All of his gifts are plagues. There are zero circumstances as to which he will bless you, since all of his blessings are curses. I also don't understand why Tzeentch is seen as inherently cruel or dickish when he can legitimately bless you (financially, general quality of life, spiritually/emotionally ect.) if through blessing you it furthers his plans.
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Because they get their understanding of Warhammer from memes and youtube videos.
Kroniebros...
Kronies are cυckolds.
how?
this. also based kroni fan
This.
Also khorne is not an aspect of honor in 40k, that is only a whfb thing. In 40k he is pure grimderp blood and killing of everyone around you
WHFB is more popular with normalgays than 40k is because of games like Chaosbane, Vermintide 2 and Total War Warhammer. In TWW Skarbrand's diplomacy lines are specifically "you have no dishonored yourself on the battlefield yet and therefore the blood god does not demand your skull".
That’s what he’s always been. The honor thing has only ever been a conceit of mortals.
Conceits are real in the Realms of Chaos and the Warp. Interpretations of Khorne as the holder of aspects of martial honor is completely legitimate, and is self-legitimizing by virtue of the beliefs in Khorne actualizing as Khorne. The gods of Chaos (and indeed all denizens of the immaterium) are not material personas with individual wills, but expressions of the collective unconscious of mortals dead, born, and yet unborn.
Except it’s not true at all. Khorne explicitly does not care about honor and in fact encourages you to betray and kill those closest to you. He especially relishes the blood of allies shed for no reason most of all.
>He especially relishes the blood of allies shed for no reason most of all.
That is not true. One of the most famous quotes about Khorne is that he does not care from whence the blood flows, only that it does.
But it isn’t true. He likes certain kills way more than others.
No, he doesn't.
He's right tho
Poisoning someone isn't the same as decapitating them at the apex of a long melee for Khorne.
Stop lying.
>The gods of Chaos (and indeed all denizens of the immaterium) are not material personas with individual wills, but expressions of the collective unconscious of mortals dead, born, and yet unborn.
No, that isn’t true. Not only are they not reflective of human psyches (like, at all) they are individual sentience’s with places they live. Nurgle literally has a house. You can visit.
Epic: Renegades
Martial honor being an aspect of Khorne is very on brand and that being part of his realm would go a long way in keep him from being one dimensional.
Would he be the ideal Khornate warrior?
Does he kill everything he see with his axes including his firends and don't use magic(magic axe is cool no mindboolets tho)?
If yes then he is perfect warrior of khorne.
What the frick
>that one greasy disgusting honestfrancis/nicoavacado lovechild at the LGS with a smoking hot Asian gf
The context is that the anime girl is a vtuber who blended up stale subway sandwiches into a smoothie and drank it.
Now post the Isha rimjob comic
It's a twisted form of love.
Dammit Slaanesh...
Yes, his gifts are plagues, but they do bless you if you are favored. It's the inversion of what you know, if you're sick, you feel bad and you are weak, but what if you are sick and you feel good, and strong?
Nurgle is unique in the chaos Gods, as he knows he is the last one, because the universe will eventually die in entropy.
Tzeentch will bless you, but sooner or later there will be consequences. Not for Tzeentch, but for you.
Dude he literally gives you turbo leprosy so that you don't feel the pain from all of the diseases he's already responsible for giving you. Yes, you do not feel pain, but that in itself is a curse. All of his blessings are curses.
>Tzeentch will bless you, but sooner or later there will be consequences
And some of those consequences can be a good thing. Tzeentch can put you in a position of political power and wealth and have you remain in that for the remainder of your life if that's something that furthers his plan. Now, is that guarantied to be the case? No, but he has been shown to do things like that, whereas with Nurgle the only direction he will ever put you in is down.
By Tzeentch's very nature he and his minions have to betray, even if it doesn't benefit them. Plenty of Greater Daemons of Tzeentch's plans have been unravelled simply because they could not help themselves or they get dicked over by other Tzeentchian entities because all their plans are in conflict. Of all 4 Gods, Tzeentch is the only one you literally cannot win with ever.
Well, that's not true. You can win with Tzeentch as long as the game itself is the goal.
You accept the burden of endless play and if you survive through it anyway, you get rewarded.
It's exceedingly difficult to have strengh, smarts and luck to maneuver around the storm of change.
He's for people who can never be satisfied with something for long, which is why he's allied with Slaanesh.
I find it interesting how Slaanesh and Tzeentch have the capacity to genuinely create things and build things up (albeit, they are still Chaos) whereas Khorne and Nurgle are inherently destructive forces. I also see Slan and Tzeentch's folllowers as being the most likely Chaos worshippers to produce offspring, Slaanesh followers by accident or intentional forced breeding for the experience of forced breeding and Tzeentch because the game can't truly end and the tendency to institute social experiments requiring populace.
That's laughably wrong.
Nurgle is the most prolific(heh) creator. He's also literally a god of fertility, most evident in Fantasy where he's often the one to save villages devoted to him.
Slaanesh are driven to consume things out of greed and excess. They're not guaranteed to create something as much as simply take it.
And Tzeentch is as likely to destroy something as create, long-lasting is a hard no in his case.
It's just that Nurgle things aren't the most glorious or efficient, but they're the most stable.
