From my understanding the three versions of the game each have their own strengths and there's no definitive edition until reborn gets a mod.
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Which version of Tactics Ogre is your favourite
I like reborn, but I really dislike the spawning buff cards, so Id say my favorite one is the PSP version.
If reborn gets a no cards mod, id call It my favorite.
Right fricking here.
The cards are actually fun but they make the game too easy. IF you can somehow get rid of the card system then it's the perfect game.
Simple as.
yea I like the cards but they are too overpowered.
Would rather only enemies have them.
With the cheat engine table you can disable the card spawns.
>Buff cards don't appear in Battle
https://fearlessrevolution.com/viewtopic.php?t=22000
No idea if erases prebuffs from the bosses (would be pointless if it didn't), but the option is there. There's also an cheat to get rid of another cancerous and as much hated addition, namely union level cap.
What truly killed Reborn for me was axing of the skill slots and removal of random encounters. This sucks out the fun of experimenting with the unit builds and strips what little freedom there was to recruit rare classes/units much earlier than story allows in Reborn now. There are many more things wrong about it and too few improvements over the PSP version, so I pick LUCT. Not the vanilla, neither fan mods but the LUCT customized to your preference with the cheats. Get the spreadsheet from the 2nd page of this thread and tune LUCT to your liking:
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/999440-tactics-ogre-let-us-cling-together/79639566
Don't forget the hi-res texture pack from PPSSPP forums if you're emulating.
It's just astonishing how these incompetent fricks can't make the game good given 20 years and 2 remakes.
>No idea if erases prebuffs from the bosses (would be pointless if it didn't)
I know for a fact you can delete card buffs with that table.
>union level cap
one of the best features of reborn, preventing you from overleveling was a wise decision.
>was axing of the skill slots
Yeah because it was so good in the PSP original where you had a bunch of filler skills
>Random encounters
This is such a bullshit complaint, go to the wildwoods if you want encounters, there was no real reason for them
based cheat engine on TO user
keep up the good work bro
PSP One Vision had some modder-brained rebalance decisions that dragged the pace of fights down to a crawl. Reborn is severely imbalanced and the new meta of collecting cards on the field is fricking weird. Having played both, honestly PSP is probably "objectively" better but if you just want to play the game and beat it I think reborn is better.
You literally need the buffs to beat the captain enemies later on.
>I never used yadda yadda
You need the buffs to beat the captain enemies later on. Many times they'll spawn in with 2-3x armor cards so you *have* to buff to kill them.
>PSP One Vision had some modder-brained rebalance decisions that dragged the pace of fights down to a crawl. Reborn is severely imbalanced and the new meta of collecting cards on the field is fricking weird. Having played both, honestly PSP is probably "objectively" better but if you just want to play the game and beat it I think reborn is better.
it makes the battles more tactical instead of denam just one shotting everything.
Send ninjas, rogues and archers to kill their healers and the battles will be over pretty quick
>Many times they'll spawn in with
You can delete all card buffs with the table, even those they spawn with.
Final Fantasy Tactics Advance.
1. Final Fantasy Tactics (PSX)
2. Tactics Ogre (SNES)
3. Tactics Ogre (PSX)
Chronicle Valeria
For me its one vision. Reborn is simplified zoomie shit, LUCT has no meta. OV is the best version of wizard chess in gaming. Having access to minor actions really elevates this above the three matsuno final fantasies
How do minor actions affect the gameplay?
>One vision
Literally the VtmB unofficial patch + of tactics ogre with made up oc lore and fanfiction
This, one vision is very well made. Lots of side grade weapons as well to add even more different playstyles
Reborn completely screwed up evasion, you simply can't evade attacks anymore. It's such a huge flaw that people who still play it despite this are unfortunately simply braindead.
>simply braindead.
But enough about people who shill one vision
No argument
See
Question for the Tactics Ogre chads in this thread.
I am building a TRPG inspired by both Tactics Ogre and FFT. However I realized I may have given my units too many skills.
Each unit can wield 2 weapons, as well as a sidearm (dagger standard, some classes get special sidearms like 2h sword/blunderbuss). Each weapon comes with 7 weapon skills varying in TP cost from 1-3. TP regenerates 1 per turn. In addition to this, each character can choose a class and a subclass. Each class has between 12-20 skills.
This means each unit can use 2x class skillsets (15 average skills each) and 2x weapon skillsets (7 attack skills each). I am not sure if sidearm should get a skillset as well or just be a backup weapon. Leaning on the latter.
Now my question is, are these too many skills? Should I delete some to make units more unique and to make choosing your class/subclass more important? Or should I keep the huge number of skills in and let the player go HAM building whatever the frick they want? Or perhaps a balance of the two, where skills need to be equipped like in Tactics Ogre? I feel 4 skills is too little, far too little in fact.
