In my opinion terribly handled themes, manipulative messages that rely on strawmen the entire time. Stupid chuuni tone throughout all of it but I could look past it if the themes were well written.
Want an example? Ange EP4/8. Everything that has to do with her delusions or lack thereof is not done well. The cruel goats in EP4 calling her out at school are actually very reasonable classmates rightfully criticizing Ange for not doing her tasks. The entire dilemma about magic and shit surrounding Ange is, in truth, a very straightforward "maybe stop bullying the traumatized orphan everyday, buttholes" situation. Don't get me started on MUH INTELLECTUAL RAPE.
The most infuriating part would be Eva's redemption in EP8 when she pretty much should have gone to jail for how horribly she mistreated and carefully destroyed Ange. Seriously, reread EP4 and keep in mind that Ange fricking dies at the end of it due to Eva's deliberate setup. Just INSANE.
You're absolutely correct. The attempt at rehabilitating Eva in the eyes of the reader was what I most disliked about the ending of Umineko. She's a despicable c**t of a person.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Umineko is incredibly lenient towards murderers and horrible people. There's a difference between not being obsessed with revenge and validating monsters who ruined many lives on purpose because THEY'RE ACTUALLY HUMAN THEY HAVE FEELINGS BRO
>Seriously, reread EP4 and keep in mind that Ange fricking dies at the end of it due to Eva's deliberate setup.
I'd like to see you argue that in court.
>The cruel goats in EP4 calling her out at school are actually very reasonable classmates rightfully criticizing Ange for not doing her tasks.
imagine being this moronic
Alright, tell me how this is wrong. I remember their concerns and Ange's destructive autism being very legitimate.
Or you could call me a loveless goat like every Uminekogay does when you criticize their bible.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>muh loveless goat
no, I will just say that you're autistic if you think that any of that was "very reasonable"
5 months ago
Anonymous
What did you expect from media illiterate speed readers?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Read the goat scene, which I'm referring to. They're just calling her out for not doing her fricking tasks.
Even the screen you posted is really a bunch of semi legitimate complaints covered in dozens of *evil cackle* and other "I'm very evil in case the reader didn't notice" shit. They're cartoonishly evil, but that only makes the legitimate points stand out. R07 can only write strawmen.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>the high school bullies are acting like bullies
Wow! I am surprised!
5 months ago
Anonymous
That's my point. R07 believes he tackled on themes of truth and escapism and delivered well written insights about it, when in truth he just wrote "evil bullies who cackle and act evil... are bad"
5 months ago
Anonymous
>r07 believes he
That's not the argument. Stop trying to push goalposts. Your claim was that the bullies were being reasonable and understanding when it's clear they weren't here(or earlier in the story for that matter. )
I don't think you should talk about what his intentions are if you can't even read the basics of the story correctly.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Again, the goat scene is conflating MUH EVIL GOATS with reasonable criticism, which is what I'm referring to. It could be that it was always meant to be about how sneaky vicious school bully manipulate you with words, if you want. But if it is, then like I said, Umineko once again shoots itself in the foot by replacing the meat of the themes with "evil bullies are evil". Great story champ.
5 months ago
Anonymous
How are you deliberately confusing an ELEMENT of the story with the MESSAGE of the story? The bullies are an element to the story in which causes Ange to go through mental duress. Even if you were to say that the bullies "were acting responsibly" (which was already proven wrong), it is still a middle schooler who lost THEIR ENTIRE FAMILY out of nowhere. It would make logical sense that Ange would be behaving irrationally and emotionally if they "were just being nice" but either way you are incorrect in your assessment. You can also oversimplify and generalize any piece of media to make it sound worse than it is. At least try to use a valid piece of criticism about the characters, the narrative, the setting, the motives etc. Here I will be the high school bullies in this situation, your posts are fricking trash and you need to do better.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You fundamentally misunderstand my point.
The bullies being cartoonishly evil means we can't have this truth and escapism debate setup, because the obvious priority is "these are just insane monsters, regardless of the larger debate, so we're not addressing that debate at all when we're showing these guys"
And the other scenario where the bullies actually have a legitimate point rather than just being evil bad guys still means they're portrayed as insanely evil which detracts the points they could be making.
There's no winning with R07's juvenile writing style, really.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Because your "point" has no validation or support for it.
You are treating your interpretation of an element of the story as if it is the one true objective way to perceive it, which goes against the message of the story. IE, you didn't get it and speed read it.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>carefully avoids addressing any of my points
Yeah I figured as much.
>He killed her in EP4.
Things that never happened. >He tried to shoot her in 8 Trick Ending (no, that wasn't a legitimate defense reaction).
He tried to hide behind cover because she was pointing a fricking gun at him. He made literally no hostile actions. He didn't even have a weapon on him, how could he have shot her back?
You really can't think he might have had the Tokarev for the potential manufacturing of a situation where it looks like the Sumaderas massacred each other? It's one tool among many and he was clearly prepared for multiple eventualities. Ange was the one who immediately extrapolated that to her own death.
Magic is a preferential method of thinking. You are choosing to think the worst of Amakusa.
>He made literally no hostile actions. He didn't even have a weapon on him, how could he have shot her back? >You really can't think he might have had the Tokarev for the potential manufacturing of a situation where it looks like the Sumaderas massacred each other? It's one tool among many and he was clearly prepared for multiple eventualities. Ange was the one who immediately extrapolated that to her own death. >Magic is a preferential method of thinking. You are choosing to think the worst of Amakusa.
He jumped at his gun to shoot Ange. Ange shot him before he could shoot. Reread the scene. The sniper was meant for the aunt, but he used the gun in that scene since he was forced to.
5 months ago
Anonymous
If you blatantly misunderstand and misremember elements of the story that's not for me to refute. Scroll above and see how plenty of people have proven you wrong about how the bullies were nice and understanding.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>He jumped at his gun to shoot Ange.
No, he did not.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, definitely innocent behavior lmao. Quote the part where Ange knows he has a handgun in his pocket too, homosexual.
But I guess we're supposed to believe the ending of EP4 with the stakes has no meaning at all and this entire scene is just bullshit.
I'm not surprised, this is really the only way to make Umineko work. Rewrite it.
5 months ago
Anonymous
ESL doesn't understand basic wording and rewrites his posts. Your claim was "he jumped at his gun to shoot ange"
You really are not doing yourself any favors by misrepresenting and changing the claim behind your posts in every response.
5 months ago
Anonymous
"Man tries to not let himself be shot in the heart, this clearly implies guilt".
He was trying to distract the cute little traumatized aristocrat so he could get out of CERTAIN DEATH, of course he's going to try to quick talk.
Yeah I'm sure he was trying to just run. Not shoot Ange. Obviously jumping to cover would ensure his long term safety, it was surely a better move than trying to rush Ange and grab the gun from her. He clearly wasn't trying to frick with her aim so he could shoot first, no, he just thought jumping behind a wall would make Ange stop trying to murder him. He had no intent of using his gun!
5 months ago
Anonymous
>makes up another paragraph misrepresenting his claims that have already been disproven
You didn't read Umineko
5 months ago
Anonymous
"Man tries to not let himself be shot in the heart, this clearly implies guilt".
He was trying to distract the cute little traumatized aristocrat so he could get out of CERTAIN DEATH, of course he's going to try to quick talk.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, definitely innocent behavior lmao. Quote the part where Ange knows he has a handgun in his pocket too, homosexual.
But I guess we're supposed to believe the ending of EP4 with the stakes has no meaning at all and this entire scene is just bullshit.
I'm not surprised, this is really the only way to make Umineko work. Rewrite it.
This ending was all in Ange's head while she was on the building the night before. The story transitions to magic ending which is the true ending. This is the only way you can explain how someone as paranoid as Ange can come to accept her shitty life.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>He jumped at his gun to shoot Ange.
No, he did not.
The midwit doesn't know what they're talking about again! Imagine my surprise!
5 months ago
Anonymous
Are you aware that bullying is an extremely real part of japanese school culture and that bullies who are good at what they do always make a habit of pretending to be friendly and reasonable to cast doubt whenever a person of authority might investigate?
5 months ago
Anonymous
That's not the point here. R07 wrote a good story about bullying in Higanbana. Umineko doesn't want to be about bullying, it pretends to be about our relationship with truth and the past. But it's actually about a bunch of morons doing stupid shit.
5 months ago
Anonymous
The "point" is that Ange was tormented by others, but worse still she was tormented by herself. Yes she had a shitty upbringing, yes she had no friends and Eva failed to be the mother she needed and the world continues to puppet the corpses of her family in increasingly gruesome ways.
But she can escape that. She can choose to believe better. She can rise above pessimism, release the suffocating grasp of the past, and move on with her life believing that her family could have been good people who loved her, and not murderous caricatures. She doesn't have to forgive her bullies, but she can forget them instead of letting them live in her head and heart, weaving macabre stories about massacring them with demons and the like.
The morals that Umineko deals with is grief. The reality is that nothing about the Rokkenjima Massacre matters to Ange. It happened, it's done with, the past will not change regardless of truth. She could seek the final truth and die once she accepts it, or she could just think better of it and go do something else, anything else. Like become a writer and a philanthropist.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>she can escape that
No. Not when you have dozens of men whose job is making sure you never get any social contact. Not when your alleged mass murderer aunt is doing everything she can to make you suffer. Not when the classmates are, according to you, cartoonishly evil bullies who flip flop between sneaky gaslighting about chores and telling Ange "LOL YOUR PARENTS DEAD THEY KILLED EVERYONE LMAOO".
This isn't executed properly to give this legitimate internal arc you're talking about. At least not for me. It shoots itself in the foot at every turn. Erika is another example of a weird strawman. Either you're a magicgay or you're a cartoonish intellectual rapist.
My biggest gripe is the trick ending being shown as the bad one when it's really just Ange finding out all these monsters want her dead and fighting back, instead of getting a free redo like in the Magic ending.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>My biggest gripe is the trick ending being shown as the bad one when it's really just Ange finding out all these monsters want her dead and fighting back
Bro.
She kills the closest thing she has to a friend out of pure paranoia from overthinking her situation.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You're delusional. He was going to kill her. He killed her in EP4. He tried to shoot her in 8 Trick Ending (no, that wasn't a legitimate defense reaction). Notice how the only scenario where he doesn't try to kill her is if she gives her money to them.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>He killed her in EP4.
Things that never happened. >He tried to shoot her in 8 Trick Ending (no, that wasn't a legitimate defense reaction).
He tried to hide behind cover because she was pointing a fricking gun at him. He made literally no hostile actions. He didn't even have a weapon on him, how could he have shot her back?
You really can't think he might have had the Tokarev for the potential manufacturing of a situation where it looks like the Sumaderas massacred each other? It's one tool among many and he was clearly prepared for multiple eventualities. Ange was the one who immediately extrapolated that to her own death.