The only thing Nurgle creates is destruction, though. His gifts are plagues, diseases, and poxes. He is quite literally the "Plaguefather". Slaanesh will actually create things (art, music, the most extensive craft brews, or pretty much anything for that matter) not just for the sake of experiencing the thing in itself but also for the sake of experiencing the experience of creating it and perfecting. Tzeentch will create societies and new systems of governance and allow that to exist for a time until the new thing needs to come into place for whichever reasons or lack of reasons and he will give space for his followers to entertain legitimately benevolent goals (though, they're still used).
>Nurgle will protect his followers
Yes, so his followers can spread more plagues. His followers do not build anything up, they only tear down, and the spirits they give are ones of despair.
Nurgle creates plagues, diseases and poxes as a form of art. His followers constantly work and improve on their design. Nurgle favours things like death worlds, with conditions not unlike symbiotic and cutthroat relations of orkish or tyranid biomes, as a self-sustaining circle of violent life.
Slaanesh things on the other hand are essentially one-shots, you created one, and it's already outdated, then can just burn or sniff it and it's gone.
>Tzeentch will create societies and new systems of governance
In place of the old to simply create chaos, because it's his thing. Existing for a time is an amusing side-effect, nothing more.
>His followers do not build anything up, they only tear down
Well, they can create too, most famous Nurgle invention is gellarpox, a mix of plague and machinery, it's truly something spectacular.
Often Nurgle tears down things outside of his domain, things under him tend to survive and prop up for far longer they're normally allowed.
Again, Nurgle is a god of Life, Death, Decay and Rebirth, so to propagate diseases and plagues, one must have the populace for it.
It's an endless cycle.
>plagues as a form of art
You don't seem to really understand what I mean by "create" and "destroy". Slaanesh and Tzeentch will make things that are permeable and potentially beneficial outside of just wanton destruction for the sake of it. If I want the best tasting food or the most aesthetically pleasing architecture, I'm going to use Slaanesh followers for that. If I want to know how to purposefully corral the local wildlife so that its' population is directed towards my neighboring states instead of my own or what is the optimal age that children should be used for labor, I'm going to use Tzeentch followers for that. The only thing that Nurgle followers will do for a nation is bring diseases and demoralize them, which is great if your enemies have to deal with that but horrible if you do.
>Of all 4 Gods, Tzeentch is the only one you literally cannot win with ever.
I guess it depends on what you want out of life, to be fair, and in the world of 40k (and even fantasy since both series are grimdark) life doesn't last particularly long for most people, and while it lasts it's not particularly pleasant for most people.
>Tzeentch is the only one you literally cannot win with ever.
In that way, Tzeench is a metaphor for GW itself. There must always be change, because otherwise you cannot force the paypigs to buy new armies. Therefore, even if they come up with something good, it must eventually change into something bad, because it's new and can be sold again.
Nurgle is death and life, over and over again, forever. It's not his fault. Grandfather is a reflection of rules set long ago. From the perspective of Nurgle, all healthy life is a curse, a mockery of the death and decay that awaits, that's inevitable. It will happen, so what does it matter if it happens now, or later? Better to be in the garden, then out.
Tzeentch will give you power, wealth, knowledge, anything you want, so long as it serves him in the end, making you a slave to his design.
Nurgle doesn't allow things to decay as a natural process and then letting the souls of sentient creatures go free, he corrupts them into zombies and bloated corpses and claims ownership of them. He twists people into things they are not, with intention of doing so. With Nurgle there is no change, only perpetual stagnation and decay.
Nurgle isn't only stagnation nd decay, he is life as well. If you gave the process of life, decay, death and rebirth sentience, that would be Nurgle.
But they are chaos gods, they are unnatural, and not good. The Emperor in the book, the plague wars tells Nurgle, and the other chaos gods that they are out of balance, and that they have too much power now. (they also know this and don't like it). But big E is gone, on the golden throne.
The chaos Gods are all these primal forces of nature out of control.
There's nothing life giving about him, though. He's more likely to have your genitalia rot off than he ever would be to give you a wife and kids, he's more prone to killing trees than planting them.
>The chaos Gods are all these primal forces of nature out of control.
Yes, exactly.
No, he isn't.
In fact, he might give you genitalia rot AND make it so they stay in one piece and gives you fertility to create a dozen more kids than before.
Killed trees will prop up again in a more scary, but dead 'ard form.
That's Nurgle, the good with the bad.
It looks bad because he's more bad than good, as all Chaos.
In WHFB there was a disease that caused women (and eventually men) to have uncontrollable childbirth, becoming impregnated by mere skin contact.
Source?
>trip and impregnate half the town
>stagnation
I might be wrong here, but wouldn't Burgle DESPISE stagnation? It is the polar opposite of decay. Stagnation is the realm of undeath, a state in which all decay is ceased. Nurgle despises the undead. Stagnation is anathema to all chaos, as chaos is neverending change.
Nurgle is stagnation in the sense that nothing new is created or developed, things merely remaining in a state of entropic dissolution forever and no possible deviation occurring.
>Nurgle despises the undead.
Wrong. All of Nurgle's followers are undead or unlife.
>Stagnation is anathema to all chaos, as chaos is neverending change.
