Why did Sonic cause so much seething from the gaming community in the 2000s?
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Why did Sonic cause so much seething from the gaming community in the 2000s?
Why did Sonic cause so much seething from the gaming community in the 2000s?
CRIME Shirt $21.68 |
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Sonic sucks
Original sonic games are good. I don't even think the 3D games are that terrible, but the 2D games are better. It's the fanbase that is cringe. If you say "I like Sonic" people will assume you're one of the memelord edgeposters.
>Teleports behind you
>Nothing personal kid
UuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuUUUUUUUUUuuuu Take that back!! Sonic is cool!!!!!
Sonic has been dead since they moved to 3D.
More like Sonic has been dead since they haphazardly reinvented the series to score Japan points (and failed) in spite of previous worldwide acclaim.
>they haphazardly reinvented the series to score Japan points (and failed)
Eh. It worked initially, as SA1 was the first time Japan actually showed signs of giving a shit about the series.
Funnily, Japan immediately went back to not giving a shit with SA2 onward, leaving everyone else with a partially-re-invented IP they didn't ask for.
I wouldn't be too shocked if something similar happened with the next mainline game. Sonic Team sticks with the open world approach because it somehow got the attention of both the west AND Japan for once, but makes the game more "traditional" in design and presentation (in relation to other games in the series) as a response to fan requests, causing Japan to lose interest in Sonic once again because they were never interested in "traditional Sonic" in the first place.
Because fans wanted to continue loving Sonic and his games, but Sonic Team kept producing turd after turd after sonic adventure 2
Adventure 2 was the turd that ruined the franchise. I don't know why sonic fans all of a sudden are praising SA2, 06, and Unleashed.
>Adventure 2 was the turd that ruined the franchise.
Adventure 2 was half finished when sega collapsed, it's a miracle the game is even half decent. It's not to blame for the games going to shit, it's a casualty of sega going to shit. That being said, Heroes the first game after they got their shit together to make a new game for the multiplat crowd is complete fricking shit. They aimed for a new audience and it shows the game is shit and that's the sonic most zoomers now know sadly.
>why sonic fans all of a sudden are praising SA2, 06, and Unleashed.
Didn't SA2 get good reviews when it first released? And people have always said that the day stages in unleashed were good.
sonic fans will consume dogshit to reach the 1/3 of the game that's deceent and call the game 'peak' i hate these frickers so much
i can name 5 games better than sa2 released after it
Imagine how stinky his feet must be
I don't need to imagine it
Sonic is like a living plushie doll, how the frick do you godless freaks get off to him.
Everything after SA1 has been trash. It's a shame how much good the formula was, only to ruin it with SA2 and everything after it.
Because Shadow is everybody's favorite but after Marvel started making movies it became the meta to make fun of edgy/serious things. So they started making Sonic cutesy again to follow the curve and it didn't fricking work out
Jeff Fowler's gonna fix that this Christmas.
>seething from the gaming community
No one was "seething", that's just zoomer copium revisionism. Reviewers and (mostly older) fans alike were just confused and disgusted by how shitty 3D Sonic games got. Do not trust anything anyone under the age of 30 has to say about Sonic's history, they only get their information from Sonictubers. (morons)
Sonic 3 is going to be underwhelming for anyone expecting "Sonic Adventure 2: Shadow The Hedgehog: The Movie", as if it's going to be anything but just more of the first two movies. As in, it's going to be an original plot draped in SA2 and ShadowTH story beats, and with some "I CLAPPED" references from those games thrown in. As long as you aren't a "MUH LORE" moron or "MUH QUIPS" spastic, then I think you'll be satisfied enough.
When Shadow says "disgusting black creatures" I'll cry and clap
I also don't get that "everyone was seething!" revisionism, we were all having the time of our lives making fun of Sonic's shit games
Projection.
Most people saying that were introduced to Sonic by either the Dark Age games or Sonic X. They sperged out because they couldn't take people making fun of subpar games.
>they only get their information from Sonictubers. (morons)
But we like cybershell!
I seriously don't know how Jeff is going to handle Sonic e without raising the age rating.
You need it for so much
>Maria's death
>Shadow's terrorism spree
>DA DEVIL FROM DA BIBLE
>obligatory Shadow DAMN
Disney movies for children have had those things except for the damn, they will manage fine
Because the last good Sonic game came out in 1999 and sega died. Everything after that was shit and aimed at multiplat kiddies.
