What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
Expectations for the DLC?
I think in Elden Ring too many things are disjointed, I don't think the DLC will answer anything.
Yes I care about lore in Souls game, story, worlbuilding, atmosphere and presentation are what elevates Bloodborne as the best From game
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DEAREST
MIQUELLA
>"no dude he's not raping a juvenile little boy, miquella is like 15 gazillion years old dude"
what's up with pedophilia in japan?
i really did try to care about it, but its just all so deliberately vague that you're expected to fill the gaps with headcannon that i just gave up
Good lore
Bad story telling
And I agree with how the whole story connects being too vague for me to really give a shit about
The little pockets of storyline that you could piece together are interesting on their own
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
Non-existent
Next
Elden Ring lore seemed more interesting than Dark Souls but somehow even less cohesive
I wonder which parts GRRM wrote. Probably the Mohg-Miquella relationship and the relationships between Radagon-Marika-Godfrey and Renala
Godfrey is a fight gay clear japanese shonen archetype
I think the whole Marika banishes the Tarnished so she can call them when she needs them is from made
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
Bad-to-Great, except for ER which has dogshit lore that doesn't actually exist.
Everything that has some semblance of causality is clearly GRRM. His entire writing style is based on cause-effect-counter effect-new cause. The ERing being shattered and causing a war between siblings is completely GRRM, the reason of the ring being shatter being a vague clusterfrick of "what the frick even knows" and Marika also being Radagon for absolutely no reason at all is entirely Miyahacki.
Don't fricking bother calling me a GRRM drone that fat frick's writing is mostly dogshit, but it's coherent through and through, unlike Souls, which is just made up on the fly.
>somehow even less cohesive
You have to wait for the DLC. the DLC is going to be a major addition to the game. Probably adding things to the overworld as well as exploring the lore behind already established characters who dont have a lot known about them yet.
Dark souls DLC was also needed to make sense of a lot of stuff in the base game. Elden ring is less cohesive right now because a large amount of puzzles to the lore arent in the game yet.
>Marika Being Radagon is Miyahacki
That sounds like a very western concept though.
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
People meme on them hard but I actually like the format. I just wish they do something different than using the same motif over and over again.
let me guess miquella is a trap and is gonna get more fanart than that squidboi from dark souls
the entire premise is the creators inserting their twisted fetish into this game series
Myazaki's fetish is bare feet
Miquella is a god with dual identities created with eternal youth, whos powers either terrified people (his own homicidal sister) or impressed them (Radagon).
Many characters in the game have some kind of duality to them, either in terms of sharing a body, sharing a soul, or having a split identity.
It's one of the main thematic elements, but I don't really understand what it's supposed to be getting at.
It's mostly a critique of people who present themselves one way and act entirely the opposite, a common flaw of leaders, especially the emperors and monarchs of old. This idea comes to a head in Morgott's boss cutscene, where he lists of the original titles of each of his siblings, just to drive home how far they diverged from their expectations. "Godrick the Golden", descendant of the resplendent Godwyn who managed to broker peace with fricking dragons and was loved by everyone in the world, is a greedy, pathetic monster, hated by literally everyone who knows his name, controlling a small militia of outcast soldiers, despised even by his own son. "Lunar Princess Ranni" abandoned both the kingdom of her father and the lands of her mother to larp as some sort of cosmic revolutionary because divorce made her sad, ultimately playing into the hands of a god much more devious than the greater will. "General Radahn" betrayed the very empire founded by the men after which he styled himself, and in the process was humbled and driven to distant deserts. "Praetor Rykard", once a respected religious leader, literally destroyed himself in a ravenous bid to literally consume spirituality, after being upset that there were limits to the cruelty of the golden order which he wanted to go past. Malenia, the "blade of Miquella", was never anything more than a thorn in his side, failing to protect him in his hour of need, ultimately destroying not only his life's work, but a large portion of the land he was trying to save.
Miquella himself is the only of Morgott's living siblings (if indeed he does live) who can rightly be called just. He did leave the golden order, but for entirely understandable reasons, and rather than seek to disrupt what little order or good that Leyendell could provide the world, he sought to supplement it with his own benevolence. His only failing was being weaker than he was kind.
You're right that the various demi-gods can be hypocrites, but Malenia marches to Miquella's orders for the post part, so Miquella bears some blame as well. Also, Godrick isn't necessarily Godwyn's descendant, so the comparison is more to Godfrey.
The "golden" line comes through Godwyn, Godwyn was the only normal child of Marika's and Godfrey's. Godfrey's only other two children with her were omens, which is likely the real reason he was banished, she thought it was something wrong with him. Of course the real reason most her kids came out fricked is because she had the seed of all creation right above her pussy.
We have no reason to believe than Malenia's march to Caelid was at her brother's orders. Everything points to her doing it to prove she was the strongest motherfricker in the world, though she probably rationalized it as bringing glory to Miquella.
There were several demi-gods of the golden lineage, hence why there were several demi-gods murdered on the Night of the Black Knives. The remains of those demi-gods are found in the Wandering Mausoleums. What matters is that Godrick is a distant descendant in the golden lineage, not that he's descended from any particular member of the golden lineage. Godfrey was specifically sent away as part of Marika's plan to keep the Tarnished out of the Lands Between then recall them as the ultimate ace up her sleeve to kill the Elden Beast, and this includes Godfrey.
Malenia does everything for Miquella sake, and even the statues in Elphael imply that Miquella is the head deity there. Marching to Caelid was likely to amass Great Runes to help empower the Haligtree, and defeating Radahn could potentially show that it was absolutely pointless to try fighting Malenia so as to make everyone else surrender and comply with Miquella's ideal age.
The lesser demigods of gold were all derived from Godwyn. That's why over subsequent generations their blood became thin, with Godrick having almost none, his son even less.
>Malenia does everything for Miquella sake,
I'm sure that's how she thinks of it. But her own boss fight makes it clear, that's not who she really is. Why else would she spare Godrick, a horrific monster who was at her mercy, simply for surrendering and begging forgiveness, but insist on destroying an entire continent simply to avoid losing a fight she started against Radahn, a generally well liked noble who had done her and her brother no harm? Ego. Pure, unadulterated ego. It wasn't enough to be the greatest warrior of the savior of the world. She needed to prove she was the most powerful person to ever live.
They weren't all derived from Godwyn, there's nothing stopping Marika and Godfrey from having lots of kids. The bloodline thinned out because these beings live for ages, so the oldest are still around at the same time as their distant descendants. The Grafted Scion enemies are probably of the golden lineage too, perhaps a mix of Godrick's cousins and possible own children. Heck, there's also Godefroy, as gratuitous as he is. Furthermore, by Godrick's "son", are you referring to Gostoc? If so, them being related is cut content with nothing left in the game to imply there's meant to be a connection.
Malenia would probably spare Godrick because Miquella asked her not to kill people she could make just enforce Miquella's ideal order instead. Miquella wanted to cure Malenia of the Scarlet Rot, so clearly he wouldn't approve of the Scarlet Aeonia. However, Malenia was desperate to try making Miquella's goals a reality, and the Scarlet Rot outer god had likely been trying to warp her mind for ages, resulting in her desperate gamble in Caelid that wound up not paying off.
By the time the player character faces Malenia at Elphael, the Scarlet Rot outer god is likely controlling her to an extent, hence why her first reaction to a new arrival at the shelter island is to kill them -- the Tarnished might have only come after the standstill between the demi-gods, so she wouldn't innately know what a Tarnished was. Millicent's quest is also about giving Malenia her free will back. Heck, the needle the player receives in turn is part of a quest to purge the Frenzied Flame and regain one's own autonomy for selecting an ending.
Millicent's quest is completely undermined by the fact that we know that Malenia willingly gave in to the Scarlet Rot simply to avoid having been defeated. She does the same again to you. Absolutely nothing in the game suggests that her selfish, arrogant behavior is somehow not indicative of her true personality. Perhaps you have been just as bewitched by her alien beauty as the army of simps at her command.
I still wish Millicent and Malenia were actually the same person and Millicent wasn’t just some clone made from the Scarlet Aeonia after the Shattering already occurred. I couldnt care less if people complained about a heavily advertised boss being tied to an extensive quest, it just made more sense thematically.
That I agree with, it would have been a more touching and interesting story
Malenia took a desperate gamble in Caelid because she worried that with her defeat, Miquella's aims would become impossible to realize. The Scarlet Rot outer god had also been trying to affect Malenia for her entire life, and thus in that desperate scenario managed to get its foot in the door. Malenia's hope was likely that she could prevail at Caelid and hold onto herself just long enough for Miquella to perfect the Haligtree and his order to cure her and safeguard the world. By the time the boss fight happens, the Scarlet Rot outer god is calling the shots, and Phase 2 likely happens solely because the outer god seeks it. When defeated and given the needle, Malenia gives the Tarnished a separate needle that might help protect their freedom just like the needle she received is meant to protect her own.
Radagon would have been killed because, if Marika only survived as the hypothetical Gloam-Eyed Queen because her other aspect died in her place, that aspect would be Radagon, meaning he couldn't have existed for the Liurnian Wars and the like afterward.
>Malenia took a desperate gamble in Caelid because she worried that with her defeat, Miquella's aims would become impossible to realize
Totally unsubstantiated head canon. Not only is there no basis for fighting Radahn helping Miquella, there's no basis for Radahn wanting Miquella to fail.
>The Scarlet Rot outer god had also been trying to affect Malenia for her entire life, and thus in that desperate scenario managed to get its foot in the door.
SHE pulled the needle. She CHOSE to be the goddess of rot. Rather than admit defeat, at the hands of someone sympathetic to her brother.
>When defeated and given the needle, Malenia gives the Tarnished a separate needle that might help protect their freedom just like the needle she received is meant to protect her own.
Malenia gives you a needle that can prevent the whole world from dying. Literally everyone in the whole game would want you to have it except Shabriri
Gowry wouldn't want you to have it either
He probably would if he knew what not having it would cause, the total destruction of creation.
Malenia had been resisting the Scarlet Rot her entire life, hence why she even developed the power to heal from landing blows upon getting her Great Rune. It was that spirit of defiance against the Scarlet Rot that was her greatest asset. Millicent also says that Malenia discarded part of herself in desperation to defeat Radahn, and we know that Malenia and Miquella basically did everything for each other. Miquella was the leader of Elphael, so he called the shots, and Morgott accuses all of the demi-gods of basically partaking in the Shattering one way or another.
As for why Radahn would be an opponent, he had his own idea for what the Lands Between should be like, hence why he tried to conquer Leyndell at one point. Miquella's ideal requires him to basically be the Elden Lord (or in his case, god), whereas Radahn's ideal has Radahn calling the shots, Godrick wants to rule it all, Rykard wants to be in charge, etc. Malenia broke the needle at Aeonia to try channeling the Scarlot Rot, hoping it would help her win and that she could keep enough of herself in the aftermath until Miquella resolved things. This gamble didn't work out well, and the encroaching will of the Scarlet Rot outer god is likely what pushed her to think it'd play ball to an extent. As can be seen with Vyke, the outer gods can try to outright take over people and make them into pawns, so Malenia had to struggle with that throughout her life. The needle Malenia provides upon getting her own back is meant to help fend off the influence of outer gods in general, not just the Frenzied Flame.
>Malenia had been resisting the Scarlet Rot her entire life, hence why she even developed the power to heal from landing blows upon getting her Great Rune. It was that spirit of defiance against the Scarlet Rot that was her greatest asset
This is Ganker level of waifugay headcanon
>and we know that Malenia and Miquella basically did everything for each other.
No, we fricking don't. We literally don't have a SINGLE EXAMPLE of Malenia living up to her title. THAT IS THE POINT. Almost nobody in the game DOES live up to their ostensible title or identity, and in playing the game we find out who they really are.
>As for why Radahn would be an opponent, he had his own idea for what the Lands Between should be like, hence why he tried to conquer Leyndell at one point. Miquella's ideal requires him to basically be the Elden Lord (or in his case, god), whereas Radahn's ideal has Radahn calling the shots,
Again, just totally making shit up. Radahn gave up his dreams of conquering Leyendell, and Miquella both never tried and it's never suggested he had any ambition to try.
Anon, what you dismiss as "waifugay headcanon" is the literal item description of Malenia's Great Rune, as well as the item description for the talisman depicting her being trained by the same blind swordsman who sealed the Scarlet Rot outer god in the past.
Malenia literally leads the military of Miquella's nation. Everything Malenia says about Miquella is to describe him as the most wise and formidable demi-god whose ideas are the best for the world. The worship in Elphael is solely toward Miquella, as is the worship at Ordina. Miquella calls the shots and Malenia acts as the military leader her brother's curse prevents him from being. Even in the boss fight, with the Scarlet Rot outer god holding the reins, the parts of Malenia that still manifest are her devoted care for her brother and the feeling that she has failed him upon losing.
Radahn never gave up his goals of conquering Leyndell, he was just repelled by Margit, later became the Starscourge, and then Elphael invaded Caelid before he ever tried to invade Leyndell again. Morgott considers all of them traitors, as opposed to being on neutral or good terms with any demi-god, so it's clear that they, as the narration and other characters say, partook in the Shattering and tried to rule the Lands Between.
>Anon, what you dismiss as "waifugay headcanon" is the literal item description of Malenia's Great Rune,
Malenia's rune describes a "spirit of resistance". You say that it's her will to fight the scarlet rot, and yet we know she was willing to surrender to it even under low stakes. No, what it is is her resistance to the defeat, which is what she actually cares about. Look at what it does, it allows her to strike back at an enemy that has managed to wound her and recover.
>Malenia literally leads the military of Miquella's nation.
No, she leads the cleanrot knights, a sec all her own, infested with her rot. The haligtree knights are a separate faction.
>Miquella calls the shots
You keep saying this but offer absolutely no proof. Not only is there no rational explanation for Malenia's march to Caelid, it literally got him kidnapped and his tree ruined.
>Even in the boss fight, with the Scarlet Rot outer god holding the reins, the parts of Malenia that still manifest are her devoted care for her brother and the feeling that she has failed him upon losing.
The parts of her that manifest are the parts of her willing to bloom scarlet aeonia in the heart of her dear brother's haligtree just to win a fight against a random tarnished, which she started. She doesn't actually care and never fricking did. It was always an act. Even if it was good enough to fool herself.
Malenia's main foe she resisted her entire life was the Scarlet Rot, hence why she was even specifically trained by the blind swordsman who sealed the Scarlet Rot outer god. This swordsman, proficient in stopping the rot, helped Malenia develop the will and resilience to stand against it for ages, as per the Prosthesis-Wearer Heirloom's description. Even her personal knights, the Cleanrot Knights, accept having to resist the Scarlet Rot as she does, as the fungi growing on them is called "cordyceps" in the game files, after the fungus that takes control of ants' bodies. The Cleanrot Knights might be her personal knights, but Malenia oversees the general military of Elphael, akin to how Godfrey lead both the Crucible Knights and entire armies.
Malenia's Great Rune notes that the Scarlet Rot even tries to hinder basic healing and health, yet it's Malenia's will of defiance -- in this context, clearly defiance against the Scarlet Rot -- that lets it confer a benefit. Even Millicent, and the item description of the repaired needle she provides, notes that "There is something I must return to Malenia. The dignity, the sense of self, that allowed her to resist the call of the scarlet rot." The Scarlet Rot actively seeks to affect people's minds, so it's not like Malenia didn't have an outside pressure on her, and a similar story is seen with Vyke and even the player character, courtesy of the Frenzied Flame.
Morgott claims all the demi-gods were traitors, and the narration and various characters say they all partook in the Shattering. Thus, Miquella did too, and with his attempts to nourish the Haligtree and break his curse, he likely sought the Great Runes for that purpose while also wanting to rule. Malenia would have marched out for that purpose, and once the Scarlet Rot gets it first foothold, Malenia can't resist things like the phase transition at Elphael anymore.
This isn't waifu shit, this is canon. BTW, Radahn beat her.
>Malenia's main foe she resisted her entire life was the Scarlet Rot,
The scarlet rot was her trump card, her greatest weapon. She never hid her infection and let her clean rot knights become infected with it.
>Scarlet Rot outer god. This swordsman, proficient in stopping the rot, helped Malenia develop the will and resilience to stand against it for ages, as per the Prosthesis-Wearer Heirloom's description.
That is not what the description says, it just says she became strong under his teaching.
>but Malenia oversees the general military of Elphael,
According to nothing
> in this context, clearly defiance against the Scarlet Rot
If it was resistance against the scarlet rot, it would just counter the effects of the rot. Instead it counters external damage, IE, being defeated in combat.
>Even Millicent, and the item description of the repaired needle she provides, notes that "There is something I must return to Malenia. The dignity, the sense of self, that allowed her to resist the call of the scarlet rot."
True. But here's the thing: she doesn't fricking know. She never met Malenia and knows nothing about her.
>Morgott claims all the demi-gods were traitors,
Morgott is ass hurt he left to make his own tree
> he likely sought the Great Runes for that purpose
Malenia didn't take Godrick's. It clearly wasn't for great runes.
