Why aren’t you making your own game? You only have to know C#.
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Why arent you making your own game? You only have to know C#.
Why aren’t you making your own game? You only have to know C#.
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what the frick would i want to do that
I only know python
Joke language. Write in C.
C++ is better for games, virtually ever game engine is written in C++ or C. Similarly most graphics are done in C family languages.
kek. you aren't a real programmer
Unity uses C#
that's a big part of the reason why unity games are so poorly optimized
lol no. both .net and jvm are perfectly capable and run their programs well, just a bit slower than programs written in c/c++. yuzu is written in c++ while ryuujinx is c#. both are head to head in performance despite yuzu having more funding than ryuujinx.
it's more than quality of developers and software in general has gone down. very few people actually care about performance and benchmark their code which is why you have people like muratori and blow autistically screech about it every time they see something wrong with the software they use.
yeah, the number of devs who have never even opened the profiler is a fricking embarrassment to the industry
I do it every session AND have only 1 memory leak that I'm postponing because I want to see the feature working first.
>.net and jvm are perfectly capable and run their programs well
unless there is an update that breaks compatibility between your bytecode and the virtual machine, then the end user is fricked with no way of fixing things
>very few people actually care about performance
maybe they don't at whatever bumfrick microshit deadend software house you work at but for websites that get real traffic computer time is money
even if you don't care about performance there are zero advantages to crap like java nowadays
>maybe they don't at whatever bumfrick microshit deadend software house you work at but for websites that get real traffic computer time is money
Who, like Microsoft Azure, #2 cloud provider in the world? You know Netflix uses Node and Python? And that Facebook uses PHP?
Small- and medium-fry businesses tend to not give a frick about performance but none of the C# shops I've ever worked at have had any trouble serving tens of thousands of requests per second on modest hardware.
If you're concerned about performance in Unity then watch your draw calls, which most indie devs could hardly give a frick about, and watch your heap allocations. Blaming the language is nodev-tier.
the JVM is so fast that people write new languages for it
i'd be interested in seeing more LISP stuff in games but clojure especially is only used by webshitters today
Unlike Common Lisp, which is truly multi-paradigm and possibly the most flexible and powerful language there is, Clojure is hellbent on being a functional language, which makes sense for things it was intended for (backends, where taking the ability to use OOP away from morons on a language level is beneficial), but for things that are inherently all about state and changing it, like games, functional approach is like kicking dead whales down the beach - and in the end you get abysmal performance.
It's a shame, because, unlike other Lisps, Clojure has a pretty good ecosystem (mostly "borrowed" from Java and JS, but yeah) and great reach, as it runs on the JVM and CLR, can be transpiled to JS and has like a dozen of other implementations in various languages for various target platforms - and also is simply good itself, but the self-imposed restriction to FP is very limiting.
I agree, and that's why I dropped using it. Functional-tards have this idea that its good to be functional, out of this idea that, you ought to know what changes are going to happen and constrain them. Btu the problem is that, on something like a complex game, I will have no idea in general what changes are going to end up happening in the end, I'm not a fortune teller who can account for everything, I need to be able to just tell the system to randomly manipulate whatever the frick I want and have it not care because it just affects the current game state.
i dont think that matters
the physics engine and the renderer are all written in C++ (i think)
thats the only thing that needs optimization
the systems and mechanics and the gameplay and UI of the game are not that resourse intensive to require optimization.
It does, which is why Unity has complex, unfinished, and unwieldy systems like DOTS and jobs.
WOOOOOOOOW
WE HAVE A CERTIFIED GAME DEV HERE WHO KNOW WHAT HES TALKING ABOUT!!!
Yeah and Unity is a shitty engine used by poor moronic people to make shitty games.
True
doesn't unreal use some bastard version of c++ with cancer exclusive syntax?
does that make it any better than unity for AA tier games?
i thought a lot of microshit or contraxtors use c# k
>i thought a lot of microshit or contraxtors use c# k
they do. banking and government use them quite a bit. it's not going away anytime soon.
Stop larping, you gay. You’re not Manfred Trenz.
Don't worry its written in C so you're still technically coding in C since most of the time you're just calling C functions. Go ahead and put C on your resume and when asked about it, tell them you call C functions via Pythonic APIs to allow for easier end user projects
Python is great if you want to work outside the game's industry.
Like, no one uses Python for anything other than porn VNs in the game-sphere, but in Networking, Cybersec and other back-end fields Python is basically THE language you need to know (there are other languages you'll want to learn too, but Python is considered the most important because it's readability means even actual morons can tell what your back-end code is doing).
Try Godot
Having started with C and C++ it's incredible how gorilla moron easy Python is
having started with C and C++ as well python doesn't even feel like programming
I just write shit and it just works
>but muh indentation
this is your brain on python
Coding isn't the problem, art is.
3d modelling is hard as frick.
You could make a renpy porn "games" and earn easy 6k a month by doing jack shit.
Theres crazy money to be made and basically no competition.
JavaScript is a real man’s language
JavaScript is the ESL of programming languages.
that is Java sirs
And Python?
python is highly structured and consistent
javascript unstructured and inconsistent
good enough for the James Webb telescope
didn't they shit just get hacked?
I'm making my game in HTML5/Javascript. I was heavily considering Unity, but considering how UI focused the game is I might as well go with something piss easy.
I just wish I knew how to change the font rendering to something aliased
make it in three.js or babylon.js
>Javascript game
good luck to ya m8
I had a 'Computer Graphics' class that was done mostly with JS examples. A lot of position based dynamics, ropes, gravity, crowd avoidance, and more shit that I still don't remember how to do.
>CSS rule exists but is supported by two different syntaxes on Webkit/Firefox, and only works on macOS
Gotta love webdev. Make a font atlas or use a pixel font?
c# is a terrible language. it's basically impossible to optimize game written in c#.
unironicly what are some good starter books to buy to learn? want to make a 3d platformer in unity in at least 3 years
Buy The C Programming Language by Brian Kernighan and Dennis Ritchie (RIP).
