mon. Definitely not when it's PLA and you can only check the IVs after transferring it. So if your Enamorus isn't perfect, you have to restart the entire fricking game from the beginning.
>my 1% edge case with embarrassingly exaggerated times
>1% edge case
An edge case that ends up being a really fricking good Pokemon on its own and is good to have.
>embarrassingly exaggerated times
You have to play through almost all of PLA in order to get the genies, and you only get 1 shot to catch it. It's so unlikely you'll get it the first time, or even the second. Legends is a pretty long and grindy game.
You can catch the Genies in Swsh.
Not the girl one. Do you even play these games?
Yes I do, clearly YOU don't.
Enamorus isn't relevant. Do you even know why the Genies are being used more? or do you need someone to spoonfeed that to you too?
So you can neither read nor play the games, interesting why you're here.
You didn't answer my question. I'll give you one more chance, next time you reply, you answer properly or I'm going to assume you're a braindead moron.
Nobody was talking about Lando-I's Intimidate or Prankster.
I'm still waiting for you to tell me how a 0 IV speed Enamorus is relevant at all. Why none was seen at worlds and why it has abyssal usage rate on ladder. But for some reason it's constantly brought up if only to fit your narrative to justify genning.
It's an edge case, but that doesn't discount its usefulness in those cases. Why does usage rate matter? Should I just list every legendary that wants a non-maxed IV spread? Or any paradox that may want to boost a stat it normally wouldn't without imperfect IVs?
>Why does usage rate matter?
If you actually played the games, you would know the the importance of usage rates - especially in competitive Pokemon. But why bother? You guys are going to keep bringing up Enamorus because that's the only thing you have. A weak argument, and ultimately pointless since genning will never be legal.
>>1% edge case
>An edge case that ends up being a really fricking good Pokemon on its own and is good to have.
Oh no! A legendary powerful Pokémon is rare and hard to obtain in its optimal stats! We never heard of a case like this!
>You have to play through almost all of PLA in order to get the genies, and you only get 1 shot to catch it. It's so unlikely you'll get it the first time, or even the second. Legends is a pretty long and grindy game.
Legends as a game shouldn't care that you want to use a Pokémon you catch there for a very specific purpose. Again, either be ready to work for it, trade from people you know and trust and check if they have one with the stats you want, or drop it.
if cheaters were actually banned you wouldn't need a 0IV speed enamorus. people who went out of their way to get one deserve to win in that matchup
>people who spend the most time not battling or get a favorable enough dice roll should win at battling
You don't see the flaw in that logic?
NTA but he didn't say that. He said that people who own an Enamorous like that most likely cheated, and people who didn't cheat didn't deserve to someone who injected.
It's a principle thing, not a practical thing.
>he didn't say that
Yes he did.
>people who went out of their way to get one deserve to win in that matchup
stuff that happens outside the battle like catching and training matter in battles. battles are decided largely by who trained their pokemon better more than dice rolls. An EV trained pokemon with 31 IVS in both defenses will win against another pokemon with no EVs and low attack IVs even if they're critted and paralyzed. I accept random dice rolls influencing my luck in the speed I train pokemon and deciding the outcome of a match because it's a part of the game.
Anon... It's also part of The Game to train them...
EV training isn't randomized, and even finding a 1% encounter Pokemon takes less time than finding a specific IV.
Here’s a thought experiment for bootlickers.
Does the game ultimately changes if genning is allowed so long as you use legal sets (ie no Slaking with Huge Power and Extreme Speed)?
All 5 legitgays that actually genuinely care can now gen as well with no consequence. Anyone who doesn’t gen just does so solely because they felt like wasting time after the theoretical unbanning.
what do you mean by "the game"?
If it was so good it would have been used.
nobody is using that ugly pokemon in battle
Pokémon isn't chess. you don't buy the table and get all the pieces. it's a monster collecting game.
You want a highly specific thing that only makes sense in the context of a competitive meta game, and doesn't really make sense in terms of how the rest of the game works. Just don't use it if it's that hard to get. Use another easier to manipulate chess piece.
>it's a monster collecting game.
That is directly at odds with its competitions. They've already added 90% of what is needed to make a competitive-ready Pokemon straight out of the box, but that last 10% is still a needless and tedious grind.
They didn't have to make it easier, and yet they did.
And you're complaining about the only hard thing you have left to do.
I'm sorry but I'm not even a compgay, I'm a shinygay and I never had troubles sitting for days to get the results I want.
You want something very nice and rare, you work for it. You don't complain about it.
I'll be happy if the SV DLC adds an item to make IVs 0, but at this point you already have half the work done anyway.
>They didn't have to make it easier, and yet they did.
They did for the sake of competitive, but didn't go far enough. If they want people to stop genning their mons, they should make competitive less shit to get into. This season in particular is moronic because it requires you to own past-gen games for some of the best Pokemon.
>And you're complaining about the only hard thing you have left to do.
Because it shouldn't be there at all.
>I'm not even a compgay
It shows.
>If they want people to stop genning their mons, they should make competitive less shit to get into.
The competitive scene would be very different anyway if people didn't cheat in the first place.
And again, you have 1 Pokémon that's really hard to get. Out of the selected roster that you can pick. Going through all that trouble for 1 mon instead of going through the trouble for all your team members doesn't seem that dramatic.
You can simply not use the mon, or put up with low IVs that aren't 0.
I'm not against more QoL but you're sounding super entitled.
>"How do they expect us to not [insert long description of learning to use a program in your computer and find ways to inject the mon in the game, can even generate a discord bot to make a trade, and go through all that trouble]"
Normal people don't do that. That's what compgays teach each other to do.
>It shows.
Likely the best compliment I got in the past week.
>The competitive scene would be very different anyway if people didn't cheat in the first place.
But I thought it was so easy for people to get perfect Pokemon now. That's what you said, right?