I will be personally designing the enemy field teams to make them as overpowered as possible, but enemies are limited to the same skills and restrictions the player is. As it should be.
Also wondering if 12v12 is the way to go, and how many weapons should each class on average be able to wield? I have 34 non-mage classes and about the same amount of weapon types, ranging from 2h, to 1h, to ranged. Most classes can equip 5-8 different weapons, and weapons have different damage calculations where different weapons work better vs different armor/stat types.
3 weapons per unit? That seems like a lot. Do you have mages or is it only weapon related skills?
There's not much specialization if everyone can do everything, so if it's 12 v 12 it would be akin to 12 generic infantry vs 12 generic infantry, instead of 3 archers, 3 healers, 4 frontline, 2 mortars for example
I haven't added mages yet but there will likely be 16 mage classes as well.
The 3 weapons is max, most units would likely prefer a shield in their offhand while the sidearm is more for protection if your main weapon is disabled/broken/stolen. Also a way for archers to gut shank someone if they get too close.
Yea that is kind of what I was worried about. The classes do have fairly unique skills so each does perform its own function, but there are also for example 3 archer variant classes. Archer, Marksman (crossbow specialist), Ranger (Hybrid archer/dual wielder, can wear bow on back as a sidearm. Several versions of knight type classes too, one for polearms/spears, another is paladin and has monk/cleric type skills, standard knight for defensive protection and guarding/rampart aura, myrmidon which is a tank sword & board disabler, warrior who is dual wielder or can use 1h weapon + shortbow, and juggernaut which is basically a mix of the FFT knight and the tactics ogre Terror Knight.
Not so worried about too many classes, I think this is a nice touch, but just worried about what you mentioned, the overlap due to subclassing, as well as giving player option paralysis from too many choices. Of course, skills being learned as you progress through the game will slowly introduce new techniques to the player, so maybe it wouldn't be too overwhelming. FFT gave you quite a bit of skills to choose from per character. I am essentially mixing the concept of making super units with a large field, half FFT and half TO.
Yes, this is too much for ttrpgs. Id keep It to two weapons, main and side.
Only main weapons should get a skillset of 2 skills
Drop the side classes and give one class skill per class.
And ill be honest, I know I just cut a Ton of things and still, this would be too much for me, 34 classes is a lot of bookkeeping to do, but with less skills to keep this looks a little more manageable to me. Id also cut down the damage calculations to weapons classes, making them differ more by skill. So, for example, claymores and halberds hit armor similarly, but detain different skills.
About 12v12, I think its a fair number. Classes should hold few weapons, seeing that there are many of them, and since there are few skills to take, make them really varied.
Awesome thank you for the feedback anon. Curious for other's thoughts as well. Will prob release a demo here before the years end.
Brother, im sorry, I read ttrpg instead of trpg.
Since Ita a video game, I think you could expand these ammounts a little. Still, the original is too much.
Id do no subclasses, and keep the weapons scheme similar: two skills per weapons, secondary weapons dont get skills, I like the Idea for standardized sides by class.
What id change however is giving each class about 5 progressive skills. Not sure how high do you Hope levels to get, but I think a starting skill + 4 skills until Max level are a good call.
Thats of course not considering mages, to which id suggest less skills, but a higher ammount of magicks to learn
The rest Id keep the same suggestions. Sorry about the confusion.
Post It here when its released, id love to play It.
I disagree, I think one subclass is fine. He said he'd make the missions really hard.
Not sure about the rest other than 3 weapons being a bit much
I think subclasses with so many classes Will defeat the purpose of individual classes.
Take for example a mage/fighter hybrid class, How will It compare to a fighter with mage subclass? I think subclasses work better with very few classes. Since he will probably have about 50, id suggest no subclasses.
hm perchance
mage + fighter would have more skills to choose from, whereas mage/fighter hybrid would only have some of the skills to choose from both.
But yeah it would get confusing and perhaps hard to balance.
Pathfinder kingmaker is a game where you can do this though.
Awesome thank you, yea a lot is still up in the air and I haven't even started story building yet, just fleshing out classes and skills and making sure the battle system works + AI isn't moronic. Making good progress on all this so should start making some ground here towards an actual alpha release soon.
I think keeping some skills passives is a great way to go about keeping class diversity without overwhelming the player.