2nd eddition good? 28 bucks for hard copy is insanely cheap.
That will do just fine.
taking this all into account will report back in a year with a screen shot of this post and a prototype build of the game
just use library genesis
C++ primer
other anons clearly didnt see you write Unity. find a book on c#, not c or c++.
Unity and C# are worthless amateur stuff. C is a much better language and is far more versatile.
If you're starting from scratch, do codecademy for basics, then soscsrpg.
Someone who actually knows what they're talking about will probably have better info, but these got me started.
I can't bump this enough
This is a GREAT book for beginners in programming and dont get discourage by LE GAMING references, he really explains vital concepts well.
The only gripe I have is that his solutions are sometimes overcomplicated as shit but its a minor one.
just buy courses on Udemy when they're on sale
I've spent like ten years with C# and I've made some kusoge, but nowadays I make my money doing webdev so I spend more time on JS and SQL than C#.
Man, I want to go back to making games but I'm lazy and I definitely won't get anything done while I'm still employed.
I am to practice. I'm gonna graduate to a better language when I understand this well enough.
start with python or c, they are easy to learn
once you understand them try c++
don't waste your time with c#. it's basically only used by unity and unity won't be around forever
Yeah, probably gonna jump to c++ next, I just want to finish the thing I'm making to solidify the basics, I don't think it's worthwhile to pick up another language inbetween
once you get some experience learning new language is easy, especially languages like c#. you could probably learn them in a day if you were skilled enough
You know what, you actually have convinced me to scrap the thing, it was an inefficient practice piece anyway, and I was gonna move onto C++ later, so why not do it right away.
>you have to know an abomination lang that rests between a web scripting one and a compiled one
>memory management and coding for performance is scawwy
making my own engine in C++ and im going to frick your mom, sister and GF.
In a few years when you realize you're dumb for thinking this, remember that I made this post. I accept your future self's (You) in advance. Thank you.
my game will be easily reverse engineered and recompiled in the future for architectures then. can you say the same for the slop you create in "babby's first game engine"? ill give you a pass if you make it in godot, because you actually need skill and grit to make anything decent with it, plus it's FOSS. i also dont need to make it big. making a game is a hobby for me.
php is still the widely used backend in current year. and rails devs are so rare that you basically need a pulse and some prior, non-ruby webdev experience to find a job. asp.net/blazor jobs arent that bad. a friend of mine makes good money maintaining and refactoring VB.net codebases.
>asp.net/blazor jobs arent that bad. a friend of mine makes good money maintaining and refactoring VB.net codebases.
VB.NET is fricking ancient shit, though. He's probably working with like .NET Framework 4.5 WebForms apps.
I don't know many people who use Blazor I'm one of a very few I know who has actually done professional development with both Blazor WebAssembly and Blazor Server. That tech has way too much of an uphill climb to compete with JavaScript. I don't get why so many startup bros like it so much. WASM has a horrendous startup time and Server is a pain to get working with slower connections.
>making my own engine in C++
Is it so common to make your own engine? I always assumed that the normal thing for aspiring developers was to use one of the existing engines, and that to create an engine you have to be a company.
there's nothing wrong with making your own engine
but there's no way in hell that guy is actually going to release a game
The cool part about making your own engine is that you won't need to make a game after because you won't have time to make it.
Not much reason to unless you have specific needs, or just wanna learn how to make a game from the ground-up.
I'm a mathlet so I leverage graphics and physics from SDL2 and Box2D respectively. Everything else, from parsing spritesheets to proc gen for my side-scrolling perspective levels is my own.
>I'm a mathlet so I leverage graphics and physics from SDL2 and Box2D respectively
this means you're sane, anon. only start making your own libs out of absolute necessity. i know it gets tiring to hear, but you dont need to reinvent the wheel.
>you dont need to reinvent the wheel
A phrase I haven't heard in a while, but always need to remind myself of. It's this kind of philosophy that makes this all possible
it can be fun to reinvent in the wheel once in a while to see how you'd do it, but don't reinvent the wheel if it's going to production
>That time I tried to use Vulkan, and in a semester
>somehow got single 3d model spinning in a static viewport
>Literally no knowledge of linear algebra,
>VBO
>UBOs
>frag/vert shaders
>MVP matrices
>plenty of other pipeline shit I'm forgetting
using SDL and other basic libraries isn't reinventing the wheel
if ur writing a library to draw graphics to screen ur trying to reinvent the tools to make a wheel as well the craft of working with whatever material you are trying to make a wheel out of, a wheel is generations away from what you are working on
Read that post again
no, I read it
I am saying that the anon saying its good to not reinvent the wheel is understating it
if he was writing that stuff he would be doing FAR more than reinventing the wheel, he would be reinventing how to carve and shape wood into a wheel or something and the tools to do so
C and its variants are absolute fricking shit
Most moronic take ever posted on the internet. C is foundational to all of modern computing.
So what's good then?
Fortran
I am, bit by bit.
My favorite aspect to work on is music, though. I love composing.
https://voca.ro/1iLOOP8HlfXJ
>https://voca.ro/1iLOOP8HlfXJ
what program do you use to make this? FL?
Yeah, I love making music. Its probably my best skill currently
what do you recommend to someone that want to start making music but don`t know shit about it?
join church choir
https://www.udemy.com/course/music-theory-complete/
https://jstuff.wordpress.com/jbridge/
https://musical-artifacts.com/artifacts?formats=sf2&tags=soundfont
https://archive.org/details/500-soundfonts-full-gm-sets
Literally search every single question on YouTube and Google (how do I make Nintendo NES Music? Atari Music? Pokemon Music? LoFi Beats? HOW DO I MAKE MUSIC ON COMPUTER? etc).