And it is. because people genned so much, they made a way to make it easier to raise stats. And I'm also not opposed to them adding a way to add a way to 0 an IV.
I'm just very opposed to the mentality that you don't ever have to go through any trouble, because raising Pokémon is just as part of the game as battling.
>raising Pokémon is just as part of the game as battling.
Getting a lucky catch on a one-time Pokemon isn't raising anything.
Anyone with a Marked and/or shiny Pokemon would disagree
>people with sunk cost fallacy would consider RNG raising anything
No matter how hard you try to separate battles from the main game, the official battles happen in the game. If we had a Pokemon Stadium to battle on, then sure. But since we don't, you're stuck also playing the game.
>Enamorus
No one uses this thing. Why is it constantly brought up?
Bottlecaps were way too rare in gen 7 and didn't effect breeding so I never got into competitive. Maybe gen 8 or 9 made it easier get Pokémon but the dexcut happened so I don't want to get more into Pokémon by entering the competitive scene.
>so I don't want to get more into Pokémon by entering the competitive scene.
so what are you doing here then?
Laughing at VGC players who defended the dexcut. I still want fully editable IVs. I don't have the ability to not give a shit about the series so I stopped fighting it but I'm not going to cuck out and give Gamefreak money either.
my friend, you can just be free, pirate the games and edit the pokemon values there
it's a kill 2 birds with 1 stone situation
I want legit editing and legit national dex. I also don't have the dosh for a good gaming PC.
"The dexcut was good for the meta/vgc" is take I saw on Twitter multiple times over the years even though the Pokémon could be blanket banned. I didn't care to remember names of miniscule accounts.
>I want legit editing and legit national dex.
Okay, I kind of understand wanting to play the game vanilla.
>I also don't have the dosh for a good gaming PC.
>Pokémon game
>requiring a good pc
You're a moron and you're not my friend anymore >:(
Emulating 7th gen hardware is difficult for a PC that's like 8 years old.
The Switch is just as heavy on your pc as a GameCube game
It's the emulators that can be a bit slow to load up scenes in the game
8 years is a lot for a PC though, you'll need replacing soon anyway. A normal range laptop can run these games fine. Had a normie ass laptop run SSB without a problem back when it came out, so computers have no issue running Switch games.
*SSBB
So you let tertiary literally whos affect your view of the vgc scene and meta at large?
> big vgc eceleb defends the dexcut
> smaller vgc accounts defend the dexcut
> another vgc player just now in this thread defended the dexcut
> "why do you just assume vgc players by and large defend the dexcut because of Literally whos"
I dont know of any VGC player other than Wolfe doing it. And saying "well that sucks, this ruins pokemon, well at least I dont have to worry about Smeargle" isnt endorsing it, its a silver lining
>at least I dont have to worry about Smeargle
For another month, at least.
True. How are my VGC bros planning to cope? I've been embracing full broken pokemon this year so I finally plan to run it myself. Skill swap moody is all Im thinking but maybe some moronic moves like Coaching, Spicy Extract or Decorate added since gen 8 could be good
I am a vgc player and I havent defended the dexcut. Nobody I know irl has either. Can you name 4 people that has? I'll gove you Wolfe Glick, being a poketuber of that callibur I wonder hoe much of a shill you need to be to be in good standing with tPCi, but regardless I just 3 others.
why are you laughing at them I don't get it. the dex cut made competitive more accessible by requiring you to buy less games and transfer less pokemon. you said you didn't want to get into pokemon because of the dex cut. they made the game more accessible for you and your hurt feelings prevented you from getting into competitive. you should laugh at yourself for being a hypocrite.
>why are you laughing at them
>proceeds to defend dexcut with "the dex cut made competitive more accessible by requiring you to buy less games and transfer less pokemon"
you're the village idiot and deserve to be laughed at
I'm countering the argument vgc players are using to justify cheating. it is absolutely true that the dexcut increased accessibility for competitive play. regardless if you are salty that your favorite mon got cut it reduced the number of pokemon you needed to transfer and number of games you had to own. this anon
says he wanted the game to be more accessible then says the dexcut made him lose interest in competing. he is flip flopping on caring and not caring about accessibility and I called him out on it.
>he is flip flopping
he's not flip flopping, he's a normal person like me who likes to bring his pokébros with him or find his old time favorites in the game. The dexcut didn't even deter people from cheating as other anons pointed out.
you guys are flip flopping on wanting the games to be more accessible and working to make the game less accessible based on your dexcut stance. if the dexcut didn't happen you guys would have had to transfer more pokemon to compete which would have decreased accessibility. you guys are against the increase of accessibility through the dex cut so the issue preventing you from competing is something else. if it's not laziness what else is it?
I don't know who that person is you created in your head but my entire stance is: the rules say no modified mons, so you don't use modified mons.
Training your Pokémon is part of the game. It's all connected. If I'm defending something is that part of raising a team to compete includes trading with friends for exclusives, hatching eggs, sometimes soft resetting if you want something very specific from a legendary. Can it be improved? Yes. Is the lack of QoL in some aspects enough to excuse people to compete in an official competition where you can earn money with spoofed Pokémon? Not really.
But I don't really care that much if people spoof them as long as the moves and info are legal. But if you're moronic enough to get caught, that's 100% on you and you deserved it. Not only you can't be assed to play the videogame you're competing to be a "champion" in, you can't even hack the values correctly. In the end, competitors should just play the goddamn game.
> flip flopping
I want the dexcut to be undone and I want IVs to be changeable on a point by point basis via some sort of non rng grinding system. No flip flopping.
I'm not a hypocrite and making VGC more accessible isn't worth the dexcut especially since people still cheat and complain about it being pay to win because of one transfer only Pokémon.
You can breed mons with IVs you want, right?
Then just be a fricking trainer and breed them. Prepare your teams for competition.
Harsher bans. Lifetime bans for me.
Bike simulator isn't fun.
