We've seen "bosses" swapped for player-like characters just with good AI, like Q3 Xaero, or UT Xan Kriegor ages ago. Just a regular opponent that is on the same level as the player, but can fight in a challenging way. And here we are in the age when AI can write entire code for a game, yet devs can't do game AI, and instead we still get 80s-style bosses with gimmicks, large health pools and Simon says gameplay where you dodge attacks for most of the fight to get a small window to do damage, rinse and repeat. How are people still finding this fun? It's been done to death. Is exploiting patterns really the peak experience gamers want?
 Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
 DMT Has Friends For Me Shirt $21.68 |
Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
haha it looks like a penis monster
>it's good because it's le hard
>Why are boss fights still a thing?
Because the game would be boring and have no incentive otherwise.
>Because the game would be boring and have no incentive otherwise.
Totally false. If you'd just have a "normal" enemy as a "boss" but one that can do the same stuff as you, use the same tactics efficiently, react to your "patterns" and just be as good as you, but with the same abilities and limitations, only way better at the game, that would still be a cool challenge and depending on your playstyle, a different experience with each fight. Think something like Street Fighter 3rd Strike if you insist on SP only, playing as Ken, who's more fun of a fight? Ryu or Gill?
It's called pvp and most gamers get absolutely btfo and cry about it in games. So nobody really wants what op is asking for.
You mean like a pvp game? Fricking moron
>DOOD WOULDN'T GAMES BE BETTER IF EVERYTHING WAS A FIGHTING GAME AND THE AI JUST READ YOUR INPUTS MORE EGREGIOUSLY
Shut the frick up, moron.
DUDE.. THAT'S A GOOD ONE, BUT HEAR ME OUT... VIDEO GAME.. WOULD BE MORE AWESOMER... IF YOU COULD DO ANYTHING
>Boss walks forward jump on him and squash him like a goomba
>Final boss walks forward but doesn't fall off cliffs and takes two jumps to squash
Boss fights are the most boring parts of nearly every game. This is just as much due to developer ineptitude as it is just the majority of boss concepts and typical practices for boss design that have been around for decades are outright bad (yet they keep being used).
Unless you go all out on the spectacle, give the boss a ton of moves and only a minor health boost over generic enemies (or establish a series of scenery changes during a setpiece in multiple phases), the boss fight devolves into a tedious whittling down a big healthbar while managing a routine pattern you have to see several times over.
This Contra boss
is just about the sweet spot for an extremely simple boss before it would feel like a fricking chore, taken out in under two cycles. Even if you lost a guy or two, leading to possibly seeing one more cycle, it's still short enough that it keeps a sense of intensity.
just play a different genre if you don't like it.
Agreed, bosses are too video gamey and we should've done away with them a decade ago for the betterment of the medium as an art form.
This, we already got rid of score, lives, game overs, and player choice, bosses are among the last things left before we go to the final route of just not having no player input period.
Next your gonna say you want every FG to be like Among Us Arena but without the sus button
Because that would be dumb otherwise. Imagine a Zelda game, you go through a dungeon, and they give you a piece of a Triforce/McGuffin at the end w/o any real challenge stopping you. Imagine going through Ganon's castle, and Ganon just surrenders the Triforce of Power to you when you reach him.
Would you rather deal with aimbots that die in 1hit but kill you 99/100 times before you even see them? I dunno how you imagine designers are supposed to create a challenging fight that's not ridiculously unfair yet showcases how powerful an opponent is.
I just posted to good examples of how this can be done. Quake 3 bots on nightmare are basically aimbot opponents, yet you can still beat them by just being good at proper use of game fundamentals.
Frick off, Todd.
>Imagine a Zelda game
You mean something just as old as a concept as Contra and doing the same pattern 30 years down the line, not really evolving or using the benefits of technology, because that would not be Zelda? Which is exactly what I argue against? So yeah, let's just ignore all tech progress, and have an enemy that is overpowered, but does the same pattern over and over again, so the player can eventually learn it, circumvent it and win. Frick all the tech that's been done to improve interactive entertainment. Here's another take. Remember how in 2001 Red Faction had destructible environments? And how it took the industry 7 years to make a game that made use of the concept? Well, let's not use the idea in any other franchise, cause it would break the tightly designed FPS gameplay loop that people have been fond of since 1993.
