People get butthurt if you emulate what the average game looked like and will throw up pictures of Vagrant Story and Alone in the Dark 4 as what all indie games need to look like.
It's not that.
People aren't getting upset about emulating a specific look.
The issue stems much from the same place as when a man attempts to dress as and pass himself off as a woman. There is always a set of uncanny elements that takes the beholder out of the mental state where they are enjoying whatever they're looking at.
Developers put so much effort into the surface-level of getting a look or an aesthetic down, but fail to understand all of the other elements that truly make actual retro games look and feel the way that they do. If enough of these elements are incorrect, it immediately invalidates any effort that was put forth into the other parts that ARE done "correctly."
Makes sense, because indie devs are all about putting together things that just barely look good enough to fool normies into buying/wishlisting/whatever to ride on their blind nostalgia, rather than doing sufficient R&D on older games to understand them well enough to apply their understanding to a finished work.
This is legitimately what happens when the mainstream media never shuts up about something. It's like how so many people that grew up during all the fast food health concerns use food analogies a lot.
5th gen is much easier to model, especially when you have these solo developers that have to do everything themselves.
Just like how nes style pixelart is more common than the 16/32 bit style
>People get butthurt if you emulate what the average game looked like
That's the ugliest game i've ever laid my eyes on. At least try to be a bit coherent with your art design.
That is fricking Pseudoregalia that appears in 2 webms, I am not the anons who couldn't read that. I don't see the name of the game in the remaining webm.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I don't know what you're trying to say ESL-kun, but sure.
9 months ago
Anonymous
I am asking, kind native speaker, what the name of this game is
I feel like 6th gen is in a weird spot where it's substantially harder to make custom assets for the aesthetic vs a PS1/N64/Win98 but only slightly easier than a modern photorealistic aesthetic, which is actually simpler to do in a way since there are millions of prefab models you can buy
This is pretty much it, 6th gen is pretty difficult to replicate on modern hardware since alot of tools Devs would have used back then are now defunct and hard to replicate with modern systems whilst also being not as simple 2d/ low poly visuals. If you're going to use more advanced graphics you may as well use some modern engine with modern lighting effects etc rather than trying to awkwardly replicate visual effects from 20 years ago that aren't really used on modern systems anymore
Women are for every genre. There is literally no point to having male characters in fiction in the year 2012+11. The casts of all fiction should consist exclusively of cute girls.
I'll never understand using a female lead but also being FPS. Men for FPS and sexy women for TPS should be a well established rule.
true
Women are for every genre. There is literally no point to having male characters in fiction in the year 2012+11. The casts of all fiction should consist exclusively of cute girls.
not everyone wants to be the cute girl, some people want to be the cool guy, especially when it's fps
Unlikely. That degree of 3D fidelity is only really practical when you have a team of a certain size... a size which most inexperienced devs would collapse under the pressure of directing.
there's some magic age that you have to hit where you make trash throwback games from your era.
We've passed the earthbound clone era, we are currently in a ps1-aesthetic era. Gen 6 soon
Indie devs fear 3D modeling for whatever reason. Then again, it takes enough time over 2D modeling that you would essentially just be forming a company in order to get a game out. 3D game development also requires more brain cells and programming logic.
>2d art >draw a picture >it just werks >3d art >have to model the shapes >got to rig it >oops your topology is fricked, have to retopo >make texture >uv unwrap the model to make it good >frick the texture has a seam, must change it again >okay it looks alright, let's export >frick it's tilted 90 degrees because there is no standard for which axis are XYZ >game isn't recognising my bones >oh it only works with .obj for static meshes, it actually wants [some other format] for animated characters >fix everything >you now have one low-poly character with an 8-frame walk animation
3d got away with being a clusterfrick of a process when it was companies using it, but it'll never catch on with indies the same way 2d did unless someone makes some god-tier tools for it.
He's saying that until the barrier to 3D development is dropped to the level one or two people can do what used to take one or two dozen, then it's not going to be common in indie games.
The problem isn't in the barrier itself, it's in the people. A lot of these problems listed have been figured out and streamlined to be fixable in under 10 minutes or so, for a low-poly workflow. Like for rigging you can just use Mixamo to do all the hardest parts for you.
The biggest issue is that most people are lazy morons. Most of them are not truly dedicated to what they do. They waste their time playing some shitty multiplayer garbage or watching slop on Youtube/Netflix instead. I can guarantee you that this is the reason for a lot of indies taking so long.