Well practicing league of legends 14 hours a day also isn’t fun but pro teams do that shit. And they can’t spend one hour a day to prepare their mons? Pro players in Pokémon are such fricking manchildren holy shit
I would like to be able to optimize any Pokémon I have by grinding.
Even if things are easier. Letting me grind dittos into perfect breeding machines would be preferable to just spawning 4IV dittos in special cases in my opinion.
breeding is not practice, though. battling is practice. you could breed for a billion hours but that wont help you impove your strategic skills one bit. if you want to get good at the game you need to actually put time in battle and watch other battles when you are not doring so.
Being a trainer is a larp. Pokemon the “esport” isn’t about raising and training pieces of data. It’s about matchups and damage calcs and strategy.
well if it’s about matchups then it’s literally about training your dudes to counter enemy dudes
You can't breed legendaries and mythicals, which you would see a lot in these teams.
I miss Poké Pelago's hot spring incubator.
Are you competing or at least watching competitions on a regular basis? If not your opinion on the matter is literally worthless
A 5 year ban would be enough to kill most cheating and not enough for morons to be deterred. You need a balance like that because it would be funnier.
come back and reply to this post with a legit 6IV legendary. there's Mew raids right now right? be a fricking trainer and get a 6IV Mew if its so easy
>be a fricking trainer and get a 6IV Mew if its so easy
I already did several generations ago lol. Time didn't suddenly start this gen.
There aren't Mew raid right now, what the frick are you talking about? Do you even play the game?
alright Mew DISTRIBUTION
you fricking autist
you obviously haven't played the games or trained a pokemon for competitive
Hyper Training
>catch Mew
>bring it to SV
>give it a Gold Bottle Cap
>31 IV in ATK
>"perfect"
A Mew with all 31s is a 5IV Mew. He asked for a 6IV Mew, meaning 31 in HP, DEF, SATK, SDEF, SPD, and 0 in ATK.
>not running physical mew
My Zacian in Sword was 6IV
I literally moved up a mew from the virtual console the other day and the one non guaranteed 6IV stat was also 31, you suck lmao
You know you can do that in a matter of minutes? Holy frick you proplaygays are pathetic lmao
remove IVs. the only reasons to have less than 31 are "muh foul play" which is pointless minmaxing for something that comes up in 0.01% of matches, and "muh trick room" where you only need 0 because the other guy can have 0.
just rip them out already.
I will accept nothing less than the removal of IVs entirely. They've removed everything else from the games, why not the one mechanic that everyone hates?
They aren't going to remove IVs.
>do thing against rules
>get banned
WOOOOOOOOOOOW
Anyone caught cheating gets a lifetime VGC ban, with an appeal. Those bragging online about how they gladly cheated, cheated at past events, and think cheating is fine get lifetime bans with no appeal and their previous VGC W/L records voided. If they won any tournaments in those previous years, they forfeit their titles and should be made to repay their ill-gotten winnings.
Just say to hell with IVs and get rid of them entirely.
you don't understand anon, I love looking at my rattata's stats and spending an afternoon comparing it to the rattata my friend caught, and seeing how mine is worse. Don't tell me that you didn't spend your childhood comparing stats with your friends instead of playing the game?
>implying you autists dont do exactly this when running damage calcs all fricking day
LMAO
>What's the solution to how IVs encourage cheating in VGC?
GF should just add a zero IV item to the game like they have bottle caps for 31 IVs
Would solve literally every possible issue. They can still ban cheaters but you also stop having to hear about people going "waaah waaah I got banned for cheating even though it was explicitly stated in the rules =~~*((" because people can just use zero IV items now
The only argument against it would be that it gives you way too much control over your Pokemon stats when they're supposed to be animals with varying stats but we passed the point of no return in that regard a long ass time ago back when they introduced Hyper Training
There isn't one because there's nothing wrong with IVs. It's the meta that's wrong. Normally I'd jump at the chance to shit on modern Pokemon games, but the IV system is actually fine. Best scenario for fixing that would be rather than removing them or anything else. This is an issue specifically with the way people play this game at a competitive level, though. No one wants to do work, they all want to cheat and get away with it, but they're lazy a absolute frick or just downright moronic. GF slapped hands over this shit and made the game actively worse for everyone else to try and curb this behavior ("HOME removing non standard moves), but the people who were being punished clearly didn't even notice. What needs to happen is that TPC needs to start handing out bans from tourneys after this. If you're caught cheating or you get DQ'd they should hand you a 5 year ban. This is a video game, if you aren't playing it then you don't deserve to compete in it at a competitive level. Actually play the fricking game and don't cheat, it's an easy fricking solution. If you don't have the time to play it correctly, then don't compete. You clearly don't have the time.
I guess if you want something even more complicated for some reason: They can change the way breeding works. Currently breeding has a chance to take a certain number of IVs from each parent (with items that increase or decrease this chance) and then the rest are determined by RNG. Breeding could be that all IVs are determined by the parents randomly (50/50 chance any specific IV is taken from a parent) and the trainer can just use hold items to force specific stat IVs to be taken. Then the only random IVs you get are in wild Pokemon. I guess that would work. This would also mean bred Pokemon would be by and large stronger than wild ones. But a "Rusty Bottlcap" (like Hyper Training but 0 IVs) would still be an easy way to shut people up, too.
>there's nothing wrong with IVs
You might not like it but it's the truth. The addition of Hyper Training literally fixed any issue you should've ever had with IVs and if they didn't, it's because you were just too dumb to understand the system to begin with or too autistic to accept that the system is fine.
>The addition of Hyper Training literally fixed any issue
No it didn't
Then tell me. Why do you not like IVs, Anon? Now's your chance to lay this shit out. Prove to us you aren't a moron autist who just hates it because he doesn't understand them or doesn't want to understand them.