Also incorrect. The only Ruinous Power who truly embodies that domain is Tzeentch, and he is opposed to Nurgle for a reason.
Read moorwiener
moron. Moorwienerian Chaos =/= WH Chaos.
>entropic dissolution
entropy is explicitly not stagnant. for there to be continued entropy, there is continued growth. the undead simply exist, unchanging forever.
Nurgle hates the undead, you literally see his perspective on Skelepope in AoS straight from his own pov and he despises the idea of such stagnant lifelessness.
I think Nurgleis a schizo moron
Issue seams to be that Nurgle likes walking in circles, while Skeletor wants to stop all movement. Neither goes anywhere, but the experience vastly differes
Nurgle likes bloat and decomposition, because it's new life growing out of an old one, continuing the cycle. A clean skeleton that births no new life forms spooks him
Nurgle genuinely loves his followers. He just has poor judgement as to what can be considered a gift. At the very least he doesn't intentionally dick over his followers like the other 3.
>At the very least he doesn't intentionally dick over his followers like the other 3.
He is genuinely trying to help them. But due to the way his power works the outcome tends to be less than intended. The other 3 will intentionally dick you over simply because they feel like it or it is their entire nature.
You have no clue what you are talking about and get all your information on 40k from shitty memes. Your opinion is irrelevant.
No he isn’t. He tortures daemons who fail him, fricks with the Plague Toads just because, and even his most favored are trapped in mire and misery forever.
>He is genuinely trying to help them.
He is genuinely trying to help them in the same way that Slannesh is genuinely trying to convince you that shoving a cactus covered in hot sauce up your bumhole while mainlining coke cut with the crushed up bones of a nubile teenager is a good way to spend a Saturday night. Nurgle's "help" is toxic and corruptive.
>The other 3 will intentionally dick you over simply because they feel like it or it is their entire nature.
Nurgle will do the same thing. At best he's just going to convince you that you like it and/or deserve it afterwards, at worst he's not even going to bother with that justification because he's just as capricious as the other 3 Chaos gods he just does it with a smile.
>Why do people attribute Nurgle to being "nice" or "loving"?
Memes and contrarianism
The biggest difference between Nurgle (and his followers) and other Chaos Gods is that they look (only look) less egoistical and more collectivistic
Here is your loving Nurgle family:
>At the very least he doesn't intentionally dick over his followers like the other 3.
What a grand and intoxicating innocence.
Except Nurgle feeds off despair. He knows exactly what he's doing anon, his followers are just too mindbroken to realize it.
Nurgle does not "love" you, unless you consider abusive gaslighting and emotional manipulation "love". All of his followers are broken depressed husks in a perpetual state of emotional anguish and misery.
its pretty much a case of people fall for something that while having a grain of truth of it (Nurgle does "love" his followers more compared to the other gods) is extremely exaggerated and taken out of context, said love is the same type of love an abusive/manipulative parent has for their child
Yeah that's what it seems to be. Nurgle is only accepting for as long as that generates complacency. If one of his followers wants to better their lot in life, suddenly there's no more room for love, tolerance or acceptance.
Nurgle does not wish to help anyone, though. He wants to keep people down and if you aren't broken, lost, or otherwise in a position in life that would make you prone to his influence then he tortures you with plagues to force you to accept his influence.
Because it's canon, dumbass. It's literally how he's stated to be.
It's not counter-intuitive, since while gruesome, significant portion of his negativity has to do with circumstance and NOT the expression at someone as is with Khorne(anger), Tzeentch(deceit), or Slaanesh(lust).
Nurgle is born out of despair and desire to live, which is what he gives. Acceptance, stability, caring for what already IS, rather than what could be. Thus the nice, loving side, loving you for you are.
As he's also a god of life, any expressions of life as his domain, including positive ones.
Why Tzeentch is dickish? Because Tzeentch is legitimately insane, he's a conglomeration of various schemes of different ambitions at the same time. Yes, he can bless you. He can bless you with curses, as he's often stated to do, because mutations and madness are more random and hence provide more options for the future. He is the ultimate cat in the bag.
This, but on the topic of Tzeentch, I want to add that in addition to being "insane" or "random" in being a god of change, he's also the prince of plots and plans within plans. The concept of "Tzeentch" isn't necessarily random or insane (ultimately all Chaos creeds and forces drive mortals insane), but fortunes may quickly change and then change again, and pursuant to all schemes, a favored may quickly find itself axed in the interest of another plot.
Much like the Carnival of Nurgle, the backroom backstabbings of Tzeentch never stops.
Because papa nurgle loves you, and we don't want things to change. We want to stay here, together, forever.
>As he's also a god of life
Chaosgays coping.
They are all just destroyers, they only destroy and corrupt everything.
Remember that the emotion that Tzeentch pulls from is hope. He's not just trickery, but hope for a better tomorrow, hope for change, for improvement. Schemes and revolution personify that change as much as magic is creating that change. Notice most Tzeentch characters have a specific goal they're trying to accomplish, like Arhiman. He appeals to intellectuals who are aware there could be better or easily lose themselves in acquiring more knowledge, as much as a rude factory worker who simply wants to throw off his shackles. The madness and mutation comes later.