>The scarlet rot was her trump card, her greatest weapon. She never hid her infection and let her clean rot knights become infected with it.
Her knights are literally dying from the rot, it is a death sentence and something that they willingly chose to receive since just being near Malenia for extended periods of time cause them to be rotted, it's not something she ordered them to do. The Aeonian bloom is also the first time she had ever used the scarlet rot as a weapon and it nearly killed her. Are you really trying to argue that the Rot is something Malenia willingly embraced and utilized willy nilly? Even in her fight she literally has to be killed before it happens, if she wanted she could've used it from the beginning, or use it against Radahn from the start.
>Her knights are literally dying from the rot,
Really? Because I saw dozens of the frickers all around the lands between, so apparently it takes a while.
>Are you really trying to argue that the Rot is something Malenia willingly embraced and utilized willy nilly?
Well yeah, because that's literally what she fricking did in the game's trailer
Why are you even arguing man, you haven't read the lore, what basis are you even getting your dumbass headcanons from
>The Cleanrot Knights vowed to fight alongside Malenia, despite the inevitable, if gradual, putrefaction of their flesh. Their acceptance of their fate made these battles fiercest of all.
They are literal sludge under the armor, it's supposed to show how dedicated they are that they willingly fight alongside Malenia despite that their death becomes a painful inevitability. Also rune of death being removed fricks with everything so there's that.
>Well yeah, because that's literally what she fricking did in the game's trailer
The Aeonian Bloom is the first time she had ever used the rot as a power. She could've embraced the rot from the very beginning and become exponentially more powerful if that's something she cared about.
nta but who the frick are you to talk about headcanon lmfao
What exactly is incorrect about what that anon said?
How on earth would Malenia hide the flesh-eating rot she was cursed with from birth? She hated the Scarlet Rot, it even took three of her limbs away. The rot was never her weapon, it was what she opposed and what Miquella specifically wanted to cure her of. Malenia didn't let her Cleanrot Knights become affected either, the stuff basically emanated from her like a miasma. Malenia only resorted to trying to use the rot once, and that was in her desperate hour at the Battle of Aeonia. The Heirloom talisman clearly implies that the strength this rot-vanquishing swordsman taught her was key to her own efforts to repel the rot.
Malenia marched with an entire army to Caelid, not a batallion of knights, and even her gear tells, via a direct quote by Malenia, of her reverence for her brother and deference to his authority: "My brother will keep his promise. He possesses the wisdom, the allure, of a god - he is the most fearsome Empyrean of all." Malenia is basically already considering her god-candidate brother the most fit for the job, meaning even over herself, and the reason he even created Elphael and the Haligtree was to seek a cure for the Scarlet Rot, as per the item description of Radagon's Rings of Light. If Malenia valued the Scarlet Rot as her weapon, clearly she wouldn't be moving with Miquella to Elphael or otherwise supporting his actions. Malenia's Great Rune also seeks to give healing, such as to offset the effects of the Scarlet Rot, and the story of the rot hindering conventional healing makes that even clearer.
Millicent is literally born from Malenia and basically IS her will and defiance given flesh. We have no reason to think Morgott is merely asshurt, and he doesn't diss Mohg, who never had responsibilities and wasn't known to be the Lord of Blood. As for why Malenia didn't take Godrick's rune, O'Neil's presence in Caelid implies she strongarmed Godrick into helping attack Caelid, so Godrick was left with some power.
Yeah Malenia hated the rot, that's why she lives in a poison castle and has an army of soldiers who she let imbue themselves with the rot, and intentionally released it in order to win a fight she started for no good reason when her normal dex homosexualry wasn't enough to win, filling an entire continent with rot, and why she doesn't care that she infested the haligtree with rot, especially since she uses it again against the player even knowing where she stood.
The rot was never her enemy. It's who she is, under the facade.
>Malenia didn't let her Cleanrot Knights become affected either, the stuff basically emanated from her like a miasma.
Let's assume you didn't just fricking make that up. If so: why the hell would she allow people she liked to be anywhere near her, if she hated the rot?
>If Malenia valued the Scarlet Rot as her weapon, clearly she wouldn't be moving with Miquella to Elphael or otherwise supporting his actions.
And yet she willingly spread it around the whole world, rather than doing what was within her power to minimize its influence. It's almost like there was a conflict between what she knew she should want and what she actually did, just like every other fricking character in the game.
>Millicent basically IS her will and defiance given flesh.
Millicent is her daughter, and even if created via weird fungus parthenogenesis, is not Malenia. She behaved differently from her sisters because they were just that: sisters, not clones. And Millicent only puts into sharper relief just how fricking abhorrent Malenia is. Millicent chose horrible, painful death over allowing her existence to be used as a pawn by evil entities. Malenia willingly sacrifices herself to the Rot in order to bail her out of the consequences of her own decisions.
>Godrick was left with some power.
He was entirely at her mercy. She had every reason to kill him regardless of whether she even needed the rune. But she spared him. Why? Because he validated her ego.
>Yeah Malenia hated the rot, that's why she lives in a poison castle and has an army of soldiers who she let imbue themselves with the rot, and intentionally released it in order to win a fight she started for no good reason when her normal dex homosexualry wasn't enough to win, filling an entire continent with rot, and why she doesn't care that she infested the haligtree with rot, especially since she uses it again against the player even knowing where she stood.
You're so fricking stupid man jesus christ. The Shaded Castle was NOT her home, I don't know why the frick you thought it was but we've established you have a goldfish brain. How do you see "her soldiers admired and respected Malenia so much that they were okay with the death sentence that is becoming a Cleanrot Knight" and see it as a mark against her?
>And yet she willingly spread it around the whole world, rather than doing what was within her power to minimize its influence. It's almost like there was a conflict between what she knew she should want and what she actually did, just like every other fricking character in the game.
How do you not understand basic 'I'm sorry master but I have to go all out just this once" shonen storytelling where she ultimately put away her pride to use her birthright power, meaning whatever she hoped to accomplish with Radahn's death (not even her own survival was something she cared about given that the blast put her into a coma), this is so unbelievably basic I don't know how this went over your head.
>And Millicent only puts into sharper relief just how fricking abhorrent Malenia is.
The literal goal of her questline is SAVE Malenia, she feels nothing but sympathy towards her "mom" and her dying wish is for you to return the needle to her
>He was entirely at her mercy. She had every reason to kill him regardless of whether she even needed the rune. But she spared him. Why? Because he validated her ego.
This is just straight up incel level headcanon
>The Shaded Castle was NOT her home,
Yeah it just had a bunch of her personal guard and one of her own prosthetic arms in it. moron.
>How do you see "her soldiers admired and respected Malenia so much that they were okay with the death sentence that is becoming a Cleanrot Knight" and see it as a mark against her?
Because if she was a good person she would have said, "No, if you want to do me service, keep your distance at all costs." But the idea of the knights sacrificing themselves for no better reason than to honor her was worth more to her than the value she placed in their lives.
>How do you not understand basic 'I'm sorry master but I have to go all out just this once" shonen storytelling where she ultimately put away her pride to use her birthright power,
It differs in couple important ways
1. She had the chance to surrender and probably get away without any long term consequences
2. By "going all out", she didn't just cause harm to herself, the way the trope usually goes, she also caused the very disaster you claim she didn't want to happen
>The literal goal of her questline is SAVE Malenia,
Luckily she died before they met, spared her the disappointment.
>This is just straight up incel level headcanon
It's literally what fricking happened. Also don't throw around "incel" while waifu gayging one of the worst characters in the game.
She lived in the Haligtree holy shit, why the FRICK are you even arguing. I'm not even going to entertain someone so stupid they can't take two seconds to read a one sentence description of what the shaded castle is and who it belonged to if this is the level of reading comprehension we're at. It's not even a scarlet rot swamp.
>The haligtree always existed and everyone always has exactly one home for their entire lives
lol
Glad to see you at least have given up pretending we have any reason to believe that Malenia challenged Radahn out of anything besides wanting to prove herself strongest
Oh, also, the only other poison swamp in the game is over the lake of rot, and the shaded castle has scarlet rot infested flora in it
You're so stupid it hurts
>Mask in the image of a white-haired young noble. Customarily worn by the head of House Marais. Increases arcane.
>The Marais family has a dual history spanning generations, serving as both executioners and castellans of the Shaded Castle. This mask bears the likeness of the first of their line.
Malenia departed from the Haligtree and returned to the Haligtree. Finlay item description and Millicent's entire questline revolves around returning to the Haligtree. Malenia and Miquella were inseperable and statues of both are all over the Haligtree
Your subhuman ass
>she lived in the Shaded Castle despite it being in bumfrick nowhere, the swamp being regular poison and distinctly not scarlet rot, and the fact that she was an Empyrean who prior to the Haligtree would've lived in Leyndell
Please don't procreate
>Malenia departed from the Haligtree and returned to the Haligtree
How do you think she did that? Like physically, what was the route? We know she reached Caelid via Limgrave and before that Liurnia, but how did she get there from the haligtree? Obviously she didn't just march through the forgotten lands and through Leyendell, it was closed even to her. She took a ship to her summer home, in northern Altus.
We know from that one Cleanrot Knight spirit ash that she went comatose after the standstill with Radahn and was carried from Caelid to the Haligtree by that knight.
Not denying that, but we know it could not have been through Leyendell.
>Obviously she didn't just march through the forgotten lands and through Leyendell, it was closed even to her. She took a ship to her summer home
Why not? She maintains enough neutrality with Morgott that he didn't just kill her when Finlay returned with her comatose body. Also for the love of god please read what the shaded castle actually is and who it belonged to, the only reason it has anything to do with Malenia is because the guy who was lord of it got so horny for her he started worshipping the rot, at best it was just a momentary barracks that her troops stayed at before continuing onwards.
there's literally a painting of malenia in the room you fight elemer of the briar in
Malenia does not live in a poisonous castle, the Shaded Castle sank into a poisonous mire after Malenia left, hence why ghosts outside the place act as if Maleigh Marais' fixation on her caused the castle's ruin. Also, with how the Marais family was sickly in general, the poison was probably there in the first place, not to mention that it's at the base of a volcano. Mt. Gelmir is likely to blame, due to places like Seethewater and the God-Devouring Serpent spitting fierce, acidic poisons.
The Cleanrot Knights don't imbue themselves with the Scarlet Rot, they're affected just by being in proximity to Malenia, akin to how the glove on her left hand is rotting away and possibly mixing with her flesh. Malenia only tried to use the rot in her darkest hour, when it seemed like Miquella's goals would otherwise fail, and the Scarlet Rot outer god was no doubt trying to affect her mind akin to what the Frenzied Flame does. The Scarlet Aeonia wound up having a devastating effect and reach possibly beyond what she could ever imagine, and Mohg kidnapping Miquella ruined whatever hope she was banking on that he could fix things in time. Radahn also still beat Malenia, as implied by her rot wings getting seen by people (Rotten Winged Sword Insignia) and her being dragged out in a coma. If she was the Goddess of Rot by that point, part of the gamble failed and the Scarlet Rot was now in charge anyway.
Millicent has knowledge of things she wouldn't reasonably have if she was just a clone. Millicent's likely a manifestation of Malenia's will, which also explains why she's at odds with her sisters, who probably represent traits not tied to resisting the Scarlet Rot. Millicent also benefits from seeing what happened to Malenia when she wavered for even a second. Furthermore, Millicent actually invades at the Swamp of Aeonia, with both organic arms, implying she temporarily gets controlled and the player cut her right arm off. Also, Godrick's validation isn't worth jack.
>Malenia does not live in a poisonous castle, the Shaded Castle sank into a poisonous mire after Malenia left, hence why ghosts outside the place act as if Maleigh Marais' fixation on her caused the castle's ruin.
The poison in the shaded castle is exactly like that of the Albinauric village. Now what was that above again?
>The Cleanrot Knights don't imbue themselves with the Scarlet Rot, they're affected just by being in proximity to Malenia,
Which she had all the power in the world to prevent.
>when it seemed like Miquella's goals would otherwise fail,
Headcanon
>Also, Godrick's validation isn't worth jack.
To her, it was worth his life and even part of the elden ring. If anything, she probably was better that he was so pathetic. That this little man was also a demi god just showed how much in a league of her own Malenia really was.
The poison in the Village of the Albinaurics is likely the result of the massacre there caused by Gideon Ofnir, and the Albinaurics being made out of metal probably isn't helping the water quality either. Furthermore, the Albinauric village is at the base of the Moonlight Altar, and thus any trash and debris from up there likely finds its way down to the village, a la the Valley of Defilement in Demon's Souls. Malenia never went to the Moonlight Altar, and Liurnia is also situated above the Lake of Rot, where the Scarlet Rot outer god was sealed by the blind swordsman.
Malenia had no power to prevent the Cleanrot Knights from being affected by the Scarlet Rot, beyond the resistance to the rot she already practiced. To help Elphael's military during the Shattering, Malenia would need some ability to be near troops, so it's not like she could keep herself isolated from everyone during that time. Miquella's goals would also actually fail with Malenia's defeat, as his army would be felled and missing its greatest warrior, not to mention that Malenia's defeat would signal that Elphael would now be far easier to siege -- though in the end, Mohg's well-timed infiltration rendered that moot.
You're accusing people of spouting fan fiction for posting item descriptions, yet you're rambling that Malenia's goal in life was other people, namely lame-ass people, groveling to her. Kenneth Haight tells us that Malenia wasn't even going to interact with Godrick until he went out of his way to insult her, so clearly Malenia isn't seeking fights for fame.
>O'Neil's presence in Caelid implies she strongarmed Godrick
O'Neil's identical twin brother worked at Castle Sol though, which is Malenia territory.
>he likely sought the Great Runes for that purpose while also wanting to rule
This is the one thing you can actually deduce he didn't really care about. Malenia defeated Godrick but spared his life and his rune was left with him, and she didn't bother with the weaker Great Rune holders like Rennala. Radahn was specifically targeted, most likely because of how holding the stars in stasis fricked up Miquella's plans, and it's clearly something he isn't willing to do by just asking given how he's still holding them even after becoming a zombie. The amber starlight specifically mentions the stars determining the fates of the gods, and it's found under a statue of Malenia and Miquella in Leyndell
>An ephemeral sliver that gives off a pale amber glow.
>What remains of a passing flash of starlight.
>If the stars command our fates, then amber-hued stars must command the fates of the gods. Such is the belief that inspired the use of these shards to prepare a most special draught.
Cannot be consumed by mere humans.
>and it's clearly something he isn't willing to do by just asking
He would have if it was for Godwyn's sake and to get rid of the undead. He liked godwyn and hated the undead.
>If the stars command our fates, then amber-hued stars must command the fates of the gods. Such is the belief that inspired the use of these shards to prepare a most special draught.
Note the word "belief" and the fact that it didn't work. Fate isn't real
>He would have if it was for Godwyn's sake and to get rid of the undead. He liked godwyn and hated the undead.
What the frick are you talking about moron, there is ZERO mention of Godwyn's relation with Radahn (or any other demigod for that matter).
>Note the word "belief" and the fact that it didn't work. Fate isn't real
How the frick can you see a meteor hit the exact location needed to enter Nokron which is directly tied to Ranni's fate the moment Radahn dies and unironically go "fate isn't real lmao". Dumb monkey
Radahn was a golden order fanboy
>How the frick can you see a meteor hit the exact location needed to enter Nokron
You just needed a fricking ladder to enter Nokron. Or any hole anywhere in eastern Limgrave or western Caelid
There is ZERO way to complete Ranni's questline without killing Radahn (besides glitching), the game straight up tells you through several characters that Radahn's withholding the stars from their movement is blocking Ranni's path, and her questline can only be completed when he's dead and the stars move again. It doesn't matter that you could technically reach it with a big rope or being able to jump 50 meters high, it's very clear that he fate is tied to the stars. Not only that but Sellen loses her immortality when Radahn dies as well, so clearly the stars have real power over people's fates.
>Radahn was a golden order fanboy
Dumb fricking lorelet who hasn't read an item description in his life and just parroting what other moronic lorelets tell you. Radahn is the least developed demigod in the game by far, while he was a fan of Godfrey his actual allegiances on anything are unknown besides sieging Leyndell at what point and getting repelled. Also it's entirely possible to be supportive of the Golden Order while believing that holding the stars back takes higher priority or that it's not worth relinquishing them to help Godwyn (which again Radahn has zero relation to, where did you even get that he hated the undead from).
>There is ZERO way to complete Ranni's questline without killing Radahn
Correct, but only because of the contrivance that both our character and Blaidd are too stupid to figure out how to climb up from the river bed. Despite the fact that he is established to be able to climb up such surfaces. The only thing requiring us to kill Radahn is game mechanics, not any actual in-universe logic.
>Dumb fricking lorelet
>Radahn is the least developed demigod in the game by far, while he was a fan of Godfrey his actual allegiances on anything are unknown
>"If you think that Radahn might have held some of the beliefs associated with the way he styled himself and behaved, you're a lorelet"
Frick you, moron.
>which again Radahn has zero relation to, where did you even get that he hated the undead from
Everyone in the golden order hates them.