Hyper Training only lets you go to 31, you have no control over the exact number. So trying to hit any other specific thresholds for Beast Boost or Protosynthesis or 0 for Trick Room just means tediousness that is exactly the same as it's always been. Either let people set their IVs exactly when hyper training, or automatically assume they're all 31 in competition.
>other specific thresholds for Beast Boost or Protosynthesis
Shithead. Fricking EV train correctly.
EVs aren't enough in some cases.
Probably extremely fringe cases that you will rarely do. So you might have to spend 30 minutes finding a mon with the right iv to breed for those extremely fringe cases.
>but i dont have one
So you didn’t play the game and you didn’t complete the pokedex in none of the games.
Also, frick this competitive scene and frick the meta. Pokemon is so fricking terrible for this shit because no one playing it at tournament level has any interest in doing anything but playing a cookie cutter team. What they should do is work toward fixing that shit in a competent way. Like, I assume shit like Tera was meant as a solution to that shit, but it clearly didn't work. There are a ton of ways they can fix this shit, though. Ways that don't involve banning specific Pokemon or just sliding the strength curve up every time a new game gets released.
Nobody fricking breeds in modern comp it's just a waste of time for anything but 0 speed idk why so many people talk about the games like we are in fricking Gen 3
Yeah, I know. I don't expect anyone to breed for anything outside of 0 IVs. But if they well and truly want that shit, they should have to put in work for it.
Because they don't play the games anon
How good you are at bike simulator has nothing to do with actual competitive Pokemon play.
just play the game lol
the game is poorly designed
Then don't play it and don't go to tournaments.
Frick 0 IV items, that's thinking way too small.
Just make the IVs customizable anywhere from 0-31. We don't need any more 17 DEF IV Lonely Statatakas being optimal for the ATK Beast Boosts.
Frick off with removing IVs. I like IVs and you won’t remove a cool mechanic from me because some manchildren cheat in their events. Frick off.
/thread
How is it cool?
>How is it cool?
I like my guys being individualised. I like comparing my pokemon to my friend’s pokemon and seeing that his Petilil has naturally more SpATK but my Petilil is faster. It gives my pokemons even more soul, together with their natures.
I like IVs and some homosexual manchildren won’t remove them from me.
Screenshot a single conversation between you and your friends where you compared how your petilil has naturally less sp atk
Are you asking him to post a screenshot of a random conversation he had with his friend?
I'm asking (you) to prove your bullshit argument that never happened.
Good, they don't like cheaters right? Showdown is cheating.
rent free
I'm not the original anon. I'm just wondering why anon would take a random picture just to post it online to someone who wants proof they had said conversation. For what purpose?
>schizo makes straw man
>ok prove it
>WTF WHY ARE YOU ASKING HIM TO PROVE IT
>straw man
it's literally the best argument against removing ivs i've ever heard
No one ever talks like that. Same reason they've provided nothing.
A few years ago, me and my friends were playing Pokemon Pearl at the same time. From time to time, we were giving each other our reactions to our playthroughs, however we made an effort to not say what we catch and use. After beating the game we shared our teams and, to our surprise, three out of four people had Drifblim in their teams. We had fun comparing them. Mainly movesets but natures and overall stats as well.
This activity made me realize that one of my friends is a complete madman who always EV trains his in-game team. You can easily see who it is on the screenshot.
Cute
Aren't those types of people just the best? The super autistic motherfrickers that suck any and all fun out of every single game by zoning in on the core mechanics and exploiting them so they can have bragging rights about some small thing in their pathetic lives. Gee, I wonder why those types of people don't tend to have any friends? Hmm...
>mindbroken this fast
I wasn't even trying to troll, I was just genuinely curious.
you don't play competitively, who cares what you think lmao
>I like my guys being individualised.
This isn't the Game Boy era anymore, there are ways to individualize Pokémon without having it affect battles. IVs are nice in theory, but in practice almost every mon meant for competitive level play will just end up the same, defeating the purpose.
Natures are fine. 1/25 roll isn't too bad and we can get the desired nature through Synchronize and breeding or stats for competitive thanks to mints.
It has a purpose outside of competitive. Specifically to create the grinding loop for monster raising sim that you do at the end of the game. Thats all that matters. Its super trivial to maximize them now as well so who cares?
>compare pokemon
>your adamant petilil has less spA and less speed than his
now what moron? still enjoying your soulful petilil with shit IVs and nature?
Mint it, cap it, it's ready to go
> IVs
> cool feature
Aren't they adding a mechanic that lets you change your ivs to exactly what you want them to be with mochi? It's going to let you change the base stats of your pokemon. Is that not ivs?
>Bronze Bottle Cap
Hyper train IV to 0
>Plastic Bottle Cap
Hyper train IV by 1
Mochi are for EVs, again, for some brain dead reason
Damn, I'm glad there's a 3rd way to raise your evs!
Ban cheaters
Bring back the grit system and kill off IVs.
how did that work again? I remember using it but I never understood how it translated over or what it actually did
It boosts stats and can max all of them, similar to (but better than) candies in Lets Go. Kinda like being able to give 200 EV to all stats.
But grit system just masked IVs. They were all there and intact under the hood. Only way to estimate was grit started at 0-3 depending on base IVs you had.
Grit sucks, it's just busywork because there isn't a single reason why you wouldn't want something to have maxed out grit.
IVs are motte and Bailey bullshit, people are primarily cheating to get Urshifu who is just fine with a gold bottle cap. Unless GF straight up puts pkHex in the game people will always cheat because it's faster and GF is never going to put pkHex in the games because it goes against the spirit of the game. The only "real" solution is harsher punishments, hacking Pokemon is just part of the culture of the scene.
Stricter bans.
Playing showdown.
Destroying careers with mass reportings of cheaters.
They need to be broken.
>creating a battle simulator game
They shill for this and the only thing they'll accomplish is getting Showdown shut down
>half of the "people" here actually would rather have cheaters banned than qol improvements that would cause less cheating
embarrassing
Why not both?