Any video game musician has an email, you can simply ask them what VSTs they use and how they learned to make music.
Also think of songs you like, research what genres they are and literally search "HOW TO MAKE genre or song MUSIC?"
I do get regularly confused with digital music production, the companies seem to obfuscate their products to make things hard. With graphics I know I can go Photoshop or GIMP or aseprite or Krita, with engines I know my options are Unity, GODOT, Unreal, GMS, but with music there feels like so much proprietary and freemium shit that its difficult to navigate. There is the DAW, and already with that I get lost between the open source ones that only work on Linux vs the Industry Standard that only works on Mac. And im supposed to source my own... plugins? And then theres the question of whether I want my own midi keyboard. Navigating this space has felt a little labyrinthine, is what im saying.
Just pirate Ableton and be done with it
Fl studio
Third party plug ins
Done.
I will recommend you the same path I went
>Start with beebox.co
>Learn scales
>Play around with the sites mixing tools, i.e filters, reverbs, echo, layering tools, etc.
>Once you've made a few songs, pick up FL (pirate it or buy it whatever)
>Learn 3 things to start: Channel Rack, Mixer, and the Piano Roll
Beepbox is nice because it lets you play with super basic tools to start. It gives you everything at once, but all of those things are super simple and dumbed down. You can make some nice midi-songs with it, and it additionally has some solid range for fuller-sounds. It'll give you a strong foothold on all the concepts you'll learn gradually, so you'll be vaguely-familiar with all of them as you encounter them piece by piece.
If you want some serious teaching, I'd recommend Udemy's music composition section where there's a lot of 12-30 hour courses that teach various aspects of music, like scales, music theory, sound design, and specific genres of music if you want to make those. Those are all like 10-20 dollars each which is super fair in my opinion.
I'd avoid the big "general" courses though, the ones that claim to "teach you everything you need to know". You want to learn specific things in detail, not small glances at everything.
Lastly, just listen to a lot of your favorite soundtracks and pick them apart, what makes them sound good? Study your favorite musicians and pick up on their patterns, adapt those ideas, and form your own style.
My big inspirations are Mudeth, Chris Christodolou, David Wise, and Ben Prunty.
https://voca.ro/15F1B54J5i7p
>beebox co
frick
I meant beepbox.co my bad
My man’s also using BeepBox like a gigachad.
get a cheap keyboard learn some basic music theory and start fricking around
comfy
Tell me/show me more about your game anon.
What's that song used for?
Its my swamp theme.
Making a game inspired by Terraria, but making it 3D and a lot more immersive and big
Do you have any videos/images? any kind of preview at all?
Why do you ask
Sounds cool, and I'm curious
What's the difference between C/C++ and C#?
C and C++ are among the most important languages ever made and are used widely in every single OS since Unix. C# is used in one of the worst gaming engine ever made, and that's about it.
c is an efficient compiled language that has been around forever
c++ is a similar language that extends c by adding classes and some other stuff
c# is a language microsoft created in the 90s to compete with java. it runs in bytecode rather than being compiled meaning it is inefficient and a b***h to work with. it is somewhat elegant and therefore it is popular with newbie programmers
the only thing c/c++ have in common with c# is bracket{} notation
none of them are particularly alike, aside from C++ and C# being essentially spawned from C
C
>low-level (typically seen in firmware, embedded code, operating systems, etc.)
>not object oriented, memory management is automatic
C++
>object oriented and procedural
>programs don't go through an intermediary at runtime, so they're very fast and that's why gamedevs use it
C#
>purely object oriented
>handles memory management safer thna C++, but is slower as a consequence
>is literally java but fixed
C
>low-level (typically seen in firmware, embedded code, operating systems, etc.)
>not object oriented, memory management is automatic
homie do you not know what malloc, calloc, memset, and so on are for?
I memory allocated in your mum last night
how can 1 person be so fricking wrong about every damn thing?
C is a low level language that requires direct management of memory and gives some of the highest degrees of control you could want, its used for everything that cares about performance
C++ is C but with extra stuff bolted on, hence the ++, its literally C, you can write C, and there are basically no C compilers made or used in the last 20+ years, just C/C++ compilers and u just don't use the C++ part if u want to write C
its C with objects and more modern stuff added to it on top, its that simple
C# is java but less shit
its performance is better than java, but its not a high performance language like C/C++
have some basic options for memory management and doesn't just completely wall you out (like java) but also doesn't allow you to take full control if you desire (like C/C++)
its a really solid language for most types of applications if u just want something that runs fairly well, is easy to write for, has excellent support & documentation, can do a lot of stuff
but its made by microsoft
and don't use it for games
>C
>not object oriented
>memory management is automatic
First is definitely possible in C if you're any good and C's roll your own OOP is honestly better than C++'s abomination of it.
Second I assume is a typo
>mfw one ritualposting autist is singlehandedly saving the game industry
>learn web dev with ruby
>almost had a rails job but had to settle for a few that are .net
unlucky. Glad I'm not a video game dev though
> c sharp
>c hash
>c pound
>c number
>c numeral
It's actually C++++. The # symbol was intended to mean two ++s stacked on each other. That's the joke.
KNEEL
is the source code available?
I don't know how to learn compsci. I don't understand how you are supposed to study for it.
People just say to bang your head against the wall and gain intuition, but 99% of the time I am staring blank at an easy leetcode question not knowing where to even start.
i don't even have any skills
because coding doesnt keep me hooked compared to art.
Funnily enough, I'm a pro DP, and coding is just the change of pace I needed to stay motivated in my actual job as well.
DP? hot
Yeah i got some basics of state machines and buffers lined up, and now I'm realising a limiting factor is my ability to generate art assets. I want tight control over attack animations to get the frame data right and also to sell the attacks, and that requires more art skills that coding atm. Been brushing up anatomy and perspective for that purpose. Will be trying to do a character sketch a day in September.