One type of skill that I think is really cool that I haven't ever seen utilized in TRPGs are attacks that end in stances. For example the Warrior class has a skill called Fool's Guard, which performs a standard attack and after the attack the Warrior ends turn in Fool's Pose, which increases Crit rate and Parry by 18.75% each. Warrior also has a passive ability where all parried attacks end in a guaranteed counter, so these two synergize together. While a class like Knight instead has Disciplined Strike, where he performs an attack and ends in Defending pose, which increases Block and Defense by 12.5-18.75% each. Lancer and Soldier have other variations on these skills. While a class like Juggernaut has some melee dark sword hp stealing attacks mixed with a fear type aura (Lament of the Dead), as well as weapon and armor breaks + melee don't move/don't act skills as well. Kind of an OP unit but vulnerable to sword and board type characters like the Myrmidon who can disable melee fighters with a net at range or other battle techniques up close. Very rock paper scissors in a way mixed with chess at the same time. I am looking forward to playing it myself and building uber boss special maps for skilled TRPG players to try to counterbreak my own broken strategies the AI will play for me as the enemy team
Pic related, Fool's Guard, an actual swordplay stance. Taking a lot of inspiration from real weapons and techniques and plan to have battles that resemble historical ones like Marathon, Thermopylae, Siege of Constantinople etc
I really like these historically inspired ideias and you seem to have a pretty Nice balance in mind.
How will items work in this game? Will there be a linear progression of better items becoming available as the game progress or will units have to scavenge for Magical items, rare weapons, armors etc?
About campaign structure, are you aiming for something more linear or a more sandbox skirmish type?
I am thinking to limit characters to carrying 4 individual items to battle, but they can sacrifice the sidearm slot for a satchel which will increase item carrying capacity by 2-4. Some classes may also get a passive bonus here like Alchemist perhaps.
As far as healing %s and such, not sure but I may want to go with a crafting system of sorts? I was thinking % of max based heals for potions and such so they are useful throughout the whole game and not too OP if you get them too early.
As far as equipment, I have light, medium, and heavy versions for armors, shields, and headgear, and haven't really thought of much outside of that. I have considered a system like Diablo 2 where items come with +1 or such bonuses making two versions of the same item slightly different. Not sure. But one thing I do know for certain is that I want there to be lots of sidegrades, rather than straight upgrades. Status debuff weapons with less damage but potentially a better option depending on your build and battle goals.
For structure, I do want there to be branching paths, some sandbox elements but there will be a story. I want there to be no "good guys and bad guys", but rather different factions with different philosophies, and the player can decide which factions to support and oppose.
Was even considering making 5 different main character starting points, where you start as the base class which represents each faction: (Warrior/Rogue/Soldier/Scholar/Acolyte), while reaching the advanced classes (Buccaneer, Samurai, Seeker, Nomad, Assassin) will require the player to have visited different faction territory to gain such classmarks.
I find faction play very insteresting, and I think your Idea sound pretty cool, specially alongside a more sandbox-y narrative. Of course that would make It so that more complex storyline arent exactly possible, but nonetheless, It certainly makes for more interesting gameplay, and id rather take that.
I like the Idea for items as well, sidegrades in these sorts of games to me sound a lot more adequate, so I think its really the right decision too.
Any chances of a system of Dungeon exploration or something similar? I really think Tactics games could go well with these, maybe in first person style, or something similar to what TO does, but maybe instead of sequential battles you get some simple exploration in between.
I haven't come to a decision on that yet. While it would be a lot easier from a dev perspective to do it TO or FFT style, and it does fit the mold, I do enjoy some on map exploration as well. I am pretty confident I can autistically make an awesome combat system that really taps into strategy and create an engaging game this way, but I am not sure how well I can handle the traditional part of RPGs that is the exploration and discovery process.
As far as actually doing this from the technical perspective, it wouldn't be difficult as well. But in so far as to make it engaging, or as engaging as the combat/party/character building, this I am not confident in.
I would like to do so I suppose, but I just am unsure if that is what the player base would want. I honestly don't mind the TO/FFT approach, but in the end I want to go the route that maximizes enjoyment and replayability.
So I answer with a firm 'Maybe'.
Are there any good TRPG type games that do this?
On another note, I noticed One Vision has a LOT of status debuffs attached to weapons and attacks. I am also going this route, but I want to hear from someone who has played OV, is it too much? Should status debuffs from skills be rare, or is it more engaging/strategic to allow multiple debuffs coming from the attack skills found in every character/weapon type?
One more thing, about the 2x weapons + sidearm, 2-handers have AOE type melee attacks (arc slashes), so while they prevent using 2 weapons for additional skills, they have their own bonuses outside of just more raw damage. 1h weapons have more versatility and often have double hits (75% damage per swing), as well as some movement abilities (dash slash, lunge), or even throw for javelins/1h axes/knives, they don't carry the same AOE or damage potential as the big boys.
Something else that I added which I haven't seen done elsewhere is a status buff + debuff which increases or reduces the chance of landing a successful debuff. This is the Initiative stat and it also helps bypass block/parry, and when attacking an enemy from behind you get an additional Initiative buff.
Just wish I knew how to get the AI to preferably attack from behind. Will get to that later I suppose.
It had been so long between playing each version I had completely lost context on what had changed twice