where do you land on piracy = theft Ganker?
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where do you land on piracy = theft?
where do you land on piracy = theft Ganker?
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this discussion is over
Hypocrite picture
Copying something means you dont need the original anymore. Was that person ever gonna purchase the original ? Who knows. But that doesnt make your statement right
But who gives a shit, I know its just a template to spam for these shitty bait threads that will come day after day after day
Frick, I hate what this place has become
>Copying something means you dont need the original anymore
And that is not the definition of theft.
>the action or offence of taking another person's property without permission or legal right and without intending to return it; theft.
If you had a machine that would copy someones car it would be as much theft acording to the deffinition as piracy is.
that's right, I pirated your car and thus now you cannot drive it. I've taken your property and won't return it.
only if the copy of the car encroached onto protected intellectual property & even then it isn't piracy it is patent violations & isn't criminal & would be a civil action - a lawsuit
>taking
That's the keyword here, you're not really taking it, it's not being taken away, it's not being removed, it's simply being copied. Someone making a copy of your car means you still have your care and still can use it. If you want to discuss the morals of it, that's one thing but nothing got stolen, in fact, something was created.
>original
like the source code? also you don't evem buy videogames today, you rent them
If I don't own what I buy anyways, your arguments have no ground even by their own logic.
NTA but if you follow that logic stealing a rental car isn’t theft either. That said software piracy isn’t theft, but it’s no less illegal in most countries. Everything else is just semantics.
The contract for a rental is exactly that - it's a rental, same as a lease & you have possession of it for a while & then you lose all possession of it after the agreement has ended.
Yes it is, since you're removing the original.
anon, i'm not that anon, but every definition of theft includes ideas like removing other people's property, and not returning it.
digital piracy isn't that. No one has ever said before this issue that theft equates a lost sale. If i go out and take a wild horse, bring him home, break him and then use him as a horse, i'm not pirating from the guy who does that and sells his horses to other people. etc, etc, etc.
Lost sales are not how people have ever defined theft. Not untill the movie and record guys got tired of piracy in places like eastern europe, etc. And physical goods are a lot closer to theft then stuff like this ever will.
For the record, i don't pirate, and haven't for a very, very long time. I have no dog in this fight. I also hate fake contrarian takes to inflame and get (yous). But while the post might be that, the image isn't exactly.
in capitalism everything has a price and if you use something without paying the authors/artists asking price it's theft, it's up to the creator - not you
define theft
The act of theft and piracy, when considered in their most florid and expansive context, can be perceived as the surreptitious and clandestine expropriation or unauthorized appropriation of tangible or intangible assets, be they material possessions or intellectual properties, sans the explicit acquiescence or legal sanction of their rightful proprietors. This egregious transgression against the norms of propriety and ethical conduct entails the perfidious and audacious act of purloining or availing oneself of the fruits of another's labor or creative endeavors, typically motivated by avarice or the pursuit of personal gain, whilst evincing a flagrant disregard for the sacrosanct principles of ownership and equitable exchange. In essence, it embodies a reprehensible affront to the foundations of societal order and moral rectitude, characterized by an unbridled disdain for the sanctity of property rights and an utter disdain for the principles of fairness and justice.
both expropriation and appropriation imply that i am taking something from you, which isnt true
i am merely making a copy of whatever you have, thus it isnt theft
While that contention may seem cogent at first blush, it fails to apprehend the intricacies inherent in the concept of theft and piracy when applied to the digital realm. While indeed, the act of replication or duplication does not result in the physical removal of the original item from its possessor, it nonetheless engenders a form of deprivation that is equally injurious, albeit less tangible. By creating unauthorized copies of a digital asset, one effectively diminishes its exclusivity and market value, thereby depriving the rightful owner of the opportunity to derive commensurate benefits from their creation or investment. This erosion of the intrinsic worth of the original work can have deleterious repercussions on the creator's ability to sustain themselves financially, thereby constituting a form of economic harm akin to traditional theft.
Furthermore, the argument overlooks the foundational principle of intellectual property rights, which afford creators the prerogative to control the dissemination and reproduction of their work. By circumventing these rights through unauthorized copying or distribution, one not only undermines the creator's autonomy over their creation but also undermines the very framework of intellectual property law upon which modern innovation and creativity depend.
In essence, while the act of copying may not entail the physical removal of the original item, it nevertheless represents a form of misappropriation that inflicts tangible harm upon the rightful owner, both economically and in terms of their intellectual and creative autonomy. Thus, despite its seemingly ethereal nature, digital piracy and unauthorized duplication constitute acts of theft that merit condemnation and redress.
a weak caveman stumbles upon a fire and claims it as his own. a strong caveman comes around and asks for a permission to warm up by said fire.
Permission is not given but the strong caveman decides to use the fire anyway becouse the fire does not disappear for the first caveman if they both were to sit by it.
He stole the fire.
Luckily weak caveman was part of a larger clan with sharp sticks and took the strong caveman to caveman jail.
Humanity figured out that stealing is not about things disappearing but about disregarding permissions where permissions are aplicable in caveman times. Why cant Ganker?
>He stole the fire.
No, that was Prometheus.
>>He stole the fire.
Fire generates a finite amount of energy/heat, so yes, when sitting by the fire he IS stealing fire.
Maybe the weak caveman wanted to warm the walls of his caves and the strong caveman's shadow is preventing that from happening.
I bake my own bread. Should I be jailed, because every time I bake a bread, a baker loses a sale, because I don't buy a bread from him?
not jailed but you could be prosecuted if its not your recipe, yes
But nobody owns recipes. I can make McDoland Big Mac sauce all I want and they can't touch me. I'm like Sundowner, fricking invincible.
>not jailed but you could be prosecuted if its not your recipe
Redd*t is the other way, clown
reddit loves piracy
In Assassin's Creed games maybe.
naw reddit if full of commies and commies love to talk about how cool they are for pirating shit
Yeah, nah. They have terrible taste, because the only flavor they know is shoe polish. They probably also defend Fallout 1st.
what's fallout have to do with this lol
>game restricts you only so that the company can squeeze more money out of it monthly
You ever heard about what an example isnand why they're used?
>game restricts you only so that the company can squeeze more money out of it monthly
what are you talking about? fallout doesn't have a subscription fee if that's what you mean? especially not fallout one. it didn't even have dlc
Reddit also requires an internet connection to be used
SUSato
If I make my own bread based on someone else's bread, and now don't need their bread, I did not steal their bread
>food analogy
frick off
So if I plant and grow my own wheat and tomatoes, I'm stealing from the food industry?
>is that Denuvo I'm tasting?
Are restaurants the gamepass for food?
if you used monsanto seeds without paying them and they find out, they will frick you
That may legally be right, but it is morally wrong
no, but to keep the food analogy going, pirating is the equivalent of snipping a leave off a plant from an orchard/garden and then replanting it in your garden/house
>no, but to keep the food analogy going, pirating is the equivalent of snipping a leave off a plant from an orchard/garden and then replanting it in your garden/house
Nobody is snipping off anything. But people may or may not collect the fallen leaves from the ground to stay in your analogy.
You will have the government on your ass if they find out about it so yes. Now be a good goy and stop growing your own produce.
That's the future they want, yes.
You're arguing that piracy is wrong not that it's theft, frickface.
Smokescreening the implications. The thing is that people would gladly conflate "theft" with "wrong." And since it isn't theft, they have no reason to feel guilty. Would these threads even exist if they were concerned only with the overhead point and not their conscience? Probably not.
>Would these threads even exist
They exist because people are homosexuals like you.
ZING
oh wait, no, that doesn't make any sense.
People not equating piracy with being wrong because it isn't theft doesn't matter when the discussion isn't strictly about the wrongness but the classification of it.
You're bringing up something that has no point, you'd be better off making a moral argument instead than being pedantic and still being wrong
If video game companies don't want me to pirate their games, they should just give me the games for free. Then I won't need to pirate anymore. If they refuse to give me the free games I'm entitled to, it's their fault that I have to pirate those games.
Let me ask you something. What did pirates, their namesake, do? Besides the rape and murder. Oh right, they stole.
>"B-BUT THEY DID IT ON BOATS"
>we have to redefine the definition of theft just like we did with vaccines
kek
>never tries to explain what is hypocritical
>literally admits he's wrong by acknowledging that we don't know if the pirate would purchase the original otherwise
>tries to be an oldgay while being an anti-piracy corporate bootlicker
Three strikes, you're out!
