That’s a nice cope, but these douche nuggets don’t need it. There’s always been a sense of superiority and contempt that “producers” have over “consumers.”
https://i.imgur.com/jiJUvRB.jpg
Why do so many modern game devs insult their fans?
The reason they do this is because they think it will cull their existing fan base in favor of another mythical “better” one. They rather win in the area of optics with this new theoretical market, than make peace with the one they have because frankly, they are moronic.
The average person is a fricking moron and you're even more moronic if you don't know how many times games were dumbed down due to brain dead playtesters.
>Make a complex class that functions differently than killing machines >Audience becomes irate because they are not killing machines
Blizzard developers are a whole other story, but this seems like an honest complaint from a developer.
I would make the statement of artist integrity and telling outside influence to frick off and stop ruining their vision, but it was obvious this was market driven by the popularity of hero shooters and how jarring it was to see multiple of the same specialist running around rather than the generic soldier games used to do.
DICE believes that the Specialists are better since they are much more versatile, to them the class system is archaic and flawed because it's much more restrictive and map-dependent, for instance in a large map filled with vehicles most players would often play as Engineer while a minority picks the rest, or in a infantry-focused map with less vehicles most players usually pick Assault.
people only pick medic in this crap because it's the most broken class that usually has the best guns and can heal and revive
Engineer is also used because lol vehicles and their guns are good as well
recon and support are joke classes with objectively the worst guns, in comparison, and you pick them if you wanna have fun or whatever
I honestly don't know who the frick gets paid to balance this series
>to them the class system is archaic and flawed because it's much more restrictive and map-dependent
That part is true. Rigid classes aren't just pigeonholed in their role regarding whatever gadget(s) they have, but it's common that the weapons they're fitted with aren't even all that synergistic. But... >Specialists are better since they are much more versatile
Aren't the Specialists even more pigeonholed? They have these much more hyper-specific abilities that lend themselves towards a very specific action/role, and most of them have shit abilities compared to a select few blessed ones. In some cases, these abilities not only narrow the scope of what they're going to be doing on the utility side more than any Class of previous games, but also influence what gear they'd be best off carrying anyway.
I can barely remember how 2042 was when it launched, before the sorta-overhaul, but It seems like their reaction to the criticism (was misunderstood, probably intentionally, nobody likes the Specialists as -characters- most of all and want generic soldiers, second of all being the specialists' abilities are hyper niche and narrow in scope) just caused the specialists to be forced to use certain weapons, leading to the worst forced class loadouts in the series.
people only pick medic in this crap because it's the most broken class that usually has the best guns and can heal and revive
Engineer is also used because lol vehicles and their guns are good as well
recon and support are joke classes with objectively the worst guns, in comparison, and you pick them if you wanna have fun or whatever
I honestly don't know who the frick gets paid to balance this series
This has always been BF's issue. They always make the Medic a supersoldier with exclusive self-heal, they always make the Sniper untouchable by making all other weapons shit at a distance, they always make the Engineer prefer to camp on a hill with a tank so he can self-heal and snipe with it. Doing away with fixed class loadouts could have been welcome, but not by replacing it with Specialists.
>be me >want to sell a product >no one is buying it >randomly start shouting homosexual at people passing by >they get pissed but now people eye what Im selling due to all the people getting mad at me >sell more product than I would have previously
Not an insult. He's right. Classes were fine back in the day when people still played for fun, but bf4 zoomers are such meta prostitutes that they all only set themselves up for success. You'd have very unbalanced teams with everyone playing medic.
Specialists fix this issue. Even when these zoomers do their esport shit they'll be able to bring a larger amount of variety in tools to the battlefield. Not only that, it even fixes the issue of recontards wasting slots on your team, as they can actually still do something useful now.
>devs
Because since they are in the right side of history, they cannot be wrong. Ideas like "maybe my product wanst that good?" are alien to them, they even have an answer before the question appears in their minds "It didn't sell well? It must be gamers (straight white males) fault".
Normies buy microtransactions, season passes, battle passes, cosmetic DLC and just about any highly israeli nickle and diming tactic without much resistance unless some games journalist makes a stink
If anything they should call them morons more often
On one level they're correct. Players are moronic and will grind every game into a miserable boring experiencing. Dark Souls pvp is honestly a perfect example of how players will ruin everything for themselves. Hugo Martin was right, you need to force players to play 'the correct way'.