>Also it's entirely possible to be supportive of the Golden Order while believing that holding the stars back takes higher priority or that it's not worth relinquishing them to help Godwyn
It's not impossible but is very implausible, and more importantly, totally unsubstantiated. We know why he froze the stars, to prevent the destruction of Selia. We have no reason to believe he wouldn't be fine with evacuating a town in order to get rid of the death root everywhere in the lands between. We also have absolutely no evidence that this is even why Malenia went there.
Unfortunately the golden order is one step ahead and killed Laddersmith Gilligan in DS3
(they actually stole a few of his ladders and put them near volcano manor)
Radahn wasn't a "Golden Order fanboy", he attacked Leyndell, as seen in the opening. Radahn just respected the cultures both of his parents came from. The meteorite that opens the path to Nokron is also clearly directed by the Dark Moon and the stars it commands, that's not some random coincidence. Furthermore, if the player character isn't already working for Ranni, they can't open the chest containing the Fingerslayer Blade, and a message says they lack a fate for opening it. The "fates" are basically the puppeteering of the Dark Moon and the stars, and someone has to be caught up in their powers and plans before even being allowed to do some things, likely in exchange for losing degrees of free will, judging from the Starlight Shards potions.
>Radahn wasn't a "Golden Order fanboy"
Yes he absolutely was
>he attacked Leyndell, as seen in the opening.
Because he questioned the rule of an Omen as Lord of Leyndell
Radahn the Starscourge effectively makes any other event like Miquella Eclipse or Ranni Age of Stars impossible and forced the Carians to seek guidance through the Golden Order
>Because he questioned the rule of an Omen as Lord of Leyndell
Nobody knew that Morgott was an Omen or what he even looked like, that's literally the entire point of Margit. How the frick did you miss this.
>Godrick's Great Rune might also just be naturally weak in the lore, since it's visually much thinner and more threadbare compared to the rest.
It is straight up called the very core of the Elden Ring which every other rune anchors itself to.
Anon, nobody knew Morgott was an omen, that's why he's specifically known as the Veiled Monarch. Also, Radahn was okay with learning sorceries from an Alabaster Lord, so he was probably the least likely to be racist/prejudiced in that regard. The Carians are unlikely to have sought guidance through the Golden Order as a result of Radahn's actions, since the opening shows he didn't have his distinct gravity magic-infused scimitars yet, so he probably wasn't the Starscourge by the time the Shattering began. Additionally, depending on when Radahn became the Starscourge, why would Castle Sol even try the ritual if they knew space was locked in place?
O'Neil's presence in Caelid implies that some of Godrick's forces got pressed into attacking the place, so Malenia likely forced Godrick to help out in exchange for not taking his Great Rune. Also, Godrick's Great Rune quickly drops off in effectiveness the stronger you get, whereas Radahn's Great Rune scales proportionally and is always a tremendous boon, which likely could reflect on the Haligtree's growth and power. Rennala was insane and her rune could be retrieved at any time, so there was no point in trespassing on Liurnian territory any more than necessary, and Leyndell had a reputation for continuing to repel every army.
The Amber Starlight seems to imply that Miquella or Malenia tried to remove a fate placed by the stars on them, succeeded, but that still didn't solve their problems. If Radahn sealing space was the problem with the Castle Sol ritual, that seems like it'd be important enough for even one item description to mention. Also, if the sun was the focus, Radahn seems to at least let that star function normally in relation to the Lands Between, hence normal daytime, the day and night cycle, etc. The "frigid sun" the Castle Sol denizens invoked might even be in the spirit world, akin to the Helphen tree.
>Also, if the sun was the focus, Radahn seems to at least let that star function normally in relation to the Lands Between, hence normal daytime, the day and night cycle, etc.
It wasn't the sun (which is actually kinda hard to see in the world and is noticeably less bright than the Erdtree), but invoking an Eclipse, which would logically involve the moons.
>O'Neil's presence in Caelid implies that some of Godrick's forces got pressed into attacking the place, so Malenia likely forced Godrick to help out in exchange for not taking his Great Rune.
The thing is nobody liked Godrick, his forces are almost entirely mercenaries for one so that seems like a weak justification when she easily could've taken his rune and taken over his territory. Additionally the only known way from the Snowfield requires the Grand Lift, so at some point Malenia had to have gone through Leyndell but likely without fighting. She was also granted passage by Morgott when Finlay carried her back despite him being able to kill her if he wanted to. Also using gameplay justification to explain lore is always going to be moronic, unless you can explain why using Radahn's rune doesn't actually light you on fire and cure the scarlet rot.
The only moons we see in the Lands Between don't start moving even after Radahn is dead, so either they're refusing to resume normal movements in general, we're to assume that, lore-wise, they are moving normally, or Miquella's plan was screwed no matter what since the gods called moons wouldn't play ball.
People might despise Godrick, but his forces could still be useful regardless. Also, while he does employ a lot of mercenaries, a number of his troops seem to cling to notions of the golden lineage, which Miquella and Malenia aren't part of, and Limgrave's history shows that these people have a history of rebelling. Keeping Godrick alive could keep those troops cooperative, especially if they were picked up as a bonus, since it's implied Malenia was just passing through before taking a detour once Godrick insulted her. Godrick's Great Rune might also just be naturally weak in the lore, since it's visually much thinner and more threadbare compared to the rest. As for why Radahn's Great Rune being on fire doesn't cure the Scarlet Rot, the flames certainly didn't cure the rot for Radahn, they at most mitigated it.
Miquella's ambition was to replace his incest mom as center of the universe. Marika's gold wasn't unalloyed so to speak.
I believe what this means is Marika wasn't nearly as lax as the dragons but still lax enough allow outer gods some degree of existence which is why the Golden Order could do nothing to shut the rot god up. He needed purity.
I'd so Unalloyed Gold is a the puritanism to Marika's Catholicism.
Marika liked to order the eradication of entire groups of people, so it probably wasn't being lax that caused the Scarlet Rot to affect Malenia. Miquella seems to have thought that Marika's attempts to invent solutions, such as through Golden Order Fundamentalism, were still lacking and not taking the right approach.
Marika made the world bow to the tree, the only part of the Elden Ring she sealed was destined death.
Golden Order fundamentalism wasn't working because the golden order wasn't true to its rejection of things beyond it (Besides holy damage fricking up "Death" entiries and poor Albinaurics for being false life) I believe Mieriel's disposition regarding heresies as representative of the concept.
The Erdtree worshipers talk of heresies and Radagon spews his own bullshit but meanwhile the people watching the Giant's flame are worshipping it and heretics are freely wielding powers from beyond.
Clearly Miquella wanted an end to that, hence unalloyed (pure) gold.
Remember, Miquella invented like almost all the Golden Order incants, the guy clearly understood the Greater Will's divine architecture the best.
Anon, there isn't a Scarlet Rot Great Rune, and the "Mend the Elden Ring" endings show that the runes obtained from the demi-gods are actually cured of things like the Scarlet Rot infestation and the Formless Mother's Bloodflame. Marika also oversaw prejudice toward Misbegotten and Crucible Knights, even though the Crucible was itself just the Erdtree when it was younger and hadn't finished maturing, so she was very much prejudiced. Malenia didn't have the Scarlet Rot because of Marika being nice, that's for sure.
Again, there's no Scarlet Rot/Formless Mother/etc. rune. Heck, the Rune of Death doesn't even seem to rejoin the Elden Ring and looks more like an afflicted rune, so perhaps that was some prototype attempt at a mending rune. I think Marika was targeted by outer gods because her role as the god of the Lands Between made her stand out and they each wanted to shape the world, but the Elden Ring itself probably didn't do anything to her kids.
>there isn't a scarlet rot great rune
That we know of. The Farum Azula Elden Ring had many parts that are missing. The Rot God itself may possess it.
The Farum Azula Elden Ring only has the same four Great Runes. That mural just depicts energy "vines" extending out from the Elden Ring, yet those "vines" either stop upon contact with a Great Rune or bounce off and undulate in various directions. This seems to be representing the Erdtree's roots network growing, not some super Elden Ring.
Anon, I pointed out how the Scarlet Rot and Bloodflame are actively purged from those runes in all "Mend the Elden Ring" endings. This includes the Age of Fracture, so the Scarlet Rot and Bloodflame are not actually inherent to the Elden Ring, the Erdtree, etc.
"O'Neil" seems to have its etymological roots in "Son of Neil/Niall", so there can be different generations and traveling at work. O'Neil also lacks the lightning arts of Niall, thus being more in line with Godrick's forces, who only have wind abilities.
>I pointed out how the Scarlet Rot and Bloodflame are actively purged from those runes in all "Mend the Elden Ring" endings.
What the frick are you even talking about?
See
>the "Mend the Elden Ring" endings show that the runes obtained from the demi-gods are actually cured of things like the Scarlet Rot infestation and the Formless Mother's Bloodflame.
Unlike their menu icons, those runes don't have the Scarlet Rot on them, the Bloodflame afflicting them, etc. during the cutscene when the Elden Ring is mended. All of the Great Runes look the same, golden with nothing weird on them, nothing bending them out of shape, etc. The Scarlet Rot, Bloodflame, and so on are not natural to the Elden Ring.
>Unlike their menu icons, those runes don't have the Scarlet Rot on them, the Bloodflame afflicting them, etc. during the cutscene when the Elden Ring is mended.
Using that cutscene is not a good metric because it doesn't change depending on which of the great runes you even bothered to get.
With Radagon's defeat and the player obtaining at least three Great Runes (two for accessing Leyndell plus Morgott's one), Radagon's makeshift lattice can be undone to fill out enough of the Elden Ring in general. Regardless, that cutscene specifically depicts up to every Great Rune in the game, and furthermore, even on the title screen and in Radagon's fight, we can see that the parts of each Great Rune that were left behind with him don't display the Scarlet Rot, the Bloodflame, etc. either.
The Erdtree didn't exclude anything; its own crystal tears boost various things, like fire, magic, lightning, etc. Marika is the one who decided to kick stuff out, usually by manual genocide rather than trying to kick out direct aspects of the Elden Ring. Sealing the Rune of Death was the exception, and in light of it never returning to the Elden Ring and looking unlike every other neutral Great Rune, that thing might not have even truly been innate.
Anon, if the Greater Will is an "alien star life form" that is a god, dictates order on the planet, and, based on the Elden Beast's boss arena, sends out Erdtrees and Elden Rings to various planets, it's probably an outer god. Also, the "black moon" of Nokstella, implied to be the Dark Moon and said to be the guide of "countless stars", is tied to the Age of Stars ending and itself is treated as an outer god. Considering that the Dark Moon is either a moon or, judging from Ranni's ending, a black hole devouring a moon, it is definitely from space. Also, if the Frenzied Flame, a counterpart to the Greater Will, can destroy the universe, how does it not qualify for being an outer god?
Heck, defeating the Elden Beast even gives the "god slain" message, and the Elden Remembrance implies that this isn't just for Radagon dying. If the Elden Beast is a god, then the Greater Will is almost certainly an outer god.
According to the description of his big stick he drops:
>Even after his lord was fled, Commander O'Neil continued to
brandish this flag.
Malenia is the only one we know who fled the battlefield, so he was probably a Malenia troop. It SEEMS like Godrick at first because of the Exile soldiers he spawns, but you find those in Castle Sol too.
If Godrick was forced to help in Caelid, he'd obviously flee too. Pretty much everyone who wasn't living in Caelid and survived the Scarlet Aeonia retreated, save for a handful of stuck Cleanrot Knights who might have become taken over by the Scarlet Rot at that point. If both O'Neil and Niall worked for Malenia, it seems like O'Neil would have had a chance to be around Niall enough to at least learn the lightning abilities.
Lightning abilities are probably just a stronger version of Storm powers, judging by context. The weaker Banished Knights only have the wind, the stronger variants have lightning added.
Same applies to O'Neil and Niall. He doesn't have the Lightning because he's weaker and less experienced. It'd be pretty weird if the only proof of Godrick being in Caelid was one commander.
Storm incantations are considered separate from lightning incantations, looking at both the ancient dragons' arts and the dragon cult's creations. The Stormhawk Axes seem to be the only connecting factor, but that could have been a learned practice after the Ancient Dragon War and before the Tarnished were banished.
I don't see greed being a force of nature akin to fire and gravity in the setting, anon.
Just saying it's not impossible, that's all.
Care to explain in detail?
For what purpose?
Why do you think greed is a force of nature on the same level as fire and space in this setting? Is is because of "want" being often pondered in Dark Souls, for example? You're not exactly saying much for a conversation.
I don't know whether or not it is, but it certainly can be if there's an appropriate entity to back it up.
Standard magic, really, desire dynamics, greed is can be an aspect of hunger, which can be then tied to void or entropy.
>Again, there's no Scarlet Rot/Formless Mother/etc.
What do you think Malenia's and Mohg's runes are? Most of the "outer" gods are not extra-terrestrial.
It's this weird theory that the outer gods are all competitors to the GW when every outer god is linked to elements that would be suppressed or opposed to the Golden Order.
The only true competitor to the GW is the FF which is its anti-thesis as a chaos entity, everything else is basic shit like a god of death, or god of decay, or goddess of pain.
Even the Blasphemous Serpent seems to just be a manifestation of volcanoes.
Exactly. Although it's worth noting that the Primeval Current is another GW tier force, although it's not exactly a "rival" to the GW as much as it is just a thing that exists and can frick you up if you look at it too hard.
Malenia probably has scarlet rot for the same reason most of Marika's kids ended up with some kind of weird deformities, they were touched by various random aspects of creation, given she had embodied the elden ring.
>Radahn beat her
Nah, she was afflicted the whole time and she still drew that fight out.
A prime Malenia would have swept him clearly. And we know he was noble so he would never claim to have defeated someone that's been plagued and not at their fullest. So in his own spirit what you said just isn't true and it shames him to say as much.
Anon, the Malenia who fought at Caelid WAS the prime Malenia. There was never a time in her life when the Scarlet Rot wasn't afflicting Malenia, but she was able to mitigate its effects, get awesome de facto cybernetic limbs from her brother, and was trained by the blind swordsman who sealed the Scarlet Rot outer god. It's like speculating about a "prime" Morgott who was never cursed and who actually had a good upbringing. Also, in the case of the "goddess of rot", defeating that isn't even for bragging rights, it's about preventing the Scarlet Rot from destroying the world. Seriously, Malenia literally glows with Scarlet Rot in that form, it's probably like a biohazard meltdown.
Correct. Malenia is an arrogant psycho.
The best explanation I've heard for Malenia attacking Radahn was to make the stars move again and induce the eclipse that was key to whatever plan Miquella had for Godwyn.
This is probably the right answer.
It's a stupid answer though. Radahn would have been totally down to clown with a plan to save Godwyn. He would have no reason to oppose them.
Why do you think Radahn stopped the stars to begin with? He wanted to keep his little sister Ranni safe.
Radahn stopped the stars to save Sellia, which a sword monument and the Starscourge Talisman state.
The attempted ritual at Castle Sol could have predated Radahn defeating space, or it might have used some spirit world's sun, hence why the dialogue refers to a frigid sun. The setting has tons of people who study the stars, so they're likely to at least realize that local weather doesn't affect the nature of the sun, and Ghostflame also exists in the setting.
He did it to save Selia. If it was to fix Godwyn, he'd probably be okay with having them move
Nah, he's gonna be Kuro 2.0, genuinely moral character trying to fix the world and shit. Not gonna deny there will be some people making fanarts about him due to the immortal trap innuendo though.
little boy feet. is it ok to like little boy feet? am I wrong?
I think you know the answer to that, anon.
hopefully not like him because Kuro is a homosexual and i am ashamed i cannot kill him at the beginning of the game
>let me guess miquella is a trap
Yes and no. Miquella is another Marika/Radagon Rebis situation where his female persona is Saint Trina.
Radagon was born because Marika was in a role she fricking hated. Best we can tell Miquella and Trina were very much aligned, probably just an alter ego rather than an actually separate personality.
Radagon is Marika, like Eve is a rib of Adam. Radagon's personality develops separately to Marika's to the point that when they rejoin he becomes philosophically opposed to her.
They were never separate. Eve was born of Adam. Radagon IS Marika.
Shit you're right. I'm going off the deep end and forgetting we even see this metamorphism in the Maika/Radagon cutscene.
Kill the Elden Beast.
St. Trina was born because of Miquella's desire to save Godwyn through dreams, like Fortissax.
Sort of like Morgott/Margit
No, that's just an alias, not a Rebis.
Correct, just like Miquella and Trina. Not all traps are trannies
More like some dum dums could not tell Miquella was a trap because he was so cute and charming.
The only things we know for sure about Miquella is
1. He’s the most powerful demigod
2. His alter ego is Saint Trina
3. His only known ability is to “compel affection”
4. He’s associated with an item that lets to control enemies
5. People who serve him will literally blow themselves up for his sake
6. He looks like Griffith
Why are people not considering the possibility of Miquella being more evil than Mohg
Because literally all of his stated goals are an objectively good thing for the world? That the Haligtree is a sanctuary for the outcasts of the world? There is no actual reason to believe Miquella is evil other than illiterate 'muh Griffith" moronation. Also just purely on environmental storytelling what happened to Elphael is clearly meant to be a tragedy and Mohg is portrayed as a deranged rapist psycho. He's also literally the only demigod to actually give a frick about Godwyn and the Outer Gods.