I don't need a personal helicopter. Does that make me a helicopter thief?
If you hate this place then leave and stop shitting up the board with your moronic takes
No arguments, theft implies something is gone, out of the owner's reach
Have you no shame being in the 60 points IQ range?
least moronic Ganker user
You are moronic as him, how do corporations boots taste like?
>Frick, I hate what this place has become
the image they posted is probably older than you
also you're on Ganker moralgayging about piracy
honestly you should have a nice day being dead serious about this
>Copying something means you dont need the original anymore.
If you don't need the original, then what's the point of copying in the first place?
Literally the most moronic argument on this website, and it makes everyone dumber every time one of you dipshits regurgitates it
I'm not even saying piracy is necessarily theft. It just isn't "consequence free taking"
nowhere in that image does it imply "consequence free taking"
its just clearing up the fact that it isnt THEFT
dumb c**ts like you should keep your mouths shut
It's what literally everyone argues when they present it
Why else would you be even making the point? It's clearly meant to downplay piracy as a concept
but i didnt argue that, did i?
want to put more words into my mouth? how about i put some into yours?
>"im a stupid fricking c**t that cant read and makes assumptions all the live-long day like a fricking moron"
shut your fricking hole, low-IQ shitter
It still is a theft in a sense so your point is moronic, and so are you.
kys yourself, low IQ homosexual
seething
malding
You're making up scenarios in your head and not arguing what the person was.
>I'm not even saying piracy is necessarily theft. It just isn't "consequence free taking"
please show us the consequences
>please show us the consequences
no, they'll never be the same
>calls people dumb
>doesn't realize one is tangible and one isn't
Get a load of this moron
You couldn't even read the post. Literal 55 iq mongoloid
So you agreed with the picture that it's not theft
Literally the eternal defense. Piracy is not stealing at the conceptual level the same way killing and murdering aren't quite the same concept. They are different so we treat them different.
>kill: make a living thing die
>murder: make a living thing die but illegally
I was about to call it a bad example, but this stupid pedantry is exactly the same line of logic.
what the frick. this is like that gif of the chocolate being cut diagonally and put back together with one piece extra
fpbp /thread
sharing data does not equal losing a sale and neither of those things equals theft
>sharing data does not equal losing a sale
yeah it does, cause youre not buying.
I wasn't buying in the first place.
You were interested enough in the product to pirate it therefore you were a potential sale.
How so? I was interested enough to pirate it, but not interested enough to buy it.
False. I don't buy games that I can't pirate. On the other hand, if it's a really good game there's times where I've bought it after pirating it. Bow down and say thank you, pirating gave you a sale.
Not buying your product, regardless of piracy.
Not giving you money. Never will.
Whether your product is available to pirate or not does not factor into the equation, because I'm not paying you either way.
So no sale was lost because no sale was ever possible.
>piracy
moronic corpo newspeak for "unauthorized copy". Also
/thread
/year
/universe
This analogy works if games are treated as a good, which now makes me realize that may be why "games as a service" has been a popular goal.
>that's some colonizer bs
that's actually so funny, how do you even think of colonialism in this situation
Great way to push people into the pirate camp
cool I'll remember this homosexual when I pirate and feel even more justified
>dub VA complaining about colonialism
>boohoo, not avaliable in your country
>boohoo, the impermanence of media
Actual fricking c**t.
>Please learn the concept of "then you don't get to have it."
but reality dictates that I do get to have it, because I can have very easy access to it at any time
frick denuvo for making it hard
"Reality" doesn't. Your criminal mindset does.
regardless of whatever your inadequate femme-brained take is on my mentality, reality makes it possible and it is beneficial to me. why would I not take advantage?
Black person mindset.
t. subservient beta male mindset. you'll take any wiener or boot in your ass from some faux authority and you will not only enjoy it but defend it. SAD!
>reality makes it possible
this anon is one step away from raping someone
>https://nitter.net/neogeo8man/status/1758410631026213221
Here we go again, piracy dilemma
>this discussion is over
Fpbp
Saved
>Hypocrite picture
>Copying something means you dont need the original anymore. Was that person ever gonna purchase the original ? Who knows. But that doesnt make your statement right
Cope
>let me pirate some bread
if Jesus is ok with it i'm ok with it too
You aren't going to starve to death without a retail version of WINRAR. I don't think Jesus would clone you activation keys.
Jesus will do whatever I tell him to do because I'm the most important person in the universe.
Crop your pepe more
Put those goalposts back, Rajesh
>oh look AI finally learned that hands have 5 fing-
>6 toed foot
back to the learning board
>it's okay when we apply the old concept on modern technology
Piracy isn't theft
Piracy is larceny
/thread
Mod out the shit from it
>mods will fix it cope
Nah, I stopped caring a while ago which is just as well since new games rarely ever interest me anyway
What if I buy it first and then share it with someone?
then that person stole from the maker of the product, and you helped
But he didnt make a copy, I did. And then I gave it to him.
did you play the game, finished it and then gave him the copy?
Yeah.
yep, it's stealing for the person who didn't pay for it. the product isn't the copy of the game, it's the game, and you experienced it, and gave it to someone else.
So you mean if I give someone half of the bread that I bought after eating the first half, I make that person steal from the baker?
you paid for a full bread
you experience half the bread, you gave the other half away. you still paid for a full bread
But that other guy didnt. Does it mean they stole it?
again, you still paid for a whole bread, and only experience half
it's like paying for a movie ticket and tagging out half way, you didn't get to watch the end half but the other guy did. its one full experience split into two
So did that guy stole the other half or not?
no
And that means if I share something of mine with someone else, they arent stealing anything, right?
video games aren't meant to be split up like bread in the first place, video games wouldn't make sense like that. also food analogy
Shure they are, you just Ctrl+C and then Ctrl+V or even Ctrl+D, its a common feature present in all PCs. Any file can be copied, and that includes videogames.
>Any file can be copied
*stolen
>no argument
Thanks for proving me right.
the argument was in terms of splitting the experience of playing the game, not the files it self
Just like you cant sell emotions, you cant sell the experience, thats a con artist' vocabulary.
>you cant sell the experience
why can't you?
Because its intangible.
>Because its intangible
that doesn't stop the selling of a service. people sell each other ideas all the time
Ideas can be written on paper. And service is not an experience.
>And service is not an experience
does having sex count as a service and an experience? does laughing at a comedy club count as a service and experience
Having sex counts as procreational activity.
And comedy club is a performance.
but so video game isn't an activity or a premade performance?
Its a product. And with products when you purchase a copy it means you own it, and therefore is free to share it however you see fit.
and its a drum roll plase, an experience
Its a product, I already told you. You buy a product, not an experience, because you cant buy intangible things.
but you can buy a performance? come on anon, your logic isn't adding up
You can buy an access to a performance. You give them money - they let you see the actors' performance.
what if you sneak it, is it stealing to watch the performance without paying?
Thats trespassing, you can literally google it, anon.
why is it trespassing? cause you're stealing the experience of the performance without paying for it.
Help, this anon's mom is stealing my semen! Somebody stop her, she is literally insatiable!
hope you like ghost blowjobs
Woooo - Wooooo!
>It's a product
This is the number 1 reason I insist video games are not art. It's a singular item for sale intended to be used for a certain amount of time in exchange for money.
It's like saying a McDonald's cup is art. It's profoundly moronic.
>for a certain amount of time
For an indefinite amount of time untill its physical destruction actually.
So if I stop playing a game in the middle, then give someone else my copy, it's not theft? Or is it theft anyway? Who's guilty of theft in this scenario?
the game is the whole experience so letting the other person finish it wouldn't be theft. but you should never finish it if you gave it away
but of course it wouldn't make any sense to the other person context wise, but thats the point, you are splitting the experience up, and wouldn't make sense for something that's not meant to be split up like that
You didn't answer the question.
>"it wouldn't be theft"
and
Hold on. What if I finish the game twice despite only paying for it once?
you experience the game, each time you finish it, its still experience the game. it still once
Nope. The pre-existence of knowledge makes it impossible to have the same experience the second time around. Each playthrough is by the nature of the thing a different experience. Therefore it makes no matter who experiences the game; each experience is separate and, according to your argument, theft.
so then you experience the post game? what a neat feature to add to a game
>so then you experience the post game?