Sonic Frontiers fixed what Adventure 2 broke.
Idk about that.
The only thing Frontiers told me is that Sonic is done hiding from its destiny as a hack and slash franchise
Because his games kept getting worse and worse?
>Adventure 2 was decent I guess
>Heroes was mediocre
>Shadow was dogshit
>'06 and Secret Rings were laughing stocks
>Unleashed was a step in the right direction but the Werehog was gay
>Black Knight was a liitle better than Secret Rings which isn't saying much
Also that era was the peak of Sonic OCs thanks to a combination of Sonic X being a thing and DeviantArt being at the peak of its popularity.
2 was decent
Opinion discarded
An abundance of shitty games. It's not a mystery. The Adventure games are ass. Heroes is ass. Shadow is ass. 06 is ass.
Sonic Advance 1, 2, 3 & Sonic Rush and Sonic Rush Adventure were just too good for some people
These are also the only gold Sonic games. Everything else ranges frol bad to the worst games of all time.
Everything after Sonic 06 has been trash. It's a shame how much good the formula was, only to ruin it with Sonic Unleashed and everything after it
It seems like they're building up to a Sonic Adventure 3
Sonic Team are always building up to a turd.
SA3 will be Sonic's last attempt to be big again.
Unleashed changed everything. It introduced the boost, drift, stomp, quick step, wall jump, and switching between 3D/2D.
You gotta admit it: these games are very memorable, as flawed as they are.
Go back to your own fricking thread.
You are the reason Sonic will never be good again
Sa1, sa2, Heroes and Shadow are objectively good
posting a reaction image doesn't make you right
Heroes and Shadow are slippery as frick and suck to play.
SA1, SA2, Heroes, and Shadow form the perfect trilogy. Literally perfect games.
>trilogy
>4 games
Adventuregays can't count confirmed
>darkagetards can't count
not surprised
Yes, but good? arguably, SA 1 and 2 despite the
jank are pretty good, but for SH and Sonic 06 I haven't played yet,
Shadow however has potential and had some nice replay value but too many endings
to warrant like what? 10 playthroughs in order to even get all the endings? fun concept
but this isn't really the type of the game worth going through 10 times in a row like a shmup,
you can only play the game so many times to an already meh combat system due to the fact that
hand to hand is useless, melee weapons still having an ammo count, and the levels just either look bad
or down right horrible to play like the "gun down the big ship missions" or that one cyberspace level that looks like shit.
It acted like it was the best shit ever being just a ripoff of many good things while actively like it was being original about it.
And the gameplay was dogshit. There's indie games now with better quality control than what SEGA was shitting out past the Dreamcast. And I'd argue even their Genesis output was still better overall than anything that came after.
Nobody was seething, people could just see that the mainline games were utter fricking shit past Adventure 2.
Nerds and furries can't skateboard.
Because the console games were garbage, the anime had one of the worst examples of obnoxious 4kids dubs, and comicsgays were vocally moronic about how much they enjoyed consuming large piles of bullshit.
No idea. Sonic Adventure on Dreamcast was kinographic. Probably just butthurt snoyBlack folk seething.
snoyBlack folk seething over not getting the shitty Dreamcast demo disk?
They thought he should be a girl.
Personally enjoyed sonic adventure dx and sonic adventure 2 battle.
remember that blackbustercritic guy who shat on sonic fans?
The guy who got mogged by a sonic cosplayer at a con and was so insecure about it he stopped posting online?
qrd?
In 2012 black buster critic went to a small sonic fan convention in Seattle iirc to make a video basically being like “haha look at all these weird freaks” but while he was walking around the convention some huge oaf that was probably like 6’5 that was cosplaying as sonic recognized him and confronted . Black buster critic was visibly scared and ended up leaving the convention. Someone got a video of it and posted it on YouTube and black buster critic started getting torn apart in his comments and basically became a laughing stock
wow that's pathetic I thought he just got bored of making videos
Does anyone have a link to the video?
Does that video still exist?
I remember him looking forward to Lost World
A large audience of people fawning over something that is objectively mediocre and making excuses for it.
Now that the dust has settled, can anyone actually refute his arguments without resorting to ad hominem attacks?
No, he was absolutely right, Modern Sonic should be axed and they should only make 2D Classic Sonic games (made by the Mania devs)
Why should classic Sonic only be restricted to 2D?