He’s associated with an item that lets you mind control enemies and his soldiers suicide bomb you
And? If you're implying he's brainwashing his followers (or god forbid Mohg) you're fricking moronic. The suicide bombing is also something they only started doing AFTER he had already long disappeared. Seriously the whole Miquella is evil lorelet dumbassery is people taking ONE (1) shady item description as taking precedent over the 30 other ones describing him as the goodest guy ever
>providing safe haven to violent savages (haligtree) is some objective good
seething moron. go back to fapping to trap porn if you're so assmad about it
>Misbegotten are.... Le BAD because.... They just ARE ok!
They literally killed and cannibalized an entire castle of people for NO reason. Demi-Humans are the ones capable of being chill.
>for NO reason
[citation needed]
>Killing and eating virgin maidens just sitting there harmlessly is... le GOOD?
and eating slave masters is... le GOOD?
Yes
You can understand why normal people outcast these violent sub-humans, then. And why Miquella is fundamentally libtarded for harboring them.
seemed like the misbegotten at the haligtree were there as an act of war. the albernaurics were the ones making the pilgrimage and following Miquella.
Misbegotten are said to be victims of abuse or worse.
>ayo ain't my fault, dey Haight man be oppressing me and shiieeet!
Demi-Humans, in the castle RIGHT NEXT DOOR, are peacefully fighting alongside humans, and history has proven them capable of diplomatic relations with the Golden Order.
There are Misbegotten in Lyendell that do nothing except peacefully pray at statues and are look over by perfumers.
And if you want to talk about history, history has proven that who the Golden Order considers deserving of being conquered or oppressed is completely arbitrary and can change on a dime and the Misbegotten were not too long ago considered blessed by the divine.
The Misbegotten at Castle Morne were abused and made into slaves, hence the slave revolt. The only thing they did that crossed the line was killing Irina.
It's implied by Irina's dialogue that Shabriri used his howl on the cliff where the Frenzy Village is to make the Misbegotten in Castle Morne go crazy.
>is gonna get more fanart
I pray that this will happen.
Or, OR, here's a thought: Play the fricking game before you open your mouth about it.
I want albinauric stuff
Fromsoft lore is generally cool, but the people that get deep into it tend to be unbelievable insufferable unfortunately
DS2 Sotfs had the best lore
>seek strength, the rest will follow
FromSoft has seriously lost their touch when it comes to the story and worldbuilding. I thought it was because they just stopped giving a shit about DS2 and 3, and Bloodborne and Sekiro were good so I thought maybe only first entries had good lore, but ER is probably the worst yet.
Nothing but disjointed concepts and scraps that just do not form a functional fantasy world. There's a difference between obfuscated or obtuse lore and just not giving a shit. People have a hard time answering what the frick a Tarnished or the Erdtree even really are, or how/why anyone in the world stays dead when you kill them, let alone the actual weird stuff that makes absolutely no sense like Marika and Radagon being the same person, Farum Azula being "frozen in time" for seemingly no reason, the stars (that are actually monsters) having some contrived effect on "fate", etc.
I agree with you mostly but damn the Tarnished are the easiest to interpret
Marika wanted to break from the Greater Will, she banished her husband and his warriors so they stayed far from the influence of the Greater Will, after she was imprisoned, she used Grace to call the Tarnished back so they would free her
the thing is, why would the 2 fingers aid the Tarnished?
In what way are they different from any other mindbroken noble you see wandering around though? The Rune of Death being removed is a major plot point so everyone is immortal, not just the Tarnished. The only difference seems to be that they see the guidance of Grace, but virtually all of the Tarnished eventually stop seeing it other than you (why the frick would this ever happen, anyway? marika giving up on them for whatever arbitrary reason? why did she give up on rogier, for instance?) If the only distinction is that they were all just Godfrey's warriors, how could they have so many distinct and unique backgrounds, especially given Hoarah Loux's still got a tribe going on? It doesn't make sense under scrutiny.
it does
Marika wants to break free, becoming Elden Lord is just the bait, if you stop trying or Marika thinka you're worthless you stop seeing grace
Godfrey fricked some pussy after divorce
>marika giving up on them for whatever arbitrary reason?
Yeah
>why did she give up on rogier, for instance?
He was weak, and Marika is a c**t.
>If the only distinction is that they were all just Godfrey's warriors, how could they have so many distinct and unique backgrounds, especially given Hoarah Loux's still got a tribe going on?
While Godfrey was Godfrey, he commanded troops from all over the lands between
>why did she give up on rogier
He's undead. She hates undead.
People still died with the Rune of Death removed, hence why there are outright casualties and not zombies after Godfrey's wars, Gransax is actually dead, etc. You also find people dead in chairs across the map, as opposed to them being zombies that get up. The Tarnished are given their Grace back and also restored to live again and again unless they quit on the task to become Elden Lord (actually to kill the Elden Beast) or if Marika thinks they're a lost cause.dh2vv
>People have a hard time answering what the frick a Tarnished or the Erdtree even really are,
The erdtree is just a big tree. If you plant bodies in the roots then new people will be born from the leaves. It's pretty cool but ultimately just a tool left by the actual god of the setting, the Greater Will. The fact that everyone in the world has different ideas about what the tree is and how most people worship it when it's just an implement, and not even the first of its kind, is a riff on Christianity in the middle ages and its fracturing into countless sects of slightly different doctrine and an obsession with relics and saints, largely ignoring the primary morals and lessons of the actual faith. This is because the game is mostly an allegory for the collapse of the Byzantine empire, due to religious disintegration and terrible succession laws that rendered the country weak and vulnerable to foreign enemies.
The tarnished are soldiers who were granted immortality by Marika. They keep it for as long as she feels like, on an individual basis. That's all there ever was to it.
>let alone the actual weird stuff that makes absolutely no sense like Marika and Radagon being the same person,
Radagon is a schizo personality born of Marika, which she herself describes in the memories told by Melina. Whether she was born from the elden beast gaining influence on her, or her just actually having a mental illness that manifested into reality is unclear, but also doesn't actually matter. What matters is that the real Marika hated being the god of golden order, and so she had a split personality that really really loved being the god of golden order.
>Farum Azula being "frozen in time" for seemingly no reason,
Have you never looked at the description of the ancient dragon stones? Dragons can twist time. They just have time powers. And they froze time when Farum Azula got fricked, to drag out the moment of its destruction forever, allowing it to persist.
Marika and Radagon did not start as the same person
Marika was probably forced to marry Radagon to keep her in check, he was loyal to the Greater Will while she planned to break free and because only Empyrians can hold the Elden Ring they couldn't just depose Marika
Radagon was never his own person, he grew from inside Marika. Nobody could have forced her to marry anyone, or do anything else, she was a god. Her imprisonment in the erdtree was entirely because her schizo alternate personality forced her to.
>Radagon was never his own person.
The Giant's Red Braid description seems to imply that maybe radagon was a giant, or maybe he got cursed by them to have red hair
The red hair hair of the giants is always associated with the flames of destruction, especially towards the erdtree. Radagon has red hair as a visual contradiction towards his nature, same as Marika. Marika is brilliant gold, and yet she resents her post and wants nothing more than the destruction of the tree which she is entombed. Radagon has the visual flair of a giant of destruction, and yet wants nothing more than the permanent maintenance of the staus quo, and for the erdtree's light to shine unbroken forever.
>the stars (that are actually monsters) having some contrived effect on "fate", etc.
They don't, fate isn't real.
In Elden Ring, "fate" is just the stars trying to mind control people, hence why the Starlight Shards potions made by Seluvis turn people into husks that are pawns.
Explain how the Crestfallen Warrior stays dead after you kill him
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
I don't care at all. I just think the games are a bit fun.
The elden ring lore is actually pretty well filled out, if anything, the issue is a lack of cultural personality in each of the regions due to not having enough npcs and basically no civilian architecture, abandoned or otherwise.
As far as the DLC, it will probably be a dream of a twisted version pre-war Altus, with a large focus on Godwyn and death and sleep enemies. The ending will likely be putting him out of his misery for good, at which point Miquella will also die, producing a mending rune in the real world.
I think we've reached critical mass for flanderization of it.
99% of Elden Ring lore was just randomly mentioning some place/thing/person in item descriptions and none of it ever mattering.
Back in Ds1 I think there was most of a story that was split up and scattered around descriptions, I dont think this has been the case for From games for a while though. Instead of coming up with an entire story and putting effort into hiding it around the place all they need to do now is pick a bunch of random disconected words and let the autistic fans write the rest.
>99% of Elden Ring lore was just randomly mentioning some place/thing/person in item descriptions and none of it ever mattering.
Elden Ring does this the least of any From game except Sekiro. Almost everything referenced by anything is actually in the game. About the only exception I can think of is the foreign origin of the Numen.
>lore
Disregarded. You're a worthless Australian.
>funny broken gameplay
Peak. Probably an autistic Norwegian high on rotten fish as you swing swap swords and keep bonuses proc'd.
The only thing I genuinely give a frick about is if the boss fights are fun and the OST makes me cum or not, they have a lot to live up to competing with Gael and Midir
>bloodborne best game
YWNBAW
The only real lore question I have is one that won't be answered- "Lands Between", as a name, suggests some irrelevant, backwoods shithole between the real important places in the world. But the magic god tree is here? The focus of the gods? Do other countries have multiple space gods poking their noses in? Are there Fingers further afield? We have multiple Astels, Fallingstar Beasts and Malformed Stars, are there tons more elsewhere, or do they only fall here for some reason?
it's the center of the world, anon. the tree's roots are in other lands.
>Do other countries have multiple space gods poking their noses in?
Probably, but also probably to a lesser degree. Shit like the Scarlet Rot is probably an issue elsewhere, but the Formless Mother maybe not, since she clearly wants the elden ring.
>"Lands Between", as a name, suggests some irrelevant, backwoods shithole between the real important places in the world
That's one possible interpretation but does not have to be true. For one thing, let's not be coy, it's clearly a rip off of "middle earth", which itself doesn't mean much until you consider that it was intended as a sort of mythologized history of England (so the "middle" between Creation and present day). But it could also mean, for example, the lands between hell and the heavens, or the geographical center of a non-spherical world.
>We have multiple Astels, Fallingstar Beasts and Malformed Stars, are there tons more elsewhere,
There's no reason that should not be the case. They don't seem particularly interested in the erdtree in particular, just falling wherever.
>Are there Fingers further afield?
Maybe. It depends on what they really are, which is left up to interpretation. if they really are starbound emissaries of the greater will, they might not only be everywhere else on this world, they might even be on other planets. But it's also entirely possible that they are simply manifestations conjured up by the Golden Order, like how the 3 fingers were accidentally manifested by the merchants who were burned beneath Leyendell, in which case the 2 fingers are likely only in the lands between.
the Greater Will(2 fingers) and Frenzied Flame(3 fingers) both come from the One Great
"One Great" is a shitty mistranslation of Erd Tree that someone dug out of source code and tried to interpret as its own entity
All that there is came from the One Great. Then came fractures, and births, and souls. But the Greater Will made a mistake. Torment, despair, affliction... every sin, every curse. Every one, born of the mistake. And so, what was borrowed must be returned. Melt it all away, with the yellow chaos flame. Until all is One again.
You're thinking of the "greattree" discussion. The Japanese translators seem to agree that the One Great actually exists and isn't the Erdtree. Regarding the "greattree" talk, in the Japanese script, "Erdtree" doesn't exist as a term, so the tree is only called the golden tree and the great tree interchangeably, hence why the Finger Reader near Leyndell tells you to approach the great tree that's the source of the golden rays of runes. Also, the barricade of thorns that must be burned is brown instead of golden, but everyone calls it the Erdtree anyway.
Miyazaki once said if you read the old and new testament you'd understand his story.
I've read the bible
Then it should make sense, Morgott especially.
Where did he say that
Norm MacDonald's show
I uh see
Only cared about the lore in DS1 and Bloodborne
>make a complete CGI cinematic trailer that covers most of the prologue exposition necessary to set up the game
>game comes out
>intro is all static concept art
>instead of explaining who the demigods are and the state of the world it just lists out the literally who sidequest Black folk who just give you a different palette swap ending
I absolutely love the game but I will be mad about this until the day i die
My headcanon is that they planned some elaborate intro and endings but had to scrap them because this time they had to shuffle a lot of lore stuff due to the usual development woes and as the result, the content didn't fit with the revisioned lore in the base game so they had to make do with simple slide shows and Mass Effect 3-tier color endings.
lol people actually give a shit about this?
it's literally like a 6 year old playing with toys making up the story as he goes
This is the first time I can say I genuinely don't care. I'm not even an Armored Core fan and I'm more excited for AC6 than more Elden Ring, I'm more excited for almost anything than more Elden Ring.
Elden Ring genuinely made me go from hardcore souls shill to a hater.
The major problem with Elden Ring is that the plot is just another succession story of a dead world. If the plot was you taking part in The Shattering, the replayability would be amazing as you could join different factions on each playthrough and have meaningful interactions with them. It's the one idea where the plot would benefit greatly from the open world gimmick.
That about sums up my problems with the game in general, it's just a lazy retread of Dark Souls.
The new mythos only serves as a reminder of the game we could have gotten.
lol fromsoft don't know how to make games like what you said. all the npcs know how to do is spout endless random dialog or act as assist summons in combat. nothing else
Yeah guys, in addition to Elden Ring being Fromsoft's first attempt at an open world game, they also should have made it their first attempt at a Bethesda style RPG, with massive dynamic battles and factions.
I hate you morons more than anything else, it's like when people got upset they couldn't go inside every building in cyberpunk. Game dev isn't magic. It's iterative. I'd love to see Fromsoft make a more story/choice heavy game, but Elden Ring was never going to be that game, and anyone who wanted it to be was fricking delusional.
How much are you being paid to be such a homosexual shill? THEY'VE MADE DARK SOULS FIVE TIMES
And Elden Ring was the first game since DS1 where they actually had a big team, a proper budget and weren't be forced to rush the product out the door by the publishers.
Anyway, if you actually have a problem with a dev iterating on their product you're a mouthbreather with no idea how game dev works. Literally every successful studio does this. Are you going to be upset that the next Elder Scrolls game isn't going to be a Soulslike? No? Why not?
Because Bethesda makes a very specific style of game that has gained them a wide audience. Those same design principles can be seen in elder scrolls, fallout, and in the upcoming starfield. That's the kind of game they're good at making, and it's what their fans want more of. What's the problem here, exactly?
the elder scrolls games are nowhere near as similar to each other as dark souls 1 is to elden ring
No shit sherlock, the first game in that series came out in 1994. You do realize that Dark Souls 1 released the same year Skyrim did, right?
Reading comprehension of an inner city child
Do I need to spell out my point for you? In the time since Bethesda has released Skyrim, Fromsoft released. DS2, Bloodborne, DS3, Sekiro and Elden Ring. And we are still at least another 5 years away from the next Elder Scrolls game releasing.
My point is, your comparison is fricking moronic. Elder Scrolls is a series dating from the very earliest days of video game development. The first Elder Scrolls title was made before true 3-d rendering was even a thing. OBVIOUSLY because of how massively technology changed from the beginning of the series to now, there are going to be massive changes both in terms of the design and Tech.
The first Souls game released on PS3, at which point gaming was fairly mature, both technologically and design-wise. There haven't been a lot of revolutionary changes since the PS3 era. So in summary: your point is moronic and you should have a nice day you dumb Black person
I'm not the anon you were arguing with, I'm just pointing out that you misunderstood what he wrote and look like a moron
What did I misunderstand? He said the Elder Scrolls games are nowhere near as similar to each other as Dark Souls 1 is to Elden Ring.
And I pointed out both that Bethesda has not released another Elder Scrolls game since Skyrim (which came out the same year as DS1) and that since Elder Scrolls is a very old franchise, it's natural that the early games in the series would be be a lot different than later titles due to both changes in technology and industry design trends. So tell me, which part of his post did I not understand? It seems pretty clear to me.
>you have to understand, Elden Ring couldn't have NPCs that have any level of autonomy or living cities b...because uhh that's not have game dev works
>Updating their quests to fit an open world format would have been too much effo-ACK!
If you're not getting paid I seriously pity you.
Feel free to explain to me how a dev who has never had more than like 20 NPC's per game is going to build a "living city" when that's not even something that much more seasoned devs like Bethesda and CDPR are capable of doing?
If it's so easy, then where are all the games with "living cities"?
Its funny how in order to rationalize your deranged ER shilling you chose to interpret what I wrote as
>super complex and life-like city simulation the likes of which the world has never seen
and not
>a couple of buildings with NPCs walking around, salesmen, and quest givers.
To do otherwise would be to accept Elden Ring did less than JRPGs from the 90s on a shoestring budget made by 5 people.
You were the one who chose to use the words "living city"
If that's not what you meant, then it's not my fault for reading your words the way I did. Learn to communicate better.