Magic is a preferential method of thinking. You are choosing to think the worst of Amakusa.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Things that never happened
Everything points at it. Just like Yasu is the would-be culprit based on the hints and mystery and narration, the white haired homosexual was going to murder Ange.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You could think that, or you could not think that.
5 months ago
Anonymous
That's not how it works. Umineko has rules, red truths and more. Narrator can't do whatever he wants. And so on. This is why we know for a fact how Yasu was going to be the culprit, that there is a bomb, and everything Will says in 7. This also includes the meaning of EP4 and the shooting scene in EP8.
More straight forward: You can't just decide to ignore plot points to pretend Amakusa isn't a monster, just because it ruins the message and makes it look stupid. You're rewriting Umineko because these plot points are bad. Honestly the best admission of R07's hackery I've seen.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Red truth only works when you're creating a story. It doesn't apply to Ange's world. The meaning of EP4 is to not let your imagination consume you and forget to live your life, that anything going on that you haven't seen specifically might never have happened at all. The Trick ending is to not let your wild suspicions consume you and incite murderous disaster.
The only reason to think that Amakusa means to kill Ange is because you choose to believe Okonogi and Amakusa are bad people ruled by money. Perhaps they are, perhaps they aren't. Perhaps you can even make a bayesian inference to assert it is more likely that they are than they aren't.
But you cannot say it with absolute certainty.
5 months ago
Anonymous
The reason I believe Amakusa sniped Ange's ass is because EP4 shows everyone dying from "stakes" and then it cuts to black from Ange's perspective. And Amakusa has a sniper. And a suspicious gun. And tries to outgun Ange on the boat (unless you think he was just going to jump in the sea, lmao)
Stop being delusional and accept the plot points R07 set up himself.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>The reason I believe Amakusa sniped Ange's ass is because EP4 shows everyone dying from "stakes" and then it cuts to black from Ange's perspective.
Congratulations, you have been bewitched. You should KNOW by now that Ryukishi is trying to guide your thoughts one way by portraying things in incomplete, preferential ways.
Of course both options are possible. It's a blue truth. It's a choice, a call you're free to make. You simply choose violence and negativity, much like Ange does.
Your truth is to always see the worst in people and never for a moment allow your guard to go down. You loveless intellectual rapist.
5 months ago
Anonymous
If you're FORCED to pick the moronic theory and assume the narrator just randomly cuts to black and other bullshit for the story to not be abhorrent, then it's just a shit story.
Picking the rational likeliest option makes the entire ending terrible. This isn't how you write a story.
5 months ago
Anonymous
OR it's a fricking story about metanarratives and how the author gives information while the audience interprets it, either with or without love.
Umineko is working on one level higher than you.
I swear to god, some people work so fricking hard just to NOT THINK.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>story forces you 100% into a moronic theory that invalidates all the previous hints for no reason other than damage control for the terrible ending >criticize this >WOOO WHAT A GOAT I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THE 4D CHESS WRITING
Umineko is motte and bailey in novel form. Based nips not taking the bait.
5 months ago
Anonymous
forces you 100% into a moronic theory that invalidates all the previous hints for no reason other than damage control for the terrible ending
NTA anon but could you explain how?
5 months ago
Anonymous
You have to disregard all obvious interpretations of Amakusa killing Ange in EP4 and trying to kill her in EP8 for the trick ending to actually be bad
5 months ago
Anonymous
Wait.....you're telling me that a story that is about interpreting media is allowing you to interpret it which is the entire concept of the fricking story?
5 months ago
Anonymous
You're not allowed to interpret it as you want. Either you pick the "everyone is such a beautiful nice guy and it was all a misunderstanding", or you end up with Ange befriending murderous psychos, which is awful.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Either you pick "maybe everyone is actually nice" or you have Ange BECOMING a murderous psycho (in the name of self-defense, of course!).
5 months ago
Anonymous
If you pick "maybe this grown ass soldier Amakusa is a murderer", you end up with Ange's legitimate self defense move being portrayed as evil and paranoid. What a joke.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You don't have to interpret it that way. You can choose negativity and violence, as I said. You are allowed to say that Amakusa's perplexed expression was his astonishment at Ange being able to figure it out just from a gun. You can interpret her shooting the boatman as warranted, after all it's more likely that he's been bought off so he won't talk later.
5 months ago
Anonymous
> You are not allowed to interpret THEORETICAL WAYS THAT EVENTS COULD'VE GONE THROUGH how you want when that's the point of Umineko.
Fricking plebian, get filtered and go back to R3ddit for your source. What's the point of a mystery genre if you aren't able to interpret things how they appear to YOU?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Can you even read, moron? My point is that you CAN'T choose what to interpret. That's why posters ITT are all trying desperately to push the stupid "it was all a misunderstanding" theory. Because if it's not, it makes both magic and trick end worse, because Ange befriends her murderers in the former and does nothing wrong in the latter, despite the narration telling you otherwise. Uminekogays NEED Amakusa to be a good boy.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Tell me where its set in stone in Umineko that you CAN'T come up with your own fan theories? Holy shit turdface, that's the WHOLE POINT OF THE GENRE, ahahahahaha.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Are you genuinely underage? How hard is it to understand the issue isn't autistic theory crafting but the fact that one theory shits on the themes and make the story stupid?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Almost any theory regarding Rokkenjima incident are legitimately all right/wrong at the same time, they are all theories, not facts.
5 months ago
Anonymous
But the reason "you believe" something has been proven wrong plenty of times in the thread.
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Read the goat scene, which I'm referring to.
I don't know which scene you're referring to since you've talked about "the cruel goats in EP4" despite the fact that the only scenes with Ange and the goats are in EP8, IIRC. >Even the screen you posted is really a bunch of semi legitimate complaints covered in dozens of *evil cackle* and other "I'm very evil in case the reader didn't notice" shit.
No, it's the opposite, it's just classic passive-agrgresive bully rhetoric disguised as "legitimate complaints". As I've said, you just sound autistic.
5 months ago
Anonymous
(also they're not "calling her out for not doing her fricking tasks", they're just seething because her low grades are lowering the class' average")
5 months ago
Anonymous
>Read the goat scene, which I'm referring to.
I don't know which scene you're referring to since you've talked about "the cruel goats in EP4" despite the fact that the only scenes with Ange and the goats are in EP8, IIRC. >Even the screen you posted is really a bunch of semi legitimate complaints covered in dozens of *evil cackle* and other "I'm very evil in case the reader didn't notice" shit.
No, it's the opposite, it's just classic passive-agrgresive bully rhetoric disguised as "legitimate complaints". As I've said, you just sound autistic.
You're wasting your time anon, I already posted the evidence of her being bullied in the thread in video form and they are either too stupid or proud to admit that they are wrong.
5 months ago
Anonymous
The girls become goat shadows in EP4 at some point, and in this scene that completely villifies them they make decent points.
5 months ago
Anonymous
still can't find which scene you're talking about
https://lparchive.org/Umineko-no-Naku-Koro-ni/
5 months ago
Anonymous
https://youtu.be/778-dLnrOZo?si=cn3qpqbhBwpqJwV0
7:11:00
They sure seem nice here 🙂
Can you show me where it vilifies them?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Goat sprites and mannerisms.
still can't find which scene you're talking about
https://lparchive.org/Umineko-no-Naku-Koro-ni/
I'll search for it later if thread is still up. I remember that scene near the end of the school part.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Oh so you are saying that you again, have no fricking clue what you are talking about.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Why are you trying so hard with posts containing so little? Honestly comes off as insecure.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Why are you arguing for something you have no knowledge of? Honestly comes off as mentally incompetent.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Like I said, it's kinda pathetic how many times you keep name calling instead of discussing the actual work. How old are you dude? Get a grip.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Name calling? Do you think that someone who is blissfully ignoring evidence presented against them is a sign of anything else other than mental incompetence?
5 months ago
Anonymous
https://lparchive.org/Umineko-no-Naku-Koro-ni/Update%20117/
https://lparchive.org/Umineko-no-Naku-Koro-ni/Update%20118/
At least try to use a compelling argument besides your own ignorance.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Like I said, it's kinda pathetic how many times you keep name calling instead of discussing the actual work. How old are you dude? Get a grip.
Where is the name-calling here anon? And where did the words on the internet hurt you?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Spamming "YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT MY CHINESE CARTOON BOOK YOU SPEEDREADER" like 10 times while refusing to discuss calmly is:
1. Juvenile
2. Pointless
3. Makes you look a lot worse than anyone you call an evil speedreader. It's a book lmao, why so mad?
I'll reiterate: for your sake, get a grip.
5 months ago
Anonymous
I accept your concession anon.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Yeah, please stick with these kinds of oneliners. They make you look a little saner.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Anon you were losing an argument and cried about name calling on an anonymous image board. It just an objective truth that you do not and continue to not know what you are blabbering on about. Why do anything else?
5 months ago
Anonymous
Where did I spam? That was my second post. You have posted more often (and incorrectly I might add). You have yet to post anything worthwhile to support your claims besides your already proven wrong memories.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Well maybe you should read the story again since you dont know what you are talking about.
5 months ago
Anonymous
How is "this group is meanies - Ange" disproving the fact that what they say in the goat scene is pretty reasonable?
What's with the autistic filename? You can discuss without calling people names instantly, you know.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You can't read file names either huh? Thanks for proving my point anon.
Magic is nothing more than a preferential method of thinking. Ange's lingering on the past brought her suffering, the world's insistence that her family must have been terrible psychopaths fed bad cognitive behaviors. The only themes and messages to be given by the end was that she should avoid pessimism, cynicism, and unnecessary doubt, especially when it certainly won't do her any good to indulge in those emotions.
Imagine being intellectually raped by ryukishi07. Bullies do shit like bullying because #1 they can #2 they don't get punished for it #3 they derive pleasure from hurting others in that manner. There's no logic behind bullying.
There is logic behind storytelling. Faulty logic, when it comes to Umineko.
5 months ago
Anonymous
Right and the logic of bullies picking on someone who is ostracized from their group due to their weird and antisocial behavior makes logical sense. Glad we figured that out!
5 months ago
Anonymous
The person you posted don't quite understand how serious Japanese bullying can get to a point of murder or suicide.
a more widespread variety of genres and aesthetics (99% of VNs are trapped within the manga/LN/anime spectrum and all the story and character archetypes they imply); deeper experimentation with the interactive format
I play vns for the sex scenes
why do you waste hours upon hours only to coom to a still image and shitty writing?
>why do you waste hours upon hours only to coom to a still image and shitty writing?
Complete waste of time to play a vn if it doesn't even have porn in it. Just go read a book.
are you also a woman who reads romance books full of shlock smut? people read to feel, to be captivated, to ponder and reflect; in other words, to savour the abstract aspects of life
to see the most abstract medium as nothing but an outlet to bus' a nut makes you nothing but a flesh automaton who's a slave to their desires. you probably have room temperature IQ
>telling someone to go read a book because they don't read VNs with porn
What's next? Telling someone to watch a documentary because they like the game's setting?