>less cheating
>Allow genning of teams
>Suddenly everyone who was genning (previously cheating) is no longer cheating (still genning (now legal))
Yeah it would result in less cheating. It would also result in less money too.
>just make cheating legal lol
They already did by adding bottlecaps, ability capsules/patches, and removing the cap on vitamins.
>The tools provided in-game are now considered cheating
Can you please stop replying to me with your stupidity.
If cheating is legal, then it’s not cheating. Learn what actual definitions of words mean next time.
>Hurr If cheating is legal, then it’s not cheating
But it never will be legal, you fricking moron. That's why it's called cheating.
Was this suppose to be a Gotcha moment?
Then why talk about it? Not the checkmate you think it is
>Then why talk about it?
Please take a long look at OP's image and see who's actually talking about it and come back to me. Afterwards I want you to get on your knees and apologize to me for being a fatherless waste of life and go back to twitter where you belong.
I will apologize because now reading the reply chain it appears we are saying the same thing and think anyone entertaining the idea of legal genning becoming possible is moronic. Was lost in the sauce
They're concern trolling, less than half of them even still play the games. Those same people saying how IVs should be untouched will be the first ones when DLC drops to shit talk them and brag how they didn't spend a dollar on it. It's not about what's right or wrong, it's about their autist brains needing to feel a sense of superiority.
>cause less cheating
Even if there was a "rusted bottlecap" that sets an IV to 0...
These people would still cheat.
Because they can't be assed to get their shiny Cresselia legitimately.
Cause it can't be a Cresselia.
It HAS to be shiny.
With the perfect IVs.
The only good thing about the removal of Hidden Power is that it removed the excuse from cheaters they used with how they "have" to cheat for the right IVs.
Well thats the stuff we want weeded out. Doesnt mean they didnt kick my ass fsir and square in a battle, but the integrity of entering a tourney that way is whats thought of as the problem
Remove IVs, EVs and natures. They're shit mechanics.
This thread is a complete waste of time. IV's will never be removed, and I expect harsher punishments for people caught genning and better Pokemon checks.
Genning will never be legal, no matter how much you b***h and moan. You're pretty much here to circle jerk over things you have zero control over. Maybe go start a strike or something, let us know how that turns out. Stop Cheating.
I don't even play VGC I just want to edit IVs legitimately.
This. Bottlecaps are nice but not a fox all solution when you need 30 special attack ivs for flutter or some shit
>Rusty Bottle Cap for 0IV
>Increase drop rates for Ability Patches and increase the amount of Tera shards earned at the end of raids or offer them for money
That's pretty much it.
Give showdown CnD
If these people keep pushing that's what will happen
Keep being vocal tho
Unironically, yeah. CnD Showdown, it's done nothing by hurt this community since day one.
t. salty boot lickers. Enjoy paying for a worse experience than Smogchads get for free.
Also, Game Freak literally can't do anything to Showdown. Worst they could do is tell them to stop using Pokemon names/sprites/models from the games.
>Worst they could do is tell them to stop using Pokemon names/sprites/models from the games.
Exactly. They can't claim ownership over the actual math or stat numbers.
Smogon even has April Fool's Day sprites that could be used as an interim.
>"I'll call them bootlickers! Surely that'll turn the argument around!"
Stop cheating lol.
I hope they go on strike just so TPC blacklists everyone who signs the petition
This. I want to see people who have molded their entire lives around cheating at video games just get lifetime banned from competition, rendering their entire "lives" pointless.
Set them all to 31. Yes it means you lose out on some Beast Boost or Protosynthesis shenanigans, but it prevents all this autism. It's no different than level. You used to be able to under level and run level 49 or 48 mons to underspeed in Trick Room, because sacrificing 2 1-2 def and hp is worth it to gain efectively 1-2 speed. They got rid of that, and while it simplified the game and quashed a valid and creative strategy, it kept things neat and easy.
Just make IVs customizable. You don't have to throw the whole baby out with the bathwater.
if you want to customize your IV's play showdown
shut up cheater
>go to a third-party website if you want to play Pokemon the way you want to
Does this look like good optics for TPCI to you?
Because everyone is rushing to play showdown. amirite?
Why don't you google "pokemon battling" and tell me what the first link you see is. hint, it's not anything cart related.
I have a better one, tell me how many normies
don't bother playing the games because they could just go on showdown.
I don't care what normies do, even though I recognize they make up most of Pokemon's sales.
Normies don't play Pokemon for competition, they play Pokemon for the RPG elements. Normies don't even have a ball in this fight. It's why a PBR style game with Showdown qualities would never work even if it's what comp players want.
>Normies don't play Pokemon for competition, they play Pokemon for the RPG elements.
This is a massive franchise and that's quite the bold statement. but you seem to forget for Pokemon, competitive is part of that RPG experience. Always have been. Many Normies do play competitive / battle, to say no Normies do is completely illogical.
>I don't care what normies do
And TPCI doesn't care what you want specifically. This game is for everyone to play, not for sweaty tryhards who gen and think they are above the rules.
>Many Normies do play competitive / battle, to say no Normies do is completely illogical.
If you asked the average Pokemon buyer to explain the difference between an EV and an IV, I can almost guarantee they wouldn't be able to tell you.
If you do know the difference, then you're probably not a normie
>tryhard
just because you settled for being mediocre in life doesn't mean I have to
It's funny you say this. I can go right now to Pokemon normie plebbit, type in "IV" in search and see threads going back 10 years of normies discussing IV spreads. I know people irl who play pokemon who are normies and they know what IV's are. You can ignore everything I just said, and still the idea that no normies know what IV's are is ridiculous and not realistic.
>just because you settled for being mediocre in life doesn't mean I have to
Cool story sister. Just remember you're not above the rules. Genning will never be legal and IV's aren't going anywhere.