>To do otherwise would be to accept Elden Ring did less than JRPGs from the 90s
It's almost as if having a bunch of NPC's sending you out to collect 10 goat anuses would have added nothing of value to the game.
>The open world doesn't NEED to be anything but a fancy Diablo dungeon bro
>you don't understand bro, they can't have just added torches that react to water. What is this an immersive sim?
>bro... you wanted NPCs that can actually walk around and have more than 5 lines of dialogue instead of reading the description on your dagger? That's not how gamedev works
Last (You) you're getting from me shill. Get a real job.
This is actually a great example of what I'm talking about when I say you don't understand game dev.
>they can't have just added torches that react to water
It's not like Fromsoft don't know how to program the code for this. DS2 had torches that went out if you rolled through water. You could relight them with an item, or by finding a lit sconce/torch/bonfire in the environment.
So why not include it in ER? Well, for starters the concept had a lot of issues in DS2 to begin with. Your torch would also burn out over time, but each time you found a new torch, it just added to that timer. So by the end of the game, your torch had like a 20 hour burn time. Which is also pretty dumb. So why implement it like that?
Well, if you instead have individual torches with individual lifetimes, you begin to realize that there's a series of cascading design consequences. If you want to have realistic torches that go out, burn out over time, and require resources to re-light then your entire game is going to have to revolve a lot more around resource/inventory management.
Elden Ring is not a game focused around inventory management or even resource management, beyond the healing flasks that refill at the bonfire. If you want to justify inconveniencing the player by having their torch go out, then you need a mechanical reason for doing so. Which involves again-crafting/resource/inventory management. And you can't have a game with a focus on inventory management where you have an infinite inventory of items/weapons on you at all times.
And again- that is not the focus of the devs. So because it's not their focus, there's really no justifiable reason for them to include it. Which comes back to again- you having no idea what you're talking about. You don't think through any of the effects a design change like this would have on the game practically.
Realism gays never understand that people want to have fun.
It's not that you couldn't make a fun game souls game that's also realistic and has immersive sim elements. But you'd have to start from the ground up and redesign every aspect of it.
>Elden Ring is not a game focused around inventory management or even resource management
I disagree, the consumables can be pretty influential, even if they are optional. They dedicated a whole crafting and gathering mechanic to them.
It's an optional thing though, most people just ignore it. Resource and inventory management are not optional in say, resident evil. That's the difference.
NTA, that's true, although I had a shit ton of fun doing a "consumables only" run. Also early on LARPing as a perfumer in early areas was a blast, if not incredibly time consuming and expensive.
True, but a torch would be the same by that logic.
No, because a torch is an item that's held in your hand like a weapon. And it's fundamentally something different to say, a firebomb or any other damage doing consumable. The point of the torch is to provide the player light, and the point of having the torch go out is to punish the player for poor environmental awareness, or for not preparing (having a fresh torch)
There's not really a way to have this mechanic be interesting if you can carry infinite torches in your inventory. Hence why it was kinda worthless in DS2 because you could just stack like 12 hours worth of torches in one torch. The only way it would be a meaningful mechanic is if you had a limited carry capacity, and you had to choose carefully how many items like torches, etc you'd carry with you into a level.
>There's not really a way to have this mechanic be interesting if you can carry infinite torches in your inventory.
>The only way it would be a meaningful mechanic is if you had a limited carry capacity, and you had to choose carefully how many items like torches, etc you'd carry with you into a level.
Elden Ring already has this mechanic for consumables, which you'd be aware of if you used them heavily in your playthrough like how I did. A lot of them are limited to smaller stacks of 3 or 5. Resting at a grace restocks the stack using your stockpile.
I don't really see how you could transfer the consumable system over to torches, which are a weapon. Especially since there are a bunch of unique torches as weapons, some of which are magical and presumably would never go out even under water. You'd have to add in some sort of fuel system for those, along with fuel for the lantern. There's not really any reason to add it in IMO
You make it out to need incredibly overcomplicated fuel mechanics and immersive lantern oil when there are a variety of simple ways to resolve it.
>torches start lit
>splashing it in water/getting ambushed or knocked down without putting the torch away/whatever other means they want to disable it, disables it
>auto-use a consumable to relight the torch
Boom. Torches help you navigate the dark, but you'll plunge straight back into it if you're an idiot. Better than dark areas just being a momentary delay before you equip the lantern.
So now you need a consumable just to light a torch in the first place? You need to at least add a mechanic for lighting it at bonfires or sconces.
And again, it's like... So it goes out whenever you put it away? Is that just for unequipping it from your hand, or putting it back in your inventory? What's even the point when there's magic torches that won't go out?
You're being disingenuous now.
I pointed out that torches should start lit, and that you should only be punished and need to relight the torch for using it incorrectly. So no, unequipping it wouldn't punish you, but you're trading fighting in the light for fighting in the dark.
If you're concerned about alternative. torches, then there are also extremely simple solutions there. (I.E. Steel Torch doesn't go out when you get knocked on your ass because it's reinforced, St. Trina's lets you roll and splash in water.)
Despite how much you're making me elaborate, it's all still rather simple, wouldn't need much work, and is highly preferable to dark caves serving no purpose besides making you take 4 seconds to equip a Lantern.
Why even include dark areas at all, if they're pointless?
So then what's stopping you from just equipping a different torch from your bottomless inventory? You get like six different torches over the course of the game. I'm sorry, this just doesn't work while you have an infinite inventory full of shit you can pull out of your butthole. And the ability to teleport anywhere at any time, with no cost. It just doesn't work.
>Why even include dark areas at all, if they're pointless?
That's pretty obvious, it makes the game more atmospheric. Additionally, the lantern doesn't give off a lot of light, but it has zero drawbacks. Torches give off a LOT of light, but they take up a weapon slot that you could be using to two-hand, dual wield or for a shield, staff etc. I frequently use torches because the light they give off is superior to the lantern.
You're incredibly disingenuous, and I see it's going to be difficult to argue with you. Everything you list either has a glaringly simple solution, or is a non-issue.
>So then what's stopping you from just equipping a different torch from your bottomless inventory?
Having them share lighting status is the obvious and simple solution, if that's even a huge problem. There are already other consumables that 'just let you equip a different version' and there's no design issue there.
>I'm sorry, this just doesn't work while you have an infinite inventory full of shit you can pull out of your butthole.
I've already told you that item stacks can be limited, and they're only replenished when you sit down at a grace. Since you've said you didn't use consumables much in your playthrough, you were unaware of this.
>And the ability to teleport anywhere at any time, with no cost. It just doesn't work.
Torches are already only intended to be used in dungeons and caves, short adventuring sections that only have a single grace at the beginning. You'd have to restart the entire area.
So in service of having a "more realistic" torch we now have
>all the torches in your inventory are magically linked, if one of them is put out, all of them are put out
This is fricking moronic and you know it
>I've already told you that item stacks can be limited
NOT
FRICKING
WEAPONS
Torches are not items. They are not consumables. They are weapons. ER doesn't even have weapon durability.
>Since you've said you didn't use consumables much in your playthrough, you were unaware of this.
I am entirely aware of inventory limits. They do not apply to weapons. A torch is a weapon.
>Torches are already only intended to be used in dungeons and caves, short adventuring sections that only have a single grace at the beginning. You'd have to restart the entire area.
Or if there was a proper inventory management system, savvy players would make sure to always carry a torch and something to light it with them. This isn't complicated. But again- this would require a complete rework of the game's inventory systems.
Without that rework, you are stuck with some weird ass system where when the torch in your hand goes out, it auto consumes a consumable to re light it (that you can probably craft a near infinite amount of anyway) but if you don't have the consumable then you don't have a light, and also none of your other torches in your inventory don't have a light for... some reason???
I don't know why you're being so moronic about this. It's obvious that if you're going to make the torch a resource that you can lose, that you need an actual inventory management system, and not this infinite pull any item/weapon out of my ass at any moment shit.
That's just the reality. I'm sorry if you're too stupid, too moronic, and too gay to see it.
>So in service of having a "more realistic" torch we now have
No, disingenuous moronanon, in favor of gameplay.
It's the feeling of:
>I'd be careful in this cave, I don't want my torch going out and leaving in the dark...
Against.
>Oh. A cave. Time to spend a few seconds equipping the lantern.
Do you not see how one is obviously preferable? Are you simply stupid? You seem to be think mechanics can be only be implemented in the most disingenuous, overly convoluted and confusing ways. And yet, with an IQ this low, you think you can call anyone else stupid?
>NOT LE FUUUUUUUUUUUUCKING HECKIN WEAPOOONS!!!
Consumables. That relight the Torch if you make a mistake while wielding it. This isn't any different from a Rune Arc.
>but if you don't have the consumable then you don't have a light
You're mentally moronic. I've pointed out multiple times thus far that torches should stay lit. This entire argument was you floundering to get me to explain simplistic mechanics to you, so that you could do as a moron does, and say it'd be complicated BECAUSE I bothered explaining the intricacies to you.
No, moronanon. Using a consumable to relight a torch is not worthy of redditishly saying:
>for... some reason???
Nor is not being able to cheese it by equipping another Torch... if that's even implemented. I only bothered mentioning it because you, a moronanon, brutishly insisted on it. Equipping a variant isn't an issue for any other consumable in the game.
Again, you only bothered mentioning this in a stupid attempt to secure le HECKING OWN on me and show everyone that having a meaningful torch would be too complicated for Elden Ring... and failing, because anyone with an IQ above 85 would see how simple everything I discussed is.
i'll take the torch system we currently have over one that's functionally the same but with added inconvenience.
And now, everyone, see how the moronanon retreats to troonycase when defeated.
90% of gamers would prefer a system that heightens tension and encourages careful play - and one that makes the Darkness(a core symbol in Elden Ring, especially in the death-ridden catacombs and caves a torch is useful in) meaningful.
As is, there is a half-implemented lighting mechanic in the game, that would've benefited tremendously from the simple solutions I provided.
Jesus christ, can both of you just frick off?
I like dark souls
and yet the 5th time was your breaking point and not DS3 the laziest retread in the series?
>Bethesda
>massive dynamic battles and factions
Todd please
I mean that's kind of my whole point. If even experienced game devs like CDPR and Bethesda can't truly deliver on the promise of that kind of RPG, what chance would Fromsoft have? I'd still like to see them try, but their quest/NPC design is very weak. Factions exist, but only really as covenants for multiplayer. Maybe it's something they could try to implement on a small scale in their next project, now that they have open world stuff down pat.
Shut the frick up anon. You don't build an open world without thinking what you're going to do in it. I wasn't even suggesting Bethesda dynamic battles, I was saying Elden Ring would have been more interesting if you could have factions at war with each other. There has already been some level of that in Dark Souls 2 in the Ivory King boss room, and Sekiro showed another side with sneaking and assassinations. What we actually got was a mess of a game, and thus one that is going to be less impactful that Dark Souls and Bloodborne. This is why most people are tepid towards the DLC because everyone knows that the meat of the content is going to spaced out by vast meadows and uninteresting platforming on a mountainside.
If ER was just legacy dungeons strapped to one another it'd be better than dark souls 2 and 3.
>There has already been some level of that in Dark Souls 2 in the Ivory King boss room
Yeah anon, you get a clunky fight with a whole 12 NPC's fighting each other. Amazing.
How the frick would you even have dynamic warring factions in Elden Ring without the scope feeling stupidly tiny compared to the rest of the world? Did you think through literally ANY of this? Even if you could fit like 100+ NPC's on each side of a battle, how the frick would that even work mechanically? It'd just be a cluster frick.
>Dynamic battles
There's already a bunch of medium sized skirmishes of various factions of enemies scattered through the map. Mechanically, I don't see how having a hundreds of NPC's wildly flailing at each other would make for very engaging content. There's a reason these types of videos are just people watching them fight it out. The novelty factor is what makes it interesting.
>Mechanically, I don't see how having a hundreds of NPC's wildly flailing at each other would make for very engaging content.
Because your pea brain only sees Fromsoft's shitty AI in action instead of actual AI army tactics.
Yes anon, that's a great idea. Fromsoft should have wasted a bunch of time and resources developing proper group battle tactics for the AI of enemies in the game, because Elden Ring is Mount and and Blade now for some reason?
This is called scope creep, and experienced devs avoid it for a reason.
>Yes anon, that's a great idea.
Yes anon, it is a great idea because it makes sense to do that when you make an open fricking world.
GTFO.
It's a great idea to turn your ARPG into an RTS because open world? What??
If you make an open world, then you make gameplay that fits it otherwise it's just wasting your time.
So the only type of gameplay that fits an open world is a mixture of RTS with hack'n slash? Why is that exactly? What about open worlds specifically require there to be giant battles between NPC factions? Can you give me any examples of games that achieve what you're talking about?
The trend of wannabe zoomie game devs here is pretty funny. Like yeah, go tell the wildly successful game studio how their game would have totally been better if they spent a ton of time and resources adding something that would be of literally zero benefit to the final product. You'd need an entirely different type of game design to take advantage of big battles with hundreds or thousands of NPC's
Keep ignoring the fact that Fromsoft did frick all meaningful with the open world. Is it any wonder why the sandbox genre is now known and the blandbox genre.
> Is it any wonder why the sandbox genre is now known and the blandbox genre.
That's great then, because Elden Ring's world was never intended to be a sandbox. It's there to facilitate exploration. There's more than one type of open world game
>because Elden Ring's world was never intended to be a sandbox
Open world is worse that sandbox because there's barely anything to do in them.
>Open world is worse that sandbox
Correct. Tell me anon, what makes an open world game better than a sandbox game.
The open world in Elden Ring exists to facilitate player exploration and freedom, to immerse them in the setting and to create a space for side content players can use to level up (replacing the traditional method of grinding by repeating the same level over and over)
If you're expecting the open world to actually be the main gameplay loop, then you're playing the wrong game. Elden Ring's content is still largely inside the levels and dungeons like any other souls game.
>exploration and freedom
You can do all of that without an open world as we have seen with past Fromsoft games. All open world did was make the journey between meaningful content longer and repetitive.
>You can do all of that without an open world as we have seen with past Fromsoft games
Having what is essentially a level select screen (like in demon's souls) does not provide the same experience as actually physically traversing the space between levels does.
The approach in DS1 is better but limited- the world of Elden Ring physically would not function if they had to cram everything as close together as it is in DS1.
DS2 doesn't have everything crammed together, but the world of the game makes no geographic sense. You don't get the sense of a cohesive world, which is one of the biggest problems with the game.
And DS3 is pretty much just a linear corridor from start to finish.
So no, they could not accomplish what they did in elden ring in a non open world format. The world design in all their previous games had serious flaws, and there are a lot of things you can do with an open world that you couldn't do with a smaller scope.
>And DS3 is pretty much just a linear corridor from start to finish.
>all those people who couldn't find the cathedral of the deep at launch
having a few rooms that branch off from the corridor doesn't mean it isn't a corridor.
Should've actually worded it, the meme arrows have destroyed my brain.
I'm agreeing with you more than anything, that's why I find it hilarious that so many people completely missed an entire boss fight and key area because they tunnel visioned abyss watchers...
To be fair, I think the way you access it is a bit hidden. I explore obsessively, so I didn't miss it.
Well yeah, that's the thing, if you actually explore there's pretty much no chance you would miss it. Now I'm just lamenting how many normies act die hard about souls games but then cannot even be bothered exploring and just find everything out with guides.
Elden Ring is probably the perfect example, considering the Ranni ending, arguably the most out of the way one to do, was by far the one the most people had done because everyone just hopped onto the meme bandwagon of "O MY FOUR ARM BLUE WIFE"
If someone likes Ranni I can tell they either didnt play the game or just watched Letsplays of it to get all the info. Bonus points for if the Ranni art is off-model, geriatric porn bait. Its like Samus. If you post Zero Suit or any other fetishy variation you are advertising to everyone you do not play Metroid. Which is fine just do the whole porn addict ERP thing on discord or /trash/.
Tbf Ranni's questline does get fairly straightforward if you explore around Liurnia and Caelid, Rogier's quest also led you into it. After you get started the directions are fairly clear. Meanwhile
>Goldmask requires you to explore around for that one statue, read the message, and use a spell that requires some INT investment
>Fia just fricks off with no hints whatsoever, you just stumbles into her if you explores around and get to Deeproot which is entirely optional otherwise
>Dung Eater requires you to explore and collect his semen around the world, with some being in Elphael
>Having what is essentially a level select screen (like in demon's souls) does not provide the same experience as actually physically traversing the space between levels does.
I've played dozens of open world games, they always end up being the same type of meaningless content. Once you've explored 10% of the content you've explored everything the open world has the offer. It's nothing but a trick you play on yourself that traversing the space between levels mean anything.
Handcrafted level design will always be superior to open world. Always.
>Handcrafted level design will always be superior to open world. Always.
The handcrafted legacy dungeons in Elden Ring are the best Fromsoft has ever made. Is your brain actually so addled by ADHD and modern social media that you can't wait 5 minutes to ride from one level to the next, soaking up the beautiful atmosphere?
>The handcrafted legacy dungeons in Elden Ring are the best Fromsoft has ever made.