I was genuinely shocked when I found out Stardew Valley had been entirely coded from the ground up using C# by literally one guy.
Honestly, it's a very good language to go with for making games since it's basically Java if people still used Java for anything other than phone apps.
Being object oriented just makes it stupidly easy to code games with.
I'd rather develop phone apps for a six-figure salary than to slave away as a vidya dev making a barely livable wage
how about you develop some fat breasts and a nice ass you bawd
amazing
>First language I learned is Java
>Immediately after I had spent 6 months learning it I found out fricking no one uses Java for anything anymore because for basically every possible application now there are better options.
Frick.
Fricking dead language how did I let myself get scammed into learning this dumb shit.
>Why aren’t you making your own game?
Because I want to do it in the most insanely autistic way with SDL and C. I'm currently figuring out how to make pong in it.
Shit, is SDL that popular?
yes, it offers so many different things; the blitting part is just a small subset of its capabilities. some programs use it's windowing support, most emulators i've used use it for controller support. there's audio support too. of course there's support for graphics API contexts.
I know no one cares but I'm gonna post it anyway, that is my debug for this, which also has debug lines for physics bodies.
With roughly 8000 static bodies and rendering the entire map to a texture and clipping it from, I max out at roughly 200MB of memory usage. Hopefully it won't go too high or I will need to look at how I store the map again.
Nice, can you post more about it?
When I've got a single enemy to fight, I'll come back to post more about. My proc gen still has some work to go before I can consider gameplay mechanics, but since it is a box2d world i do have gravity, movement, and a jump that will launch you if you're holding against a wall as you jump and keep holding the jump key, which is obviously a bug but may be re-worked as a feature
idk, Valve funded/co-authored it and all the nintendo decomps and emulators use it.
SDL is one of the most popular libraries for game development ever made. Even ignoring all of the 2D graphics features, it's the easiest way to get a cross-platform window with OpenGL, though I think GLFW has gotten popular due to it being lighter and newer. It's so prevalent that Steam provides it by default on Linux
What are the limitations of stuff like GLFW and SDL? When do I want to stop looking at those APIs and start looking at DirectX/Vulkan level stuff? If I wanna make FFVII-IX or Mario Sunshine stuff, can some dude's SDL-based rasterer work fine? Do Switch games like Mario Odyssey and BOTW also use something like SDL? They have to, right? Cuz the GPUs on the Switch are some ARM cores or something.
SDL is good if you want an "all-in-one" library that provides everything you'd need for 2D game development. GLFW is more of a way to bootstrap OpenGL or Vulkan in a cross-platform way, as OpenGL/Vulkan don't know what a window is, don't know what inputs are, what sound is, etc, so something like GLFW or SDL provides that scaffolding. If you're looking to do 3D game development and have no previous experience, though, it's going to be a bit of an uphill battle, and going with Vulkan over OpenGL would make that hill 90 degrees.
I am. Doing some C# diplomas financed by my workplace as upskilling my current coding with the goal of being able to make my own mini apps and games as hobby.
We learning switches, pointers, and arrays next so my code isn't YandereDev IFTHENELSE ad infinitum.
Was yanderedev's problem even anywhere close to pointers and memory management? I thought, amongst other things, his problem was nested if-else hell and really inefficient lookup methods. Which admittedly arrays and switches do solve.
Yeah I remember reading about switchers and arrays being better ways than his nested IF ELSE hell however he has a game that runs which is more than 90% of people. So that's something.
I want to do that. I have some ideas and I am doing some documents while also revising as I learn better ways to code.
It's really exciting even if nothing comes from it and start all over haha.
1. I am
2. I'm using UE so I need C++ knowledge
3. I'm sculpting in Blender
4. AI will code for me anyway
I am making my own game. idk much about game dev but plz don't laugh
It's kinda like rimworld
>plz don't laugh
i won't because i'm fairly certain most people surely can't do it. i'm rooting for you anon, keep on at it.
>unless there is an update that breaks compatibility between your bytecode and the virtual machine, then the end user is fricked with no way of fixing things
this is such a weird thing to complain about. they have far worse things wrong with them but this is true when upgrading almost anything.
>maybe they don't at whatever bumfrick microshit deadend software house you work at but for websites that get real traffic computer time is money
idk if you've used modern software but most of them suck ass. windows 11, modern games with their poor performance, etc. just because the company you work for care about those things doesn't make it true for the rest of the world. when the competition is high, sure time is money. but the products you use have no real alternatives, you can do frick all.
>even if you don't care about performance there are zero advantages to crap like java nowadays
nobody is starting new projects in java and i haven't claimed otherwise. but not every company has neither the luxury nor the talent needed to hop platforms and languages like discord or vercel. which brings me back to the point i made earlier about the quality of software going down.
keep it at anon!
personal projects is what i would recommend. make something that you'd proud of at the moment.
glfw, sdl are programs that let you create graphics contexts and windows. you use them to program with graphics apis you mentioned. sdl's blitting capabilities are pretty limited so i'd say start with a more powerful engine that abstracts away the low level stuff for you before jumping to one of the graphics apis. games like botw and smo use nintendo sdk and they use their own set of standard libraries. also go for something like 2d graphics before jumping into things that are way more complex for a beginner.
>keep it at anon!
frick
https://github.com/OpenRCT2/OpenRCT2
here ya go
>this is such a weird thing to complain about
no one responded to that post because it's the ramblings of an obvious undergrad student
yeah, it was pretty obvious. i mean anyone who has looked at any of the job postings at any level would laugh at such claims. i mean most of the internet still runs on php for crying out loud.
makes sense since you already have an understanding of how things vaguely work in the lower level thanks to your experience with c/c++.
unis used to teach c in intro to courses before mit decided to switch to python for some dumb fricking reason and everyone followed suit cause they think mit shits gold. i think it's a big mistake because the memory management part is what truly makes it worth taking the course. with python, you don't even think about it at all.
yeah, good for personal projects and learning things but terrible when it comes to usable software.
i thought they backtracked on that policy
>using SDL and other basic libraries isn't reinventing the wheel
fairly certain anon called the another anon a sane person precisely because he didn't reinvent the wheel.
whatever you do, keep going
It's hard to change from C# to C++?