I'm not really following this convo but I always think it's funny how /vp/ will simultaneously try to hold the positions that "the games need to be harder because not only casuals play these games" and "Gamefreak needs to stop putting so much effort into comp because casuals don't care about that"
The common sense solution would be to add an item that let's you reset IVs and to reduce the mmo tier grind for all the comp shit
A pie in the sky dream is for GF to implement granularity in customizing mons and some sort of battle resort side area type thing for comp to get a hand on mons (temporarily) you otherwise would have difficulty obtaining yourself legally (make it something like 'you need to register the mon in your dex first' if you really want to commit to it). This all is for naught when you recognize that GF doesn't even acknowledge natures and their tie to stats more than it has to much less IV and EV mechanics beyond a few blurbs of text.
The expected solution is that they're going to add an item that costs 10 trillion Pokeshekels that reduces your IVs by 10. But hey at least then you just need to hack in the money.
Dont cheat
up the hack checks
lifetime bans, repay all winnings if ill gotten
its a competition, and cheating is an unfair advantage
>What's the solution to how IVs encourage cheating in VGC?
1. Ban the cheaters.
2. Problem solved
/thread
If you start banning cheaters from future competitions, they'll stop cheating out of fear.
No, they'll just cheat smarter. They'll start sending their rentals to people with hack checking software outside of TPCI.
Absolutely nothing will come of this.
>cheat smarter
Yeah VGCplayers can't even gen properly. I'm sure more of them will get DQ'd in the future
yes typically after you see the person in front of you fall in a pit trap, you don't also fall in said pit trap. you walk around it.
>See someone fall into a pit trap
>stare at them flailing around
>walk in and fall as well
>Blame the trees
Sounds like your Average VGCplayer to me.
>stare at them flailing around
how do you stare at someone in front of you if they're in a hole?
>Blame the trees
what do trees have to do with pit traps? how do you frick up greentexting like this?
there must be a no-tolerance rule against cheating like in every single other fricking game
pokemon has such a clown fricking pro scene game i swear
>They'll start sending their rentals to people with hack checking software outside of TPCI.
In 99% of the cases it's more effort than breeding and training a mon legitimately.
Ban all who bring 0 IV mons not native to SV
They literally should add IV training items and reduction items
I will laugh if they introduce a new mechanic in gen 10 that makes all pokemon at level 50 go full 31IV in all stats
The solution is to make the mechanic transparent. In gen 3 IV range was doubled to make it even more random, which is moronic. Then you got these natures and abilities and all that other crap as well, and the hidden abilities and all the gift and event crap, breed moves, and so on. And of course there are shinies as well.... Basically, they made it so that it is impossible to get *exactly* the mon you want. AND this is why the cheaters cheat. Because they are too lazy to compete with japanese AUTISM.
Now, over time they've added a bunch of garbage to try and change a pokemon you do not want to one you actually want. This is good, but it's still very poorly designed. They could have simplified the entire procesd by just having you farm mcguffins to a power a single machine you placed your mon in that could change all the aspects. They could have made all information you needed easily available so you would know how many mcguffins you needed. Sadly, pokemon is owned by game freak..
In any case, stop cheating.
>Any other monster raising franchise.
>Players will gladly put in the work to build that one perfect mon, no matter how obtuse the mechanics are.
>Pokemon
>"noooooooooooooo remove ivs remove natures remove egg moves remove leveling i want my godmon and i want it RIGHT NOW!!!1!"
Monster rancher comes to mind, ultra Kaiju is surprisingly fun
no other monster raising franchise works the way Pokemon does and no other monster raising franchise has national tourneys
Why would there being national tourneys for other monster franchises be an argument in favor of genning?
Why do you think the existence of a more popular, official competition method would have people excuse generating? If anything they'd say it's a stronger argument against genning.
I play other monster raising games and the first reaction people have at hacking in these RPGs is cringing and having 2nd-hand-embarrassment.
Pokemon isn't a monster raising game. It's a monster battling game with a poorly designed raising mechanic bolted on
Not according to the creators that just banned morons like you. Learn to have fun and actually enjoy video games for more than being the best on the playground, ya frickin soulless frick.
>Not according to the creators
Then why are almost all additions and adjustments for SWSH and SV catering to VGC?
Wveryone loves pointing out pvp battling was an afterthought of gen 1. It was designed as a single player rpg primarilly. But at this point can you argue raising and training arent integral design desicions when
>so many of them exist and some are required to be used if you want to optimize
and
>GF seems adamant they must be done by the books withint thier definition of "legit" or else the player is subjected to disqualification
?
Ban Legendaries and Mythicals. Now no one can b***h about the Pokemon they want being unbreedable and you also cut out cancer like the Forces of Nature out. Maybe Paradox Mon too since they seem to be very ultra centralizing "pick Long Misdreavus/Metal Hariyama to win" mon atm.
Force homies to get creative again. Every damn team is the same.
What happened to my gimmick teams? Weather? Baton Passing? Meme magic? Shit like this is lame and fricking bogus.
We ain't gonna get no Pachirisu tanking Draco Meteor in a massive upset-tier shit ever again. Just the same 4-6 Legendaries/Mythicals/Paradoxes on every team.
>Ban Legendaries
That format exists, it's called Series 1 of a new Gen. It'd be boring if the rules didn't change for three years.
>What happened to my gimmick teams?
Open team sheets.
>Weather?
Weather has and continues to be viable. Most teams have at least some weather component, even if it's slotting in a weather move to potentially overwrite enemy weather.
>Baton Passing?
Outside of Extreme Eevoboost in Gen 7 this was never a thing in VGC.
Literally just remove IVs. They only exist to pointlessly pad out the game just like having to grind for fricking gear slots in Splatoon.
>add an item that gives 0IV on a stat
>even much better give an IV and EV item that allows users to manipulate how much of each they need specifically
>a new Key Item where you can change Pokeballs for your shitters, this would eliminate Ball autismo overnight
>keep mints and bottle caps
>instead of an IV judge, make both IVs and EVs visible so there will be no need to download Pkhex (outside of finding out your SID)
people think more QOL will help. these Black folk don't play the game in the first place.