Because there hasn't been a single 3D Sonic game that has been remotely as good as the classic games
Literally only ONE official Sonic title has actually attempted to translate classic Sonic gameplay to 3D.
Then why are there 2D Modern Sonic games?
>Then why are there 2D Modern Sonic games?
At first it was by force, now it's by obligation from nostalgiagays of the 2000s era. Without them, no one that likes modern Sonic would even want 2D Sonic, especially after Sonic Colors ruined that aspect of appeal for them.
because 3D is hwat differentiates the two. Classic Sonic is NSMB of Sonic
Because not only is it proven to work and only be mid at worse if the physics are perfectly reprelated (see Superstars), I still believe it has never reached it's true potential. Sonic is not a speed game, it's a momentum platformer, and only S3K, CD and Chaotix conceptually and Mania has actively made the game's level design carry to it without restricting it with shitty gimmicks that have nothing to do with the level design (Superstars), too flat in its level design (Sonic 2), or has too little locations for momentum (Sonic 1). I believe we could get a game that transends the classics without going into the Boost2Win shit direction the Advance games went in.
However, a proper 3D take on classic can exist as well, as seen by Lightspeed Lina and Rollin Rascal. And I'm sure Taxman can do it too now that Penny's game has been shown to be well made.
>they should only make 2D Classic Sonic games (made by the Mania devs)
They should let the Mania devs make a 3D Sonic game.
It's not like it could be any worse than what Sonic Team regularly shits out.
True true
No we was spitting straight facts
I wonder what he's doing now
This child baited more people on the entire internet than any anon here will ever
I look at it kind of the same way I look at the Backstreet Boys. They caused so much seething in the 90s but now most people have just accepted they were good and genuinely miss those times.
A lot of times a new trend emerges that is good but because it seems so different it automatically gets met with negative backlash. It's because a lot of people just don't think for themselves and can't accurately judge things as they really are.
And I think the autism aspect actually plays into this. Because by most people's standards autists are actually too good at thinking for themselves. So you naturally end up with a split between the normie Sonic fans and the diehard autists which culminates in this huge era of infighting.
>They caused so much seething in the 90s but now most people have just accepted they were good and genuinely miss those times.
Have you considered that the previously seething people and the currently accepting "most people" are made up of completely different demographics.
People who were upset with 2000s Sonic grew up with a different Sonic. You see the exact same shit with people who grew up with 2000s Sonic upset with how Sonic changed in the 2010s. And you will once again see the same shit from people who grew up with 2010s Sonic not liking the 2020s open world Sonic for its differences.
Time is a flat circle.
I simply don't think this is the case though.
I think it's just a big logical leap and an unfair unnuanced argument to make that everybody just likes what they grew up with and hates everything else.
But this is what I mean when I say people don't think for themselves. Average people are incapable of examining things exactly as they are without bringing in any outside context until they've gotten far enough away from it. The distance of time or even literal distance has a sobering effect. But see an autist doesn't have this issue.
Basically in 1998 the average person looked at Sonic Adventure and saw a different Sonic than they were used to. The typical autistic Sonic fan just saw Sonic Adventure.
If this is even half truth for all gamers, then anyone born growing up playing games would all naturally stop playing games after they hit ~12-18 and move on from gaming in general. If it was always like this, that it's not that games can come out objectively worse over time than it is just people growing out of games, then you should never see a single gamer past the age of 18.
But you don't. So this is utter bullshit. Blaming the audience instead of the companies that have and still HAS consistently shat on their consumers with shitty business practices, rushed broken slop """""fixed"""""" with DLC/Patches 10 years later, and other scummy nonsense actively ruining vidya, acting like that doesn't exist and gaming has only improved in a straight or exponential line, is max level shitposting.
You're looking at things in too broad of a view. Maybe you could say that the game industry as a whole has gotten overall worse in several ways. But that doesn't mean a good game, a genuine masterpiece even, can't or won't come out tomorrow. See you're only examining things in the context of other things not as they really are.
>But that doesn't mean a good game, a genuine masterpiece even, can't or won't come out tomorrow.