What the frick is wrong with these russki Black folk
>telling someone to go read a book because they don't read VNs with porn
What's next? Telling someone to watch a documentary because they like the game's setting?
>a more widespread variety of genres and aesthetics
But we already have that. >99% of VNs are trapped within the manga/LN/anime spectrum
Manga, LN and anime aren't genres.
Anon you're confusing mediums with genres. The similarities exit mainly because they're influenced by the same Japanese culture and because they're targeting the same demographic.
There are plenty of VNs that aren't what you are badly attempting to complain about.
There are also many Adventure games like that too. Eastern and Western.
No, I will not spoonfeed you in your thinly veiled recommendation thread.
Yes, you may seethe.
here OP, a lot of these games have gameplay and are in different genres. I personally recommend Hotel Dusk
https://vndb.org/g350?f=&fil=&l=&m=1&s=24w
https://vndb.org/g35?f=&fil=&l=&m=0&s=24w
There are plenty of VNs that aren't what you are badly attempting to complain about.
There are also many Adventure games like that too. Eastern and Western.
No, I will not spoonfeed you in your thinly veiled recommendation thread.
Yes, you may seethe.
>No, I will not spoonfeed you in your thinly veiled recommendation thread.
This isn't Ganker, Black person. You are allowed to give out recs and have recommendation threads
And? That means I should recommend to some lazy shit who can't even communicate properly and needs to do it behind 15 layers of irony?
Why are you even mad? Felt personally insulted? Are you that same kind of moron?
Unlike OP and you I am sure. You can just ask for recommendations normally next time. I doubt you actually have the capacity to learn anything considering your b***h tier response.
5 months ago
Anonymous
You are throwing a tantrum over someone giving out a recommendation after smugly declaring you are going to "spoonfeed" and telling OP to seethe
If casuals here really bother you, feel free to go back to /jp/ where your elitist circle are
because writing good stories with massive differences depending on player interaction is a pain in the ass
main reason picrel has no player choice, it would be fricking impossible to write otherwise
>Why can't R07shit evolve beyond otaku pornslop and western games drenched in irony?
Fixed that for you. Good thing I played S;G first otherwise I would've dropped VNs altogether.
there is a niche of western text adventures, incredible small niche but nevertheless
the problem? can be pretty gay
i recommend inkle's sorcery, it's an honest adventure
Casual eroge is its own market. When I play Yuzusoft games I do not expect a complex story with lots of twists, and if I got one I would actually be offended. That's why practically all Yuzusoft games are formulaic and reuse tropes from previous entries, it's completely intentional. The casual eroge space is mature and consistent because the products are consistent. You cannot have that with something like Umineko/Steins;Gate/Subahibi. Those works are extremely inconsistent in what the reader expects. Robotics;Notes sucked if you expected more Steins;Gate, even Steins;Gate 0 sucked if you expected more Steins;Gate. Games like Dies Irae are polarizing, meanwhile everybody that bought Senran Banka knew what they were buying.
If you are known to make decent casual eroge you have a lot of repeat customers. Yuzusoft games have been about the same quality since the mid 2000s because it is very easy to make consistent.
In contrast, look at Nitroplus which puts out more serious complex stories, they've made a few outstanding games in the past like Saya no Uta, Steins;Gate, Full Metal Daemon Muramasa. For each of these great Nitroplus works, there's a dozen very mediocre ones that never become popular.
There is a real business justification for running a company that pumps out a casual eroge every 2 years with an expected revenue. Most of the great VN works are either super risky, or labors of love by very small groups like 07th expansion.
I feel like I'm in the minority who genuinely enjoys visual novels for its narrative and nonlinear storytelling and despise the inclusion of sex scenes. I can understand having some to show character's backstory, but almost all of them are just there purely for fap material.
Mahoyo is a good step in the right direction, have a great story featuring cute girls without needing any h-scenes.
It's not H-scenes that are the problem, but them being inorganic. That's why Hollow Ataraxia's H-scenes are so much better than Stay Night's, they happen between people you know and who are in-universe lovers rather than the entire plot coming to a screeching halt because the creators were afraid that the reader would quit the VN if they didn't see sex every couple of hours.
>read ep4 >get hit with the kinzo reveal The frick? So Krauss, Natsuhi, Nanjo and the eagled servants were LARPing this entire time? But why? Is anybody else in on it? Didn't Battler talk to him in ep2?
I'm not touching ep5 until I come up with a plausible explanation for this shit
Magic is real
t. Unironic magicgay.
Accept magic into your heart. We're the secret boss faction. Mystery Black folk are low IQ zombie thralls who enslave themselves to tropes and expectations - literally. >secret faction
You're about to meet the true enemy of skeptic faction soon. The meta faction.
Don't trust anything the witch shows you, it's all a lie!!!
now get out of here before someone spoils you. you seem like the type of reader least deserving of having the mystery ruined
Mysteries are a gay waste of time. Anon. I need you to repeat after me: Magic is REAL. Free yourself from this burden and your brain from those wrinkles.
I loved both but the best written game is Sunless Sea, though I can't say if the latest game released by that writer is better because I haven't played it yet.
Because if you can write a story like that you'll probably have better luck simply writing a book and reaching a more receptive audience this way. VN readers are composed of either coomers or morons who think titles like Wonderful Everyday are something more than just random pseudo intellectual garbage so there's simply no point in trying to deliver something that is actually good.
are you also a woman who reads romance books full of shlock smut? people read to feel, to be captivated, to ponder and reflect; in other words, to savour the abstract aspects of life
to see the most abstract medium as nothing but an outlet to bus' a nut makes you nothing but a flesh automaton who's a slave to their desires. you probably have room temperature IQ
>are you also a woman who reads romance books full of shlock smut? people read to feel, to be captivated, to ponder and reflect;
I do all that when I fall in love with a e-girl and become aroused
Tsuki is quite underwhelming. It's a slightly less hackneyed take on the same formula and energy as FSN. The poster child of a raw prototype that was okay with taking risks and upsetting people. The unpolished WN that becomes the sanitized LN.
Umineko is just a good VN. As in better than Tsukihime. If you're not willing to read Higurashi before umi then you might as well just read Tsuki
The best experiences, like Alternative, require prep work. Umi is no exception. >umi isn't a direct sequel you don't have to read higu
It IS a direct sequel and you MUST read Higu and at least the bible
Umineko is great but really fricking long. Don't listen to the other poster, you don't need to read Higu. But you should have read some Agatha Christie and the Bible
Tsukihime is interesting, but you should probably read FS/N first. It's more chuuni, has more action and has bigger plot twists. It's longer too, but it's also more fast paced. Personally I liked Tsuki more, but it's less polished and more introspective. Tsuki-R hasn't adapted the best parts of Tsukihime yet.
uhh which one is a good start bros???
Depends on what you want.
Needy Girl Overdose is only a couple of hours and is more of a videogame than a VN; it doesn't even have much reading, so you just get a few endings in an hour or two whenever you feel bored.
Tsukihime because it's much shorter and pretty straightforward since it doesn't try to throw cryptic bullshit at you like Umineko does
Also Umineko's story borrows a lot from Tsukihime
I really wish there were more action oriented VNs out there. I remember reading through Dengeki Stryker and then getting kinda sad that there wasn't anything else out there quite like it. It'd be really cool to see some magical girl ones or some more mecha ones that aren't like, horror adjacent, too.
They could already exist and I could just be totally missing them because I'm blind as frick, but most of what I find seem to be either romance, horror or porn VNs.
Will saw magic outside the chapel. Will had the detective's authority. The magic was not a vision of someone he was interrogating
The same magic appears in the finale of Higurashi
Both uses of localised temporal manipulation are associated with (Fred)Rika Bernkastel
Higurashi cannot be explained without magic as Rika knew about the slippery tile.
These observations prove a number of things
1. Magic exists in higurashi
2. Rika has magic
3. The same magic exists in Umineko
4. Rika and Fredrika Bernkastel use the same magic, share the same name, worship as priestesses
5. Rika is Bern
6. Featherine is Hanyuu
7. Umineko is a direct sequel to Higurashi and anyone suggesting you read Umi first should be shot dead.
After reading Umineko not so long ago the reveal seems like the biggest wack that only possible under shit tone of circumstances. And even game itself tells you if you change even one detail the whole shit is collapsed on itself. Because of this I see why shit like Rosatrice exist. In fact, I'm inclined to believe that Krauss being the culprit is more likely than this whole thing.
What visual novels have natural h-scenes rather than "how do we make people buy our game? porn"
I like porn, don't get me wrong, but as I grow into my 30s I find myself more into the writing/contextual side of erotica rather than just the fap value and I feel like so many visual novels miss a huge opportunity there where games are just either entirely porn, or the game has an abrupt h-scene at the end of a route just to encourage people to play.
It's fine for a VN that serves solely as a vehicle for porn but if the focus is on a story that I'm actually invested in the only thing h scenes do is waste my fricking time, they're usually not even good enough to fap to anyway
>play YU-NO >get to the other world >protag's wife dies >protag is devastated because he feels responsible for it happening >not even a week later he fricks some random b***h in the oasis without a second thought >this is all after he and his daughter almost died in the desert >eventually ends up fricking his own daughter that conveniently has matured far faster than humans do
These scenes actually made the story worse
>Why can't VNs evolve beyond otaku pornslop and western games drenched in irony?
VNs evolved into those things, like how animals keep evolving to crabs. In the 90s you had a ton of experimentation that dried out in the following decades. The early 00s benefited the most from this where all the now big name visual novels got to take advantage of this new creative space pioneered by the previous era of creators. It's similar to how blockbuster movies came from the New Hollywood wave. And just like in the film industry, this lead to stagnation and a tunneled focus on safe commercial products over risk taking.
I will be honest with you, I liked Umineko up until ep5 where they started to shift their focus from Rokkenjima to Meta-World and stopped the usual murder mystery formula
I liked ep7 the most because it was purely focusing on Rokkenjima and had little to no focus on the Meta-World and Ange (outside of the tea party), and Willard is actually competent unlike Battler
It has to do with the fact that 1-4 are where you are supposed to be gathering hints and think about the mystery, while 5-7 are basically crosschecking and receiving more background information that you couldn't really know otherwise - and finally 8 is really just about the message of the VN
I've said it before but I think it's clear he doesn't enjoy certain japanese games (and that's fine) but he acts like a huge gay about it. There's nothing wrong with having preferences but he comes off across as consistently shitty with a lot of his sperg rants basically being >Why does a japanese game set in japan having japanese things like maid cafes and mikos
are you bombarding me with blue truths hoping that one of them lands? I'm afraid I am neither of those things you listed. You can however call me a clown because I take pride in it
Gotta admit I'm a little jealous of people who read Umineko. I tried to give it a fair shot but I quit after chapter 2; Chapter 1 was great (aside from Maria, I fricking hated her) and Chapter 2 was also extremely intriguing regarding what the frick was happening. I definitely would have read on but it was written by Ryukishi so I didn't have any faith in him delivering on the set-up of Chapter 2, especially not after coming from Higurashi and hating the reveals there. Chapter 1 (retroactively ruined by Chapter 6), Chapter 2, and Chapter 5 were phenomenal; thankfully 2 & 5 were isolated enough from everything else that they could work as their own thing so it wasn't ruined.