It's also a bit wrong to say Slaanesh is just lust. It's more like ecstasy, the joy of sensation. That's why Slaanesh isn't just breasts and dicks, but also music, art, drugs. The willing change of your body so that you can experience more sensation as you get used to or numbed to the lesser pleasures, as your ears need sheer noise to be stimulated, as you constantly need drugs pumped into you to get half the same high.
Because people get suckered into the idea of 40k being well written. Someone memes thier idea of the positive aspects of the gods to help capture the slow insidious rot that chaos is only to then find out its just an 11 year old writing from the edgy scribblings of a 13 year old. See it all the time, people give GW and BL credit when in reality they are morons with a pen full with piss.
Because Nurgle's intent is benevolent, his values are just warped. Consider this: there are currently hundreds if not thousands of bacteria and viruses living in you right now. To Nurgle, you are a wonderful ecosystem of endless decay and rebirth. So what if a few of his own additions cause horrible disfiguring disease, suck it up little man and put a smile on that face.
The fluff when Nurgle was first imagined was that Nurgle was bringing blessed pain relief to those dying of horrible plagues who prayed for his aid. In return, you became a follower or demon that helped spread the diseases further.
The giggling little nurglings were based on this childrens book about kind hearted and playful blobs that lived in trash heaps. (Yes I know, the thought of GW stealing ideas from other franchises is hard to believe)
You sure on the influence there, my guy? Because as an older Brit that is the first I've ever heard of those books.
>You can't steal from something if anon doesn't know it exists.
Quick, give him amnesia drugs, theft will be eradicated forever.
That's the joke. he's a kind, grandfather like figure that genuinely takes delight and pleasure in the works of his chosen. Yet, he is disease, sickness, plagues, but not suffering. He's the most appealing and the most unappealing god you'd want to serve.
Nurgle isn't the god of disease, he's the god of entropy. His powers relate to the cycle of death, decay and rebirth, cycling eternally.
His 'gifts' subvert that cycle and give you pseudo-immortality by making you host to diseases which numb pain, make you physically stronger, and generally turn your wounds into new sources of 'blessings'. This is why he is considered benevolent by his followers (read: not anybody sane)
>I also don't understand why Tzeentch is seen as inherently cruel or dickish when he can legitimately bless you
All of the chaos gods are essentially monkey paw wishes made manifest.
Tzeentch grants knowledge, insight and sorcery at the expense of madness and mutation.
Khorne grants strength, martial prowess and bravery at the expense of suicidal bloodthirst and rage.
Slaanesh grants you pleasures and sensations beyond understanding, but only in excess.
And Nurgle grants eternal life and fortitude, but at the expense of literally rotting from the inside out.
Excellent post dude.
Because some people fear death. They fear the end. They would do anything, suffer anything to drag their terminal breath out just a moment longer. Those are the people nurgle cares for. He gives them exactly what they wish for- he stalls the inevitable, at any cost.
Also, Nurgle is pre occupied with simping for Isha in his black house, he's not even directing things, its his demons Ku'Gath, Rotigus, Mortarion, and Typhus. After God Blight, his Garden is burned and Mortarion sent to the Black House.
Ever met a total disaster of a person - fat, slob, no job, terrible hygiene, autistic, posts on Ganker? And they're 100% oblivious to the fact that they could do better with their lives?
That's essentially what Nurgle gives you. Satisfaction.
Tzeentch meanwhile is all about the type of people who are never happy in life, and keep chasing ephemeral dreams. They're not happy, but they are certainly making things happen.
He is a gestalt generated out of the fear of death, experience of suffering and mortality and peoples emotional responses to it. He is the comfort people sick when sick and the answer to why god am i sick all in one being.
He is the answer to why me when you are dying of cancer.
Father Nurgle is also Mother Nature.
OH NO!
20+ year LOOOOOONNNNGGGG game of telephone from fans who mutate the ideal from the overload of diseases fricks you up that it sometimes makes you numb, to always makes you numb, numbing is the first side effect, to Nurgle personally makes you unable to feel pain on purpose, to Nurgle personally makes you feel comfortable, to Nurgle loves you and wants you to be comfy.
It's a series of misinterpreting what the last guy said and taking it ten steps further
Because Nurgle loves literally all forms of life, and wants the best for them.
Those forms of life include horrific pathogens too, however, and they are the majority, so they get more say than more complex lifeforms.
If I may add my own 2 cents, I think one of the reasons why Nurgle and his followers appear “happy” is more or less a crab in bucket mentality. Think about it he is the embodiment of entropy, decay and nihilism, his whole appeal is “Just accept yourself as you are, never improve!”. I think that’s what ultimately makes him and his followers evil, yes they seem chill and happy but I think the plaguebearers are the very real face of everything nurgle is, gloomy and hopeless
A few decades ago, there was a theory that all the chaos gods are just parodies of the types disfunctional people who play WFB and WH40k.
Nurgle is the dim neckbeards with BO that are (as you point out) happy as they are.
Khorne are all the rage quitters who can't stand loosing.
Slaneesh are the coomers who like to stick breasts on all their models.
Tzeentch are the rule lawyers who suck the fun out of a game with their exploitation of the rules.
And Malal?
That's literally exactly what he is. Every Nurgle follower is broken so far beyond the point of repair that it loops back around to making them seem jolly and good-natured.