If you scream that videogames are art, then you have to accept this. It requires real work to create art of any kind, that's why it's respected to begin with. But most people don't get this and instead choose to believe lazy tards who can't be arsed to open up Blender today and fix that model.
I don't know what to tell you, Anon. They still have to texture low poly models and that alone is about the same effort or more as making a pixel art sprite sheet. 2D game development is easy. That's why I prefer 3D. I take pride in doing the more complicated task. However, a 2D artist can hammer out an anvil in an hour, while I take 3-4 to make one that is catered to a specific art style.
9 months ago
Anonymous
If you have a concept artist, you can have them draw the character from all sides and then just use view projection, and then spend some time to fix up some of the more noticeable seams. Most players won't care that the textures under the model's arm stretch sometimes, it's fine as long as the game looks good overall and plays well. Those who do care about it are morons and you shouldn't listen to them since they don't want to actually PLAY the game.
Just as an example, take a look at how GTA Vice City was modelled. The second island is literally made up of boxes with photos of storefronts on them, sometimes ridiculously oversized with doors being 2 times bigger than Tommy. Has anyone cared about this? Not really.
9 months ago
Anonymous
And that is still far more work, effort, and thought than slapping down a couple of sprites and moving on.
>lip sync animation
There's also solutions for things like this. You could just automatically generate it using a Blender addon you bought/pirated or inside of Unreal. Sure it might not look as good as hand-crafted lipsync, but always ask yourself this:
Do you really need this level of fidelity?
More often than not you will answer "no", and you can just use shortcuts for these instances. If you brute force everything like a moron then that's on you, really.
Even though researching those things and learning them is maybe an hour of work and then you generally know that skillset, they have to do that for multiple aspects to make an indie game. All of your "just learn this to fix that" adds up to a point of not being worth it over just knocking out a 2D game. A 3D indie game already typically moves less copies because it doesn't look as impressive as professional 3d games. Why put in all the extra effort to make less money?
>It requires real work to create art of any kind
there's work and there's years spent doing the brute force asset generation an entire team might have done in the past. compare writing a novel to doing nothing but lip sync animation for 8 hours straight every day.
9 months ago
Anonymous
>lip sync animation
There's also solutions for things like this. You could just automatically generate it using a Blender addon you bought/pirated or inside of Unreal. Sure it might not look as good as hand-crafted lipsync, but always ask yourself this:
Do you really need this level of fidelity?
More often than not you will answer "no", and you can just use shortcuts for these instances. If you brute force everything like a moron then that's on you, really.
Can someone hurry up and copy PSO episode 1 2 and Blueburst please? I just want a game exactly like it with more content. It's all I ask. They did the whole looter shooter shit the right way with rare drops and the little box things on the floor. The shit just worked.
Thing is, if are trying to emulate old graphics you are limiting your customer base, to people having nostalgia for aesthetics like this. People don't want old looking games, it can be stylized, have some art direction, but pure graphics downgrade doesn't pay the bills.
they planned on releasing at the end of this year I believe but their funding did far better than expected so they hired some more homies to work on the game. afaik its almost done, theyre just deciding who to contract for the soundtrack and shiet
in two days
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1353230/Bomb_Rush_Cyberfunk/
Too much effort. They're barely doing 5th gen aesthetics right now
I love the 6th gen aesthetic so much. Gives you that sense of wonderment
>Ganker hates N64 graphics now
What happened?
the only N64 game that looks this good is majora's mask
People get butthurt if you emulate what the average game looked like and will throw up pictures of Vagrant Story and Alone in the Dark 4 as what all indie games need to look like.
It's not that.
People aren't getting upset about emulating a specific look.
The issue stems much from the same place as when a man attempts to dress as and pass himself off as a woman. There is always a set of uncanny elements that takes the beholder out of the mental state where they are enjoying whatever they're looking at.
Developers put so much effort into the surface-level of getting a look or an aesthetic down, but fail to understand all of the other elements that truly make actual retro games look and feel the way that they do. If enough of these elements are incorrect, it immediately invalidates any effort that was put forth into the other parts that ARE done "correctly."
Makes sense, because indie devs are all about putting together things that just barely look good enough to fool normies into buying/wishlisting/whatever to ride on their blind nostalgia, rather than doing sufficient R&D on older games to understand them well enough to apply their understanding to a finished work.
>when a man attempts to dress as and pass himself off as a wo
forget "rent free", you're fully mindbroken.
That anon is right though.
This is legitimately what happens when the mainstream media never shuts up about something. It's like how so many people that grew up during all the fast food health concerns use food analogies a lot.