And what about Unity to Unreal?
if you actually want to release a game don't switch engines
if you just want the learning experience go ahead and try any language/engine out, most of your skills will transfer
Have fun with blueprint scripting spaghetti
I am working as Unity junior dev in a shitty company, but it's ok, I am starting in this gane sev world...
But how can I improve my carrer? Add Blender, maybe?
can you even model people/creatures if you don't know how to draw?
You can start by just staring at how other people do it and copying them, but eventually you do want to learn some art skills so you can start making your own poses and designs. A lot of dummies start by copying FFVI sprites and then think "ah shit, I need to do 45 and 135 degree perspectives for better 8 way movement", and their art journey begins.
I have a Bachelor's of Science in Computer Science that I got like 8 years ago and I have never managed to find a programming job.
I work at a call center making 40k a year. I can't even remember most everything I learned.
Did you actually develop solid programming skills during the degree or did you just drift through your topics barely passing everything?
What languages did you learn to a competent, professional level?
Did you do any networking during your final year?
Was it a vocational degree where they place you in an internship for the second half of your final year?
Just curious, CS degrees are generally pretty employable so it's interesting to find out what leads people to end up in your position.
Tbf my CS degree barely taught programming either, isn't it common not to, and to focus on theory?
But the department did try to get people to intern and there were networking fairs. I ended up doing neither and it took me a few years of dev-adjacent work and small personal projects to become employable in dev roles.
Because CS taught you more than writing the code itself.
I'm on my third year, first semester. and I barely write any line of codes on the first half of the semester.
I'm doing a degree in IT right now, not quite a CS degree but I like it because the last 6 months is literally either a 3 or 6 month internship (student's choice) at an appropriate company.
Really gives you a nice foot in the door right from the start. In fact most of the final year is just a couple of actual topics with the rest being networking, employability training and resume/interview training.
I don't know what the job market is like for junior roles these days, but with the way the economy is I have to imagine it's important to have basic experience before someone will even offer you basic experience, so that setup sounds really valuable.
>Did you actually develop solid programming skills during the degree or did you just drift through your topics barely passing everything?
I did the first two years but then the last three I barely went to class and got mostly low Bs and high Cs
>What languages did you learn to a competent, professional level?
Only C++
I did small amounts of Assembly, Java, C#, C, PHP, PERL, Javascript, and MYSQL but most of my classes had me using C++.
>Did you do any networking during your final year?
No. I made no friends, I didn't form bonds with any teachers, I didn't do any internships, and I didn't work in the computer lab or anything like that. I slept 14 hours a day and stayed home posting on Ganker.
>Was it a vocational degree where they place you in an internship for the second half of your final year?
No but there were opportunities to do an internship. I didn't do them because I thought a degree would be all I needed to get a job.
Yeah, sorry my dude I won't be too harsh but this one is definitely on you.
Should have done the internship and talked with your teachers at least.
I made a similar mistake when I got my first degree in assuming the piece of paper was all I needed, so I understand what's happened here.
I have a lot of game ideas, most of which I could do as a solo developer, but none of them I see as a breakout hit. I'm looking for the right idea, which isn't easy.
I made some games once
I make games in javascript. Javascript is a fun language.
how many hours of gameplay and girls do I need before I can start getting funded on Patreon for an R18 VN game? like 5-10 hours of gameplay and 3-5 girl paths?
I've been making an FTLike
I'm already interested friend, my game is a spin on Half Minute Hero
>interested friend
I've got a live build, still missing some core graphical assets though.
https://pricklypeargames.itch.io/wodopom
>my game is a spin on Half Minute Hero
whatcha got so far?
Probably not, but they can leverage the fact that they employ him against the code if it was worth anything (but presumably not enough to quit the job).
Well, don't sell yourself short.
I'm the dude posting the stuff about the robot with the 2d platformer perspective. Still working on proc gen for filling in the hills, but drunkard's walk seems to be the solution for a fully connected cave,
>unitytrannies
you will never make it
Programming is my day job. Creating a game would be fun, but I can't make art.
not allowed? same for my brother as Amazon. He has to get permission to make code off the clock, or they own it per the employment contract.
that's not enforceable
I meant I have no artistic skills. I don't think I have any official restrictions on personal projects.
homie just make one female friend and you will have yourself a high quality artist
Oh boy. It’s another Ganker programming thread, where STEM students that took one semester of CS come to act like they know what they’re talking about by shitting on modern languages and game engines. Can’t wait to see the amazing critiques we’ll get this time.
Oh boy, it's another shitposter that doesn't contribute meaningfully to the conversation.
The irony of your own comment adding absolutely nothing to the discussion while also not refuting what I said in anyway
I don't need to refute anything shitter,
Were my contributions, or is it too cloudy up there from your NEET pedestal?
Oh boy. It's another sour moron that comes into a thread to shitpost when people are just trying to learn and create fun things.
Over half the thread is people crying about about c# and unity being unoptimized. No one is going to learn shit in a Ganker game dev thread. Go to Ganker where at least the average user isn’t a teenager or complete baby like yourself.
>enters thread and makes post that clearly indicates he is irritated
>calls others baby
The irony of you using irony in your other post.