Handcrafted my arse. Ever since Bloodborne the level design has been increasingly using crafted dungeon sections like a rogue dungeon. It's all so boring to see now, with the exception being Stormveil Castle, but even that place falls into the trappings of a rogue dungeon design.
>Handcrafted my arse. Ever since Bloodborne the level design has been increasingly using crafted dungeon sections like a rogue dungeon
What the frick are you even talking about? ARe you saying there are portions of the legacy dungeons that are procedurally generated?
What portions of Raya Lucaria or Leyndell are procedurally generated? What the frick are you even talking about?
Ever since Bloodborne, Fromsoft have designed a level program that snaps together room sections like a rogue dungeon. This pattern is mostly predominant in the catacomb sections in Elden Ring. When you see the same sections being repurposed all across the world, everything starts to look the same and has no identity of its own. It fricking sucks and I get bored out of my ass seeing it everywhere.
Okay, so I'll repeat myself. The handcrafted legacy dungeons in Elden Ring are the best Fromsoft has ever made.
I am not talking about the catacombs, or the mines, or the caves. I am talking about the legacy dungeons, which very clearly are handcrafted.
>Okay, so I'll repeat myself. The handcrafted legacy dungeons in Elden Ring are the best Fromsoft has ever made.
They are not. They have long stretches of nothing. Imagine trying traverse them with depleting stamina always on instead of when you're near an enemy. What a fricking slog.
Oh, so you just have ADHD then and don't have an opinion worth shit. Nice to know.
Nothing to do with ADHD. I get enjoyment out of expertly crafted worlds, I don't get satisfaction from surface level crap.
Bored of it. As I have already pointed out, once you've seen 10% of open world content you've see it all. All that is left is the time wasting traveling from point A to point B.
>Nothing to do with ADHD. I get enjoyment out of expertly crafted worlds, I don't get satisfaction from surface level crap.
Except you don't. You get enjoyment out of being a contrarian. The legacy dungeons in Elden Ring ARE expertly crafted. They look amazing, and the level design is intricate.
But apparently they have some big open areas in them, which is just too much for you. Cities and castles wouldn't just have big open spaces in them. Have you ever actually been in a real castle? Or even gone on a hike? Your life must be so pathetic, I pity you.
I think you're just being contrarian for the sake of it. Take Elden Ring and put it into the format of say, Demon's Souls. You just have the hub area, and you can teleport to the various legacy dungeons.
How is that an improvement? And now grinding is a massive chore because there's no side content that you can do to level up or get upgrade materials.
Demon Souls has handcrafted level design from top to bottom. Open world is nothing but open bore.
Elden ring's legacy dungeons are both larger and better designed than the ones in demon's souls.
>Elden ring's legacy dungeons are both larger and better designed than the ones in demon's souls.
Nonsense.
Objectively in terms of size, they are bigger. And objectively, they are denser and more interconnected, with more verticality because of how Fromsoft is able to take advantage of the new jumping mechanics.
Only Stormveil Castle is comparable. The others are shit.
What's wrong with Raya Lucaria or Leyndel?
They have long stretches of nothing.
Are you terrified of empty spaces or something? When you step outside and see a mountain, do you shriek in panic and hide?
Raya Lucaria and Leyndell are packed to the gills with detail, and Raya Lucaria has so many extra paths hidden behind bushes and on the rooftops that it's excellent.
Yeah it took me ages to discover all the secrets. The water wheel elevator was kino as frick. The only legacy dungeon that wasn't superb was Farum Azula.
kek Elden Ring's world is hand-crafted and there are surprises everywhere.
>Handcrafted level design will always be superi-ACK
Shart Souls 2 level design is awful tho
>posts one of the worst designed areas in DS2 to prove his point
>Is it any wonder why the sandbox genre is now known and the blandbox genre.
always was.
good thing elden ring isn't a sandbox then
>sandbox game
you can't even identify genres properly.
>Yeah anon, you get a clunky fight with a whole 12 NPC's fighting each other. Amazing.
And it was the most kino moment in the franchise. Your point?
Ivory King is good but Gael is obviously the most Kino
His line where he goes:
>Huh... I guess we were really Dark Souls III, Unkindled One...
Makes it ideal GankerKINO, but prevents it from being true Kino. Do you understand?
I'm not arguing what that other Anon was, but first off, NPCs fighting eachother isn't a 'gimmick' anymore than regular combat is, Fromsoft just hasn't really explored it. And around 12 NPCs is the ideal amount for the Fromsoft engine. Anymore and it just becomes a stupid RTS.
I liked those areas where you could see NPCs beating the shit out of eachother, and that one Radahn dungeon where his knights were fighting Malenia's. Those examples show it's conceptually fine.
Gael is Kino because of his fricking ridiculous move set in phase 2 and 3 and how it comes out of nowhere after phase 1, and with the reveal coming at the climax of the best song in the entire souls series (but not bloodborne because obviously there are like 4 or 5 better songs in that game)
Agreed. It's still 98.5% kino for me.
Oh yeah, all I'm saying is that wanting to have some sort of LOTR size battle is stupid. I wouldn't mind if another boss tried that concept again.
It was a fun gimmick for sure, but it would be pretty hard to scale up to the size of an actual battle.
Bro did you even play Elden Ring? There are a ton of spots where enemies are fighting each other. There's even an entire dungeon where its Radahn's soldiers fighting scarlet knights and you can either join in or whiz past them all to grab the loots.
Also there are hardly any areas that are empty in the open world. There feels like there is SOMETHING to find every 20 feet or so. You literally got points of interest across from points of interest, next to other points of interests.
>Bro did you even play Elden Ring?
Yes, completed it twice and got every trophy apart from the Frenzy ending because I was bored out of my fricking rocker.
>Also there are hardly any areas that are empty in the open world. There feels like there is SOMETHING to find every 20 feet or so. You literally got points of interest across from points of interest, next to other points of interests.
I've already said that previous Fromsoft games are superior because you don't have to traverse a bunch of bland and repetitive open world sections that take up 90% of the total content. I'm not going to repeat myself again.
The level design of Elden Ring legacy dungeons mostly suffer because Fromsoft was spending those resources building their open bore. I'm also going to say this to you as well that the legacy dungeon crafting is better in previous games. I will not repeat myself to you either.
>The level design of Elden Ring legacy dungeons mostly suffer because Fromsoft was spending those resources building their open bore
You haven't quantified how they suffer though. You have zero examples other than "there are big open spaces"
Like big open spaces didn't exist in previous souls games. Did you forget the massive hike down the Causeway to the cathedral in Anor Londo? All the empty space in Darkroot garden? There are literally areas in every souls game that are just "big open areas"
How is the dungeon and level design better in previous games? What level in DS1, DS2 or D3 is on par with Stormveil, Raya Lucaria or Leyndell? Have you even played any of these games?
>You haven't quantified how they suffer though.
I fricking have you lying c**t, I have already pointed out that they have that rouge type level design of putting pre built sections together that's been a thing since bloodborne.
Are you moronic or something? Why do you keep mixing up the legacy dungeons with the catacombs, caves and mines? It's pretty obvious those are made using a similar tool to the chalice dungeons.
Now pay attention. We're talking about Legacy Dungeons. Stormveil. Raya Lucaria, Leyndell, Farum Azula, etc. What's wrong with those levels?
>Are you moronic or something? Why do you keep mixing up the legacy dungeons with the catacombs, caves and mines?
I've literally said that this repetitive shit is in the legacy dungeons with Stormveil Castle being the least offender.
Now clear off, I'm done beating this fricking drum.
Where in the legacy dungeons? What parts of the levels are being randomly generated with the chalice dungeon system? You can't name any, because there aren't any. You're so mindfricked by your own Ganker contrarian groupthink that you literally hallucinated something that does not exist. Incredible.
>rouge
Scream, cry and piss yourself, babyman.
>Like big open spaces didn't exist in previous souls games. Did you forget the massive hike down the Causeway to the cathedral in Anor Londo? All the empty space in Darkroot garden? There are literally areas in every souls game that are just "big open areas"
that has nothing to do with what he said you disingenuous homosexual, none of those areas take up a large portion of the game map
You have no taste and unlikely even played the game.
This tbh
Remember when everyone was saying that this game was going to be about Ambition and imposing your will upon the world like some badass pagan hero? The game we got feels so lifeless and drab in comparison- and instead of being able to choose a claimant or construct your own Mending Ring it's just another 'you were le manipulated the whole time!' plot. Miyazaki needs to find a tone that isnt Mono No Aware if he wants his settings to feel distinct.
I WANT THE DLC AND I WANT IT NOW
Honestly I used to think things were a bit disjointed. However, go watch the youtube videos of tarnished archaeologist. Guy is very autistic in attention to detail, and honestly the narrative he presents is very much a coherent one.
The ER lore just isn't as interesting as DS. Most of the curiosity and confusion I felt was ultimately more from TL frickery than the actual concepts. Empyreans and Numen? These words are used oddly and with no explanation. The Japanese words used are reasonably self-explanatory.
Dark Souls 1 lore > Elden Ring lore > Demon's Souls lore > Bloodborne lore >>>>>>> Dark Souls 3 lore >>>>>>>>>> Dark Souls 2 lore
Elden Ring has got interesting lore, imo
DS3 is the worst by far dude
look at Anor Londo, remember Anor Londo, look at Gwyndolyn, remember Gwyndolyn, look at the painted world, remember the painted word? I liked Gael, but man DS3 lore is dogshit
>Heroes from the past who sacrificed themselves are resurrected once again for one more duty
It makes sense that you revisit some areas and you revisit some NPCs from DS1. But DS3 has enough new things to justify bringing back some of the old. The DS3 criticisms of seeing some of DS1's things again is a stupid one. 95% of DS3 is new content. But you SHOULD see some of DS1's literally just based on the lore.
(cont.) and why is DS3 lore better than DS2 lore? Because at least it's actually something. DS2 lore is a random mishmash of nonsense stapled together in the last minute. No rhyme, no reason. Maybe DS3 lore is a retreading of old ideas, but it's actually SOMETHING.
yes that's what sequels are like
Will we see miquella and malenia's shadowbound beasts in the DLC?
>they're a duo bossfight
would be kino tbh
my opinion is he needs to stop remaking the same fricking game with the same fricking story every single time
Was playing today and went to activate Godrick's rune. I guess the fingers are atop the Divine Towers because the signal's better up there?
don't worry about it
No, I actually think that's it: they're literally antennae hanging out and waiting for the Greater Will to get in touch.
Antennas is an apt way to describe the Fingers. My own view has always been that this species was particularly chosen/subjugated by the Greater Will to serve as its emissaries because of its innate ability to communicate across the universe by using its long appendages.
Also, I'm just going to bring up an old observation:
>Quella, Goddess of Dreams
>Miquella, known for sleep-related items and a dream mechanic in cut content
>the Golden Tree of the dreamworld
Elden Ring is Dark Souls 2: 2.
Lol I've literally been saying this since day 1. Half as a meme, half true. DS2 was even focused around crowns and thrones and had a war with giants. FYI, DS2 was actually originally designed as an open world game, but the tech couldn't handle it so the idea was scrapped and they had to make the game in like a year from the assets they had on hand.
Shame that ironically, ER ended up half-baked as well, same as DS2. Guess it'll have its own SotFS overhaul equivalent in the DLC, I hope so anyway.
>Shame that ironically, ER ended up half-baked as well, same as DS2
I mean, even Demon's Souls and DS1 had cut content. I'd say ER is by far the least half baked game Fromsoft has made since DS1 at least. If you go look at the concept art, it's almost at 1:1 with the final product. There was stuff cut and rushed for sure, but not to the extent of DS2 where the levels don't even fit together logically, or DS3 where so fricking much was cut or swapped around between the leak and release.
>DS3 where so fricking much was cut or swapped around between the leak and release.
I'll never forgive them for taking this shot away
Not even a Director's Cut can bring that much back, can't it? I do wonder how much it would cost to technically pay the entire team to implement DS3, the true way.
But good luck even to the wealthy to be able to support the costs.
>Expectations for the DLC
GETTER SHINE!
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
People put too much thought into it causing any discussion about it to be full of headcanon
I want torrent to sit on my face
Theres femboy art of him
you have to bear in mind that time is convoluted
they gave that asmr homosexual Vaati a career and that's annoying. The everyone is so mysterious talking in the games also gets annoying after a while. The good part is that people actually want to talk about the games
i hope we get new torrent abilities
elden ring lore sucks
How can Melina be both the Gloam Eyed Queen and Marika’s daughter when the Gloam Eyed Queen is never described as having any relation to her and is only said to be an “Emperyean.” Other gods clearly exist like Eiglay, The Fell God, the Dragon God who just up and maybe others but theres just a huge contradiction that the game also tries to drive home in one of its major and arguably poignant endings. Either nobody but the player is meant to know that or Fromsoftware could not decide and just didnt care about who Melina is. Theres even evidence to say she was apart of the Black Knives since she fights just like them, not to mention she can physically FIGHT despite saying shes a disembodied spirit who nobody but you can see.
Whatever Melina is meant to be is schizophrenic and it could have been so much simpler or even enigmatic without feeling ridiculous.
Personally, I think Melina was a child of Marika and Radagon who was given some power that was taken as a spoil of war upon Maliketh's defeat of the Gloam-Eyed Queen. That would explain why Melina has reddish hair and a thematic butterfly, the Smouldering Butterfly, akin to Malenia's Aeonian Butterfly and Miquella's Nascent Butterfly. Melina would know how to fight like the Black Knife Assassins because Marika herself was implied to be part of their order before she splintered off to wield the Elden Ring and be a god.
Others theorize that the Gloam-Eyed Queen started as a separate Empyrean, but then was reincarnated as Marika's daughter with Radagon.
It's simple. Melina is not Marika's daughter in the conventional sense, but a spiritual derivative. She effectively IS Marika, or whatever is left of her. Why do you think you only see her at sites of grace? How can she can remember things Marika said when Melina was not around? How can she remember things Marika only said to herself? Melina is Marika.
And she was also the gloam eyed queen.
Who defeated the gloam eyed queen? Not Marika, but her Shadow, Maliketh. And like all shadows, his purpose was to keep her in line. And so he did. He hurt her so badly that Melina still bears the beast claw mark as a scar and a seal on her past.
If the Shadow ever turns on the Empyrean, that's because the Empyrean has been declared a lost cause and is to be killed. Marika cannot be the Gloam-Eyed Queen, because Maliketh would have outright killed her in that case and the Greater Will and Two Fingers would have to select a different Empyrean to wield the Elden Ring.
At that time, there was only one empyrean. They made her work.
Malikeths purpose isn’t to keep her in line hes her comrade in arms and bodyguard. If that were the case he wouldve cleaved her in two when she shattered the bloody ring. Also Melina states “spoken echoes” which means Marika left some sort of divine imprint.
Perhaps in a twist of fate, Marika was "saved" by the existence of her other half.
Shes personally crucified by the Elden Beast who supercedes everything sans Outer Gods with parts of her internal organs missing. I suspect that permanent death would be much more merciful than being subjected to thousands of years of torture and humiliation.
Hence, "saved".
In that case, Radagon would have been annihilated, which we know didn't happen since he's still around to become Elden Lord and later be the first phase of the final boss fight.
We have no reason to believe that, especially since, after Placidusax's god fled and apparently abandoned the Elden Ring, the Greater Will and Two Fingers seemed content to wait until another Empyrean was born, namely Marika.
>In that case, Radagon would have been annihilated
Why? He put Marika in the cage, stabilized the elden ring, used his own magic to seal both it and himself away where it could not be hurt ever again. There was no reason for the fingers to go after him, they may not have even been able to if they wanted
If she's a part of Marika how is she still around in the Frenzied Flame ending where Marika's body is crumbled to dust and incinerated by the fire?
Because Melina was already a spirit with no body
Then she isn't Marika then.
She's her ghost. Or part of her ghost at least
It's super vague because it's not the main point of the games, and because it's super vague, people pretend like it's some super awesome and deep thing.
It just exists to help guide ideas in the worldbuilding for level design so there's an internal logic to things.
At least for their soulsborne stuff. Armored Core is obvioiulsy different and older.
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
its fine, love that they dont try to push mediocre story and hours long cutscenes down my throat
>Expectations for the DLC?
Beach episode with my wife Ranni.
Maybe I'm too stupid but I still can't understand how death works.
Why do people still die even after the Rune of Death was removed?
What about the spirit world? Does the erdtree prevent people from going there?
Is there is reincarnation like new beings or people just revive?
What exatctly was the Ranni ritual with Godwyn?
Fromsoft "lore" worked best when it was simple and understated. A cinematic opening explaining the state of the world. An NPC or two to dictate a concise goal and set of actions that you're destined to follow. A world that felt lived in, but nothing was explained. After you finish that short narrative driven goal, you'd get hooked and find your own motivation to continue through the vast remainder of the game.
The only unfortunate thing is, Demon's Souls and Dark Souls did this the best. While yes, they are very similar, they were different enough in overarching characters, themes, tone, design, and overall architecture of the game.