Here it is. The dumbest take in Ganker
>Shit boss desing
Dark souls games
>kino boss design games
Metroid prime 2
Metroid dread
Jet force gemini
Shadow of the colossus
i want more games where boss fights are actualy events and you have to figure out how to defeat them.
Dogshit humanoid or huge moronic Black person with huge weapon that can be defeated by spamming attacks and abusing iframe rolls are fricking boring.
Gas all soulsBlack folk.
Rent free
Constantly shitting on Dark Souls for contrarian reasons is the most pleb thing, Dark Souls is not a perfect game by any means but claiming the bosses in Jet Force Gemini are better is dumb as all hell.
I had Jet Force Gemini as a kid so I view it with rose tinted glasses, still I can barely remember the bosses. I agree Dark Souls is pretty much a glorified rythm game with the iframe abusing but that has it's own charm, things that are simple are not inherently bad.
Write Black person more, maybe your arguments become persuasive then.
Gitgudgay
>AI can write entire code for a game
Well theres your problem, AI may be able to replicate artslop, but programming a functional coherent codebase is beyond current AI.
>functional coherent codebase
LMAO, I bet you flip burgers for a living and just read Ganker for hot takes like this.
>You mean like a pvp game? Fricking moron
Yes, that is exactly what I mean, but here's the kicker, it's not actually PvP so you don't have to deal with tards like you while playing.
If you're suggesting to play and FG against AI for an imitation of a human oponent, then you clearly have zero idea how these games work.
Where are the AI games?
>they're closed source!
Lmaooooooo
Ideally a boss should be a test of the cumulative skills and knowledge the game has provided the player up until that point.
Play a 1v1 genre like fighting games if you want human like opponents.
Set-piece challenges are fun.
>We've seen "bosses" swapped for player-like characters just with good AI, like Q3 Xaero, or UT Xan Kriegor ages ago. Just a regular opponent that is on the same level as the player, but can fight in a challenging way.
That's still a boss.
Bosses serve to test the players knowledge of mechanics and memory of the controls. Things went to shit the moment bosses were just normal enemy but more HP from lazy devs. The gimmicks in a good game are often the key element the boss is IQ checking you on.
kino
Well giving a boss theme to a really strong player would be kino but about the patterns thing homie thats what every game is even pvp is just about trying to find out your opponents patterns and idiosyncrasies all the training mode and labbing stuff is just a prerequisite because of how complex some games can get
Imagine a game where enemy ai changes patterns making it more unpredictable and interesting. I agree with op. That sounds based.
>And here we are in the age when AI can write entire code for a game
yeah, pong tier games
Boss fights have always been tests of endurance and learning the boss's patterns. What you are asking for is basically like PVP and does not make for a memorable fight
Boss fights are a thing because they have kickass boss fight music.
>Weaker stat wise than everything else in the game including basic enemies
>Megalovania is heavely implied to be the player/Chara's theme not his
So was he just a normal enemy who said trying his damnedest to stall the player by screwing the rules? If so then souvl
Bosses are fun and require more to be done right.
Because they are fun and if it isn't fun then what's the point?
you're right, I want a boss monster with Xan Kriegor AI
mirror fights aren't fun, downing skyscraper-sized monsters is awesome
It's because most gamers are animals.
Humans came this far from slaying beasts bigger than them so no, we'll never get tired doing what made us successful
>Humans came this far from slaying beasts bigger than them
Deer? Cows?
Giant hairy elephants Black person
AI can't make a game, not good code anyways. better than you for sure.
Enemy AI and AI are not the same thing
> muh human like ai
90% of the time a free win, 5% of the time you get dumpstered, and the rest is a good match people actually would enjoy
This is part of why FGs and MP games are dogshit for consistent challenge.
It's cinematic. Games without bosses are so fricking forgettable.
>when you OD on contrarian pills
overcoming adversity deepens game experience.
Excellent authenticity.
Not a hint of sarcasm.
In-depth discussion points.
Incredulous enough to receive attention.
Offensive enough to demand a response.
Perfect bait.
boss fights are the best part of any game
wt