5th gen is much easier to model, especially when you have these solo developers that have to do everything themselves.
Just like how nes style pixelart is more common than the 16/32 bit style
troony detected
>PICREL
source?
This game would probably look cool if I could look away from the player character's ass for two seconds. I'm trying but it ain't happening.
What is the source my Black looks fun
>furshit character with big hips, fat ass and thigh highs
dropped
neat I picked this up a few days ago actually
granted that was because I kept seeing art of the goat's fat ass but the gameplay looks neat too
>People get butthurt if you emulate what the average game looked like
That's the ugliest game i've ever laid my eyes on. At least try to be a bit coherent with your art design.
Conker exists
This little dude looks like he should be spitting out bubbles then jumping off of them.
5th gen is objectively the ugliest generation ever.
What game is this?
illiterate bros...
I'm on a phone and don't see titles of webms
Top right of the webm
That is fricking Pseudoregalia that appears in 2 webms, I am not the anons who couldn't read that. I don't see the name of the game in the remaining webm.
I don't know what you're trying to say ESL-kun, but sure.
I am asking, kind native speaker, what the name of this game is
Cavern of Dreams
Thank you!
I feel like 6th gen is in a weird spot where it's substantially harder to make custom assets for the aesthetic vs a PS1/N64/Win98 but only slightly easier than a modern photorealistic aesthetic, which is actually simpler to do in a way since there are millions of prefab models you can buy
This is pretty much it, 6th gen is pretty difficult to replicate on modern hardware since alot of tools Devs would have used back then are now defunct and hard to replicate with modern systems whilst also being not as simple 2d/ low poly visuals. If you're going to use more advanced graphics you may as well use some modern engine with modern lighting effects etc rather than trying to awkwardly replicate visual effects from 20 years ago that aren't really used on modern systems anymore
OG Xbox vibes
This looks slow as frick.
Frick off, ezra miller
voxels bro
Looks like what DNF should have been.
Game?
Phantom Fury, phonegay.
Sequel to Ion Fury, i'm assuming.
Thanks
Also I have trouble reading on my PC so I just use my phone lol
>textures still lower resolution than an average PS2 game
>some textures have filtering, some don't
>modern lighting
>modern animation standards
Shame you have to play as a woman. Squandered potential.
I'll never understand using a female lead but also being FPS. Men for FPS and sexy women for TPS should be a well established rule.
Women are for every genre. There is literally no point to having male characters in fiction in the year 2012+11. The casts of all fiction should consist exclusively of cute girls.
man this looks pretty fricking great
true
not everyone wants to be the cute girl, some people want to be the cool guy, especially when it's fps
>revolver with 20+ chambered rounds
neat
its actually a real weapon, french design of course so its more dangerous to the wielder Lefaucheux M1858
never, or at least it will be a pale imitation
Unlikely. That degree of 3D fidelity is only really practical when you have a team of a certain size... a size which most inexperienced devs would collapse under the pressure of directing.
haunted psx + nostalgia N64 is fricking gay can indies please move on to PS2 gc and xb
have a dogson
good buddy
there's some magic age that you have to hit where you make trash throwback games from your era.
We've passed the earthbound clone era, we are currently in a ps1-aesthetic era. Gen 6 soon
Indie devs fear 3D modeling for whatever reason. Then again, it takes enough time over 2D modeling that you would essentially just be forming a company in order to get a game out. 3D game development also requires more brain cells and programming logic.
>2d art
>draw a picture
>it just werks
>3d art
>have to model the shapes
>got to rig it
>oops your topology is fricked, have to retopo
>make texture
>uv unwrap the model to make it good
>frick the texture has a seam, must change it again
>okay it looks alright, let's export
>frick it's tilted 90 degrees because there is no standard for which axis are XYZ
>game isn't recognising my bones
>oh it only works with .obj for static meshes, it actually wants [some other format] for animated characters
>fix everything
>you now have one low-poly character with an 8-frame walk animation
3d got away with being a clusterfrick of a process when it was companies using it, but it'll never catch on with indies the same way 2d did unless someone makes some god-tier tools for it.
Literally what the frick are you talking about? Are you not aware of what the indie scene looks like right now?
He's right, and the indie scene for 3d art is a bunch of stiff assets that look like shit.
Yeah, you actually have to work on a videogame. Unexpected, right?
He's saying that until the barrier to 3D development is dropped to the level one or two people can do what used to take one or two dozen, then it's not going to be common in indie games.