Nope. You steal it.
but according to you, its the post game experience, that's a feature right there
moron, does anyone make money besides Gamestop when Gamestop sells some used copies? No
Gamestop business model is theft, who could've guessed
Technically you buy the license not the game, moron.
technically people are tired of your corpo shit corpo.
Says who, Black person?
and that would be why the picture says "product" which is the "license" and not the "game", moron.
Ok, then dont say "product". say "license". See how the appeal of that image changes
Fricking corporate scum and their mott'n'baileys.
Trying to sell copies in the digital age is like trying to sell bottled air.
you act as if games are made as easy as air
The production of the game takes work.
The copies do not.
If you want to charge for game development, the business model you want is patronage.
Selling copies is moronic and only remotely possible because of a draconian State-enforced monopoly on distribution.
>patronage
anon, that's even worse, you'll have games that's never gonna be finish. have you seen what patron does to a game
Have you seen what publishers do to a game?
yes, and a finished product that you can choose to not buy is better than fricking early access in the hopes of a finished game
Early access that you can choose not to buy into if you have no confidence in the developer.
Everything is shit, all the time, copyright isn't preventing anything from, being shit, the only thing it does is enable a fricktarded business model that should not be possible in a remotely free market.
>if you have no confidence in the developer
what if its a first time developer? how the frick are you suppose to gauge that?
all im saying is, they finish the game, if the game looks good, i pay for the game. none of the EA shit cause thats an even worst system
WTF if it's a first time developer? How the frick am I supposed to know what to buy?
You're fricking moronic, every idiotic point you bring up is applicable to the market as a whole and not tied to copyright.
homie what, i just hate early access. were you talking about copyright with someone?
>oh no they didn't get paid
Literally not my responsibility you fricking israelite.
piracy is not theft, piracy is piracy
fyi, duplicating rented good for personal use is legal, its been settled in court a long time ago thanks to vhs companies
the same applies to video games, if you download a game from xbox game pass, you can duplicate it for personal use
piracy however is illegal, piracy is no more than sharing a duplicated good with third parties or acquiring a duplicated good from a third party, doesnt matter whether it is done online or offline
whether it is moral or immoral is for you to decide on your own, i think creators need to be protected by scavengers and fraudsters who would want to profit off of their hard work and risk-taking, on the other hand, i think it is absolute bullshit that a creator has complete control of their creation until death + 70 years, a bit excessive and will result in the general public not being able to acquire and enjoy by reasonable means products like ape escape and mega man legends, for example
the answer is twofold: 1) no it's not, and 2) even if it was, you should still do it
fpbp
That is not how theft is defined. Not in any law, not in any dictionary.
Piracy IS theft, the thing is there's nothing wrong with theft.
If a game is woke then it's okay to pirate it
I just don't play them
I don't care. I can get it for free, so I will.
5pbp
I mean it is stealing, you're meant to pay for it and you're not. People suddenly getting all armchair lawyer and pedantic about definitions is so insufferable.
I think piracy does more good than harm overall. The only reason most games in existence are still playable is because of piracy.
I'm paying in time, which is a currency that is not immediately profitable for companies. Also, all the shit I want is old enough to run on my literal toaster and thus no one fricking sells it.
>Also, all the shit I want is old enough to run on my literal toaster and thus no one fricking sells it.
Most shit is being sold again. It's gotta be some obscure shit in a world where stuff like Liberation Day is still being sold to people.
Piracy is only equated to theft because it's the easiest way to criminalize it.
There's no such thing as stealing information/ideas/intellectual property. It's all either replication or duplication.
If buying a game doesn't mean you own it (as certain publishers say), then pirating a game doesn't equal theft
People say this like it's a checkmate when it really isn't. The lack of ownership around games is ABOUT eliminating piracy. And they'll succeed, in fact they kind of already succeeded. There are plenty of new games that are simply unpiratable. Eventually that will be a vast majority of games. And if game streaming becomes the norm with most games being exclusive to streaming, then it'll be over for good.
>The lack of ownership around games is ABOUT eliminating piracy.
No it isn't, never was. It is about being able to charge a continuous monthly fee forever, instead of just giving you the thing after getting your money once.
>It is about being able to charge a continuous monthly fee forever
Which eliminates piracy.
I'm talking to fricking children. You people are so useless. No wonder there hasn't been any kind of proper movement against this, most people don't even know what the hell they're talking about.
Money is the goal, eliminating piracy is just a side-effect, that's the difference. If they could make more money from subscriptions even while a whole black market of private servers emerged, they would still choose that over selling one-time copies with 100% uncrackable dongles that made them less money but with zero piracy. See: every single professional application on the the planet, even the ones that were coupled with locked-down hardware and were already practically impossible to pirate.
>Money is the goal, eliminating piracy is just a side-effect
Bluepilled moron.
Money wasn't the goal for a decade now.
Control is the goal.
>And they'll succeed
That's why the whole western gaming industry i literally experiencing their biggest crash since 1983 right now kek
>There are plenty of new games that are simply unpiratable.
And none of them are actually worth playing.
Really gets the noggin joggin
This sounds like a non-answer shitpost but sadly it really is unironically true. No always-online game is worth your money let alone your time, and on top of that they all get altered into programs that run offline in singleplayer eventually anyway.
>they all get altered into programs that run offline in singleplayer eventually anyway.
Name one time this happened.
SimCity 2013
How you feel is irrelevant because I'm not a sale. You will literally never got money from me. Ever. I don't pay for games and If I can't pirate it I just don't play it.
depends if i like the company or not
it is theft of the potential sale taking income that should have gone to the developers. but with AAA games, piracy is justified now as the products aren't worth their asking price.
you are brainwashed
publishers are not entitled to game sales, a pirate woudnt have bought the game in the first place
there never would have been a sale, thus the piracy didnt cost them anything
its the opposite even, piracy is good cause it may cause pirates to buy the product if they really like it
I agree with what you said.
>Piracy = good
Well, this is my slight disagreement because it's more of a grey area for me and makes some assumptions.
The assumptions are that people would buy games even if there is an easy to use free version. That won't be the case, and this is the one good use case that I see for gay shit like DRM.
The DRM doesn't necessarily stop piracy, but makes it uncomfortable enough to where the consumer has to weigh the options of time cost vs currency.
That said, the industry misses this point and jacks up gaming prices with a sharp increase of shit quality. The music piracy industry is now niche because of making music cheap and accessible. The games industry should take note.
>a pirate woudnt have bought the game in the first place
this isn't true. I'll hold out but only for so long if there's not cracked version. Or even worse if it's updated frequently
>potential theft
homie pls
>it is theft of the potential sale
Sounds exactly like the RIAA gays claiming they were owed trillions of dollars on pirated music, as if every single person that pirated had the means to pay for it but didn't. Completely moronic logic for greedy suits.
It's a false argument. People should always pirate.
Thin veiled TDF (Tendo Defense Force) thread.
>country in which piracy has been the norm for years
>steam comes along and facilitates purchases
>piracy is reduced drastically
>policies change, all local payment methods are gone, prices increase, currency goes back to being just U$D
>piracy increases again
It really IS a service problem, huh?
It's theft.
However, if I don't respect the person or people that made and/or publish the thing, it's old enough for legally obtaining it to not be sensible or feasible or I have legal ways for me to access the thing for free, I do not find it reprehensible.
If purchasing my games doesn't mean I own them any more then pirating them shouldn't mean I'm stealing them.
Correct. You are only getting a taste of immaterial thing.
>where do you land on piracy
In the "I don't give a frick" side
If buying isn't owning, piracy isn't theft
Star trek says killing your clone is still murder. That is my stance on it.
If you had a tiny clone of Hitler, would you torture it?
I don't torture people. That's something evil, people do.
Historically it's the exact opposite.
does it have his memories
Why would that matter?
If I hack your brain chip and give you hitler's memories does that make it ethical to torture you?
if a game is
>unfinished
>too expensive
>not enough replay value
>is on a shit launcher
>doesnt have a playable demo or free trial
>looks shit
then i'm pirating it
want me to stop pirating?
make quality $15 games that are finished with ~10 years of free updates and content
i want to be able to sink 500-3000h into a good fricking game, not clock it in 5 hours and waste $130
for that price I could just get a hooker for an hour or two.
2 hour demos should've stayed instead of this refund garbage.
Refunding is so easy though lol.
Sometimes I even get 3 hours and I can still get a refund.