The latter park of the story (or when the story actually picks up) seems to be really interesting but his needless focus on creating mystery hurts the overall product by increasing the length of his work, turning it into a bloated behemoth, but also by creating a jarring and drastic tonal shift. He also constructed the story as he went which isn't great. I don't get the idea of creating 2 disparate parts to a VN when each part is already so winding.
You can see a clear change in the trajectory of the story when the cowriter/Ryukishi's best bud died. I wonder how the story would have progressed if he hadn't.
>the cowriter
Why the hell has the story surrounding BT gotten so weird? BT wasn't a fricking writer, he was nothing but a scripter who put the VNs together.
Yes he was Ryukishi's best friend, and first in line as far as his beta readers went, but BT was NOT a "cowriter". Any change in direction is from R07's grief over his passing, not a change in talent or the writer's pen.
Only read up to Chapter 2 so my experience shouldn't have been impacted given that the supposed co-writer was still around at that time, no? Still, Umineko was set up just like Higurashi where questions is a bunch of mystery for the sake of mystery and answers is a bunch of sloppy answers to the mystery with the actual story tacked on. I don't think the co-writer's death had much impact at all; the lack of an editor, however...
>Chapter 2 was also extremely intriguing regarding what the frick was happening. I definitely would have read on but it was written by Ryukishi so I didn't have any faith in him delivering on the set-up of Chapter 2
And you were right on that, but it's all about the journey.
If anything I can tell you that no future chapter retroactively shits on a previous one, though you could argue the resolution doesn't deliver as hard as it should and if you are in for the mystery then you will most certainly find it unsatisfying as hell.
>And you were right on that, but it's all about the journey.
I'm sad I didn't get to experience Ange's journey because I think I would have really enjoyed it. Sadly, the whole simulation nonsense had to get mixed in with it. Chapter 2 felt off, which was a similar feeling to Chapter 2 in Higurashi where we just start the story, with no explanation as to how things are back to normal. My fears were founded then so I didn't want a repeat in Umineko, hence I dipped. >no future chapter retroactively shits on a previous one
Do you mean that the answers arc doesn't dedicate an entire chapter to revisiting a chapter from the questions arc? Chapter 6 in Higurashi might have absolutely ruined Chapter 1 for me but Higurashi also provided us with Chapter 5; I was a little let down with Chapter 2s ending, finding the villain to be worse than an alternative, with explanations given to be very weak. Oh boy was I ecstatic when I found out that my criticisms were actually perfectly explained away in Chapter 5. I didn't know how answers worked at the time but I had an amazing time with Chapter 5, which is a shame that Umineko doesn't provide that sort of experience, even if it might retroactively ruin other moments.
>Do you mean that the answers arc doesn't dedicate an entire chapter to revisiting a chapter from the questions arc?
The closest thing is Ep7 vaguely answering to unsolved questions from Ep1 to Ep6's colored truth debates and Kinzo backstory. You can get more detailed answers in the manga if you care about it.
>You can get more detailed answers in the manga if you care about it.
I'm aware of the existence of the manga but most posters in Umineko threads act like it doesn't and shouldn't exist.
Again, I've only read the first 2 chapters so I can't exactly focus on the themes of the latter portion of the story but looking up the answers to the murders in Chapter 1 & 2 is fricking insulting. I was sold on Umineko being a love letter to the golden age of murder mystery but what I get instead is a story that shits all over the mystery genre's rules and conventions, with extreme contrivances and chicanery through the use of confabulation. It's frankly appalling; no wonder both author and fans want to sweep that shit under the rug.
>Chapter 2 was also extremely intriguing regarding what the frick was happening. I definitely would have read on but it was written by Ryukishi so I didn't have any faith in him delivering on the set-up of Chapter 2
And you were right on that, but it's all about the journey.
If anything I can tell you that no future chapter retroactively shits on a previous one, though you could argue the resolution doesn't deliver as hard as it should and if you are in for the mystery then you will most certainly find it unsatisfying as hell.
>tfw only moron subhumans hate this series. >tfw they have literally no proof otherwise other then deliberate misquotes and being full fricking moron. >tfw they won't stop even though they have proven themselves legally moronic
In the west it's not socially acceptable to normalgays to like VNs or anime without extremely high levels of irony. Western VN authors are always desperate to pretend they're not like those other (Japanese, low-status) VNs.
westoid shit is shit no question about that, but anyone talking about or using umineko images in 2024 is mentally ill.
Even shitposters use better content and have moved on, its just mental illness at this point. They invested so much time into reading this slop that the denial hit so hard they're spending their entire lives on it now.
Yet you point out an account that's clearly a troony, you troon obsessed literal moron homosexual lmao, better stop enjoying everything trannies do so you don't end up castrated lmao! Imagine having a mental breakdown when you can't understand the purpose of a plot.
Not the first anon. Also please read your posts again, you're completely unhinged.
umineko is not japanese, it is virtually western(by the fans' own admissions") and nu-western pozzed slop at that
a single look at pic related tells you all you need to know about umineko and the kind of "people" it attracts
Yet you point out an account that's clearly a troony, you troon obsessed literal moron homosexual lmao, better stop enjoying everything trannies do so you don't end up castrated lmao! Imagine having a mental breakdown when you can't understand the purpose of a plot.
>Trannies play Umineko, a game in which a person with fricked up genitals proceeds to lose it and cause the death of many >They somehow love it
Another example that proves those who lie so much they deceive themselves can warp anything to their taste.
Anons will seethe at this but it's true that there's a much bigger bulk of trannies in this fanbase than almost any other big game. Except Celeste maybe
>Read TsukiRE >Arc route pretty okay, burgerdate/10 >Okay, time for boring as frick Ciel route >Ciel route has the best version of Arcueid >New characters like Noel and Mario which fleshes out the Church >Cat fights >New e-girl vamp >End of EVA ending >Hybrid vamp shiki >Become bros with Roa >Defeat God
What the frick?
I'm sorry but I loved it aside from no become Arcueid's underling bad end.
Will be nice to read the "low level" version in far side in 2030 though. But I doubt it, Arcueid hinted at turbid water at the mansion, the doctor isn't explained why she has dead apostle blood vaccines, and Nasu wants to bring back Nero, welcome to another ride of over the top ROUTES friend.
most of the game was written pre 2015, Nasu then locked it away to focus on FGO and only took it back out after 2020 to finish things off
It's incredibly tonally inconsistent because of htat
>why has the genre that's bottom of the barrel in all categories not evolved
It evolved at the inception of vidya. CYOA books became actual vidya of all genres, from RPG to FPS. Then some hacks went "hey remember CYOA books? I bet we could make bank hiring the bare minimum and selling it as porn", and then we got VNs.
Not him but in Zork you're generally trying to figure out what to do to solve a puzzle by typing shit into the parser while in a CYOA all the choices are listed for you and you have to figure out the best one so it's a different experience
>Evolved
More like killed off. Audiences wanted big flashy games with high definition graphics and little substance instead of something ambitious like Fabled Lands. There are barely any video games with the same feel as 80s gamebooks aside from direct adaptions. RPGs sure but the vast majority of RPGs don't use dice rolls the way gamebooks did and generally play differently. FPS games? no fricking way.
No one died, it was all an insurance scam for Eva that simultaneously let the rest of the family run away on boats with the gold. Battler was supposed to go pick up Ange but fell in the water.
umineko is the deepest and most well written story of all time though?
I posted it because it is one of the few outliers
if your VN has porn meant for erotic consumption it doesn't have artistic integrity
Incel take. Having sex is part of the human experience and part of the greatest pieces of art ever made.
>Having sex is part of the human experience
So is taking a shit, yet it's not something sane people want to see scenes of
>if your VN has porn meant for erotic consumption it doesn't have artistic integrity
Nah.
Also Umineko is shit and CROSS†CHANNEL is high art.
have a nice day
I agree with you partially but have a nice day regardless
Umineko is extremely shit when it comes to writing. Anyone jerking off this troony garbage has never read a good novel in his entire life.
The prose indeed isn't very good but the writing overall is one of the best things the medium has to offer.
>one of the best things the medium has to offer
That would be something like S;G or WA2, Umineko is just a bad mess.
>S;G
The absolute state. How do you tards out yourselves so consistently?
Umineko isn't even a good story. Prose has nothing to do with it.
What's bad about it, exactly?
In my opinion terribly handled themes, manipulative messages that rely on strawmen the entire time. Stupid chuuni tone throughout all of it but I could look past it if the themes were well written.
Want an example? Ange EP4/8. Everything that has to do with her delusions or lack thereof is not done well. The cruel goats in EP4 calling her out at school are actually very reasonable classmates rightfully criticizing Ange for not doing her tasks. The entire dilemma about magic and shit surrounding Ange is, in truth, a very straightforward "maybe stop bullying the traumatized orphan everyday, buttholes" situation. Don't get me started on MUH INTELLECTUAL RAPE.
The most infuriating part would be Eva's redemption in EP8 when she pretty much should have gone to jail for how horribly she mistreated and carefully destroyed Ange. Seriously, reread EP4 and keep in mind that Ange fricking dies at the end of it due to Eva's deliberate setup. Just INSANE.
You're absolutely correct. The attempt at rehabilitating Eva in the eyes of the reader was what I most disliked about the ending of Umineko. She's a despicable c**t of a person.
Umineko is incredibly lenient towards murderers and horrible people. There's a difference between not being obsessed with revenge and validating monsters who ruined many lives on purpose because THEY'RE ACTUALLY HUMAN THEY HAVE FEELINGS BRO
>Seriously, reread EP4 and keep in mind that Ange fricking dies at the end of it due to Eva's deliberate setup.
I'd like to see you argue that in court.
This is a book...
That's more than yours will ever be.
>The cruel goats in EP4 calling her out at school are actually very reasonable classmates rightfully criticizing Ange for not doing her tasks.
imagine being this moronic
Alright, tell me how this is wrong. I remember their concerns and Ange's destructive autism being very legitimate.
Or you could call me a loveless goat like every Uminekogay does when you criticize their bible.
>muh loveless goat
no, I will just say that you're autistic if you think that any of that was "very reasonable"
What did you expect from media illiterate speed readers?