The problem isn't in the barrier itself, it's in the people. A lot of these problems listed have been figured out and streamlined to be fixable in under 10 minutes or so, for a low-poly workflow. Like for rigging you can just use Mixamo to do all the hardest parts for you.
The biggest issue is that most people are lazy morons. Most of them are not truly dedicated to what they do. They waste their time playing some shitty multiplayer garbage or watching slop on Youtube/Netflix instead. I can guarantee you that this is the reason for a lot of indies taking so long.
If you scream that videogames are art, then you have to accept this. It requires real work to create art of any kind, that's why it's respected to begin with. But most people don't get this and instead choose to believe lazy tards who can't be arsed to open up Blender today and fix that model.
I don't know what to tell you, Anon. They still have to texture low poly models and that alone is about the same effort or more as making a pixel art sprite sheet. 2D game development is easy. That's why I prefer 3D. I take pride in doing the more complicated task. However, a 2D artist can hammer out an anvil in an hour, while I take 3-4 to make one that is catered to a specific art style.
If you have a concept artist, you can have them draw the character from all sides and then just use view projection, and then spend some time to fix up some of the more noticeable seams. Most players won't care that the textures under the model's arm stretch sometimes, it's fine as long as the game looks good overall and plays well. Those who do care about it are morons and you shouldn't listen to them since they don't want to actually PLAY the game.
Just as an example, take a look at how GTA Vice City was modelled. The second island is literally made up of boxes with photos of storefronts on them, sometimes ridiculously oversized with doors being 2 times bigger than Tommy. Has anyone cared about this? Not really.
And that is still far more work, effort, and thought than slapping down a couple of sprites and moving on.
Even though researching those things and learning them is maybe an hour of work and then you generally know that skillset, they have to do that for multiple aspects to make an indie game. All of your "just learn this to fix that" adds up to a point of not being worth it over just knocking out a 2D game. A 3D indie game already typically moves less copies because it doesn't look as impressive as professional 3d games. Why put in all the extra effort to make less money?
>It requires real work to create art of any kind
there's work and there's years spent doing the brute force asset generation an entire team might have done in the past. compare writing a novel to doing nothing but lip sync animation for 8 hours straight every day.
>lip sync animation
There's also solutions for things like this. You could just automatically generate it using a Blender addon you bought/pirated or inside of Unreal. Sure it might not look as good as hand-crafted lipsync, but always ask yourself this:
Do you really need this level of fidelity?
More often than not you will answer "no", and you can just use shortcuts for these instances. If you brute force everything like a moron then that's on you, really.
Can someone hurry up and copy PSO episode 1 2 and Blueburst please? I just want a game exactly like it with more content. It's all I ask. They did the whole looter shooter shit the right way with rare drops and the little box things on the floor. The shit just worked.
its called "selaco" and you are welcome.
the 6th gen aesthetic is more subtle and technologically complex, while also requiring more brute man hours in asset generation.
I wanna see an indie PS2 platformer like Sly or R&C and not these 1998 PC or PS1 style games. They’ve gotten old
Frick yes 😀
game?
>when are indie games going to made by professional, well paid designers, animators, and sound technicians?
When we start regarding the sixth gen studios and their budgets to have been "indie" this whole time.
furry alert
It looks good but indie dev aren't capable of developing videogames like this in less than an age or even finishing development.
This is literally just mario odyssey furry edition
6th gen had some great water and it was all done with a simple trick.
WELL? WHAT WAS THE TRICK?
Thing is, if are trying to emulate old graphics you are limiting your customer base, to people having nostalgia for aesthetics like this. People don't want old looking games, it can be stylized, have some art direction, but pure graphics downgrade doesn't pay the bills.
They have already.
https://store.steampowered.com/app/562860/Ion_Fury/
https://store.steampowered.com/app/964800/Prodeus/
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1286350/BPM_BULLETS_PER_MINUTE/
They only just started with ps1 so it will be quite a long time.
It's too non-distinct. Just looks like a shittier low res version of what we have now. Previous gens all had their own flavour.
they already are
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2146290
>To be announced
So vaporware after it releases into Early Access. Same old song and dance. Ignore it.
they planned on releasing at the end of this year I believe but their funding did far better than expected so they hired some more homies to work on the game. afaik its almost done, theyre just deciding who to contract for the soundtrack and shiet
when it is viable to do so
5th gen is already starting to get popular in the indie sphere, so I'd give it like 3 to 5 more years.
There's a very fine line between a game intentionally trying to imitate 6th gen aesthetics, and a game that just looks like it was made on a budget.
That's why it's probably not going to take off as a thing.
Literally a current gen game
And this one