Piracy is theft, anyone who ever made anything worthwhile will tell you it's not nice to spend your time and using your arduously acquired skills making something you want to sell copies of, only for someone to take it and distribute it for free, it's not a nice feeling even if you factor in all the potential positives like the word of mouth, demo substitutes, larger fanbases and free marketing etc
That being said I have never paid for a game or a movie or a song in my life
I don't care. Do whatever the frick you want. Stop trying to get people to fight about everything.
Anyone who stays in this thread is willfully participating in bots trying to get you to hate everyone around you.
hey op can you actually provide your own, unaltered opinion on this matter or are you-
yep he's just going to post a twitter screencap and wait for the thread to collect easy (You)s because why be sincere in CY+10 when you can have some other moron spout your opinion for you or even better have an easily malleable opinion that changes on the dime because you have to fit in the cool kid's club
op is the twitter guy I think
What's most annoying about piracy discourse is that there are non braindead reasons to be for piracy, but people just decide not to use those and just say stupid shit like
>LOL I don't give a frick I do waht i want >:)
>yeah i'm stealing and I DON'T CAAAREEE!!!!! WOOOOOOOO
Are we on a fricking school yard? You're actively choosing to make piracy look bad, like it's only for idiots. Are you doing that on purpose?
My reason for pirating is I like free shit. Simple as
Opinions here do not escape to the normiesphere.
Those kinds of opinions are the worst. Only edgy poorgays crow about how proud they are to be pirates.
>you pirate because of homosexual morality
>I pirate because frick 'em
We are not the same.
I don't need to justify shit to you. I'm just gonna do it.
I pirate all I want because I'm huge (6'4 250 lbs) and I could kill game developers with my bare hands, therefore I am entitled to their products for free.
The only thing "making" piracy look bad is your unwillingness to embrace the extreme position of "frick you, I don't owe you a justification". I don't care if you have well-thought out arguments, that's not a position worth defending.
>I don't care if you have well-thought out arguments
Of course you dont, since you cant refute any of them.
You've been reduced to closing your eyes and ears and screaming about le big bad pirates in a bid to defend megacorps. Think on that and introspect a little.
If people are pirating you're products it's for one of two reasons.
>The person wouldn't have ever been a paying customer anyway due to not caring to support the dev or not being able to afford it
>You made a product that didn't incentivize people to purchase it due to it being trash, it being too expensive/monetized in some capacity, or it being inaccessible to the average consumer
In either case, I don't care. Either the product was bad in some capacity and I don't feel the need to defend a dev, or the people that pirated the product never were going to be paying customers to begin with. I personally pay for what I play because I prefer the convenience of it all, the lack of technical issues/multiplayer problems, and honestly because I'm a dumbass and would probably download a virus. But if people want to pirate things, go for it.
If it's a good game then it will naturally earn what it deserves even with piracy happening. A good example is Darkwood. Darkwood is straight up one of the best horror games that's come out in the past decade. To which, the devs literally uploaded the game to a site for people to just download/pirate it. And it still did fine since people wanted to support a good horror game. The only time I've ever seen devs complaining about pirates actually hurting their sales is either some really small indie dev that made some quick and dirty pile of junk that was never going to hit the top charts anyway, or massive publishers who are upset that their multi-million dollar franchise didn't get to advertise their microtransactions to as many people.
Piracy is fine. I don't do it, but I also don't see an issue with it. Make a good game and it's rarely an issue.
People who talk about the fact they pirate are insecure poorgays.
piracy isn't theft because i dont actually own anything.
Piracy is not theft, it's misappropriation :^)
>are we on a schoolyard
>he says this on cuckchan
RMAO
I've finished around 400 games in my life, probably played thousands of them in total. How many of those I bought? Roughly 10.
I've been pirating since the NES era and I live in latam. First worlders are missing out.
if its an indie game and if its release date its kinda unethical to pirate.
But if its triple A shit i feel like its fine to pirate since they dont lose money anyways.
If buying isn't owning etc etc
if buying a game isnt owning it, pirating it isnt stealing it
In my country downloading is legal due to piracy tax, uploading is not. Nonfree countries do not concern me.
>is it theft?
no, ignore contrarians who don't understand meaning of words and are merely begging for attention like little prostitutes
what country?
The frick do you care glowie.
Could not care less. It doesn’t affect me, and stealing from corporations is always morally correct.
90% of the time I pirate something it's because I'm never going to fork over money to buy it unless it's on an extreme sale. The other 10% is stuff that I'd never buy because it's either bad or too short and just wanted to try out because there's no demo.
Copyright should be done away with. If you can do something better than the person with the copyright, you should be able to.
Piracy is theft.
I don't care and if you don't want me to steal your things get better security.
I advocate for for the intensification of its percieved flaws and fears it creates, so fewer idiots get into it and it'll likely go on for longer.
Disregarding the ethics, the truth is the more people jump on board the more likely more drastic steps will be taken, ie the removal of more trackers.
Piracy is not theft. Piracy is still a crime. However piracy is easily remedied by making good games that people are willing to give you money for. Therefore if you have an issue with piracy, it's your own fault for making shitty games. The end.
The games industry argument about how piracy eats into sales is pretty moot and riddled with assumptions.
The assumptions are:
>People would buy the game if they weren't pirated
>Each copy pirated is a unique and separate sale that wasn't had, and that there are people who pirate, then purchase the game (or the other way around)
>They are entitled to a game purchase
The modern game industry is literally arguing over pennies at this point seeing as the only real lost sales were people who would have been tricked into purchasing the game without trying anyway.
The games industry deserves to fail and their absolute entitlement and hubris is stunning.
I own a physical copy, I can download a digital one.
No demo, pirate to try.
If piracy is theft then theft is good, simple as.
Wasn't there a study done in the UK that showed that pirated books ended up selling more than non-pirated books?
Probably, but much like highway traffic planners it probably gets ignored so some people can keep their redundant jobs.
"Yes sir we here at the anti-piracy division have been doing a great job preventing theft of your product! All studies show that piracy reduces sales, trust me!"
correlation doesnt equal causation. if people dont want to read your book FOR FREE then its probably a shitty book that nobody is going to buy. if people do want to pirate it then its a good book and will sell regardless.
just make better games
>correlation doesnt equal causation
Except when it does. If two things correlate that means it just has numerous complex causes. Which means that everything has a cause and anyone that denies that is just a whiny perfectionist homosexual.
Ethically, this is complete semantic nonsense. You can call piracy theft or consider it its own special class of wrongdoing, but it ultimately makes no difference because you are obviously not intended to use software that requires authorization (ie, purchasing a copy or license) without said authorization. Obviously this doesn't apply to freeware (and an argument can be made that it doesn't apply to abandonware either, a recent anecdotal example would be the Battle for Middle Earth games which are impossible to purchase digitally and are very expensive to purchase physical copies of). This is basically an emotional or moral argument, however, because legally speaking the definition is very clear.
Legally, piracy is copyright infringement, because you are using copyrighted software without authorization from the distributor. Theft is defined as specifically involving tangible, physical goods. If you rob a Gamestop, that is theft. If you download a cracked game, that's copyright infringement.
The ONLY argument of relevance that is worth scrutinizing or considering here is whether or not piracy actually hurts sales in the long-term, which apparently there are many studies showing opposing results.
Case closed, wienersuckers.
More often than not people pirating something were never going to buy it in the first place. It is not a lost sale, but is instead a free advertisement because the pirate may decide the game was worth working up some money and paying for or may post on sites about how much fun they had with it which could lead to further sales even though they individually did not purchase the game. Sure it could go the other way of them posting about how shit it is and dissuading others from making a purchase but that's partly your own fault for not making a fun game.
troony games aren't worth pirating
Taxation is also piracy but is legal for some reason.
he didn't say that!!!
No it isn't, taxation is THEFT, it takes money away from you, not leaving your original copy.
The better analogy would be QE (money printing), which is in fact, literally piracy. You could argue it is morally wrong for the same reason as piracy, i.e. it dilutes the value of the original product.
i don't pirate modern games because they're boring
buying used old games doesn't do anything for the license holders so piracy is a zero guild process
Didn't american lawmakers get to the conclussion that it wasn't theft? Still illegal distribution of copyrighted material or something like that, but it's not theft.
piracy isn't theft but i with it was so i could put the companies i hate out of business
No demo? DLCs that aren't proper expansions? Day 1 DLC? Microtransactions? Gachashit? Online only? Games as a Service? The list goes on.