>Go to Ganker where at least the average user isn’t a teenager
:^)
C# has a lot of solid, well-performing games written in it, though. 2D games like Stardew Valley, Celeste, the Ori series, 3D games like Outer Wilds and Subnautica, etc
None of those are actually doing anything performance intensive in C++ though, its using C# as a scripting language, its like when python calls C functions
XNA is calling C++ directx functions and is basically a wrapper for them
and unity straight up uses C# as a scripting language and is written in C++, there is a reason plugins need to be in C++
Sure, I'm not saying people should write their own game engines from scratch in C# if they want max 3D performance (although I've seen that work out fine too, and if you're an indie it almost certainly doesn't matter). It's just silly to go "this game is slow because of C#/Java" when the problem is almost certainly shitty graphics optimization or a crap framework the game is built on top of.
Just look at Unreal, written in C++, and its notorious shader stutter. I bought Redout 2 the other day and was getting shader stutters over a second long in racing game that focuses on speed and precision. Blaming C++ for that would be ridiculous.
and virtually all unity games use c# although on mono and not .net. games like hollow knight, genshin, cuphead all use unity.
there's terraria uses XNA (well technically monogames cause microsoft killed xna and people had to develop their own open source replacement) which also uses c#.
and exceptions. god i fricking hate exceptions. they make no sense.
unity is not C#
unity is C++
C# is unitys scripting language
unity plugins MUST be written in C++
XNA is C#
but it calls directx functions
which is C++
and it has C++ binding for a lot of the more performance intensive stuff you want to do on top
doing what amounts to basic business logic in C# is fine, because C++ is doing the heavy lifting of graphics and serious computation
this is as moronic as saying all python programs are c cause the reference python interpreter cpython is in c. well they do technically optimize many of the things to gain near c level performance but it is pretty moronic.
Ori isn't written entirely in C# like your generic low effort indie pixel shit.
The game had multiple in house tech and graphic pipeline some of those are impossible to be written in C#.
>Go to Ganker where at least the average user isn’t a teenager
I refuse to believe you actually believe this
They hated him because he told them the truth
I stopped posting about gamedev on Ganker because of the massive dunning Kruger here
Now I just get a kick out of watching these morons argue
Instant seethe when I call them out on how moronic these threads are. Ganker easily has the lowest tech iq of any board on this site
>cries about me “shitposting” while not even being able to use correct punctuation
In the game dev threads? Or the music production ones? Or even daily programming general? Or web dev general? No way are those threads mostly teenagers. If you go into chinkshit general and the pc building one, or any of the windows bad Linux good ones, no shit they’re filled with teenagers.
At least be subtle, fricking moron. If a punctuation mistake is all you've got to go on, then save yourself the embarrassment and have a nice day already. Shit, the only reason I haven't left the thread yet is that my 3D-print has another 30 minutes,
Where do you find studios or people looking for composers anyway?
c# is MAJOR bloat
c++ is MINOR bloat
i made three games in C and I don't wanna change
there is really no reason to use pure c these days outside of extremely constrained environments. you don't have to use all of the features from c++; stuff like templates, lambdas, RAII, and smart pointers can save you a lot of headache
I leik smart pointers
But I found out about them a year ago, and sprite management hasn't been easier
>Oh frick I need 8000 refs to this sprite
>pass around smart pointer w/ custom de/alloc
>problem solved when containing object is delete'd
NOT using templates, lambdas, RAII, and smart pointers can also save you a ton of headaches
templates are okay
frick lambdas
frick raii
and smart pointers are nice
This guy's got it. Not sure about the hate for RAII though. Lambdas get messy real quick
RAII itself is great, it's the one unconditionally good thing about C++. It's just that it's required to get other features to work, just to do things like prevent exceptions from blowing up everything.
>Lambdas get messy real quick
they're just C++ closures. you can cause some nasty lifetime footguns if you don't know what you're doing and the syntax is admittedly a little arcane at times, but virtually every modern language implements some form of them and for good reason.
If you want to get into programming, pursue Information Systems majors, not Computer Science majors.
bold of you to recommend a degree not available in most schools.
>c++
Suck a frick gay
>ultimate telescope gits knocked off, and spins right to my butthole super close
>I hate all of you unconditionally
>why aren't you writing a book? you only need to know english
this is how you sound
how do i save this thread before jannies delete it
right click save as? Ganker archive sites?
If I had the time to make webms, I'd post progress that way right now, another thread and another day
open all the pics and webms and press ctrl+s.
Does it work for godot or do I really have to frick myself by learning Gdsctiprt
I tried writing my own engine with SDL and opengl but I'm too dumb. I can put 2d textured rectangles on the screen but when it comes to rotation+collision and making a gui with it, I'm a brainlet. I wanted to make an in game map editor and a GUI thats similar to Dear IMGUI but really stripped down and simplfied but I cant even do that.
writing opengl isn't easy anon
the only bit SDL makes easier is that instead of needing to write platform specific code to initialize opengl it handles it all for you and opens a window nicely while managing that
otherwise opengl does none of that for you
you are writing vanilla opengl basically, which is not easy
if you don't understand the rendering pipeline you wont even be able to get shit on screen
you need to write a vertex shader and a rasterization shader
I can explain it to you more if you want, I have written opengl stuff before
but you could also look at something like https://learnopengl.com/ , be warned, if you aren't already an experienced programmer you probably will get filtered by this, and even if you are it will probably take you months before u can even do basic shit that would be remotely like putting together a game
Yea I used that site. I wrote some simple c++ classes that basically just wrap a GLuint. I can put rectangles (actually 2 triangles, I even use an EBO) on the screen with a texture and rotate them at different speeds. I'm not sure how to proceed after that.
if u want to draw 3d objects u need a fragment shader and rasteriztion shader to actually put stuff on screen
frag shaders is what makes triangles from ur points, and raster is what turns it from models and maths to actual pixels
then you can load in a model or just define like a cube in space, pass them down the pipeline and presto u have ur thing on screen
I was gonna do 2d
opengl has 0 support for anything 2d.
there is basically no graphics pipeline that supports 2d.
its all 3d drawing sprites to planes on a orthographic camera
fricked up, I know.
but its what you have to deal with if you want hardware acceleration
>bg3 spell jammer book
I that is why. spell jammer hammer shit. where the frick is boo?
bg3 is cool because it allows you to make choices, or not. it is a true sequel to the original bg games
BG2 was far too rigidly quest focused.
after reading the entire thread, I'm still confused
is C++ really better than C#? does anyone think otherwise?
also, how do you make 3D maps? (I assume they're not made in blender)
Programming languages have different specializations, there's not really a "best" programming language. C++ is harder than C# but can provide better performance. If you're using an existing game engine it doesn't really matter because the engine core is probably written in C++ as others have pointed out and whatever you're doing on top of it is probably not very intensive in terms of logic, plus you're more likely to frick up the performance of the graphics pipeline.