People forget that while Nurgle appears to care, he ultimately is just as self serving and prone to wrath as the others.
Even in the Lost and the Damned book, the GUO appears nice and gentle but his actions show a careless and ultimately cruel, discarding attitude to his followers.
Furthermore he has and does punish his followers as shown on Hammer and Bolter and approves of it. In the end, he is like his brothers: Self serving. The others promise power, pleasure or knowledge. Nurgle promises love. All however only want more followers and influence.
I used to love Nurgle but I prefer the 100% honesty of Khorne.
>i hate everyone and don't care about anything except if you kill. Kill lots and you get power.
Vs nurgle
>I love you and will forgive you for anything and we are one big happy family...unless you do something I don't like, then I will dispose of you, but still love you :]
Does Khorne really want more followers? He seems perfectly happy that his own guys get themselves killed and add their skulls to the throne. I imagine World Eaters suffer way more attrition than Orkz due to the fact that they can't sit still in a spaceship and kill eachother before they land.
Yes in the sense more followers equates to more influence. His mindset is as two dimensional as you can get but he actually recruits himself most of the time if he sees a promising follower i.e Scyla or a particularly good tactician. The gods needs followers to keep their status and power. Definitely has insane attrition but any expression of violence is a Khornate waiting to happen and Khorne is more than happy to plant blessings even if not actively sought out. Hence his power.
On the broken telephone thing with Nurgle earlier, the whole honour thing was one throwaway line in Lost and the Damned. He REPRESENTS elements of honour but has always been a 100% bloodthirsty lunatic to the point he savours when khornate followers kill former allies or friends, also noted prominently in the Realm of Chaos door stopper books.
Here is a little lore twist, which aren't represented in tabletop games (nor 40k, nor AoS). In 40k Khorne CSM Lords are one of the most cunning and skilled strategists and warlords, except of World Eaters since they are all gagling lobotomites
>Khorne CSM lords
>who are not WE
I thought that was synonymous?
Lol no.
What other warbands have non WE Khorne lords?
>What other warbands have non WE Khorne lords?
"your dudes" warband which you play by CSM codex rules instead of WE codex
That's my favorite thing about Chaos, honestly. It's got the most potential for Your Dudes by far.
https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Khorne_Daemonkin
World Eaters are just super-cool club among Khorne's fandom (because Khorne worshippers have no clue how hard their God lughs at Angron whenever he gets killed), and just like with other legions splinter parts of WE fund the most famous of CSM Khorne warband. But marine doesn't need to have butcher nails to worship Khorne.
In fact Angron's sons are probably minority among current WE because they probably the easiest to join among original 9 Legions
Good mention anon, makes sense if you think of it like 'Khorne wants you to kill- killing on mass with an organised force is the most effective method of mass death - being a good strategist means you can kill on mass more often, also other people underestimanting you for being a khorne lord and thinking all you have is a headlong charge when that is in fact the distraction to another move the enemy wasnt expecting
Second part of comic. Nurgle's love canonically accurate.
i feel like tzeentch is pretty straightforward too
he'll frick you over whenever he feels like it
It's straightforward in the sense that he's usually pretty upfront about how you should never ever trust anything he says except for all the times you should and your relationship with him is going to be one of constant paranoia unless you embrace the madness. Otherwise he is the exact fricking opposite of straightforward.
i guess it's a case of all the other gods want you to please them in some way through your actions and deeds
but you might falter or fail and if you get on their wrong side then whoops you're screwed
on the other hand tzeentch is gonna frick you eventually regardless if whether you please him or not and i feel that's the most straightforward
I feel like you and I have very different definitions of "straightforward" Anon.
well i am pretty moronic
Nurgle represents life without meaning.
His blessing will allow you to live, grow, and die, without ever actually "living".
Nurgle cultists don't suffer for all the plagues they endure, but they also don't feel much of anything at all, like a monk who has forsaken all attachment to the material world and lives as some kind of plant.
For a nihilist dominated by fear, who is afraid of dying, and equally afraid of living for the suffering it brings, it's no surprise Nurgle would be seen as benevolent.
This goes to the extent Nurgle followers completely neglect any forms of personal decency. Puking on themselves like pic related or not caring about a prolapsed anus.
Wouldn't diseased, tumor-ridden sick fricks puking on themselves and struggling to hobble along on fat stumpy mutated legs make for really terrible soldiers that are kind of easy to kill?
no because they don't care as much about losing organs and body parts to your attacks since they're basically already dead and rotting
you have to remove their structural integrity so they collapse in on themselves or burn them to ash, which they still might not even care about since they're bound to be running on some warp stuff that doesn't care about the laws of the materium
rot and disease spreads wherever they go too and blowing chunks out of them probably just splatters more contaminants about
I still imagine they're probably worse than slanneshi or tzeentchian fighters though
khornate soldiers are probably the easiest to fight imo
>khornate soldiers are probably the easiest to fight imo
Except you're dealing with warriors who dream of nothing except war and the shedding of blood. You can argue that Khornate warriors are more likely to be straightforward in their approach, but they're extremely skilled at that type of approach, whereas Tzeentchian warriors are more likely to betray their own and engage in dirty tactics but will never approach you with the sheer ferocity and batte-lust that Khronate warriors will. Tzeentchian warrios and Slaaneshi warriors are also perfectly fine with losing if that's part of the 'plan' or in the Slaaneshi case, the conditions for losing result in a greater sensory experience.