This is a two-way road, do unto your customers as you would have them do unto your company.
There used to be an old photo floating around some years ago describing DLC / Expansions.
I think someone needs to add one for the current year, only it should be a bunch of children in construction hats piecing together a lego set, but selling it piece by piece to you, then calling it "LIVE SERVICE"
>copy this guys personal computer files
>he says im stealing
they flip so fast from just this one example
This mogged everyone in the thread so they ran away from it.
Intellectual property doesn't exist so its impossible to steal
I just find it funny that people are tripping over themselves to stand up for companies that actively gouge, cheat, lie to and demean them all the time while also stealing their data. It's a zoomer thing, used to be unheard of on this site but now it's pretty common to mock people for pirating.
I'm not tripping or standing up for companies that do any of those things. OP posed an idiotic question, and I gave a very thoughtful and articulated answer. It's not complicated. People who get emotional about this subject will equate piracy with theft, when by legal definition it is considered copyright infringement. It's also obvious that it's not the "right" thing to do. You're not stealing from the rich to give to the poor like some righteous crusader- you're playing a videogame you don't have permission to play. You might suggest that my stance is implicitly stating that I'm "defending" shitty developers, but let's not split hairs here- ethically and morally it is not appropriate, but those who do it anyway don't give a frick. What I object to is not the practice, it's the incessant moralizing that doesn't have any logical reasoning that makes any sense.
To use another hot topic as an example, it's the same reason I despise the "pro-choice" crowd- they all pretend what they are doing is somehow morally virtuous while conveniently ignoring the fact (and it is an absolute fact) that abortions are the explicit killing of unborn humans. An extreme example, but this is Ganker. In the same way that abortions objectively entail the murder of unborn humans (which are living, in spite of the moronic objections of moronic millenials who slept or jerked off through their biology classes), piracy objectively entails the unauthorized use of copyrighted property.
Do what you want- I don't really care about any of that. Just don't blow smoke up my ass with nonsensical emotional arguments.
we have ChatGPT browsing Ganker now?
didn't you learn from April first of last year? it's been here the whole time
Corporations think they're clever for making a meme out of Chatgpt and pretending they aren't maliciously trying to pacify the public into letting them run the planet.
Fake oldgay. Ganker has been laughing at poorgays since time immemorial. Yes of course people have been pirating games since way before the inception of Ganker, but no one has been quite so proud of being pirates than the poorgay zoomers who grew up thinking that piracy is a supreme moral good instead of a necessary thing to do.
Once buying becomes owning, piracy becomes stealing.
Also, if you're not selling a game anywhere in its peak form, it's no longer piracy to acquire it.
I am a pirate, pure and simple.
I WILL rape and pillage
Ill pay when i can. I understand i wouldnt have a lot of great games if they didnt make money.
Ill pirate if theyre abandonware games, never localized games, locked on old consoles, removed from the digital stores and downloads or just rereleases.
I liked libraries until Infound out they bin books. Piracy is the only archive preserving progress.
All govt should be killed. No exceptions. All seeking profit should be slaughtered.
>All seeking profit should be slaughtered.
t.12yo who just read the communist manifesto
You had a good point until you went all commie at the end. The gaming industry unironically doesn't give a frick about preservation and stuff like piracy and emulation are the only ways to actually preserve titles once the online services harboring them shut down. So what's "theft" today becomes the only way to actually play the games tomorrow.
don't mind me. just pirating this coke recipe
You guys hungry? I have fish and bread, I can seed it for you. No, I won't give the bakers or fishermen money for the lost sales. Why would I go and do that?
Jesus, fish and wine is old content. It isn't even available in the desert, why would it be theft if the original copyright holder doesn't make it available for purchase?
You ask why would it be theft. I say to you, theft is to take. Piracy is to give. Do not steal hollow praises unto the lord, nor demo generosity unto your brethren. Give, that my love may be reflected through followers of me. The gift of the 1080p Sephirotic release Evangelion onto a USB hard drive that can be easily watched through the USB port of your Blu ray player does good to a weary spirit.
>they're STILL seething about his item dupe exploit
Intellectual property rights of any kind are not legitimate property rights at all.
Why? But I ask again- why? On what grounds are they not legitimate? Morally? Because legally, they are wholly legitimate and have been so for over 40 years.
Legally they are, but logically they are not.
Ideas are fungible and non-scarce. If you think of 1+1=2 and someone else thinks of 1+1=2 that is the exact same thing. Neither is unique. In other words, they are fungible. If you think of 1+1=2 that doesn't stop someone else from thinking of 1+1=2, even entirely independently of you. In other words, they lack scarcity.
Additionally, there is the matter of expiration. When you own something you just own it, there is no caveat that after a certain amount of time you no longer own it and someone else gets to take it from you. Even if it were like that, what happens to that object then? Who owns it after you no longer own it? The first person to use it? What if you're the first person to re-use it? Do you regain ownership of it? If someone else re-uses it first do they then get new exclusive rights to it? We could keep going like this forever. It's insane to say that there should be implicit time limits on ownership.
That then brings us to the next issue: If property shouldn't be time-limited, then how do you deal with the ownership of ideas? To go back to the example of 1+1=2, the very idea of 1+1=2 should be considered to be the full property of whoever it was that first came up with it. Whoever their property got passed down to from generation to generation up until today should be the one who owns the concept of 1+1=2. The same applies to every single idea in existence. Everything from making a sandwich to doing pushups to sawing planks to even language itself.
Owning an idea is a concept which makes absolutely no sense.
>Why? But I ask again- why? On what grounds are they not legitimate? Morally? Because legally, they are wholly legitimate and have been so for over 40 years.
Here, in both the acts of copying the text of your post and of taking a screencap of it, I have pirated your ideas. At a fundamental level this is the exact same as sharing a video game or a movie or a book or anything else like that.
It's only ok if you are wearing a pirate hate while doing it. If not, then you should be executed via firing squad.
Pirating a game instead of purchasing it through proper channels is depriving the publisher and developers of a potential sale, so yes it's stealing even if nothing is technically removed.
I do think piracy has done more good than harm to the industry and community overall, but I do hate how insufferable some third-world pirates can get about how they're "based" for not having bought a game since 2008 when they learned how to torrent.
As a kid I pirated every game because I couldn't afford them.
As an adult I almost never pirate because most new games aren't worth playing.
I used to pirate as a kid and a college student. I just buy them now to save time.
If games i bought with my money aren't mine and i never actually owned them then piracy isn't theft and a crime 🙂
I have more than enough mandatory expenses I never asked for simply from being born a human on earth.
I don't think I should need to also pay for mass-produced entertainment made to the same standards as pig feed.
Piracy is theft. And if you're cool with that then do it and stop larping that you're doing some public service.
I'm either
1. Not going to buy the game
or
2. Going to buy the game
If I'm not going to buy the game then piracy isn't stealing because I'm not going to give them money anyway.
If the game I pirate is actually good then the chances of changing my mind and actually buying the game increases.
Piracy is a glorified demo.
Next they'll be claiming that second hand games are Piracy.
It's copyright infringement.
Software is intellectual property, you can't steal intellectual property by downloading software. You can only execute it without a license from the copyright holder.
Why is this so hard for c**ts to understand
Way I see it, the company doesn't own the game, it owns the right to sell it. So as long as you don't infringe on that right by selling it yourself without their permission, you're good.
I often hack into FTPs, copy the file, then delete the original off the FTP so that I do in fact steal.
I do this as much as I possibly can.
How long until game devs unironically begin to claim that people choosing to ignore their $90 games are a bad as the pirates?
If buying is not owning then piracy literally cannot be stealing. If buying a game only gives me a license to use someone else's software then pirating is simply using software without a license - NOT stealing.
Its not technically theft but you were a potential sale and try and buyers are liars most the time even if they genuinely enjoyed the game
YOU WOULDN'T DOWNLOAD A CAR
where do you download games these days besides the russian forum
It's not theft but I wish that it was.
>my apartment complex has ONE internet connection everyone shares whether they want to or not
>meaning everyone has the same IP
>obviously you do banking, Ganker and mail on your phone with your mobile data
>a little old lady subscribed to netflix
>she shared it with neighbour
>neighbour shared it with neighbour
>everyone has been using it for years
>we all do chores for her like cleaning and shopping and bring her our excess food as a small acknowledgement of thanks while taking care of the elderly is just the right thing to do anyway
>netflix sends the whole apartment letters saying we're breaking the law by sharing netflix outside of a single household and claims we are in practice pirating
>the letter demands we all buy our own netflix subscription or face consequences
Literally what do they think they can do when it's being used on a single IP address network? I'm so curious, there hasn't been any other letters for half a year and obviously we haven't changed anything.