If you're just getting into game dev just pick whichever existing engine is easiest for you and start working on prototypes, you don't need to distract yourself with reinventing the wheel.
thanks a lot anons <3
is it easy to switch from C# to C++ after a while?
depends
if you pick up good fundamental programming skills then they transfer over, but it will not make picking up the language "easier" specifically or the best way to do things in it
the first language is the hardest to learn
the second is almost as hard because everything feels different and weird
the 3rd is easy
the 4th makes you forget about the first 2 you learnt but is trivial to pick up
>C++ is harder than C#
Only if you're moronic or indian
C++ genuinely isnt that bad.
Until you have to hit the "compile" button.
That's why c++ is better than say Python tho. It tells you your code is shit before you run the program. The problem is that it tells you in a cryptic way sometimes.
so c++ is harder
On a program that's less than 100 lines, yes.
you CAN make good things with C#, but i wouldnt rely on unity because of how bloated it is. maybe if you're making something in 3D. there a reason why jon blow switched to C++ when he released his game, because of the severe limitations of XNA and microsoft's tools at the time. as for 3D maps, you can make them in blender. but rendering them is dependent on the engine you've made or using.
>also, how do you make 3D maps? (I assume they're not made in blender)
blender can handle static level geometry just fine, but you generally want some custom tools to place dynamic objects within said static geometry in a format that is efficient for your engine. blender can get you like 80% of the way though.
by map do you mean like a stage or landscape
then yeah, they are made in blender
you don't necessarily need to make them all as 1 mesh but part by part and stitch it together in engine
its pretty hard to do and there are a lot of tools for making landscapes and shit in engines because of it
Some of the best games I've ever played have been made with unity so maybe I should just use that.
Vidya has been my primary hobby my entire life and yet I have never had any desire to make a game.
And that's a good thing, because if you do you will lose interest in videogames for some reason.
reading this thread, i get that making an engine from the ground-up is basically slaving my whole life to it, so which engine is actually a good option? As I understand, both Unreal and Unity are unoptimized pieces of shit
That's only the case if you're making a 3d game.
Just pick up Unity or Godot, both are free and let you script in languages that casuals can pick up. Godot has the advantage of scripting in a Python-like language and being like <200MB for the whole package, while Unity has the advantage of being more well-documented and more of an industry standard.
The key through all this is to learn programming IDEAS, as opposed to programming LANGUAGES. How best to organise and call the data your code is putting onto your RAM. Once you learn that, language isnt that much of an issue.
Generally, yes.
Also just go with Unity. You're making an Indie game, not "Massive AAA Goyslop-fest #66666666 by Microsoft Bought Company", optimization isn't as important.
Besides, being all picky about engines for slight optimization or technical differences is basically just making excuses for why you're not making the game yet.
Worry about optimization AFTER you have a couple of finished games under your belt.
If the engine can do what you need it to do to make your game, that is enough.
I will NEVER make a game.
whats the next iteration of the language and why is it C##
and why isnt there a glyph for hexadecathorpe in Unicode yet
I need some help with rpgmaker
Been looking around some plugins to get but its just confusing
I'm an artist for an upcoming game, not the programmer. But I have ideas I tell you! A vision, I say! Don't we all...
Yes, we all have ideas. That's why everyone laughs at self-proclaimed 'idea guys'.
We are ALL idea guys, literally every single human being is an idea guy.
The difference between a developer and an idea guy is just whether they have any actual skills, experience or talent.
Also if you're an artist, not a programmer, make sure your idea will actually work from a technical perspective by asking the programmer before you start making assets for it, otherwise you could end up wasting a lot of time on art for a game that isn't technically feasible.
Answer me this homosexuals, if c# is so superior, why does every studio that doesn’t use unity garbage require proficiency in c++? This isn’t exclusive to just one studio either.
>Implying you should only know 1 language
If you aren't proficient in at least 3 separate programming languages, you are fricking incompetent, unemployable trash.
I mean look where you are. I hardly think people in this thread actually want to get hired at a large game development company, that's one of the worst jobs I could imagine. It's just indie level shit, noone should give a frick about c++ when c# and FNA/Monogame gets you a graphics context in 1 second.
Unrelated but frick it. As someone who is literally clueless about 3d modelling, how hard is it to make mods in Genshin? Do I need to watch those 13 part videos on how to make a donut in blender? I just wanna see Mona in a dress.
It's easy if someone already made the model and uploaded it online.
If you gotta make the dress yourself... well, at least blender modelling is always a useful skill to have on your CV.
I think there's already a dress online. But the thing I'm clueless about are the accessories, how to texture and most importantly, the physics. I've seen a lot of mods where the dress is so rigid. I'm still looking at how some people manage to add cloth physics to their mods.
Language doesn't matter when your game logic is so simple it's a few if statements and maybe a for loop.
Why shouldn't I just use RPGMaker?
What game are you trying to make?
An adventure RPG like the Pokémons I used to play as a kid. I like legit sprite graphics and am decent at making chiptune music. I'd just be converting the stories I've been writing into game format.