Read the goat scene, which I'm referring to. They're just calling her out for not doing her fricking tasks.
Even the screen you posted is really a bunch of semi legitimate complaints covered in dozens of *evil cackle* and other "I'm very evil in case the reader didn't notice" shit. They're cartoonishly evil, but that only makes the legitimate points stand out. R07 can only write strawmen.
>the high school bullies are acting like bullies
Wow! I am surprised!
That's my point. R07 believes he tackled on themes of truth and escapism and delivered well written insights about it, when in truth he just wrote "evil bullies who cackle and act evil... are bad"
>r07 believes he
That's not the argument. Stop trying to push goalposts. Your claim was that the bullies were being reasonable and understanding when it's clear they weren't here(or earlier in the story for that matter. )
I don't think you should talk about what his intentions are if you can't even read the basics of the story correctly.
Again, the goat scene is conflating MUH EVIL GOATS with reasonable criticism, which is what I'm referring to. It could be that it was always meant to be about how sneaky vicious school bully manipulate you with words, if you want. But if it is, then like I said, Umineko once again shoots itself in the foot by replacing the meat of the themes with "evil bullies are evil". Great story champ.
How are you deliberately confusing an ELEMENT of the story with the MESSAGE of the story? The bullies are an element to the story in which causes Ange to go through mental duress. Even if you were to say that the bullies "were acting responsibly" (which was already proven wrong), it is still a middle schooler who lost THEIR ENTIRE FAMILY out of nowhere. It would make logical sense that Ange would be behaving irrationally and emotionally if they "were just being nice" but either way you are incorrect in your assessment. You can also oversimplify and generalize any piece of media to make it sound worse than it is. At least try to use a valid piece of criticism about the characters, the narrative, the setting, the motives etc. Here I will be the high school bullies in this situation, your posts are fricking trash and you need to do better.
You fundamentally misunderstand my point.
The bullies being cartoonishly evil means we can't have this truth and escapism debate setup, because the obvious priority is "these are just insane monsters, regardless of the larger debate, so we're not addressing that debate at all when we're showing these guys"
And the other scenario where the bullies actually have a legitimate point rather than just being evil bad guys still means they're portrayed as insanely evil which detracts the points they could be making.
There's no winning with R07's juvenile writing style, really.
Because your "point" has no validation or support for it.
You are treating your interpretation of an element of the story as if it is the one true objective way to perceive it, which goes against the message of the story. IE, you didn't get it and speed read it.
>carefully avoids addressing any of my points
Yeah I figured as much.
>He made literally no hostile actions. He didn't even have a weapon on him, how could he have shot her back?
>You really can't think he might have had the Tokarev for the potential manufacturing of a situation where it looks like the Sumaderas massacred each other? It's one tool among many and he was clearly prepared for multiple eventualities. Ange was the one who immediately extrapolated that to her own death.
>Magic is a preferential method of thinking. You are choosing to think the worst of Amakusa.
He jumped at his gun to shoot Ange. Ange shot him before he could shoot. Reread the scene. The sniper was meant for the aunt, but he used the gun in that scene since he was forced to.
If you blatantly misunderstand and misremember elements of the story that's not for me to refute. Scroll above and see how plenty of people have proven you wrong about how the bullies were nice and understanding.
>He jumped at his gun to shoot Ange.
No, he did not.
Yeah, definitely innocent behavior lmao. Quote the part where Ange knows he has a handgun in his pocket too, homosexual.
But I guess we're supposed to believe the ending of EP4 with the stakes has no meaning at all and this entire scene is just bullshit.
I'm not surprised, this is really the only way to make Umineko work. Rewrite it.
ESL doesn't understand basic wording and rewrites his posts. Your claim was "he jumped at his gun to shoot ange"
You really are not doing yourself any favors by misrepresenting and changing the claim behind your posts in every response.
Yeah I'm sure he was trying to just run. Not shoot Ange. Obviously jumping to cover would ensure his long term safety, it was surely a better move than trying to rush Ange and grab the gun from her. He clearly wasn't trying to frick with her aim so he could shoot first, no, he just thought jumping behind a wall would make Ange stop trying to murder him. He had no intent of using his gun!
>makes up another paragraph misrepresenting his claims that have already been disproven
You didn't read Umineko
"Man tries to not let himself be shot in the heart, this clearly implies guilt".
He was trying to distract the cute little traumatized aristocrat so he could get out of CERTAIN DEATH, of course he's going to try to quick talk.
This ending was all in Ange's head while she was on the building the night before. The story transitions to magic ending which is the true ending. This is the only way you can explain how someone as paranoid as Ange can come to accept her shitty life.
The midwit doesn't know what they're talking about again! Imagine my surprise!
Are you aware that bullying is an extremely real part of japanese school culture and that bullies who are good at what they do always make a habit of pretending to be friendly and reasonable to cast doubt whenever a person of authority might investigate?
That's not the point here. R07 wrote a good story about bullying in Higanbana. Umineko doesn't want to be about bullying, it pretends to be about our relationship with truth and the past. But it's actually about a bunch of morons doing stupid shit.
The "point" is that Ange was tormented by others, but worse still she was tormented by herself. Yes she had a shitty upbringing, yes she had no friends and Eva failed to be the mother she needed and the world continues to puppet the corpses of her family in increasingly gruesome ways.
But she can escape that. She can choose to believe better. She can rise above pessimism, release the suffocating grasp of the past, and move on with her life believing that her family could have been good people who loved her, and not murderous caricatures. She doesn't have to forgive her bullies, but she can forget them instead of letting them live in her head and heart, weaving macabre stories about massacring them with demons and the like.
The morals that Umineko deals with is grief. The reality is that nothing about the Rokkenjima Massacre matters to Ange. It happened, it's done with, the past will not change regardless of truth. She could seek the final truth and die once she accepts it, or she could just think better of it and go do something else, anything else. Like become a writer and a philanthropist.
>she can escape that
No. Not when you have dozens of men whose job is making sure you never get any social contact. Not when your alleged mass murderer aunt is doing everything she can to make you suffer. Not when the classmates are, according to you, cartoonishly evil bullies who flip flop between sneaky gaslighting about chores and telling Ange "LOL YOUR PARENTS DEAD THEY KILLED EVERYONE LMAOO".
This isn't executed properly to give this legitimate internal arc you're talking about. At least not for me. It shoots itself in the foot at every turn. Erika is another example of a weird strawman. Either you're a magicgay or you're a cartoonish intellectual rapist.
My biggest gripe is the trick ending being shown as the bad one when it's really just Ange finding out all these monsters want her dead and fighting back, instead of getting a free redo like in the Magic ending.
>My biggest gripe is the trick ending being shown as the bad one when it's really just Ange finding out all these monsters want her dead and fighting back
Bro.
She kills the closest thing she has to a friend out of pure paranoia from overthinking her situation.
You're delusional. He was going to kill her. He killed her in EP4. He tried to shoot her in 8 Trick Ending (no, that wasn't a legitimate defense reaction). Notice how the only scenario where he doesn't try to kill her is if she gives her money to them.
>He killed her in EP4.
Things that never happened.
>He tried to shoot her in 8 Trick Ending (no, that wasn't a legitimate defense reaction).
He tried to hide behind cover because she was pointing a fricking gun at him. He made literally no hostile actions. He didn't even have a weapon on him, how could he have shot her back?
You really can't think he might have had the Tokarev for the potential manufacturing of a situation where it looks like the Sumaderas massacred each other? It's one tool among many and he was clearly prepared for multiple eventualities. Ange was the one who immediately extrapolated that to her own death.
Magic is a preferential method of thinking. You are choosing to think the worst of Amakusa.
>Things that never happened
Everything points at it. Just like Yasu is the would-be culprit based on the hints and mystery and narration, the white haired homosexual was going to murder Ange.
You could think that, or you could not think that.
That's not how it works. Umineko has rules, red truths and more. Narrator can't do whatever he wants. And so on. This is why we know for a fact how Yasu was going to be the culprit, that there is a bomb, and everything Will says in 7. This also includes the meaning of EP4 and the shooting scene in EP8.
More straight forward: You can't just decide to ignore plot points to pretend Amakusa isn't a monster, just because it ruins the message and makes it look stupid. You're rewriting Umineko because these plot points are bad. Honestly the best admission of R07's hackery I've seen.
Red truth only works when you're creating a story. It doesn't apply to Ange's world. The meaning of EP4 is to not let your imagination consume you and forget to live your life, that anything going on that you haven't seen specifically might never have happened at all. The Trick ending is to not let your wild suspicions consume you and incite murderous disaster.
The only reason to think that Amakusa means to kill Ange is because you choose to believe Okonogi and Amakusa are bad people ruled by money. Perhaps they are, perhaps they aren't. Perhaps you can even make a bayesian inference to assert it is more likely that they are than they aren't.
But you cannot say it with absolute certainty.
The reason I believe Amakusa sniped Ange's ass is because EP4 shows everyone dying from "stakes" and then it cuts to black from Ange's perspective. And Amakusa has a sniper. And a suspicious gun. And tries to outgun Ange on the boat (unless you think he was just going to jump in the sea, lmao)
Stop being delusional and accept the plot points R07 set up himself.
>The reason I believe Amakusa sniped Ange's ass is because EP4 shows everyone dying from "stakes" and then it cuts to black from Ange's perspective.
Congratulations, you have been bewitched. You should KNOW by now that Ryukishi is trying to guide your thoughts one way by portraying things in incomplete, preferential ways.
Of course both options are possible. It's a blue truth. It's a choice, a call you're free to make. You simply choose violence and negativity, much like Ange does.
Your truth is to always see the worst in people and never for a moment allow your guard to go down.
You loveless intellectual rapist.
If you're FORCED to pick the moronic theory and assume the narrator just randomly cuts to black and other bullshit for the story to not be abhorrent, then it's just a shit story.
Picking the rational likeliest option makes the entire ending terrible. This isn't how you write a story.
OR it's a fricking story about metanarratives and how the author gives information while the audience interprets it, either with or without love.
Umineko is working on one level higher than you.
I swear to god, some people work so fricking hard just to NOT THINK.
>story forces you 100% into a moronic theory that invalidates all the previous hints for no reason other than damage control for the terrible ending
>criticize this
>WOOO WHAT A GOAT I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THE 4D CHESS WRITING
Umineko is motte and bailey in novel form. Based nips not taking the bait.
forces you 100% into a moronic theory that invalidates all the previous hints for no reason other than damage control for the terrible ending
NTA anon but could you explain how?
You have to disregard all obvious interpretations of Amakusa killing Ange in EP4 and trying to kill her in EP8 for the trick ending to actually be bad
Wait.....you're telling me that a story that is about interpreting media is allowing you to interpret it which is the entire concept of the fricking story?