They're just trying to scare you. Those stupid israelites aren't going to do shit, nor can they anyways.
Piracy isn't theft because theft implies transferred ownership, and PC gamers, and pirates on any platform, own nothing and are extremely happy about it
I do own my fitgirl repacks thovghever. I can boil 'em, mash 'em, burn 'em on a DVD.
Daily reminder that DRM was never meant to combat "piracy" but to destroy the second-hand market for PC. Previously, people who were willing to spend money on games in principle (i.e. not "pirates") could pay another player to take a used game off their hands. The Nose Merchants saw this and were absolutely incensed that money changed hands without them getting a cut. Hence they decided to ruin that entire market by making the resale of games literally impossible via limited online registration, hardware-locks and similar demented shit.
This was never meant to prevent the cracking of games which was a) virtually impossible until very recently and b) completely irrelevant to their bottom line because "pirates" don't pay for vidya in the first place. Turd World Timmy was never gonna pay $60 each for a dozen games a year just because SecuROM prevented Spore from being put up for free for like a week. However, First World Freddy, who previously spent $20 each on three used games a year might now instead begrudgingly spend $60 on one.
Both are illegal and I'm white.
officially I believe that piracy is something you do behind the scenes
but when pirating anime it's the only moral course.
my rules is pirating 3ds is justified
never pirate current machines.
Here's my stance...
Im a bloody pirate.
YO HO
it's theft of intellectual property
this rationalization is dumb and harmful : you don't want to normalize piracy, you want people to think it's evil so fewer and fewer people do it, so companies stop using shit like denuvo or any other drm
game theory 101
only chads comfortable with being thieves are worthy
honestly? who cares? if you geniunely believe that publishers are looking out for your best interests then you're moronic. Many games are riddled with DRM that do nothing but hurt consumers. DRM that most pirates avoid entirely through cracks. It's painfully obvious that the plan for the industry is to abandon physical media entirely to destroy the used game market. Sales will be forced to go through the publishers only instead of the hands of the secondary market. Games now have expiration dates and can be taken off these online markets at the drop of a hat. So if the plan is to make sure gamers own nothing, how is it theft? what are you stealing? their right to hold you by the balls and hold your favorite games for ransom under the threat of never being able to purchase them again?
Piracy (modern piracy at least) is categorically not theft, but it's still bad in most cases. Just because something isn't theft doesn't mean it's fine.
I PIRATE FOR THE THRILL OF THE BOOTY. GIVE ME ALLL OF THE BOOTY
Piracy is the only way to solve media preservation problems when copyright and consumer protection laws are as moronic as they are in Burgerland.
Regardless of how you feel about it, piracy is legally speaking copyright infringement and not theft.
Complete bull. Piracy is necessary, both because game publishers lie and steal, and because no one else cares of maintaining and archiving old games.
It is not, and it is your IMPERATIVE to do it. Mega corps do not care about you, mega corps will not suffer from one or even a thousand pirated downloads of a single game, but they will try to twist you into giving them everything and more because just having one yacht isn't enough for them.
I think that in order to call piracy theft you need to define theft in a way that makes piracy theft. Otherwise you'll never manage it.
Wehther you should do it or not is a different matter. You forfeit any right to an opinion about the business of making games if you aren't paying for them.
>corny
I fricking hate zoomers so much, such a homosexual way of phrasing things.
if buying isn't owning, downloading isn't stealing
I land on corporations can suck my wiener. If I'm not buying from you it's your problem, you're not providing a good enough reason to do so.
Defending piracy isn't half as corny as reposting shit from twitter as if Ganker is twitters comments section
artists should legally own the production rights to their creations to prevent immitators from selling bootlegs but artists should not entitled to theoretical profit. piracy is illegal because the artist loses the ability to make a hypothetical sale when someone shares it for free. this is like a car company suing carpoolers because the passengers should all buy their own car. it opens a can of worms. what if an artist sells their game for $20 and a pirate shares it and two years later the artist marks up the price to one billion dollars. did the pirate steal twenty dollars or one billion? hypothetical profit is immeasurable and meaningless because they are measuring made up value. a work of art is worth more than the electricity and hardware used to make it, because art is a product of labor and skill not raw material. skill is subjective.
piracy is still a dickish move, but the government shouldn't criminalize it. artists should just accept that some people are unscrupulous, but anyone who wants more content will pay for it because of enlightened self interest.
I land on piracy = seething shill.
it's not some moral or anti authoritarian posturing thing for me, i'm just cheap
Calling piracy theft is like calling rape murder.
And when you try to correct them they go "OH SO YOU THINK RAPE IS GOOD THEN"?
No they're just entirely different fricking crimes.
I thought we are at a point where rape is worse than murder already
Piracy is totally fine if you're pirating games/movies/whatever from corporations, but I personally think it's good to support smaller independent projects. Don't really care what other people do but that's what I do.
Basically this. I only give my money to projects and creators that I think deserve the money and support, which is most indie games, or sometimes bigger titles that did something risky or are genuinely honest and consumer friendly, NEO: TWEWY being a good case of that.
As shitty and cliche as it is, voting with your dollar is really the only thing we can do as consumers to nudge companies in whatever direction we want them to
It's the only language that corpos will ever listen to, so there's little else we can do as single people but that.
mom status?
I get hard imagining all the money these homosexual companies are losing everytime I seed something
Here's a wild take:
Anything you put onto the internet is no longer yours. If it's a game, a video, a picture, a book, a comic, whatever, you rescind your ownership once you upload it onto the internet, copyright laws shouldn't even attempt to protect this.
Unless the thing you "own" is completely impossible to replicate in any way and nobody has even remote access to it, you'll never stop it from being copied and used without your input or knowledge.
I will use use a sledgehammer to turn your face into something thats impossible to replicate.
Yoink! Your comment is mine now. You made the original, but I can make infinite copies out of it now that you've made it public.
Serves you right, putting shit on the internet.
>game releases for $60
>only one person buys it, uploads it
>50,000 people pirate it
imagine it was your game. do you think this is ok?
>create a buggy mess of a videogame
>charge extra for a pre-sale exclusive item to force people to buy your game before you even finish it
>have 2 DLCs already finished and release them as an extra part of the product for $20 each
>add DRM that destroys your user's SDD for playing your game
>include an intrusive launcher so they must use your ecosystem if they want to play the game, push ads through it
>include a game pass that will keep them spending on the game they've bought, but in a monthly manner
>lock all the cool shit through loot boxes
>add a clause in your ToS that indicates that you can rescind the permission of the user to play the game they just bought for arbitrary reasons
>make it so the always online feature of the game crashes the first week that the game is out
I would be impressed that morons even wasted space or broadband downloading the game in the first place.
did your highschool bully become a multimillionaire off their passion project? you have some personal issues, maybe some fundamental life experiences you never got. its ok lil bro Ganker will always be here for you 🙂
>who hurt you
Women were a mistake
have sex incel
t. chad
Chads don't instantly revert to highschool situations in order to win an argument.
Chads don't use the term incel because sex comes naturally to them so it's an afterthought in the worthiness of another male.
In fact, only someone who would think sex is hard to get would use the term incel as an insult unironically, that means women whose only value is the quality of their sex and beta males who see sex as the ultimate achievement.
Ah, no arguments
Pretty chuffed that 50K people played my game. In reality those numbers mean a lot of sales so I would be double chuffed.
Reminder that calling piracy "piracy" was already goofy exaggerated villification
I think software licencing is just too abstract for third worlders and zoomers.
Even when buying a physical copy you don't own the source code of the game, you merely bought a right to play it. Copying the game files off the disc and distributing them (for free or for money) would still be illegal since you never bought the game itself.
Burning the files into a CD was just the best distribution method before broadband internet.
And any install wizard from around that time made it abundantly clear in the EULA that you're not the owner of the software.
This whole discussion about the semantics of theft is irrelevant since piracy isn't a violation of property rights but of usage rights. Like riding the train without a ticket or entering a museum without paying.
But as I said, these are apparently incredibly complex concepts for most, that's why lowIQs need to bring physical objects into it to help them discuss which ultimately dooms them to always miss the point.