Unfortunately, it's also the only story they can tell. DS2, DS3, Sekiro, Bloodborne, and Elden Ring all follow what has now become their go-to formula. Everything in Elden Ring's lore just seems like the crusty left-overs from Demon's Souls. It sucks ass tbh because I like the game.
>GRRM spends all his time criticizing Tolkien bringing up complete irrelevancies.
>"Oh why didn't he explain TAXES?!"
>And then he never proceeds to do any of that in his own books.
>Big bad of the Silmarillion named Morgoth.
>GRRM names the first big bad of Elden Ring, Morgott.
Bravo, you fat moron.
>GRRM does the worldbuilding for Elden Ring
>There is no port city in the game
>there are no farms
>we see no tax collectors or methods of tax collection in game
GEORGE YOU FAT FRICK
>implying the japs didn't just scribble over George's 2-page draft with their own tried-and-true setting tropes
He probably didn't even come up with Dung Eater
i would love to know what specifically GRRM did in elden ring
i feel like it was mostly just a few backstories and names of characters
no way he had anything to do with the map layout
The Lands Between (Middle-Earth) and Numen (Numenoreans) were definitely done by him since hes been trying to surpass Tolkien his whole life. Numen are even said to be descendants of people who got punished by an even higher power just like the Numenoreans when Eru nuked their entire continent.
>Godfrey
>Radagon
>Rennala
>Marika
Every character in the game is descended from GRRM. bravo georgie
Fia is 100% GRRM.
There aren't any titcows in the Lands Between at all, which makes me think fatfrick just did the basic outline for the lore and that's it
>GRRM does the worldbuilding for Elden Ring
>Miyazaki gets a hold of his work
>"And then bad thing happened, removing all trace of everything my dev team isn't competent enough to include in the game"
I hate FromSoftware
Why write a coherent story and setting when you know the fanbase will do it for you
Yeah anon, Fromsoft should have made the scope of the game balloon 10x by including massive living cities full of NPC's for the player to interact with.
There is literally not a single dev studio on the planet that could take a world as big as the lands between and fill it with living NPC's and then make a functional game out of it. What the frick would the player even be doing if the big legacy dungeons were filled with living breathing NPC's?
It's absurd, you people have literally no clue what you're talking about.
>Fromsoft should have made the scope of the game balloon 10x by including massive living cities full of NPC's for the player to interact with.
Yeah how silly, I'm glad they instead chose to make the scope of the game balloon 10x by including a metric frickton of dungeons that look and play the same while having next to zero unique characteristics.
>There is literally not a single dev studio on the planet that could do this stupid idea I made in my head for the sole purpose of seeming too difficult for any developer to pull off. From did EVERYTHING they could!
have a nice day
Who said it couldn't be post-shattering? Could there at least be the ruins of a fallen civilization somewhere?
How would you even structure Elden Ring if the game isn't post-shattering? You going to go do fetch quests for queen marika?
>Fromsoft fan when he finds out that there are games which don't take place in post-apocalyptic wastelands which conveniently excuse the devs from having to construct a functioning world (there are also games where the enemies aren't all mindless zombies but he hasn't learned this yet)
You could also just set it during the Shattering
So I'll repeat my question
How would you even structure Elden Ring if the game isn't post-shattering? You going to go do fetch quests for queen marika?
>Yeah how silly, I'm glad they instead chose to make the scope of the game balloon 10x by including a metric frickton of dungeons that look and play the same while having next to zero unique characteristics.
...That's not scope. Do you even know what scope is? Scope is the amount of work the devs have to do to complete the product. It's how much workload has to be completed to ship a product. Those dungeons are there for the sake of players who need to grind for extra levels, and there's literally nothing wrong with them design wise.
>Who said it couldn't be post-shattering? Could there at least be the ruins of a fallen civilization somewhere?
Okay, so how do you make the game work structurally? You're now doing fetch quests for (insert fallen civilization)
How is that going to work, exactly? What does doing fetch quests add to the game? Or maybe we could have some quests where we walk behind an NPC while they talk, that would add a lot of value to the game!
I'm not going to answer your question because it's a bad faith question and it's already been answered besides
Lol okay. Here's what I will say. Nobody who claims to be able to give an answer, but refuses to give it for (insert reason) is able to actually give that answer. If it's so easy, you'd just do it.
You get bonus points for claiming it's been answered already (without pointing out where). That's because you're trying to pretend that you win, despite knowing that if I actually force you to get into any sort of detail, all of your ideas and arguments will immediately fall apart.
In other words: Cope
>anyone who refuses to waste their time reasoning with obstinate morons (who assume that just because a game takes place in a living setting it HAS to be filled exclusively with boring collect 10 bear anuses fetchquests) is [schizobabble]
nah I just know that your married to your point
*you're
oopsie
>continuing to type words that aren't the answer
This is embarrassing
Why do the Zamoran ruins look identical to every other ruin despite them being their own unique culture? The funny part is you just know if this happened in a Bethesda game there'd be a million 4-hour long video essays about how this doesn't make sense and lazy worldbuilding and etc etc but here it just doesn't matter at all that all these cultures which lived in the Lands Between have the exact same architecture
Why do the ruins in Limgrave also look like the ruins in Liurnia an Atlas? And why do all of them look like the ruins in Dark Souls 3? hmm...
what do they eat?
Bro you don't get it.. git gud.. skill issue
boyfeet
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
It started out fine but the vagueness eventually turned into nonsense and it's just lazy, a great way for them to not actually construct any narrative or have any actual writing
>Expectations for the DLC?
Lots of rolling
>I think in Elden Ring too many things are disjointed, I don't think the DLC will answer anything.
Yep. Demon's Souls, Dark Souls 1, Bloodborne and Sekiro are the only modern formsoft games with an actual coherent story.
>Yes I care about lore in Souls game, story, worlbuilding, atmosphere and presentation are what elevates Bloodborne as the best From game
Care about it less. If they can't be bothered to at least try the bare minimum then why should it be your job to piece together their nonsense that was never meant to be pieced together? Unless your name is Vaati, you gain nothing from it except wasting time.
i've always enjoyed piecing things together and discussing theories with my brother. i avoid all lore discussions and videos outside of that context though, lore communities are the most insufferable groups out there
lore aight
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
I'm sick of there being so much room for headcanon and homosexuals like vaati to make a living by pulling shit out of his ass. nothing wrong to have some degree of speculation, but shreds of a plot does not an interesting story make.
>Expectations for the DLC?
no expectations, frankly. I'm definitely going to play it but I have no idea what they're attempting. if I had to take an absolute stab in the dark I'd say that they're going to try and subvert expectations by having miquella the one manipulating mohg for some nefarious and unspecified purpose that you vaguely learn about as your explore and talk to npcs and such, and you end up fighting some corrupted version of him as a final boss battle.
>I think in Elden Ring too many things are disjointed, I don't think the DLC will answer anything.
yeah, agreed. honestly, it's part of the reason I see the game as plastic, hollow, and devoid of life. there are shreds of a working universe here, but they don't offer enough to grasp a fully realized albeit murky image of the who/what/where/why/how of it all and I'm tired of that.
>Yes I care about lore in Souls game, story, worlbuilding, atmosphere and presentation are what elevates Bloodborne as the best From game
of course, of course. I don't know I personally like sekiro the most, it's the only one with a very straightforward plot.
We'll, consider that Armored Core literally ends with THE ending in the first game, and then they just make more games without any regards to the first game, Echo Night and King's Field games are equally if not more disjointed, so I personally don't give a frick about fromlore, as long as the gameplay is fun.
the ps1 king's field trilogy games are heavily linked to each other. the most loosest one is the first game since it was literally the first game fromsoft ever made. but because of how barebones it is, coming up with two sequels for it was an easy enough task. 4 is a standalone story though.
MIQUELLA IS MINE AND MINE ALONE AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
>nu Ganker wants Fromsofts games and ALL games to play like DMC
>now nu Ganker wants Fromsofts games to play like a RTS
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
Its good, personally i think its pretty easy for a game's lore to lose me as it writes page after page of info dump and boring fluff, so i enjoy that every item in the game is about 3 to 5 sentences long, with one of them being gameplay info, as its just descriptive enough to be intriguing without being too long that it gets dull, and since every item has it, it becomes this drip feed of ideas that keeps me engaged without removing me from the game for 10 minutes to read about the game, just a quick 30 seconds.
>open menu
>find item
>read description
>"oh neat"
>close menu
Not to everyone tastes, but it fits me perfectly.
>Expectations for the DLC?
I think it will happen in the spirit/dream world as the elysian-like golden fields and the ghostly graves seem to indicate the former and miquella's presence seem to indicate the latter. I expect 5 things
>1
Godwyn bossfight because of the logo having the death centipede mark and the dark tree around the erdtree and miquella wanting to kill him
>2
Lots of "old heroes" minor fights since its in a spirit/heaven world
>3
A Sif-like change in the Malenia bossfight cutscene if not outright a new ending
>4
Maybe a return of the dreambrew quest, usually i dont believe in reuse of cutcontent but with them adding the little jar and the end of the limgrave succession quest i feel like there is a chance of them adding more non used content than usual, specially since it was related to st.trina/miquella
>5
A hint on their new ip
More random bullshit and nonsense and spooky area full of coffins or something and some big bosses.
Also some broken ass spells or weapons or shit for a couple of days until they're nerfed to trash.
Why would you ever do the those who live in death ending? Seem's really silly, like ooo lets fix none of the problems but now skeletons are allowed. Good fricking job, really satisfying conclusion there.
Because undead mommy milkers
she'd be a skeleton bro can't have milkers cause she's all bones. maggots have eaten her body already!
To access that ending you have to tell Fia that you murderized your way there and beat up all her simps just to get some hugs
I wanted a Dragon Communion ending.
>the reason all the other morons became belly dragging wyrms is they didnt have Great Runes
>consuming the hearts of the most powerful dragons also makes you stronger
>eventually you become the next Dragon God/Lord
>ending shows a bunch of Ancient Dragons bowing to you or flying around the new Erdtree
The Great Runes don't seem to protect people from becoming Magma Wyrms, the player character just doesn't change beyond the eye adjustment because otherwise it'd be a permanent dragon form that couldn't be turned off.
He probably means that the player would install a mending rune that would cast aside the divine punishment of being a magma worm and allow them to become a true dragon.
That anon seemed to think that the dragon hearts were the answer, not a mending rune, so he probably thought Great Runes in general just countered the side effects. Also, Placidusax's god, who was probably a dragon in turn, was the original wielder of the Elden Ring, so there wouldn't be a marked difference.
Great Runes can already stave off the effects of Outer God influence and are large portions of something constructed by the Greater Will. Surely they would be able to save a person eating a few hearts of some wyverns.
Great Runes are created by an outer god, the Greater Will, and various forces actually try to warp the runes: The God-Devouring Serpent and the Scarlet Rot have damaged Rykard and Malenia's runes respectively; Mohg's rune has been afflicted by the Formless Mother's Bloodflame; etc. Also, having Great Runes doesn't even prevent the player character from beginning to transform.
The Greater Will isn't an Outergod, or is at least well beyond the strength of other entities.
All the outer gods in game are representations of nature that Marika suppressed by uplifting the Erdtree. Chaos, Rot, Death, Destruction, Avarice and Suffering.
Anon, the Greater Will is an outer god, fitting all the descriptions for one and even apparently being an opposite to the Frenzied Flame. Where the Greater Will apparently created all life upon the One Great's fracturing, the Frenzied Flame can destroy all of existence. Also, how is "avarice" a force of nature? The Frenzied Flame seeks the apocalypse, the Kindred of Rot don't even treat each other well, based on Gowry getting to puppeteer their bodies and dismiss their deaths like they're nameless tools, and the Rune of Death destroys the soul, ruining any kind of cycle of spirits.
>It's an outer god, fitting all descriptions of one
Every outer god in the game is an obscene aspect of nature that the Erdtree cucked with its bounty. By definition, they're just offensive entities that exist "outside of" the golden order.
The GW isn't that, the GW is basically god or at least some weird alien star life form that dictates order on the planet. Not an outer god, the outer gods aren't cthulhu in the ED setting, they aren't from space.
>The FF
The FF is in all likelihood the GW's counterpart following the themes of duality in the game. If the GW is order, factoring into Causality, then the FF is the ultimate expression of Regression. Obviously an "outer god" from the perspective of the GO but most definitely actual kindred of the GW.
>Avarice a force
You have a point with that. Really I think the BS is just a Volcano deity not dissimilar from the Fell god. Marika hates the giants for following an entity with the one power to destroy the Erdtree, Fire, which is natural. Rykard aligned himself with an even hungrier, destructive force. Volcano's spew lava that melt things down, in that sense the BS is just FF light.
None of the OGs represent alien forces, they're all heavily repressed aspects of a world once devoid of death or suffering.
>the outer gods aren't cthulhu
They aren't limited to a single form in the least. What looks like one thing in one situation may be a myriad more in any other.
>None of the OGs represent alien forces, they're all heavily repressed aspects of a world once devoid of death or suffering.
Death and destruction is what they seek.
Outer Gods goal throughout all fictional and perhaps real examples is to take back the universe to its original state of sublime destruction for destruction sake.
I think the fingers are literally the hand of God, but split in two and as such expressing its dualistic nature like in the Zoroastrian religion. The severed and rotting hand of a dead god, still twitching and affecting the world but without any true will animating it
>God
>dualistic nature
aaaaaaahahahahahahhaaa
>Also, how is "avarice" a force of nature
Such is not impossible.
skeletons should be allowed to vote, they're my summon bros.
Like when joe biden got dead people to vote?
Fia is basically the Dung Eater if he was a woman and bothered trying to deceive people.
>Fix none of the problems
All the endings "fix" things one way or the other.
empyrean bussy
Who the frick cares, there is no real lore to fromslop games its just headcanon of schizos that make 2h youtube videos based on short description of an item, stop trying to make it more than it is.
>dedicate life to uncovering the lore of fromsoft games
>turns out the "lore" was taken from an asset gallery
kek
People who devote their time to analysing shit like textures are a lost cause. I just treat item descriptions like teaser trailers of the next episode of a tv show.
Are we sure this isn't just asset theft? There were a bunch of animations from ER up for sale on the unreal store. I don't see why people wouldn't also rip textures.
If you have the ability to travel ten years into the future and back I think there's something more worthwhile to do with it than stealing game textures.
They used real works as basis for things, like how they used gnosticism for the game. You can see clearly by looking at this piece that much of the story was built around it.
>What's that, you want to get from point A to point B. Well, you need to cross a massive plane of emptiness for half an hour to do that. Don't worry about being bored, here are a bunch of copy and paste small ruins to trick your brain into thinking it actually matters. You will be doing this for the next 100 hours. Welcome to Elden Ring.
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
always interesting, but fact of the matter is the combination of sometimes deficient translation by Frog Nation and late-development changes in story concept leaves it in a serious you-see-what-you-want flux
>Expectations for the DLC?
probably at least as big as some of the previous entries' DLCs combined (IE, Ashes of Ariandel+The Ringed City, or DS2's Crowns trilogy, maybe Bloodborne's single pretty big Old Hunters as a low bar) since they're keeping so mum about it, or at least I hope it is
>I think in Elden Ring too many things are disjointed, I don't think the DLC will answer anything.
less likely since the GRRM manifesto made probably the most stable bedrock so far for them to expand off of, we might still not know what the frick is going on with the Outer Gods business the same as we never really got a good picture of the Great Ones in detail, but they'll probably tie off any hanging plot threads to do with Marika's offspring and obviously Miquella in particular
>Bloodborne
Isn't even top 3 fromsoft games, keep coping
it'll be so fricking lame if miquela ends up being a copy paste of griffith. i don't believe there is enough evidence to support it personally. but i can see it happening and really hate it when these games lean really heavily on the berserk references. not to say i hate berserk but come on, be more original or at least subtle about it. zweihander is way cooler looking than the greatsword in this game also, suck it guts cosplayer dweebs.
>Expectations for the DLC?
blood corrupted goth femboy miquella
can't frickin wait
I personally can’t wait for the hidden fog boss room where Malenia and Mohg are both recycled bosses fought at the same time for no clear reason and then a bunch of losers spending months debating why
sounds kino, they have unfinished business after all.
I think Dark Souls is beautifully open ended and allows enough for people to imagine things. A lot of headcannon is just bullshit, but at least the open-endedness of it gives people that option to wonder about the mystery of the world which is good writing.
Like the story itself is meh, but the way it plays out and builds the world in a mysterious way is awesome
Don't really care for it, but I like games that don't forcefeed the story if you don't give a shit.
I really like it. Elden Ring world and setting feels more unique, curated and extravagant than previous Souls games
the lore is my dick in his buttpussy
The concept of aliens in a medieval fantasy game is stupid as shit.
Why? They are just creatures who originated among the stars. What are the Anunnaki/Nephilim?
I like how their interpretation of "aliens" is a dragon fly with a tail made of planets and a giant human skull for a face.
I personally find it to be the coolest trope ever. FFXVI does something similar and it's my favorite Final Fantasy now.