Its alot easier to kill guys running at you screaming their heads off armed with melee weapons who may kill each other on the field because violence lmao than guys who have probably set up a plan years in advance for the blood morons to assault you and distract you at the exact moment they're, I dunno, fricking overloading all the powerplants in your hive city so it explodes
slanneshi people pursue perfection and they can be showboaty which will frick them but they basically have all of the advantages of a khornate without the moronic bloodlust and only a chance of moronic regular lust
they have all the advantages of a khornate with a dash of self preservation
and with tzeentch, again, well, its hard to beat an enemy you don't even know is killing you
I guess it's the difference between fighting a pack of pissed off gorillas and the difference between fighting a few trained soldiers who are really intent on getting their trick shots down perfectly, at least when comparing Khornate and Slaaneshi warriors, gonna not use Tzeentchian warriors in example because it's never really about war in itself for them.
>running at you screaming their heads off armed with melee weapons who may kill each other on the field
Can't the same be said for Slaaneshi warriors though? They're more likely to have the battlefield devolve into an orgy than they are to explicitly kill you.
The mistake you're making is thinking that khormates are all raging morons. In actuality, it varies between raging morons and veterans of a thousand battles, organized by generals that may have waged war for centuries with the singular purpose of murdering everyone as effectively as possible.
The rager moron may be the most over-used trope, but it is a largely false one. Absolutely nothing in the tenets and rituals and concepts intertwined with khorne precludes strategy and tactical acument; in fact, the very basis of the entire part of the realms of Chaos and the warp itself that constitute Khorne demands it.
In fact, the mindless tide is largely a Nurgle thing, relying on plague zombies and the immense endurance of his blessed.
When it comes to other deities, the polytheistic nature and conception of the world lends credability to the gods of Chaos, making them legitimate items of worship, the entities of which regularly affect the world in a tangible sense. Saying there's no excuse to worship the Chaos gods is incredibly ignorant, especially as the "Chaos gods" are not known quantifiable by the overwhelmingly vast majority of mortals, and they are not approached as or presented as Evil.
The descent into madness and true devotion is slow and corruptive. There's a reason they are a credible threat and actively rooted out by secret agents.
>In fact, the mindless tide is largely a Nurgle thing, relying on plague zombies and the immense endurance of his blessed.
Don't put that shit on Nurgle, DG have everything from siege experts to infiltration, and they specialize in chemical warfare. Sure the zombies are zombies, but they're not the Nurgle CSM.
>Saying there's no excuse to worship the Chaos gods is incredibly ignorant,
Okay so take this back into the original context of my statement contesting some anon's claims that Nurgle is "the closest thing to love" in the setting. In Fantasy, that is objectively not true since many of the deities of humanity are significantly more benevolent entities than those of Chaos. Never did I mean there was no excuse for following Chaos in itself, but that if benevolence is an aspect your heart is desiring then you won't find it in Chaos, much less so in the Plaguefather.
I mean you will absolutely find it in Chaos, there's entire pantheons, and dozens maybe hundreds of interpretations of the big four alone, and for some people the gods of Chaos are the end-all be-all, from the midwifery to the warmongering.
But very fair point, "closest thing to love" is literally intrue in a setting that has deities such as Shallya, even if not everyone knows it.
Shallya is dead. The wold world is gone, Anon.
40K is the only real setting aside for Age of Shitmar. And there is no love besides Nurgle in 40K, even the Emperor hates you.
>The rager moron may be the most over-used trope, but it is a largely false one. Absolutely nothing in the tenets and rituals and concepts intertwined with khorne precludes strategy and tactical acument; in fact, the very basis of the entire part of the realms of Chaos and the warp itself that constitute Khorne demands it.
Skarbrand dude. Khorne found him more useful, more brutal, to be a greater killer once stripped of his sanity - and his presence once got a whole planet to turn into a bloody mess. I get you want to fight against a trope, but it's part of Khorne's deal.
It's funny that Khorne never had any honour and just demanded bloodsheed, and morons are still pretending that he was originally "god of honour" but recently GW changed it, despite realm of chaos from 1989 saying otherwise.
There is a hint of truth in everything, but it's so obscure nobody remembers where it's from, but is certain it was an old, reliable source.
Epic 2ed?
So OG khorne was bloodthirsty moron who wanted blood, then in some short source he got "muh honor" more or less insignificant recton, then he got turned back into bloodthirsty moron.
About yes. A bit like how the 5e rulebook moved the Macharian Crusade from 392.M41 to 995.M40, and was completely ignored in all other publications since.
>they basically have all of the advantages of a khornate
That basically is doing a lot of work lmao.
Khornates are the easiest to fight, until they reach your battle-line and you're actually fighting them.
Not noticeably more so than any of the other chaos guys.
You're gonna start shitting yourself to death with mega dysentery aids just being in the presence of a nurglite.
Anyone who thinks Nurgle is benevolent needs to explain the fall of the Death Guard. 100% manipulation, very few of them turned by choice.