Gen X brought about cancerous shit like feminism and hippies
Well, I agree that piracy, blocking ads, even refusing to watch ads on TV or on the streets is all theft.
But I'm also a master thief.
that I pirate games to play for free
none of this ethical shit because at the end of the day gamer "morals" are lofty as frick
As we all know Doom was a colossal failure. So many pirates killed Doom it never stood a chance.
Piracy is good for everyone as long as the product is good. If the product is good, piracy is free marketing at worst, and actual conversion into a sale at best. Did anyone ever buy a video game because they couldn't pirate it?
We have plenty of examples of no DRM games with massive financial success. We also have cases of devs going out of their way and uploading their game on torrents for those who cannot afford it. I bought the game just to support these practices, even though I am not that interested in playing it.
Piracy is theft but I don't care. I wouldn't have to steal stuff if people just gave it to me for free. I deserve everything I want for free because I'm me, and it's not my fault that no one acknowledges that. I'm me! I'm a big deal! I'm the most importantest person ever! Why doesn't anyone see that?
>I own pixels on a screen even though everyone can copy them. This makse sense.
You cannot pirate a license therefore downloading a game is just that, downloading a game.
Piracy isn't theft, and that's unfortunate because I want to hurt the companies I pirate from.
piracy is not theft
piracy is its own thing, and is still wrong
Piracy is piracy, theft is theft. More than one thing can be illegal. Don't know why that's such a big issue for people.
Even if it's theft modern companies deserve to be robbed.
piracy is the best, you can't convince me otherwise frick off
i dont give a frick if homosexuals get less potential renevue lmao dont make shit games
I pirate because there is no demo to play, before buying and within 2 hours there is a chance the game isn't boring or has long ass tutorial.
It's clear as crystal the twittergay is right, just from looking at its current history in society.
When it comes to copying games - software piracy - the industry has always pushed a don't copy narrative. But simultaneously, back when they couldn't really do anything about it, both the music industry and the tv/film industry only got uptight about obvious bootlegging for profit. If you were copying shit off tv or dubbing VHS or cassettes, even CDs, they pushed absolutely no narrative on you at all.
Now that we're all living in an area where they can sue providers and even individual users into bankruptcy, and control all access points themselves, they now push the narrative that it's theft and piracy.
Of course pirating is theft. Is is both unethical and illegal.
Having said that though I do pirate all my Switch games and pirate movie camrips kek.
Pirates are the vegans of gaming
Actually its pc gamers in general who are
If buying a game isnt owning it, then pirating a game isnt stealing it
he's right copy paste is by definition not theft. you still have the original. it is art forgery at best, and video games aren't art :^)
One problem is that piracy offers a preservation advantage that no company offers.
buying isnt owning
therefore
piracy is not theft
for me piracy is basically me testing if some slop works well on my pc and if I'll like its gameplay. If I enjoy it, I'll buy it at the next sale, if not, I'll just ignore and shitpost about it forever.
>if not, I'll just ignore
And that's why demos are no longer a thing.
Piracy is theft, now hear me out first. Piracy definitionally was theft during the age of the sail. Copyright violation therefore isn't piracy at all, and never was.
I don't care.
Nowadays you should just pirate anything you want to play as to not support pozzed corporations. And even that only applies to older games, as newer games are so bad they're not even worth pirating.
I feel like piracy is theft and don't pirate games but I steel the frick out of movies and tv shows because frick them homosexuals. With games it's just that there's a lot of other games I could be playing so why go to the effort? With movies I just want to watch that specific one without waiting.
> I will only say this, that if the measure before us should pass, and should produce one-tenth part of the evil which it is calculated to produce, and which I fully expect it to produce, there will soon be a remedy, though of a very objectionable kind. Just as the absurd acts which prohibited the sale of game were virtually repealed by the poacher, just as many absurd revenue acts have been virtually repealed by the smuggler, so will this law be virtually repealed by piratical booksellers. At present the holder of copyright has the public feeling on his side. Those who invade copyright are regarded as knaves who take the bread out of the mouths of deserving men. Everybody is well pleased to see them restrained by the law, and compelled to refund their ill-gotten gains. No tradesman of good repute will have anything to do with such disgraceful transactions. Pass this law: and that feeling is at an end. Men very different from the present race of piratical booksellers will soon infringe this intolerable monopoly. Great masses of capital will be constantly employed in the violation of the law. Every art will be employed to evade legal pursuit; and the whole nation will be in the plot. On which side indeed should the public sympathy be when the question is whether some book as popular as Robinson Crusoe, or the Pilgrim's Progress, shall be in every cottage, or whether it shall be confined to the libraries of the rich for the advantage of the great-grandson of a bookseller who, a hundred years before, drove a hard bargain for the copyright with the author when in great distress?
-Baron Thomas Babbington Macaulay, on extending copyright excessively (February 5th, 1841)
But cutting is copying.
piracy is theft as proven already in this thread
*not
not gonna lie if piracy was cutting & pasting it'd be so based
imagine your friend buys the game, you pirate it & you hear him talk about how his copy vanished
copyright infringement isn't theft
Depriving a ((seller)) of his profits is considered theft
So if I decide not to buy a game, does that mean I'm stealing from the publisher?
>So if I decide not to buy a game, does that mean I'm stealing from the publisher?
Yes. They just haven't passed the legislation yet.
if you download it without buying it, yes
>try to sell ice to inuit
>they don't buy my ice because they just pick it up from the ground
>they are depriving me of my profits, this should be illegal
>Rabbi Shekelstein agrees and passes a law forcing the inuit to buy ice from me
>WTF they don't care and started pirating ice?
>it's okay when the government copy pastes dollars
Good enough for them, good enough for me.
Corporations consistently push the boundaries of law and desperately try to do all but outright steal from customers while slowly making their inaccessible or vandalized to the point of non-functionality.
Making a copy of something is not theft.
Piracy in the age of unchecked corporate greed and invasive anti-consumer practices is both justified and the right thing to do.
Most importantly it has no impact on sales since people who pirate were never going to make a purchase anyway. Imaginary sales are not lost sales.
Death to all corporations, businesses, and commerce in general. It all only benefits the absolute worst forms of human being.
Vidya hu ackbar.
*making their products inaccessible
No matter what it is, I'm still going to do it.
is*
suck shit, commie
I think the bottom-line is if piracy affects sales or not.
The example I usually use is CDPR games, specifically GOG games so you can include Baldur's Gate 3 in there as well.
These games are released DRM free and pirating them is as easy as copying and pasting the installer anywhere.
Despite how easy it is to pirate these games, The Witcher 3, Cyberpunk, and BG3 were one of, if not the biggest games of their respective launch years.
Wouldn't you naturally assume that these games would take a noticable hit in sales if it was so easy to acquire them?
It's not even discussed at all.
Hell, even Minecraft was so easily downloadable back in the day.
You could look up Minecraft free download on Google and get it with no problem, you probably still can, and that game is THE beat selling game ever.
If these games are so big while also being so accessible, why are so many companies so willing to actively sabotage their games with intrusive DRM and anti-piracy measures that degrade in game performance?
Is there no data or discussion among them about this?
At the very least wouldn't these companies want to save a few bucks on licencing anti-piracy software?
What's the actual data on the money saved on sales with anti-piracy software against the sales lost without?
What about platforms that now can't purchase the product because of said anti-piracy software being incompatible with their system?
Really, it all seems pretty obvious to me, it has to be to them too right?
>If these games are so big while also being so accessible, why are so many companies so willing to actively sabotage their games with intrusive DRM and anti-piracy measures that degrade in game performance?
Corporations have their own mysticism. People think that because they are profit-seeking organizations, they will be objective without wasting time and money on nonsense, but this is totally false, especially when it comes to large corporations.
Many corporate decisions are basically "exoteric" things because someone gave a presentation that impressed some executives. Much of the wisdom of the corporate world can be equated with religions.
>I think the bottom-line is if piracy affects sales or not.
That's the real thing. Piracy is a crime but it's also an incredibly weird one with effectively zero impact on the entirety of MULTIPLE industries it effects both on a macro and micro level from gaming as a whole to individual studios. Deciding whether it's a crime or morally wrong to do misses the forest for the trees in that at its absolute worst it's akin to jaywalking and nobody really gives a shit on any rung of the society its apart of. If anything piracy has created more jobs within the industry than it's ever endangered.