Exactly. No ammount of items will suddenly make people play legit. They need to theorycraft in the damage calculator
But it makes things better for everyone else
That's the official showdown option
I'm not against QOL for regular players. But the excuses created are never going to go away. Why take ten minutes when you could take eight and cheat will always be a thing for these people.
get rid of trick room and there's no reason to have 0IV Pokemon
Coward. Where is the "It's not an issue" option.
Gamefreak wouldn't even notice if all those gays boycotted. It's the casual audience who carry the games not the competitive autists
But Smogontards lost the VGC yesterday
>Jap kids were just using cookiecutter meta teams you find easily online
>Jap teenager mogged a Smogontard NPC with his unique team
>Jap Master competitor mogged another Smogontard NPC with a cookiecutter meta team that he devised
how come this was never a problem when i competed
if you're too dumb to cheat you deserve to get banned
if you just want to play sims then stick to showdown
>WE WANT CHEATING TO BE LEGAL!!
How fricking entitled can you be?
They already made bottle caps what more could you want?
I want hyper training to effect breeding vgc players want IV reducing items
Why don’t they stick to simulators since they clearly prefer that anyway? It probably cost more to travel to japan than whatever winnings they could have gotten
They want internet clout.
>Remove IVs
>Remove EVs cap, ev train all stats
Return to Kanto.
or we keep the rules and it's a moron filter because the hack check is the most basic level shit.
Just introduce rusted bottle caps.
vgc players wouldn't grind for them they're too lazy
People who want to get rid of IVs are insane communists
The next game will go back to gen 1 mechanics. Nothing matters but winning the speed tie and getting crits.
I will never get caught or banned for genning my teams. I don’t care if I scrub out of every regional I go to. The point is I will not stop and no one can make me stop. Seethe harder you concern trolling homosexuals
you're gonna get banned for cheating and cry about on X when they look at your low play time x999 of every item and box full of competitive pokemon. tell us how you demand respect please
Why would I hack for money and items moron. I literally only gen mons and I’m autistic enough to make sure there’s no way to get detected
There are 2 solutions.
The first one is to have a way to generate pokemon directly in game. GF will never do it, because they evidently think that competitive is side content at best and not worth ruining the "lore" of the game for it.
The second one is removing IVs, which again won't happen for the same reason. This would also frick over some pokemon since you couldn't have 0 ivs in speed for trick room or atk for that dark move that uses the atk of the pokemon hit, I forgot its name.
option 3 would be to ban people with a 0 ATK and SPD IV Cresselia and 0 SPD IV Enamorous since they're impossible to get. option 4 would be to remove foul play and trick room
>option 4 would be to remove foul play and trick room
Don't give them ideas
>The second one is removing IVs, which again won't happen for the same reason.
Multiplayer can already automatically set your levels to 50, lore is meaningless in pvp.
If you want to use 0 speed for trick room then put the effort
I breed everything with a hacked shiny ditto, all the children are legal
These same people will laugh at this image and say "you deserved it, you didn't follow the rules".
its simple, really
cheating is fine if you don't get caught
but if you get caught, you have no right to b***h about it
The solution to IVs? Make them cosmetic values. No more of that stat bullshit, IVs will now determine the slight color variation of your pokemon like how Spinda have different spots based on their IVs.
How about we actually keep things as intended so people who grind really hard earn the perk of having a properly IVed mon? Prepwork for strat planning is already rewarded as intended, and 99% of the rest of the game's teambuilding works (grind money for vitamins or EV train as normal, grind for bottle caps and TM ingrediants) fine. For those autistic enough to breed for 0 attack 0 speed or reset for legends kind of earned those, didnt they?
>How about we actually keep things as intended so people who grind really hard earn the perk of having a properly IVed mon?
Because it’s completely arbitrary to the actual meat of the competition. EV training would be like requiring athletes to watch paint dry or to play that saving baby easter egg in Stanley Parable. Doing so would let them earn their Jersey that they need to replace every season. Not a single other competitive game in the world requires you to do a bunch of arbitrary tasks in order to simply prepare for the competition.
The competitive scene is not separated from the game.
Saying this is like saying the Halo or COD campaigns are part of the multiplayer.
So what are your thoughts on teamsharing? You don’t have to “play the game (doing a bunch of arbitrary chores)” if you only use teams someone else made and handed to you.
the gameplay in cod and halo are nothing like pokemon you can't compare them.
>So what are your thoughts on teamsharing?
Rentals have been a thing since S/M. They even have in-game Rental teams. Any other moronic thoughts you want to share or can I go make breakfast.
I disagree because (unless Im mistaken) the campaigns have no bearing on the pvp, clearly not the same here. In Splatoon 1 you needed to beat the campaign to unlock the Dynamo Roller, the only weapon unable to be purchased from Sheldon. That is a more apt comparison because its a built in game requirement. Helps thatbyou technically have 8 other generations of games, Home, Go, and VC releases to also pull from, but ultimatley still needs the prepwork in any combination to function.
>Saying this is like saying the Halo or COD campaigns are part of the multiplayer.
Whether you like it or not, it's part of the same campaign.
We're unfortunately not using a game like Stadium or Battle Revolution or Showdown to compete. And it'd likely not gonna change that much if we competed in a Stadium model because you'd likely still have to use the Pokémon from the game.
The point of the game is to compete with your pokébros. It's a tamagotchi-like thing. You're not supposed to turn it into a souless "I bought this race dog with tons of drugs and I'll have a fair chance now".
I agree with most of your point but the "pokebro" point combined with the Karengay pic makes me think you're now leaning too far in the other direction, careful anon. Sure I can with with my imperfect Flutter Mane with 31 attack IVs, but that's not the same as saying "I can just use shitmons without context or strategy and make it to the top"
Nah of course. I mean to say you can still get properly trained mons, but it's important you're the one doing the work (game design wise). As in you're the trainer who proudly caught the mon and trained it or minted, or hypertrained, whatever.