If its all turn-based and stat based, seems like the sorta thing RPGM is good at. If you're using your own assets you might even be able to fool people into not knowing its RPGM
Yeah that's the plan. I can shit out decent art as well, but I'm probably just going to build the game on stock assets and wrangle some artgay when I feel like going public. This is really for my own satisfaction and idc about money.
I'm learning Godot boys. It seems like the most sensible for a beginner. Wish me luck. Will try to participate in a Jam soon, make some friends and start making big things maybe?
To the guys that say that C# is dogshit and that C++ and C are infinitely better, genuine question, what the heck are you guys making that requires that extra performance boost? I am moronic, but I've not had any problems with c# in programming what I need and want.
the biggest thing i struggle with programming is being able to solve a programming problem related to algorithms
Unity is an abomination
>good at a java
>if i want to make a game with it i have to essentially code an entire engine
Thanks, i hate it.
>learning a dead language
There's your problem
>dead
Not dead for enterprise software because it's everywhere. And it ain't legacy code.
Thanks but I'm sticking with C
>you only have to know c#
>and 3d modelling, and musical composition, and learn/code an engine, and animation, rigging texturing, lighting, using other programs and importing exporting between them
You can use premade assets. Asset flip games on steam are common for a reason.
>Doing everything yourself like a moron.
Use one of the many easily accessible, free to use, cheap to commercially license game engines.
Buy assets from the asset store or use default assets for animations, lighting, etc
Contract an artgay to make anything you don't want to look generic/to have a unique style (textures, models, music, etc).
Combine these assets in the engine, use your programming knowledge to code any mechanics you want, and build the game
People like you are always just pathetic homosexuals who are lazy and don't want to try, so you invent excuses for why it's too hard and no one could ever do it because you have to make everything yourself despite that being complete fricking bullshit.
You're a grown man who lives with his mom. You're not anyone to call someone lazy b***h breasts. Inb4 troon rage
>relying on buying assets rather than creating your own things
Have you tried this yourself, man? You can pirate a lot of the top assets that's fine but if you want to create a cohesive theme and style then you're screwed...
I am making my own game the only thing I will not do is the music, I will buy that. I have pirated a shit ton of good assets and extensions for Unity and Blender to make the job easier though. I'm not a lazy c**t like you assume, I'm just being real about the amount of work required if you want to create something good, because you need a lot more than just knowing how to code.
There's a reason why most devs work as a team. Making a game is extremely multidisciplinary, as it is the fusion of traditional art, filmmaking, musical composition, puzzle design, literature AND the code needed to bind all these elements together. If you wanna make your own game by yourself, you gotta really scale your idea back aggressively.
how do i start? i only know java, i don't know how to make music
>need degree to get any kind of job here
>Was considering doing an at home study one (I'm old)
>Friends say I should do programming because they like it and think I would plus there's jobs
How fricked am I trying to learn this shit from literal scratch?
>there's jobs
Nah
Do you like fixing problems everyday and solving logic puzzles?
If no is your answer then don't bother. You should watch some video of a day in a programmer job. A real one with man, not those bullshit where they walk the office and eat candy.
3ds max license decided to stop renewing for me and I'm out of fake schools to use.
I can't figure out a way to generate art assets that I find acceptable. I don't enjoy 3D modeling/scultping, 2D art doesn't seem like a learnable skill, and I have no desire to work with an artist.
>taking Advanced Data Structures and Algorithms
>no longer is it obviously about coding
>it’s some next-level combination of linear algebra and discrete math
>have absolutely no fricking idea what is going on
SEND ME SOME GODDAMN HELP PLEASE
>use arrays and lists 90% of the time anyway
>when i seed speed use maps and sets
Heh, nothing personal.
>launch unity
>open project
>open scripts
>"ah frick I have to figure out how to make thing1, thing2, thing3 and system1, system2, system3 and so on"
>launch video game
>at the end of the day close everything with nothing done
big question
how do you figure/learn how to do pretty visual effects?
lightning, splashes, particles, etc
youtube tutorials
as always
Just use additive alpha blending LMAO seriously.
>have a vague understanding of how programming concepts and algorithms work and can do basic ones
>can't program them or have an idea how to use them to solve problems
lol
ChatGPT can help with this. I went from being hopeless to being slightly less hopeless because of it.
>have to use a personal number to use it
...
U wot?
i kinda gave up because it seems like AI will just completely end indie games after the AAA gays figure out how to shit out constant games with AI art and programming done smart by a big team. nobody will want to play 1MA games anymore.
maybe i'm a fool but why should i spend a few more years gitting gud at art and programming when my skills will be obsolete by then.
You do it for your own personal growth, anon. The vast majority of people who do these things won’t create something of value.
the point is nobody will want to play my game when AI games made by teams run rampant
you absolute dumbass, AI is used to simplify the development process of vydia, and that shit can apply in indie game development as well
AI is not some sentient entity you just tell what game you want and it will spit it out, AI serves as a tool to make the development easier
if an AI was used heavily during the development, including for the creative aspects of the game like the writing, story or the visuals, it wouldn't be as appealing as something made by humans, at least not at this stage of development, which also hasn't progressed much since last year
and besides, even if the best case scenario for AI game development happens, there will always be people that will want to play games made entirely with human touch, just like now there are people buying indie games and enjoying the genuine creativity of the human spirit
of course, none of this shit matters to you, if you really wanted to make games, you would already be making them instead you're coping about "muh AI"
>he wants to make games for profit instead of for fun
you wouldn't make a good indie dev anyway, so good riddance
Because I also need passable art (2D sprites or 3D models and textures), passable music, and passable sound effects.
I also need the time, but I'm not a comfy NEET anymore.
Don’t feel too bad, being a NEET rarely lends itself to high-functioning creative output in any case.
Indeed.
I can't do anything that involes numbers
c# best parts dried up on her mama's thighs when she was born. C/C++ superior race for game dev and java for everything else excluding fortran and cobol.
Now Git Good.
But I am, in c# nonetheless. Making big progress