Piracy is just another word for copyright infringement. That's the crime you commit when you pirate "Furry Hitler Anal Gape Adventure". Every time someone goes to jail over piracy related things it's copyright infringement, not any variation of theft. Laws are just fairy tales enforced through violence though so it doesn't matter what they say.
Stealing is only unethical when the person you're stealing from has less money than you.
Wage slaves have the lion's share of their labor's product stolen from them, so they get a free pass on taking back what's owed to them.
Stealing from devs who have less money than you is the only case that's unethical.
Read Chomsky, Marx, Bakunin.
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Gabe Newell had the best and most accurate take on piracy, in that is a service issue. There NEEDS to be an incentive for the customer to purchase a product via a service over just pirating it and Steam is the solution to that. It is not just a convenient place to install and reinstall games on one device or another, Steam also comes with built-in QoL features for capturing screenshots, a per-game discussion forum, and other minor features like notepads, calculators, or a web-browser.
In short, you getting an objectively better experience by purchasing and playing a game on steam instead of pirating it.
>Gabe Newell had the best and most accurate take on piracy
No, he didn't, because he still pushed the fradulent definition of piracy as theft.
In the eyes of ~~*those who control the money*~~, it IS theft and sadly, their word is law to the goyim
>some moronic bloatware botnet bullshit
>renting your game
>better experience
Steam is exactly part of the "service issue", to the point I won't even bother pirating a cracked nosteam version of a game anymore
It is always morally correct to pirate. I am following the example set by my lord and Savior Jesus Christ
If they want my money they should become worthy of it. Until then piracy will continue
while piracy is of course theft and immoral, i only pirate games snd movies from companies that are racist or bigoted, like disney or nintendo
I will own everything and you will go bankrupt.
>all piracy supporters are commies
that is funny and expected
piracy isn't theft, it's piracy. It's a completely different crime and you can make your judgement and moral rulings all you'd like on it, but the fact people need to equate it to stealing speaks volumes about how much of a nothingburger it really is.
>buy apple
>eat apple
>plant the seeds in my backyard
>now I have apple tree
>tfw I'm pirating apples
>water the apple tree
>give the apple tree nutrients
>don't let anyone chop down or steal from the apple tree
man, this pirating shit is expensive
Planting your own apple tree is actually illegal.
Monsanto sues for copyright infringement all the time for people planting seeds instead of buying them from the company.
can they really tell its their apple im growing? damn
They can, Monsanto seed are genetically modified. They do a DNA test and sue.
lol wtf are you on about? a fricking apple has dna now? come on
yeah anon, shits stupid
apples ain't even alive
>it's illegal because a megacorp says so
Man it would be so nice if the US had a government that would step in and stop megacorps from rewriting the laws to suit them as they bully the penniless smallfolk. But alas, we havent had an actual government in a decade, only oligarchs piloting the machine
It is theft but I do not care
>tfw to dumb to pirate safely
I'm not going to make it am I.
No court of law has ever actually treated piracy as theft, that's fricking absurd. It's just violation of copyright.
not sure if this counts
https://www.justice.gov/usao-wdmo/pr/florida-man-pleads-guilty-software-piracy-scheme
he sold key cards with fake Microsoft keys, and deprived Microsoft of 2.5 million dollars.
>fake key cards
No, he scammed 2.5 million dollars out of people looking for cheap grey market code keys.
Piracy is only bad due to hyper capitalism and interest based economy.
Piracy is just a modern version of borrowing your friend's copy, prove me wrong
P2P file sharing should be legal - the shared content should under local law, investigated after a signal is reported.
>should be legal
isn't P2P file sharing already legal? i can send stuff between my work computer and home computer legally
It's what corporate shills like to call a 'grey area', same as the secondhand market. The reality is literally all of their arguments against piracy apply to general file sharing and secondhand market reselling ans bringing this up always loses them support fast, so they sidestep it
makes you wonder, if you could play a game and pass it on, and everyone did it with one copy. everyone in the world finished it using one copy.
the developers would gain no money, while everyone finished it, is that morally right?
if a game is fun and good, buy it to fund the creation of future fun and good things
if a game is pozzed and bad, pirate it (or avoid it entirely) to not fund the creation of future pozzed and bad things
simple as.
>buy it to fund the creation of future fun and good things
I bought New Vegas. Where are my future fun and good things?
you didn't buy enough copies
buying more copies would have deprived other players of the experience and thus could be considered theft
> i bought New Vegas day one
>my reward is the outer worlds
yeah, frick that
Copying, reproduction, alteration and sharing of media, or any information, is the divine right of all mankind.
Piracy isn't theft, but in cases where the money you pay goes directly to the creator it's better to buy something you like.
So digital communism is a good thing? make the game for the benefit of all mankind, not for money
I do whatever I want.
Why do pirates feel the need to moral grandstand about it? If someone calls you a thief just tell them to go frick themselves
>If someone calls you a thief just tell them to go frick themselves
Because piracy isnt theft, lets be clear about that
I pirate the same game twice to inflict extra damage.
Frick corporations.
If they make good games that are worth the money, people will buy. If they make shit games, people will look for ways to not waste money, including piracy, especially piracy.
i actually prefer to buy games from key sites because not only are the scum devs not getting paid but some turkish reseller is getting their money instead
is it safe to buy from G2A? im afraid they might steal my credit card number
G2A is safe. The worst that can happen is that they get some stolen key that either doesn't work or will get deactivated, and then G2A gives you a new key.
I pirate every western game. I buy jap games but only when it's heavily discounted. Money that I save is spent on PC hardware upgrades.
>not even trying to find statements that might be controversial on Ganker, just needing to have your daily twitter cap thread
this is an addiction dude
corporations regularly engage in theft and other forms of abuse, so piracy is theft and that's a good thing
It's quite simple
>Do I think the game is going to be worth paying for?
If so, I'll buy it on Steam or GOG, because it's convenient and easy to reinstall
>Do I think the game is probably going to be shit but I want to see if it's actually worth buying?
If so, I'll pirate it, and buy it if it does actually impress me (it usually doesn't)
>Do I think the game is probably going to be shit but I want to see if it's actually worth buying - but can't pirate it for whatever reason?
Then I won't buy it, and I won't pirate it
If anything, piracy has allowed the gaming industry to get MORE money from me
>it's not technically theft so it's okay
I still pirate regardless
>I AM SILLY
Holy frick you actually thought you had something there. How embarrassing for you.
He bought the machine to duplicate
you pirated that jpeg, how dare you not credit the original artist
Corpos commit the brunt of theft through wage theft. I am simply taking back what is mine.
I'm poor so my strategy to play games was to save up for an ebay second-hand gaming rig, then pirate literally every game above, say, 5$. It's genuinely just a question of do I pirate basically everything or just not play games. I chose the former because the people who suggest the latter either never had to deal with being poor and don't really get what it's like, or they have a genuinely very cucked mentality and seem to take actively pride in having less than others.
I have money and I still follow your logic, I'm not going to pay for something if I can get away with not paying for it.
Piracy laws are dumb, it's like punishing someone for sharing a bag of chips they bought.
They better get used to the idea of me pirating movies but remaking them in my image with AI.
>doesn't understand how sharing works
typical moron anime poster √
Don't care, the money spent on entertainment is much better invested in a index fund. You can retire years earlier if you do this all your life. What kind of moron would give years of their life to appease companies.
you're using a product that's meant to be payed for. so yes, it's a form of theft.
For every 1 pirate, there's 20 paypigs to compensate for any "theft"
You can tell hogwarts legacy sold purely off of name and culture war bullshit because there's not a single person that will say that HL is their game of the year. It only got any sort of attention because trannies made a huge fuss out of it.
People don't just buy 1 game a year. It doesn't have to be a GOTY to sell a lot of copies. Hogwarts was a perfectly acceptable semi-open world action game. It covered enough people's "that's alright" categories that it sold well. People buying stuff to "own the libs" never amounts to a hill of beans.
I remember there were multiple threads of Ganker screenshotting their Steam pre-orders saying that they "did their part" specifically to own the trannies which makes it even sadder since the game is still full of woke stuff including an actual troony character that you interact with during gameplay
the only thing piracy and theft have in common is that both are things only done by subhuman Black folk
how can piracy be theft when paying isn't ownership?
Everything I do is right.
If it wasn't then someone would stop me.
No one has yet to stop me.