>I have to..play...le game?
Consider the point you're trying to make against the replies before; its clear that Pokemon is emphasizing how they only want legit nongenned pokemon regsrdless of them meeting battle-relevant legal attributes. Does this not indicate they value the training and prepwork as much as the battles themselves?
>Consider the point you're trying to make against the replies before; its clear that Pokemon is emphasizing how they only want legit nongenned pokemon regsrdless of them meeting battle-relevant legal attributes. Does this not indicate they value the training and prepwork as much as the battles themselves?
It really fricking doesn’t.
Unlike Teambuilding, real training is limitless. An Athlete can always train to become faster, stronger, and endure more. With teambuilding you just hit a hard cap until your Pokemon’s stats are all maximized.
The actual training of Pokemon is practicing strategy, against real people. Not “I walked around an empty area all day and mashed A at certain locations”, against literally nobaby because you’re not competing against anyone.
Have you ever played the bug catching contest in gsc? You actually are competing to find the best catch. This is the same thing in an irl context. Only difference is you have a near unlimited time before an event to find your maximum efficient pokemon to use.
>The actual training of Pokemon is practicing strategy, against real people. Not “I walked around an empty area all day and mashed A at certain locations”, against literally nobaby because you’re not competing against anyone.
How you get there is irrelevant as long as its legal in game, but that aside it seems Pokemon disagrees, otherwise they wouldnt care about genning pokemon that are mechanically legal but hacked
Stop using what aboutisms pokemon is a turn based rpg and training your homosexuals is the point you lazy Black person
is right. A true Pokémon Champion has to make greater sacrifices to be better than everyone else.
There isn't an in-game solution because cheaters don't play the games anyway
Weve gotten to a point people are telling japanese children to commit crimes instead of play the game. VGCucks have zero shame.
Next you'll ask for card printing to be legal because you don't have enough money to buy the cards you need for a competitive TCG deck.
You guys really said "we want genning to be legal", you are beyond moronic if you truly believe that's a possibility.
man the VGCheaters are embarrassing themselves and getting BTFO in every thread
Why does /vp/ suddenly care about VGC? I thought you gays just played battle sims without any raising of Pokemon at all?
vp doesnt play the games, their reactionary to the hot drama of the day.
Kill IVs. You ban the cheaters and more will show up. You remove the incentive to cheat and it stops being a problem.
Kill IVs, then rework the older games to remove the mechanic entirely and make hidden power have a flat base power with a random type.
I don't get it breeding 6 IVs mons are easy, why to much complain?
Ban cheaters, introduce an item or service that allows to reduce the IV of a specific Stat.
I’ve been watching more competitive Pokemon lately and the younger divisons are way more fun to watch than the Masters division. The competitive matches as a whole would be more accessible to watch if they were forced to use rentals/fan favorites. A 4v4 with 6 rentals could be really compelling.
Masters division pros get their pokemon hacked, gifted from fans, or they say "gifted from fans" when really they're hacked. Junior divisions get their pokemon from older players like siblings or madter division players they get help from, ironically not too different.
All the more reason to have a Rentals division.
Why do we care about IVs? those are a lot easier to get than fricking tera crystals. 50 of those for 1 mon is AIDS. you have to grind an entire day just for 1 mon. while IVs/EVs are fairly easy
Because even though hyper training exists now before gen 6 and even during gen 6 IVs created the incentive to cheat thus normalizing cheating with the Pokémon community. Even non vgc players had hacked 6IV dittos to make breeding for Battle chateau easier for themselves. That's kinda why I want editable IVs that effect breeding even though hyper training is a thing so, less egregious cheaters can retroactively earn that what they cheated for.
Here’s a good question for everyone. Is RNG manipulating for shiny perfect stat mons in older games and trade them up to SV considered cheating?
it's easier and faster to catch a shiny and buy some silver coins
But this is the best way to get 0 Spe and 0 SpA IV perfect legendaries
>What's the solution to how IVs encourage cheating in VGC?
Remove IVs
>But muh trick room
Remove IVs
>But muh 0 atk vs foul play
Remove IVs
>But what if hidden power returns
Remove IVs
>But muh beast boost manipulation
Remove IVs
>But muh individuality and characteristics
Remove IVs
Are IVs and Eevees autistic?
Its a cope tourneygays use to pretend pokemon is a strategic esport and not a baby game with rng
>he doesnt into opprotunity cost and risk management
>What's the solution to how IVs encourage cheating in VGC?
Being less lenient towards cheaters.
Fact: the game works just fine. Getting a 0 speed pokemon is a sign of determination. Everything works as intended
Defend or refute this
Personally, he lost me hard at the tourism and money talk; in one breath he says the Hawaiians dont want us there and dont need our money because it leads to gentrification, and yet in another he advocates to donate to a charity for a relief fund regarding the wildfires, seeming to contradict himself, but that has nothing to do with his arguments cheating, genning, and accesibility of pokemon.
It's weird that a white guy is taking the actual center stage from the people he's trying to defend and not letting the speak...oh wait. No it isn't. That's par the fricking course for this sort of shit. I find it hard to believe that this guy has ever in his life spoken to a Hawaiin person ever, but if he had I would've given way more pause and interest if he had gotten that person to talk about this stuff instead of himself. If he wants to change this and speak up for a group of minority people, the least he could do is give them a voice instead of talking over them for them. It's a super white colonizer thing to do.
I shall refute: He pronounced Raikou wrong.
They'll just ignore you, just like how they ignore all one star ratings on Pokemon Center. Their shit sizes are lying to you.
The only solution is to offer an in-depth teambuilder as robust as Showdown that can be used to create a team that's allowed to participate in VGC.