You're not allowed to interpret it as you want. Either you pick the "everyone is such a beautiful nice guy and it was all a misunderstanding", or you end up with Ange befriending murderous psychos, which is awful.
Either you pick "maybe everyone is actually nice" or you have Ange BECOMING a murderous psycho (in the name of self-defense, of course!).
If you pick "maybe this grown ass soldier Amakusa is a murderer", you end up with Ange's legitimate self defense move being portrayed as evil and paranoid. What a joke.
You don't have to interpret it that way. You can choose negativity and violence, as I said. You are allowed to say that Amakusa's perplexed expression was his astonishment at Ange being able to figure it out just from a gun. You can interpret her shooting the boatman as warranted, after all it's more likely that he's been bought off so he won't talk later.
> You are not allowed to interpret THEORETICAL WAYS THAT EVENTS COULD'VE GONE THROUGH how you want when that's the point of Umineko.
Fricking plebian, get filtered and go back to R3ddit for your source. What's the point of a mystery genre if you aren't able to interpret things how they appear to YOU?
Can you even read, moron? My point is that you CAN'T choose what to interpret. That's why posters ITT are all trying desperately to push the stupid "it was all a misunderstanding" theory. Because if it's not, it makes both magic and trick end worse, because Ange befriends her murderers in the former and does nothing wrong in the latter, despite the narration telling you otherwise. Uminekogays NEED Amakusa to be a good boy.
Tell me where its set in stone in Umineko that you CAN'T come up with your own fan theories? Holy shit turdface, that's the WHOLE POINT OF THE GENRE, ahahahahaha.
Are you genuinely underage? How hard is it to understand the issue isn't autistic theory crafting but the fact that one theory shits on the themes and make the story stupid?
Almost any theory regarding Rokkenjima incident are legitimately all right/wrong at the same time, they are all theories, not facts.
But the reason "you believe" something has been proven wrong plenty of times in the thread.
>Read the goat scene, which I'm referring to.
I don't know which scene you're referring to since you've talked about "the cruel goats in EP4" despite the fact that the only scenes with Ange and the goats are in EP8, IIRC.
>Even the screen you posted is really a bunch of semi legitimate complaints covered in dozens of *evil cackle* and other "I'm very evil in case the reader didn't notice" shit.
No, it's the opposite, it's just classic passive-agrgresive bully rhetoric disguised as "legitimate complaints". As I've said, you just sound autistic.
(also they're not "calling her out for not doing her fricking tasks", they're just seething because her low grades are lowering the class' average")
You're wasting your time anon, I already posted the evidence of her being bullied in the thread in video form and they are either too stupid or proud to admit that they are wrong.
The girls become goat shadows in EP4 at some point, and in this scene that completely villifies them they make decent points.
still can't find which scene you're talking about
https://lparchive.org/Umineko-no-Naku-Koro-ni/
Can you show me where it vilifies them?
Goat sprites and mannerisms.
I'll search for it later if thread is still up. I remember that scene near the end of the school part.
Oh so you are saying that you again, have no fricking clue what you are talking about.
Why are you trying so hard with posts containing so little? Honestly comes off as insecure.
Why are you arguing for something you have no knowledge of? Honestly comes off as mentally incompetent.
Like I said, it's kinda pathetic how many times you keep name calling instead of discussing the actual work. How old are you dude? Get a grip.
Name calling? Do you think that someone who is blissfully ignoring evidence presented against them is a sign of anything else other than mental incompetence?
https://lparchive.org/Umineko-no-Naku-Koro-ni/Update%20117/
https://lparchive.org/Umineko-no-Naku-Koro-ni/Update%20118/
At least try to use a compelling argument besides your own ignorance.
Where is the name-calling here anon? And where did the words on the internet hurt you?
Spamming "YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT MY CHINESE CARTOON BOOK YOU SPEEDREADER" like 10 times while refusing to discuss calmly is:
1. Juvenile
2. Pointless
3. Makes you look a lot worse than anyone you call an evil speedreader. It's a book lmao, why so mad?
I'll reiterate: for your sake, get a grip.
I accept your concession anon.
Yeah, please stick with these kinds of oneliners. They make you look a little saner.
Anon you were losing an argument and cried about name calling on an anonymous image board. It just an objective truth that you do not and continue to not know what you are blabbering on about. Why do anything else?
Where did I spam? That was my second post. You have posted more often (and incorrectly I might add). You have yet to post anything worthwhile to support your claims besides your already proven wrong memories.
Well maybe you should read the story again since you dont know what you are talking about.
How is "this group is meanies - Ange" disproving the fact that what they say in the goat scene is pretty reasonable?
What's with the autistic filename? You can discuss without calling people names instantly, you know.
You can't read file names either huh? Thanks for proving my point anon.
Magic is nothing more than a preferential method of thinking. Ange's lingering on the past brought her suffering, the world's insistence that her family must have been terrible psychopaths fed bad cognitive behaviors. The only themes and messages to be given by the end was that she should avoid pessimism, cynicism, and unnecessary doubt, especially when it certainly won't do her any good to indulge in those emotions.
This is fine in principle. I just don't think Umineko crafted that in execution.
?si=cn3qpqbhBwpqJwV0
7:11:00
They sure seem nice here 🙂
Imagine being intellectually raped by ryukishi07. Bullies do shit like bullying because #1 they can #2 they don't get punished for it #3 they derive pleasure from hurting others in that manner. There's no logic behind bullying.
There is logic behind storytelling. Faulty logic, when it comes to Umineko.
Right and the logic of bullies picking on someone who is ostracized from their group due to their weird and antisocial behavior makes logical sense. Glad we figured that out!
The person you posted don't quite understand how serious Japanese bullying can get to a point of murder or suicide.
Are they being nice and reasonable? Can you tell me when they are in the story?
Funny meme, I upvote you kind sir!!!
You must be at least 18 etc
umineko isnt even a good vn. Maybe among english translated ones
But japanese language vns have a whole iceberg to go through
you say this every time and when they get translated they turn out to be mediocre
What do you want out of VNs, Anon?
a more widespread variety of genres and aesthetics (99% of VNs are trapped within the manga/LN/anime spectrum and all the story and character archetypes they imply); deeper experimentation with the interactive format
why do you waste hours upon hours only to coom to a still image and shitty writing?
It's hot
>why do you waste hours upon hours only to coom to a still image and shitty writing?
Complete waste of time to play a vn if it doesn't even have porn in it. Just go read a book.
are you also a woman who reads romance books full of shlock smut? people read to feel, to be captivated, to ponder and reflect; in other words, to savour the abstract aspects of life
to see the most abstract medium as nothing but an outlet to bus' a nut makes you nothing but a flesh automaton who's a slave to their desires. you probably have room temperature IQ
4 gay guys looking at each other
What the frick is wrong with these russki Black folk
>telling someone to go read a book because they don't read VNs with porn
What's next? Telling someone to watch a documentary because they like the game's setting?
russian god puts gays in this thread in their place
VNs should have made books obsolete
non-picture non-sound having garbage
complete waste of time to read a book, just play a VN
>a more widespread variety of genres and aesthetics
But we already have that.
>99% of VNs are trapped within the manga/LN/anime spectrum
Manga, LN and anime aren't genres.
>Manga, LN and anime aren't genres.
pedantics, you'd be delusional to think they aren't extremely similar in any way
Anon you're confusing mediums with genres. The similarities exit mainly because they're influenced by the same Japanese culture and because they're targeting the same demographic.
There are plenty of VNs that aren't what you are badly attempting to complain about.
There are also many Adventure games like that too. Eastern and Western.
No, I will not spoonfeed you in your thinly veiled recommendation thread.
Yes, you may seethe.
here OP, a lot of these games have gameplay and are in different genres. I personally recommend Hotel Dusk
https://vndb.org/g350?f=&fil=&l=&m=1&s=24w
https://vndb.org/g35?f=&fil=&l=&m=0&s=24w
>No, I will not spoonfeed you in your thinly veiled recommendation thread.
This isn't Ganker, Black person. You are allowed to give out recs and have recommendation threads
And? That means I should recommend to some lazy shit who can't even communicate properly and needs to do it behind 15 layers of irony?
Why are you even mad? Felt personally insulted? Are you that same kind of moron?
You sound insufferable
Unlike OP and you I am sure. You can just ask for recommendations normally next time. I doubt you actually have the capacity to learn anything considering your b***h tier response.
You are throwing a tantrum over someone giving out a recommendation after smugly declaring you are going to "spoonfeed" and telling OP to seethe
If casuals here really bother you, feel free to go back to /jp/ where your elitist circle are
wow you're a gay
Speaking of Hotel Dusk. Never read second vn. How is it?
more of the same. it's worth it i'd say.
You can read Proust or any big Ganker book, you know. Its almost free and you'll get more surface-level references in movies, anime and other mediums.
because writing good stories with massive differences depending on player interaction is a pain in the ass
main reason picrel has no player choice, it would be fricking impossible to write otherwise
vnshit is not video games
go to
and rpgay there
I play vns for the sex scenes
Read more VNs.
Or go play old adventure western games. that's literally where VNs spawned from
>Why can't R07shit evolve beyond otaku pornslop and western games drenched in irony?
Fixed that for you. Good thing I played S;G first otherwise I would've dropped VNs altogether.
>S;G
good bait
>S;G
Great VN
there is a niche of western text adventures, incredible small niche but nevertheless
the problem? can be pretty gay
i recommend inkle's sorcery, it's an honest adventure
cause vn's aren't games
what more would you do with it?
Casual eroge is its own market. When I play Yuzusoft games I do not expect a complex story with lots of twists, and if I got one I would actually be offended. That's why practically all Yuzusoft games are formulaic and reuse tropes from previous entries, it's completely intentional. The casual eroge space is mature and consistent because the products are consistent. You cannot have that with something like Umineko/Steins;Gate/Subahibi. Those works are extremely inconsistent in what the reader expects. Robotics;Notes sucked if you expected more Steins;Gate, even Steins;Gate 0 sucked if you expected more Steins;Gate. Games like Dies Irae are polarizing, meanwhile everybody that bought Senran Banka knew what they were buying.
that is a pretty indepth reply. I guess the VN audience wants more or less safe consumption?
If you are known to make decent casual eroge you have a lot of repeat customers. Yuzusoft games have been about the same quality since the mid 2000s because it is very easy to make consistent.
In contrast, look at Nitroplus which puts out more serious complex stories, they've made a few outstanding games in the past like Saya no Uta, Steins;Gate, Full Metal Daemon Muramasa. For each of these great Nitroplus works, there's a dozen very mediocre ones that never become popular.
There is a real business justification for running a company that pumps out a casual eroge every 2 years with an expected revenue. Most of the great VN works are either super risky, or labors of love by very small groups like 07th expansion.