They'd be slow but hard to kill, which is how the faction plays on the tabletop before 10e kek.
They make more sense as dead bodies and festering parts that are resurrected and made into shambling zombie-like hordes than guys who decided disease is neat.
Not normally due to magic bullshit but when they’re cut off from it for even a minute they scream in horror and agony before literally falling to pieces.
god that all sounds amazing, why can't it be real...
Because he does, he's the domain of rotten platonic love, he just loves all life equally and you're not beating bacteria by galactic vote
The world of Warhammer is so fricked up that Nurgle is the closest thing to love you will ever experience. The whole universe is a toxic relationship.
>The world of Warhammer is so fricked up that Nurgle is the closest thing to love you will ever experience.
Zahndrekh and Obyron
Necrons don't count they laugh at you lowlife humans for all the failure you carry.
>Nurgle is the closest thing to love you will ever experience
In Fantasy if you're a human, you have a whole plethora of benevolent deities to devote yourself to and have no excuse at that point. In 40k if you're a human your options are corpse emperor or Chaos so.. yeah ig but if you're not human you have better options. If you're an Eldar it's much better to be a Harlequin than deal with anything Chaos related.
Fantasy died Anon, let it go.
>In 40k if you're a human your options are corpse emperor or Chaos
There are humans living within the territory belonging to the Eldar, the Necrons, the Tau and now the Votann.
As a side note, Necrons were retconned from bloodthirsty terminators into benevolent robotic caretakers about 15 years ago.
>There are humans living within the territory belonging to the Eldar, the Necrons
Lolwut? Certainly you aren't meaning slaves in Commoragh or Trazyn's exhibits
>Tau
>Imperium invades a Tau world
>al the humans decide to betray the Tau empire immediantly showing they cannot be trusted and dont care about the greater good
>Tau now know the humans on this planet cannot be trusted
>slowly gets rid of them in the most humane way possible
Yeah totally the bad guys
Frick double negative the humans can actually be trusted. Tau really are the bad guys
>Imperials
>trusted
Lel
>Lolwut? Certainly you aren't meaning slaves in Commoragh or Trazyn's exhibits
No, after crons recton from terminators into knagz in spess they take occupy human worlds and take human population as servants, of course it depends on local overlord's mental ilness.
Eldar on the other hand, Exodites and Craftworlds want monkeys out of their lawn, except Commorragh they for once welcome refugees with open hands..
Tau in canon are nice to humans they conquer tho, sterilisation is only Dow thing and Dow is moronic in terms of canon, khorne psykers level of moronic.
Being a Harlequin means dealing with chaos for the rest of your life
The Emperor wants what is best for humanity. That is enough.
Only relevant warp entity wich actually loves you is the Tau one since she came out of a belief in a philosophy to make the world a better place in a society wich doesnt hate life.
If you're human, the Emperor loves you.
I don't really think the Emperor even knows you if you're a human.
If we're saying the tau b***h cares for humans because of beliefs then the widespread Imperial belief of the Emperor caring for his followers and the actual fricking saints that keep spawning probably means something
But.. the Emperor himself objectively doesn't care about people, at least on an individual, personal level. You can argue that he cares about humanity as a whole and its survival and potential to survive but he's not going to come down and meet you on a relational level, partly because he can't and partly because he doesn't even want to be in the position he's in to begin with and is horrified at the prospect of people worshipping him as a god.
>nu41k "lore"
Opinions discarded.
>eats 1000 humans per day wich probably outclasses several tyranid hive fleets in amount of humans eaten
>gives Chaos 5 gigantically strong servants wich the Imperium has nothing to oppose unless there happens to be a Primarch or Caldor Draigo around
>creates a government so weak and inneffectual its unable to accomplish anything of note
>Celestine the poster boy of being liked by the Emperor has to go through hell each time to get the right to revive herself so she can fight for humanity
>evem Guilliman knows he only sees humans as tools
>even Guilliman knows he only sees humans as tools
No, he sees his sons as tools, not humanity. He wants to help humanity reach its true potential so it doesn't need to be afraid of chaos, his sons were the tools to help him achieve it.
Please don't tell me this is official, published writing
Do you know how many fricking trillions of humans exist in this setting? If he ate 10 000 humans a day every day for the 30 000 years he has been on the golden throne it would only be 100 billion souls eaten. Terra itself houses at least 200 billion people and each hive planet has hundreds of billions of people, across the million worlds of the imperium.
Big Emps could eat 1 000 000 people a day every day for 10 000 more years and still not have killed as many humans as have been killed in the Empires wars against Chaos alone.
Could this thing help an Eldar I wonder? How much does the moryal's choice of which deity to worship matter really?
In the new book she killed a fleet of Death Guard before entering Tau territory. She has done infinitely more for the Tau in this one single action then the Eldar Gods did since the War in Heaven.
Elephant talk thread, all this amounts to is a bunch of gays who watch warhammer 40k lore videos repeating the same phrases like a mantra.
They put smiley faces on his models and everyone who plays him is overly nice to cover for the rancid odour.
With Tzeentch it's always a game of second guessing, even good outcomes you still are paranoid. With Nurgle you literally just stop giving a shit good or bad, because whatever happens happens and you can't change that.