>Expectations for the DLC?
just your usual fromshit dlc, hopefully do something better with the garment altering because most of the armour sets in this game are shit, also hope they have a ship level/dungeon, talking about the one east of the Beastial Sanctum off the coast of caelid, shits annoying me badly
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
DeS, DaS1, BB are all well-written, extremely so in places. Or maybe its just me, because I enjoy when stories do the thing where they drop the entire jigsaw puzzle on the floor and say "you put it together and figure it out yourself". Not that I completely figured everything out about those games' lore, far from it; I ended up doing a lot of reading because of how fascinating it is, including the JP-English retranslations and things like that.
But the other games aren't really as well-written. Well, DaS2 has some good parts to the lore but DaS3 is needlessly convoluted and most of it doesn't really amount to much. There is evidence that DaS3 was just Fromsoft playing around with "what new idea have we not done yet" and so of course the lore is going to be a lot worse because they are literally just designing levels for the sake of giving players another level to explore, rather than each area having a purpose. I haven't actually played Sekiro or Elden Ring yet, to be honest, but I do catch some Elden Ring lore from time to time and its just so generic in comparison to what came before.
People shit on DaS 3's lore because of the last minute changes but it's really not that different. They threw some concepts at the wall, a war between Light gays and dark gays and a guy who wants neither to win for eternity.
All they did was change it so that guy was a mid-game boss and his plans were somehow congruent with the lord of hollows ending.
It's not generic. ER has the most in depth lore out of any of their titles. It's also by far the most complete, and there's only a few mistakes/errors in terms of continuity timelines and whatnot. As a huge loregay, it's surpassed DS1 in my eyes.
The Erdtree... Is... Le parasite?.. No... It can't be...
It isn't, it's a god representing life.
Malenia vs Radahn is such a legendary, high level confrontation that anons are still malding at one another over who's "right or wrong"? Miyazaki-sama. . .I kneel. . .
I'm going to cum on the physical disc of Elden Ring's DLC. This will both make it a holocrux and a vestige of feeling relenting.
>demon souls
Shit
>dark souls
Good
>dark souls 2
Okay
>dark souls 3
Barely satisfactory
>bloodborne
Okay
>sekiro
Good
>elden ring
The worst. All you do is observe a story which they forgot to write you in. The tarnished is clearly completely shoehorned into the lore when they realised Game of Thrones man gave no importance to the player character.
>Game of Thrones man gave no importance to the player character.
Wait, what are you even talking about?
They tell a story about the golden lineage then tack on that you the tarnished have gotta come and sort shit out by choosing one of 5 identical inconsequential endings.
I completely forgot GRRM worked on Elden Ring. . .I can't disagree either. I remember how disappointed I felt when I got the Goldmask ending and it wasn't even unique, just a reskin of the normal ending like with Fia's and Dungeater's as well.
Sucks dick. They paid an author to do video game lore without any direction to make it fit the style of storytelling. It really shows how little care was made to translate his material into the game in a good way.
Never played it, no means to run it, but how exactly did it came to be that some bunch of power hungry crazy alchemist-tische (the whole rebis and all I mean) nutters managed to usurp order from a godlike entity?
Why are Radahns soldiers still hostile to you after you fulfill the promise and put him out of his misery. The whole “shattered Elden Ring insanity” argument can be ignored when they’re sapient enough to target all the evil wildlife in the area, burn it and hold a festival in his honor to begin with.
This is legitimately the only part of the game that makes no sense.
I can buy the rest of the enemies attacking you - You're a Tarnished, a foreign invader, there to kill and depose their superiors. But the Redmane kBlack folk literally have NO reason to be mad at you. They even throw parties for letting Tarnished go fight Radahn directly. They WANT him to die.
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
I stopped giving a shit past Demon Souls and DaS one because it's garbage.
The gimmick they've been pushing got old fast once it got revealed there's absolutely no real substance at all coming from their need to replicate the feel of being an ESL reading English fantasy books for the first time. Souls lore at this point reads 1:1 like (Pic related) this fricking shit to me. If you call the Souls story shit people will say you just don't "get it" but I "got it" and got tired of the gimmick with Dark Souls 2.
These are also the same fricking people who were jerking off the lyrics for the Elden Ring soundtrack about the deep lore of the lyrics expressing hatred of the gods before it revealed it was computer generated garbage, or people who thought the broken NPC questlines day one for Elden Ring were part of some grander design about how some stories may end in an unsatisfying way (It was just broken). Frick outta here c**t
There's such a thing as too vague, I feel. There's a good narrative foundation in most Fromsoft games, but it never goes anywhere because they are way too invested in their method of storytelling that is basically just shrugging one's elbows and going "Who knows".
All FROM needs to deliver for me in a souls game is
>promise of big baddies with godlike powers
>you get to fight them later on
This is all that matters to me. I just want to fight badass monsters and warriors, etc.
>promise of big baddies
>not boobies
Those are a very welcomed extra, but not what I set off for in the first place. The unexpectedness of breasts makes them all the more welcome.
Elden Ring's lore is a bit shit. Compare it to Dark Souls, where you have an understanding of all the major character motivations and plot points, but are left wondering about the ramifications of linking or not linking the fire once you piece everything together. You have a complete picture with just enough ambiguity.
In Elden Ring, there are a lot of incredibly important points that you never understand:
>who is Melina?
>what is her motivation for anything she does?
>what is the force behind the guidance of grace? It's obviously not the greater will since we are actively prevented from entering the Erdtree.
>why did Queen Marika shatter the Elden Ring?
>what does it even matter that Radagon and Markia are the same person? Since they disagree on whether the Elden Ring should be shattered or not it's not clear what them being the same person even means
>who is Melina?
The Gloam Eyed Queen. It literally shows you this in one of the endings
>what is her motivation for anything she does?
To bring destined death back into the lands between
>what is the force behind the guidance of grace? It's obviously not the greater will since we are actively prevented from entering the Erdtree.
Doesn't matter it's just a same mechanic like in every FS title
>why did Queen Marika shatter the Elden Ring?
Bitches be cray
>what does it even matter that Radagon and Markia are the same person? Since they disagree on whether the Elden Ring should be shattered or not it's not clear what them being the same person even means
Trans representation
>I'm too stupid to understand basic plot elements so the lore is shit
At this juncture, I'd like to remind you that the Greater Will is a benevolent and just god whose arrival brought with it a golden age of prosperity that was ended and turned into the misery we experience via a massive woman moment.
Nice try, we saw Farum Azula, that first Elden Ring society was all sorts of messed up. Goldmask's rune is the way to go.
Goldmask is the highest order of GW simp, anon. His entire shtick is that the mortal "gods" (aka Empyreans) are fallible and cannot be trusted with the power to rule. So he endeavors to make it so that the ring is perfect, just as it was when it first came to the Lands Between and to go one step further and make it immutable from that state. And in that state, it is entirely in control of the GW.
The Empyreans, and the system of the Empyreans, was selected and crafted by the Greater Will in the first place, and the other outer gods try to muscle in on it. To hold all of the gods accountable and make the world better, even the outer gods have to be held accountable and cut out of the order.
GW IS the ring, or rather the ring is part of the GW. It gains its power from the GW, so cutting it off from it would render the ring itself inert.
Hell, this is made obvious by the fact that Marika fracturing it a bit seems to have interfered with its connection to the GW to such a degree that the world went to shit in its relatively brief absence.
the Elden Ring is the Elden Beast, the Greater Will is far away in the cosmos
And the Elden Beast is a creation of the Greater Will that it sent into the Lands Between. No matter which angle you view things from, the ring is intrinsically linked to the GW, so cutting the GW off from it would be utterly counterproductive.
>The Greater Will is far away in the cosmos.
I like to believe that, because of the fact that Enia mentions it'll take 1000 years to contact the Greater Will after you burn the Erdtree, probably because it's so far away in space.
But if that's the case, it also implies that Enia has been bullshitting the tarnished previously, she hasn't been in contact at all.
The reality is probably that the GW is probably just having a big think, but I like the idea.
I'm pretty sure the whole "takes 10k years to contact" thing is a lie on the fingers' part to not cause panic by saying "welp, can't hear shit".
The ring being damaged probably means that communication between it and the GW is cut off, and in the interest of not making people jump to conclusions that the GW has abandoned them, the fingers instead opt to say that there's latency issues.
Enia acts as if she's seen and dealt with this before, so that likely refers to a time from before the Elden Ring was shattered. As such, while some messages the Two Fingers receive are legit, at other times the Two Fingers just make assumptions, such as thinking the Greater Will is pleased after the player character acquires two Great Runes.
>it also implies that Enia has been bullshitting the tarnished previously, she hasn't been in contact at all.
That's exactly what's going on. We're told in no uncertain terms in the intro that the shattering war led to abandonment by the Greater Will. The only reason people assume otherwise is the call of lost grace that kick-starts your journey. Though Enia is only the messenger, I get the feeling even she understands the situation, hence why she tells you how to burn the Erdtree.
Nothing implies that the Elden Ring is some kind of limb or organ of the Greater Will. The narrator states that the Greater Will abandoned the Lands Between because of the Shattering, as in the war. Heck, depending on how long it takes to actually send a message to the Greater Will, as Enia reveals, the last time anyone spoke to or received a message from the Greater Will might have been before Marika ever shattered the Elden Ring.
I hope Miquella has an ending in the DLC tied to the main game. No recolored bullshit, no Moon Outer God controlling a literal puppet to do its bidding, no burning down the world because a blind, israeli demon told you to….just the world free from all Outer God influence.
Daily reminder that Malenia could only beat Radahn by unleashing the scarlet rot.
I must say, the irony of threads about such games is immense, people makindg decisions about cosmic scale matters with only a bunch of ill-thought emotional sentiments and primitive logic, bar a minor bunch.
Talk about cosmic horror.
Just imagine, you're a peasant, see this weird dude in armor walk by silently. How much horror would you feel were you to know that soon, some meat-suit containing a self-apologetic, incredibly rude degenerate with no taste is going to toss your reality into fire or ever increasing chaos of space spooks or what have you just because it appeals to his aesthetic sensibilities?
I went with Goldmask because the item descriptions told me he's objectively correct.
Well, you're alright.
Guys, the Moon is great and we should go into the dark void of space!
Let's go!
The Moon is cool, yeah.
Only 1 (or 2) did that.
Literal nazi.
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
Dogshit, only top tier moron and redditors find it "deep" and "good"
Expectations for the DLC?
More of the same, some cool areas to explore, another wave of shitty humanoid samey bosses like the rest of the series
Bloodborne is cool. There aren't that many games in victorian aesthetic.
Man I just started playing elder ring and holy shit it's boring so you need level 50 to beat the storm-wathewer castle you get 10 exp for killing enemy you need 3000 exp to level up you need to level up 50 times wow such fun game play such fun game oh yeah want to explore? Nope you need to farm 10000 enemies to progress. Bad game
Wanna try to beat 30 guards of castle ot the same time?
Okay but first you need to go over 3 birds that throw explosives on you and do double attack after + they are flying then you have to jump over 2 roofs then you have to go through 1 high knight and torchman then you have to go to another knight but faster then you have to go and kill mud crab and 2 dogs and then you can die to 30 enemies under castle nice
Sounds like you don't enjoy playing video games anon
I would enjoy it if the progression felt less like rape. And again with blaming the player not the game. When the game is shit always blame the player not the game right? It's 10/10 ign after all right???? And all YouTubers liked it right????
I like it but I never care enought to take a deep dive apart from certain stuff here and there with the lore, I enjoy it on a service level. I might think it's cool or interesting when reading an item description or listen to the inane rambling of an NPC but then I move on. That goes for every From game for me.
Elden Ring has the coolest settings of their games imo, but it also has the biggest lore holes.
It's the setting I like the most, especially because you get the feeling of various factions and characters with power plays like Bloodborne, but in fantasy setting with armies and kingdoms waging civil war. Yet its plot is filled with outlandish and exotic fantasy elements that also tied with thematics like ambition, concept of freedom, religion, race wars,... Ranni basically plays political 3d chess using Death and separation of Body and Soul to outsmart the GO, so the political and fantasy elements tie really well. It also has the most interesting lore for undeads so far. It's hard to make necromancy, a relatively stale and very much overused theme, feel fresh and unique
pre good but
obviously not enough bear-fricking
If Vyke already murdered two demigods for their runes were they just unimportant enough to be named?
Seems like there were a bunch of demigods, possibly many that were not immediate children of marika but further descendants like godrick. And yea I suppose a bunch of them nabbed a piece of the elden ring amid the chaos. iirc isn't every headless corpse inside a walking mausoleum a dead demigod?
Why does japan love LGBT shit so much?
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
I think it’s really cool that it’s structured in a way that forces as little of it upon you as possible. It’s up to you to find everything to piece it together, to understand the world you have to live in it for a bit.
Issue is, this low-exposition approach means you have no true buildup of stakes, so the ending of every souls game is just some weird bleak flame kindling that amounts to not very much. Sekiro managed to fix this by having a smaller and more consistent cast that builds, but that game’s lore is far smaller in scope.
>Expectations for the DLC?
a vague date
>What's your opinion on Fromsoftware lore?
Nobody gives a shit about it outside Dark Souls 1 and Bloodborne for good reason, it's pretty paper thin.
That said, I appreciate that they don't dump exposition on you or spam cutscenes Bioware style for every little thing. And even if they're whatever to think about, it's usually at least visually interesting, very little in Fromsoft games comes across as just average fantasy tropes. Apart from their thing for dragons.
>Expectations for the DLC?
For bosses to be even tankier and evasive.
For it to take another year since they're probably rigging up another stupid open world for it.
Eldeb ring had no lore
>I think in Elden Ring too many things are disjointed
Not really, if anything Elden Ring is the most coherent game in the series, unless you count Sekiro.
All the major lore figures are tied together and have clear motivations, and the logic of the setting is pretty straightforward.
Whereas in Dark Souls there's a lot of ambiguity.
I realize the only reason I hate these games, the same reason I hate Final Fantasy, is the lack of continuity. Demon's Souls lore is probably the best in the series, but it doesn't matter when later games only reference it in abstract ways. Soulsgays insist that all these games have absolutely nothing in common, it's pretty gay.
I mean Demon's Souls and Dark Souls/etc are different IPs. They're only tied together because they have similar gameplay and are by the same developer, the worlds are completely separate. No shit they're not connected.
Reference has absolutely nothing to do with continuity, that's why people shit all over 3. Souls games have absolutely zero continuity, but it's done in a very obnoxious way. Imagine if every new zelda game invented new terms for heart containers, but otherwise played the exact same. It's the most shallow lack of continuity ever, but fans still insist there's nothing in common, like just because heart containers are called "love crystals" it's all of a sudden an entirely different IP. It's the laziest shit.
You're an idiot. Media is a mind-numbing eternal liveservice grindmill of hyper-repetitive sequels because of that mindset. Being an anthology is the only reason franchises should exist in any capacity. Bioware sequel writing is atrocious. Frick you.
And Dark Souls is way too repetitive as-is. Nobody gives a shit about Dark Souls 3 lore because it won't stop fricking referencing previous entries.
Elden Ring definitely has the most interesting setting and the storytelling for Fromsoftware was at its height. The left over mysteries feel like actual mysteries not results of forgetfulness or inconsistencies.
THE GOLDEN ORDER STILL STANDS, PLEASE IGNORE ALL THE "TREE BAD" PROPAGANDA.
T-THINGS ARE GOING TO BE OKAY, LEYNDELL WILL RISE AGAIN
we need this picture except it's Leyndell in the background and Morgott
I just want more unuque stuff for every build
>No story
>Barren open world
>No challenge
>Dualwielding makes the game even more trivial
>Input reading
>Magic is overpowered
>No mimics
>Just summon ashes to win, bro!
>Bosses are easier to stagger now, meaning the game is even more casual friendly
>Most weapon abilities trivialize the game
>Like 75% of the game is optional
>No solo invasions
>No covenants, meaning that PvP has no point
>4 endings are the same (kek)
>Teleports (WHAT THE FRICK WERE THEY THINKING?????)
>Intro is a powerpoint slideshow
>"Altering costumes" system is the dumbest idea ever
>Fast travel
>They changed Malenia's white VA to some Black person for woke points (OH NO NO)
>All big bosses are garbage
>Cuck shit
>Feminist shit
>Simp shit
>Furry shit
>troony shit
>Gay shit
>Pedophile shit
>You have to simp for a woman in order to access some of the game's content (lmao)
>Paid DLC
>Final boss is a troony and a giant fish instead of kino old man battle like in literally all previous games
>Skyrim dungeons (that have no rewards)
>Boss reuse
>Asset reuse
>Worst camera ever
Is Elden Ring the worst game of all time?
not worst of all time, but worst souls game, even DS2 is better.
the camera + gigantic bosses make those encounters pure, absolute trash, most of the time you are just hitting the foot and can't even see their bodies.
ER is too much anime... you can see this in the simping (Ranni), the Mary sue waifu (Malenia) and the edgy wolves, specially maliketh and his acrobatic, death, dark based powers
Black folk
Shut up homie best lore is ds1, best world building is bb and best combat is ds3. the other games dont exist and ER is just a weapon art sim
Elden Ring has the best lore and setting imo