VNs have faded from relevance.
uhh which one is a good start bros???
remove them all from your list and play Chiccha Love Apaato, there's a re-release on 26th
fata morgana (or tsukihime)
not him but ill try this tomorrow. I dropped it 2 years ago
Witch on the Holy Night then TsukiRe fan translation.
Umineko will take a SHIT LOAD of time
play needy girl overdose because its #essential_transcore
Fata Morgana is only good if you're a woman
subahibi
I feel like I'm in the minority who genuinely enjoys visual novels for its narrative and nonlinear storytelling and despise the inclusion of sex scenes. I can understand having some to show character's backstory, but almost all of them are just there purely for fap material.
Mahoyo is a good step in the right direction, have a great story featuring cute girls without needing any h-scenes.
Mahoyo is 12 years old.
28*
out of 10!
It's not H-scenes that are the problem, but them being inorganic. That's why Hollow Ataraxia's H-scenes are so much better than Stay Night's, they happen between people you know and who are in-universe lovers rather than the entire plot coming to a screeching halt because the creators were afraid that the reader would quit the VN if they didn't see sex every couple of hours.
>read ep4
>get hit with the kinzo reveal
The frick? So Krauss, Natsuhi, Nanjo and the eagled servants were LARPing this entire time? But why? Is anybody else in on it? Didn't Battler talk to him in ep2?
I'm not touching ep5 until I come up with a plausible explanation for this shit
Magic, b***h, don't have to explain shit.
Is what a BITCH would say!!
homie it's frickin magic.
Magic is real
t. Unironic magicgay.
Accept magic into your heart. We're the secret boss faction. Mystery Black folk are low IQ zombie thralls who enslave themselves to tropes and expectations - literally.
>secret faction
You're about to meet the true enemy of skeptic faction soon. The meta faction.
Don't trust anything the witch shows you, it's all a lie!!!
now get out of here before someone spoils you. you seem like the type of reader least deserving of having the mystery ruined
Mysteries are a gay waste of time. Anon. I need you to repeat after me: Magic is REAL. Free yourself from this burden and your brain from those wrinkles.
>But why? Is anybody else in on it?
Probably the one responsible for it, idiot.
Did you skip the entire episode 3? It was literally made for people like you.
I'm not reading that shit unless my dick gets hard
it depends do you like femdom?
Who is more annnoying? Uminekogays or Disco Elysium gays?
people who post redditjak gays.
I loved both but the best written game is Sunless Sea, though I can't say if the latest game released by that writer is better because I haven't played it yet.
Because if you can write a story like that you'll probably have better luck simply writing a book and reaching a more receptive audience this way. VN readers are composed of either coomers or morons who think titles like Wonderful Everyday are something more than just random pseudo intellectual garbage so there's simply no point in trying to deliver something that is actually good.
>vn thread
When does this game get good
>gaem
The only VNs I like are Ace Attorney, Snatcher, Policenauts, and Hotel Dusk.
Read S;G.
>
>are you also a woman who reads romance books full of shlock smut? people read to feel, to be captivated, to ponder and reflect;
I do all that when I fall in love with a e-girl and become aroused
Umineko is neither of those. Do you actually read VNs?
anime was a mistake
>posts a non-pornographic LN with no irony
Waifus sell, people don't give a frick if it doesn't have waifus or attractive characters in general.
Should I read Umineko or Tsukihime?
Umineko. Now get out of here.
Frick, wrong reply
Correcto:
-->
How did I manage to frick up the correction???
Tsuki is quite underwhelming. It's a slightly less hackneyed take on the same formula and energy as FSN. The poster child of a raw prototype that was okay with taking risks and upsetting people. The unpolished WN that becomes the sanitized LN.
Umineko is just a good VN. As in better than Tsukihime. If you're not willing to read Higurashi before umi then you might as well just read Tsuki
The best experiences, like Alternative, require prep work. Umi is no exception.
>umi isn't a direct sequel you don't have to read higu
It IS a direct sequel and you MUST read Higu and at least the bible
Umineko is great but really fricking long. Don't listen to the other poster, you don't need to read Higu. But you should have read some Agatha Christie and the Bible
Tsukihime is interesting, but you should probably read FS/N first. It's more chuuni, has more action and has bigger plot twists. It's longer too, but it's also more fast paced. Personally I liked Tsuki more, but it's less polished and more introspective. Tsuki-R hasn't adapted the best parts of Tsukihime yet.
Depends on what you want.
Needy Girl Overdose is only a couple of hours and is more of a videogame than a VN; it doesn't even have much reading, so you just get a few endings in an hour or two whenever you feel bored.
Tsukihime because it's much shorter and pretty straightforward since it doesn't try to throw cryptic bullshit at you like Umineko does
Also Umineko's story borrows a lot from Tsukihime
>Also Umineko's story borrows a lot from Tsukihime
Hahahahahahahahaa
Nice argument, moron
>Also Umineko's story borrows a lot from Tsukihime
lmao
People still make threads about Umineko. People don't make threads about any other VN. Make of that what you will
You should read Higurashi though. Only reason not to is that Umineko might seem a little mid in comparison.
I really wish there were more action oriented VNs out there. I remember reading through Dengeki Stryker and then getting kinda sad that there wasn't anything else out there quite like it. It'd be really cool to see some magical girl ones or some more mecha ones that aren't like, horror adjacent, too.
They could already exist and I could just be totally missing them because I'm blind as frick, but most of what I find seem to be either romance, horror or porn VNs.
but I like clannad
Only furshit games are unironic
Umineko is only good after you've read the manga
>Why can't blah blah blah
Already did.
Counter point: Magic IS real.
Prove it
Will saw magic outside the chapel. Will had the detective's authority. The magic was not a vision of someone he was interrogating
The same magic appears in the finale of Higurashi
Both uses of localised temporal manipulation are associated with (Fred)Rika Bernkastel
Higurashi cannot be explained without magic as Rika knew about the slippery tile.
These observations prove a number of things
1. Magic exists in higurashi
2. Rika has magic
3. The same magic exists in Umineko
4. Rika and Fredrika Bernkastel use the same magic, share the same name, worship as priestesses
5. Rika is Bern
6. Featherine is Hanyuu
7. Umineko is a direct sequel to Higurashi and anyone suggesting you read Umi first should be shot dead.
why is a glorified book so pricy though?
Trying to finish BS2.
Frick birbs.
Love me Dorothy and Lorina
Also shilling Baldr Sky because it's fricking 2D DMC with make-a-combo and mechs.
After reading Umineko not so long ago the reveal seems like the biggest wack that only possible under shit tone of circumstances. And even game itself tells you if you change even one detail the whole shit is collapsed on itself. Because of this I see why shit like Rosatrice exist. In fact, I'm inclined to believe that Krauss being the culprit is more likely than this whole thing.
What visual novels have natural h-scenes rather than "how do we make people buy our game? porn"
I like porn, don't get me wrong, but as I grow into my 30s I find myself more into the writing/contextual side of erotica rather than just the fap value and I feel like so many visual novels miss a huge opportunity there where games are just either entirely porn, or the game has an abrupt h-scene at the end of a route just to encourage people to play.
Swan Song
Why don't you like H scenes? Don't you have sex?
It's fine for a VN that serves solely as a vehicle for porn but if the focus is on a story that I'm actually invested in the only thing h scenes do is waste my fricking time, they're usually not even good enough to fap to anyway
>play YU-NO
>get to the other world
>protag's wife dies
>protag is devastated because he feels responsible for it happening
>not even a week later he fricks some random b***h in the oasis without a second thought
>this is all after he and his daughter almost died in the desert
>eventually ends up fricking his own daughter that conveniently has matured far faster than humans do
These scenes actually made the story worse
https://seacats.net/teaparty/res/44.html
IM NOT CLICKING THAT
>Why can't VNs evolve beyond otaku pornslop and western games drenched in irony?
VNs evolved into those things, like how animals keep evolving to crabs. In the 90s you had a ton of experimentation that dried out in the following decades. The early 00s benefited the most from this where all the now big name visual novels got to take advantage of this new creative space pioneered by the previous era of creators. It's similar to how blockbuster movies came from the New Hollywood wave. And just like in the film industry, this lead to stagnation and a tunneled focus on safe commercial products over risk taking.
I will be honest with you, I liked Umineko up until ep5 where they started to shift their focus from Rokkenjima to Meta-World and stopped the usual murder mystery formula
I liked ep7 the most because it was purely focusing on Rokkenjima and had little to no focus on the Meta-World and Ange (outside of the tea party), and Willard is actually competent unlike Battler
It has to do with the fact that 1-4 are where you are supposed to be gathering hints and think about the mystery, while 5-7 are basically crosschecking and receiving more background information that you couldn't really know otherwise - and finally 8 is really just about the message of the VN
>That bewildered look on Amakusa's face when his scheme was exposed. That was pretty good.
Umineko is shit and only liked by some very loud EOPs, japs hated it.
I wish joe played this game, it would be so fricking funny
who? am I supposed to know which eceleb this is?
witcher 3 video guy
...I saw your beato image and assume you were going to make a joe mama joke and I thought I should play along....
I thought that too Georgie
he literally got filtered by the Steam store page's screenshots kek
Really? Any sauce? moron got filtered by baby's first murder mystery (Danganronpa)
?t=2204
cheers anon
He somehow ALWAYS has the wrong takes
what he says after that clip is somehow even more moronic https://youtu.be/iWlp4ba9dtk?list=PLIUsXWF1inYsc4XGZT-nWhgndVts6dZoY&t=14941
Classic
That fricking stuttering hamster always makes my blood boil.
I've said it before but I think it's clear he doesn't enjoy certain japanese games (and that's fine) but he acts like a huge gay about it. There's nothing wrong with having preferences but he comes off across as consistently shitty with a lot of his sperg rants basically being
>Why does a japanese game set in japan having japanese things like maid cafes and mikos
He is though
Feb 29th
Been a while ever since I saw a Umineko thread on Ganker where people actually discuss what's written
But half of this thread has just been an anon who is arguing against the story based on their own faulty memory? I guess that irony is lost on them.
Better than getting flooded by schizos or making it about troonery.
I'd rather discuss the story with people who have actually read it, you're welcome to go back to being a schizo troony.
Not the one who is arguing with you. The threads have been in a terrible state for a while, so I'm glad to see it's pretty decent today.
Am I a schizo if I believe the Sayo is Ikuko interpretation?
Yes but I was thinking about schizos who spam the thread because they have a hateboner for umineko
That's the point
But being flooded by schizos or making it about troons isn't talking about it either you dumb Black person
umi shitcords aren't real posters
Because that's what people play visual novels for, dummy.
LOL lmaoooooooooo
i imagine you fat and disabled just like the rest of you from that shircord shithole, umi/higu special needs
are you bombarding me with blue truths hoping that one of them lands? I'm afraid I am neither of those things you listed. You can however call me a clown because I take pride in it
oh yes you're you special care kid
you and your other disabled friends will get polio
why deny the truth, italianon?