>With Nurgle you literally just stop giving a shit good or bad
The DG codex has a few examples of how Nurgle's forces are so infectious that if they get inside your lines, even if you win, you lose. That doesn't always translate to gameplay, but in the fluff they're almost Tyranid levels of pyrrhic victory.
Because his blessings keep you alive, rather than let the diseases kill you. It's sick, twisted love. Like a parent that hurts their child so they can nurse them back to health. He takes much more interest in his followers that most other gods, for better and for worse. Tzeentch can give you what you ask for, if it suits his goals, and as soon as you're no longer useful, your luck will change. All for the purpose of keepint the great wheel turning, never allowing stagnation to set in.
>that Magister Kant passage
I didn't realize I was a Nurgle worshiper already. Too much time despairing how I could be anything other than what I am now if I'd known better.
Because the Chaos lore is stupid.
Nurgle loves all life.
However he loves it all equally, so you have the same value in his eyes as a single bacteria of E.Coli in your gut.
Let's start by saying that's all chaos gods are bad and will frick you up.
>All of his gifts are plagues. There are zero circumstances as to which he will bless you, since all of his blessings are curses.
Nurgle is god of corruption, plague and enthropy, he is happy about this.
When he give you his gifts like plague he does it because he love you.
>I also don't understand why Tzeentch is seen as inherently cruel or dickish when he can legitimately bless you (financially, general quality of life, spiritually/emotionally ect.) if through blessing you it furthers his plans.
Tzeentch if change for change sake, he treat his followers as pawns, everytone is his pawn in his everchanging plans, he will mutate you into shit and tell you to deal with it.
Also being rich and having good quality of life is Slaanesh thing.
In conclusion nurgle is not doing it out of malice and genuinely care about his followers, he is nicest of chaos gods to his followers.
Because gw has downplayed the horror of nurgle to sell models like the sloppity bilepiper. It makes sense to think that about nurgle when your frame of reference is dancing nurglings, poxwalkers and plague marines with cum blasters. Yes the horror is still there but its been subsumed by the nigh mocking “love” and goofyness that nurgle has always had a bit of
>Because gw has downplayed the horror of nurgle to sell models like the sloppity bilepiper.
The Sloppity Bilepiper is actually really fricked up if you read the lore. It's a diseased bestowed upon a Plaguebearer as a punishment for slacking off, that causes it to uncontrollably sing and dance until it shrivels up into a shrunken head.
because half his servents are happy and sing with joy, another big group is moody but still okay. His lowest servents suffer without any kind of personal gain but no one ever identefies with the lowest caste, so it's easy to ignore
>I also don't understand why Tzeentch is seen as inherently cruel or dickish
every second of your existens is a coin flip, if you are allowed to keep existing or explode into shit.
Not ONCE in my whole life have I heard this description of Nurgle. I assume all the replies to OP are the same as mine.
Nurgle’s gifts aren’t any better. He takes away the pain, true. But Slaanesh gives you joy, Tzeentch gives you ambition and Khorne gives you bloodlust. All their followers are effected in such an away as to become totally devoted. Nurgle fundamentally no different from the others, his surface-level personality is that of the doting grandfather but he’s the same as the others in his actions, plans, etc.
Nurgle blesses you with basically hyper depression so you dont give a shit anymore.
That sounds pretty rad for many because they equate depression with stoicism. But stoicism means having a normal, healthy relation to your feelings, allowing them to exist and even expressing them while still keeping a rational view on things and not letting yourself be consumed by strong emotions such as grief and anger or yearning for things that are not yours to change anyway.
Depression is either a biochemical malfunction or a protective measurement when emotional trauma is experienced in such exessive ways that the desintegration of self is in close vicinity leading to an emergency shutdown and thus producing a constant flatline. Basically an emotional coma. Things that dont move have a much smaller chance of breaking.
Problem is that human sanity is directly buond to the ability to percept the world and themself trough feelings. Thats why depression also leads to depersonalization, memory loss, lack of focus, headaches, panic attacks (yes even if you feel "nothing" you can have panic and extreme agitation, your brain chemistry is affected, not your adrenal glands, enjoy) and dissocative psychotic episodes. The longer the depression lasts, the more permanent insane people get. I saw several patients nearly completely recover from their depression but never recover from the strains on overal mental health it left. People are legit fricked in the head after that to the point where even a normal conversation might be hard for them to follow in severe cases. Not even talking about shit like introspection. Its like talking to toddlers.
So its not like you keep your sane personality and just dont feel anything. Your self will get lost in a swamp of a dozen mental health conditions that will make it hard to even actively recall coherent episodes of your past. Thats not that different from some Tzeentchian mutation madness. Its just madness from another source.
It's kinda we all gonna die anyway so don't worry and be happy.
You can say simlar stuff about slaanesh but there "be happy" is more important and death is new expirioence instead of endgame.
"You should never grade evils, for if one is the worst, then you might be tempted to kinship with the least."
You can 100% grade evils, example:
>Current US government > Every government pre-1700s
Dont treat quotes from a quasi-horde shooter game like it comes from a nuanced moral compass
The thread is literally about chaos gods in warhammer universe. By the way, does the arrow mean that it's better or worse (more evil) than governments pre-1700s?