Exactly, because that's what made me buy Mania because it was good and competently made, while I didn't buy Superstars, because it wasn't good and wasn't competently made. Compared to Sonic Team's typical buggy slop it was "more" competent, but only thanks to Taxman's own framework the japs copied to keep from having a complete shitshow (and the parts that wasn't based directly on Taxman's code happened to be the glitchiest parts of the game, funny how that is). It's almost like "different Sonic" isn't the real issue, it's that different Sonic's games were hot ass and poorly made. The only thing keeping them from continuously being rightfully hated on is those generations of brats growing up on them thinking they were actually good and the people that shat on them mostly moved on from gaming in the first place to care about restating how bad they were.
>I simply don't think this is the case though.
>I think it's just a big logical leap and an unfair unnuanced argument to make that everybody just likes what they grew up with and hates everything else.
That wasn't my point. You said you see "most people" currently just accept that the previously criticized media is actually good. In reality, those people are most likely a completely separate group from those who were criticizing said games in the first place, hence why their views are different.
You're right that the passage of time can impact how people view media, but at the same time, those who shit on 06 when it released are definitely not the same group that currently touts the game as some ambitious, misunderstood gaming experience. The fanbase is made up of different demographics who hold different views on the same shit because they were introduced to said shit in different ways. This happens to any IP that lasts for multiple decades.
But the thing is the people that tout 06 as an "ambitious, misunderstood gaming experience" were wrong then and are still wrong now. And so are the people who consider it one of the worst games of all time.
The point is the opinions can always change but the game never did. Whether the general opinion becomes more or less accurate over time is typically a function of how good or bad the thing really is in reality. And that reality will always transcend any demographic factor eventually. Because 06 is not as hyperbolically good or bad as the majority thinks it takes longer to work that out.
>But the thing is the people that tout 06 as an "ambitious, misunderstood gaming experience" were wrong then and are still wrong now. And so are the people who consider it one of the worst games of all time.
And? Both parties can have completely wrong opinions all they want. The existence of said parties is my point.
>Whether the general opinion becomes more or less accurate over time is typically a function of how good or bad the thing really is in reality. And that reality will always transcend any demographic factor eventually.
I don't agree with this at all. Something being seen as "good" or "bad" from a current standpoint is largely reliant on current trends and attitudes, not solely because the quality of the thing itself.
Take the original Resident Evil's control scheme. Is there something inherently flawed with its usage of tank controls? No, they work perfectly fine for that game because the experience is both completely designed around said controls and because it really is the best approach to controlling a character in a game with fixed camera angles (something even LucasArts devs would admit when looking back on Grim Fandango's development).
Of course, the common current opinion on tank controls is simply that they're "bad" or "clunky" or "obsolete" no matter what. But is this because tank controls are truly an objectively bad approach to character movement? No, most of those opinions are basically held by those who have only ever experienced analog controls as a standard, as again that is the "trend" or experience they've grown up with and are accustomed to.
I blame Erin the hack Hanson.
Erin Hanson was the reason Sonic was considered a laughing stock in 2006?
Good timing for a thread, I just finished Mania with true ending and Advance, but the annoyance of finding the springs, having to beat the game with 4 characters, and the god-awful special stages just made me cheat in a full save and get true end that way. I started 2 but it's not very good. Finding 5 of those rings per zone is hell, doing it as all 4 characters sounds like a nightmare, but without that the stages are just hold right to win. I don't know if I should even bother finishing 2 and just going to 3. 1 was only okay, the final two zones are really weak.
Playing Sonic CD right now. Man, it doesn't for everybody, but once this game clicks with you, it really fricking clicks.
Wacky Workbench still sucks ass but that aside I've been autistically replaying this game over and over.
I know its fun to speedrun supposedly but that game's level design is pure aids
Its actually the best and most intelligent level design in the series albeit
Mind explaining your thoughts? I recently beat it for the first time with all emeralds and I couldn't stand how much it focused on exploration and annoying twists and turns
The level design is based on a blend of going fast and exploration, but it doesn't just let you hold right and win like Sonic. Instead the spring at the end of the first level is there to non-lethally remind you not to just hold right when going through a level.
The general premise of CD (use a combination of time travel and momentum physics to explore open environments for robot generators and holograms) would honestly work better in a 3D game than a 2D one.
Almost like something that could work in an open map-style setting, but I doubt Sonic Team will ever look back on CD and make the connection.
It was the design change I heard?
I am the ultimate
They were on the level of ponyfrickers of severe non-functioning autism.
You probably weren't around to see it, but the Sonic community was extremely weird and strange from 2006-2009. Gen X schizos started to project the fanbases onto the games themselves.
Is Sonic the traditional game for Hispanics?