The presentation in the recent Nasu rewrites of Tsuki have been really good.
would you the original form of beatrice?
Bern's Purple Statements is the only good part of Umineko
Gotta admit I'm a little jealous of people who read Umineko. I tried to give it a fair shot but I quit after chapter 2; Chapter 1 was great (aside from Maria, I fricking hated her) and Chapter 2 was also extremely intriguing regarding what the frick was happening. I definitely would have read on but it was written by Ryukishi so I didn't have any faith in him delivering on the set-up of Chapter 2, especially not after coming from Higurashi and hating the reveals there. Chapter 1 (retroactively ruined by Chapter 6), Chapter 2, and Chapter 5 were phenomenal; thankfully 2 & 5 were isolated enough from everything else that they could work as their own thing so it wasn't ruined.
The latter park of the story (or when the story actually picks up) seems to be really interesting but his needless focus on creating mystery hurts the overall product by increasing the length of his work, turning it into a bloated behemoth, but also by creating a jarring and drastic tonal shift. He also constructed the story as he went which isn't great. I don't get the idea of creating 2 disparate parts to a VN when each part is already so winding.
You can see a clear change in the trajectory of the story when the cowriter/Ryukishi's best bud died. I wonder how the story would have progressed if he hadn't.
>the cowriter
Why the hell has the story surrounding BT gotten so weird? BT wasn't a fricking writer, he was nothing but a scripter who put the VNs together.
Yes he was Ryukishi's best friend, and first in line as far as his beta readers went, but BT was NOT a "cowriter". Any change in direction is from R07's grief over his passing, not a change in talent or the writer's pen.
Only read up to Chapter 2 so my experience shouldn't have been impacted given that the supposed co-writer was still around at that time, no? Still, Umineko was set up just like Higurashi where questions is a bunch of mystery for the sake of mystery and answers is a bunch of sloppy answers to the mystery with the actual story tacked on. I don't think the co-writer's death had much impact at all; the lack of an editor, however...
>And you were right on that, but it's all about the journey.
I'm sad I didn't get to experience Ange's journey because I think I would have really enjoyed it. Sadly, the whole simulation nonsense had to get mixed in with it. Chapter 2 felt off, which was a similar feeling to Chapter 2 in Higurashi where we just start the story, with no explanation as to how things are back to normal. My fears were founded then so I didn't want a repeat in Umineko, hence I dipped.
>no future chapter retroactively shits on a previous one
Do you mean that the answers arc doesn't dedicate an entire chapter to revisiting a chapter from the questions arc? Chapter 6 in Higurashi might have absolutely ruined Chapter 1 for me but Higurashi also provided us with Chapter 5; I was a little let down with Chapter 2s ending, finding the villain to be worse than an alternative, with explanations given to be very weak. Oh boy was I ecstatic when I found out that my criticisms were actually perfectly explained away in Chapter 5. I didn't know how answers worked at the time but I had an amazing time with Chapter 5, which is a shame that Umineko doesn't provide that sort of experience, even if it might retroactively ruin other moments.
>Do you mean that the answers arc doesn't dedicate an entire chapter to revisiting a chapter from the questions arc?
The closest thing is Ep7 vaguely answering to unsolved questions from Ep1 to Ep6's colored truth debates and Kinzo backstory. You can get more detailed answers in the manga if you care about it.
>You can get more detailed answers in the manga if you care about it.
I'm aware of the existence of the manga but most posters in Umineko threads act like it doesn't and shouldn't exist.
Again, I've only read the first 2 chapters so I can't exactly focus on the themes of the latter portion of the story but looking up the answers to the murders in Chapter 1 & 2 is fricking insulting. I was sold on Umineko being a love letter to the golden age of murder mystery but what I get instead is a story that shits all over the mystery genre's rules and conventions, with extreme contrivances and chicanery through the use of confabulation. It's frankly appalling; no wonder both author and fans want to sweep that shit under the rug.
Uu
>Chapter 2 was also extremely intriguing regarding what the frick was happening. I definitely would have read on but it was written by Ryukishi so I didn't have any faith in him delivering on the set-up of Chapter 2
And you were right on that, but it's all about the journey.
If anything I can tell you that no future chapter retroactively shits on a previous one, though you could argue the resolution doesn't deliver as hard as it should and if you are in for the mystery then you will most certainly find it unsatisfying as hell.
How do I play umineko with the old sprites?
jp has dl links for the originals on their 07th Expansion general.
07th mod or Umineko Project. Both have easy tutorials on their website.
>old sprites
>umineko project
moron
Old sprites could be PS3 sprites
Because it's cheaper and easier to publish a book or as weebs like to call them light novel.
>tfw only moron subhumans hate this series.
>tfw they have literally no proof otherwise other then deliberate misquotes and being full fricking moron.
>tfw they won't stop even though they have proven themselves legally moronic
>and western games drenched in irony
Huh? That's true. Why is western VNs drenched in so much irony?
In the west it's not socially acceptable to normalgays to like VNs or anime without extremely high levels of irony. Western VN authors are always desperate to pretend they're not like those other (Japanese, low-status) VNs.
westoid shit is shit no question about that, but anyone talking about or using umineko images in 2024 is mentally ill.
Even shitposters use better content and have moved on, its just mental illness at this point. They invested so much time into reading this slop that the denial hit so hard they're spending their entire lives on it now.
what, do vns have fricking sell-by dates now? can't talk about em past a certain arbitrary time length?
rosatrice was kino and better than the official theory
yes i will always be mad
why is nobody addressing the shameful attempt to redeem ev*
Eva was never evil, she was just a neurotic b***h who couldn't deal with her trauma
She killed a 17 year old and gloated about it.
Not the first anon. Also please read your posts again, you're completely unhinged.
You are losing it anon, take your meds.
umineko is not japanese, it is virtually western(by the fans' own admissions") and nu-western pozzed slop at that
a single look at pic related tells you all you need to know about umineko and the kind of "people" it attracts
Not a fan of judging a work by its fanbase but Umineko's is especially egregious.
> It has western aesthetics and inspiration.
> Therefore its western slop.
> Made by a Japanese???
> TRANNIES LIKE IT REEE!!!
Trannies like beer, trannies like your call of doowdies, trannies like your animu and vidya. You are a troony aren't you? TRANNIES! REEE!!!!
Honestly I'm thinking about people like you when I say "egregious fanbase", way before the troons.
Yet you point out an account that's clearly a troony, you troon obsessed literal moron homosexual lmao, better stop enjoying everything trannies do so you don't end up castrated lmao! Imagine having a mental breakdown when you can't understand the purpose of a plot.
they/xir/>she also likes your favourite game, I guess you have to hate it now!
Why are there so many anons who like to get mad for no reason?
Isn’t umineko as long as the bible?
Look up Cooking Companions.
>Trannies play Umineko, a game in which a person with fricked up genitals proceeds to lose it and cause the death of many
>They somehow love it
Another example that proves those who lie so much they deceive themselves can warp anything to their taste.
yasu didn't kill anyone
she did lay out rifles for the adults to snatch up.
Nothing happened on the island besides it exploding up, they all played a longcon prank on Ange.
He's responsible for planning a murder and facilitating it by telling everyone about the bomb and everything.
The massacre would have happened even without Yasu's involvement. This is proved by what happens in Lion's fragment in Episode 7
>umitrannies aren't real chud, you're a shizo11!!!
how autistic do you have to be to make a collage like that?
>Thinking that autist is an insult on Ganker
>Talking shit about screencaps on Ganker
have a nice day Black personhomosexual
seethe more
back to discord
So are Narutotrannies, Onepiss trannies and so on, what's your fricking point?
I miss digi
Anons will seethe at this but it's true that there's a much bigger bulk of trannies in this fanbase than almost any other big game. Except Celeste maybe
Does liking Silence of the Lambs make you a troony?
>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO UMITRANNIES ARE NOT REAL THEY ARE JUST A FIGMENT OF YOUR IMAGINATION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>going on reddit
I think we found the umitroony.
I literally had to look for a while to find the trans reference. You are mentally ill homie, unironically. Seek help.
Because you can't one up baldr sky
>Read TsukiRE
>Arc route pretty okay, burgerdate/10
>Okay, time for boring as frick Ciel route
>Ciel route has the best version of Arcueid
>New characters like Noel and Mario which fleshes out the Church
>Cat fights
>New e-girl vamp
>End of EVA ending
>Hybrid vamp shiki
>Become bros with Roa
>Defeat God
What the frick?
Welcome to Type Moon powercreep, everything is over the top and feels like bullshit.
Roa moment was the only salvageable part in hours of that shit.
I'm sorry but I loved it aside from no become Arcueid's underling bad end.
Will be nice to read the "low level" version in far side in 2030 though.
But I doubt it, Arcueid hinted at turbid water at the mansion, the doctor isn't explained why she has dead apostle blood vaccines, and Nasu wants to bring back Nero, welcome to another ride of over the top ROUTES friend.
Powercreep? That's more like a power jump. Powercreep is a slowburn effect where everything ramps up after each fight.
most of the game was written pre 2015, Nasu then locked it away to focus on FGO and only took it back out after 2020 to finish things off
It's incredibly tonally inconsistent because of htat
>ryukishi slop
>good
SMALL BOMBS IN THE FOOD
I refuse to explain
>why has the genre that's bottom of the barrel in all categories not evolved
It evolved at the inception of vidya. CYOA books became actual vidya of all genres, from RPG to FPS. Then some hacks went "hey remember CYOA books? I bet we could make bank hiring the bare minimum and selling it as porn", and then we got VNs.
> CYOA books.
Text adventure games were one of the first computer adventure games you fricking idiot, remember zork and the like?
Not him but in Zork you're generally trying to figure out what to do to solve a puzzle by typing shit into the parser while in a CYOA all the choices are listed for you and you have to figure out the best one so it's a different experience
it's literally cyoa with additional an time wasting puzzle
>Evolved
More like killed off. Audiences wanted big flashy games with high definition graphics and little substance instead of something ambitious like Fabled Lands. There are barely any video games with the same feel as 80s gamebooks aside from direct adaptions. RPGs sure but the vast majority of RPGs don't use dice rolls the way gamebooks did and generally play differently. FPS games? no fricking way.
No one died, it was all an insurance scam for Eva that simultaneously let the rest of the family run away on boats with the gold. Battler was supposed to go pick up Ange but fell in the water.
That explains the whole "i'm gonna fall i'm gonna fall" foreshadowing
>2024
>Still no phase 2
Did nothing wrong
>#1 profile pic of umineko troony audience
it's so over for bern
You think I give a frick about what troons like?
bernsister, don't be mad, it's just suspicious considering the company you hang around...
If you let any group of people dictate what you should like or dislike, you are a little b***h.
Sex with Auntie Rosa