Problem is that DICE don't know how to do this, even they admit that their success was entirely by accident.
the real answer is because the people giving those answers don't do real work, it's their "job" to shift the blame on everyone else and suck their boss's dick so that they can keep moving upwards on a legacy of total failure.
The Specialist system is fundamentally broken because players don't want the system in the first place. Dice are being petty homosexuals who, upon realizing that people don't actually want their dumb system, will double down on it and then blame their customers for the fact that Dice are petty talentless homosexuals.
it's the moronic devs that don't understand their game. Classes are supposed to have a rigid battlefield role based on their equipment. BF3 started blurring the lines by making version weapon classes available to every class and it's all been down hill from there. Battlefield was not meant to be cod. It was not meant to be Overwatch. They should have made a new IP if they wanted to copy those games. Battlefield is a big battle game, not a 1v1 kill montage game. They turned it into a somehow even shittier cod.
>it is the fans fault we just added Black folk to WW1 they are racist >its the fans fault we just added females to front line WW2 they are sexist >its the fans fault we ruined the games mechanics and tried to add microtransactions everywhere, they dont understand it
Frick EA
>Didn't understand
NO ONE CARED HOW THEY PLAYED
Everyone was complaining about how they were clearly made to sell skins and had the most garbage and unfitting characters ever. They hated how they spammed dumb ass quips at the end of the round and caused the whole game to be nothing but the same player model against eachother on both factions. They hated how there WAS grunt soldier models in the game but we had to be some special snowflake instead. The could have taken the entire specialist system, but made it so you played as a grunt nobody with no special quotes or bio and it'd have been loved.
When people moaned they wanted classes back, no one meant from a gameplay perspective, they just wanted specialists gone. Now we have an even worse hybrid system in place that is worse then launch because they don't want to can their precious R6 knock off heroes.
>ea tell their new devs to make a sci-fi bf game with meme royale elements >after a year one of the devs ask >but we already own battlefront, why make a another sci-fi bf title? >ea says frick, you're right, just make it modern day >after another year one of the devs ask >but we already own ape sex legends, why make a another meme royale title? >ea says frick, you're right, just make a whole new game >but sir, the deadline is next year >shut up and release it, marketing got our back
Admitting fault but then just doubling down on the things people criticized turns you into 343. At least they don't pretend to not fricking hate their customer base
During 6th and especially 7th gen companies shed a lot of unnecessary talent. The games that were being put out would, for the most part, play themselves out of sheer necessity because they were designed around controllers that could only vaguely aim at things. In games where your cursor determines what you interact with, that meant that games could only ever rely on the player being able to vaguely press a button in the vicinity of a thing.
This caused a downward spiral for FPS, TPS and some RPGs, where they started attracting players who were specifically enticed by the fact that the game didn't demand too much from them and would constantly throw distractions in their face so that the player did not have to confront the fact that they were practically watching a movie.
It makes sense that incompetent developers would insult their playerbase when they clash with people who are finally developing some kind of taste (even if it is pretty shit taste overall).
>because it's MY game and I'M the gameplay design lead and I want you to play this way so i'm gonna MAKE you have to play this way and no i DON'T care what the franchise was like for the last 15 years >i failed out of every other industry i tried to succeed in btw
I don't know what the context is - from what I read, it could be an admission of their own shortcomings, but whatever the case, the problem IS theirs. Either you communicate what your 'intent' to the player or else you failed.
This is an adventure game. Core classes are fundamental, make sure the player has an idea and is regularly being reinforced by what the 'intent' is behind that class.
their fans are obsessed morons and children, they can say what they want without repercussions
That’s a nice cope, but these douche nuggets don’t need it. There’s always been a sense of superiority and contempt that “producers” have over “consumers.”
The reason they do this is because they think it will cull their existing fan base in favor of another mythical “better” one. They rather win in the area of optics with this new theoretical market, than make peace with the one they have because frankly, they are moronic.
>You are eating the burger wrong
because they're shit at their jobs and are incapable of accepting criticism
Where’s the insult?
They don't need people to buy their games anymore. Blackrock pays them anyway.
then the fault still lies with them because they didn't manage to properly explain how the specialists are supposed to be used
The average person is a fricking moron and you're even more moronic if you don't know how many times games were dumbed down due to brain dead playtesters.
>Make a complex class that functions differently than killing machines
>Audience becomes irate because they are not killing machines
Blizzard developers are a whole other story, but this seems like an honest complaint from a developer.
I would make the statement of artist integrity and telling outside influence to frick off and stop ruining their vision, but it was obvious this was market driven by the popularity of hero shooters and how jarring it was to see multiple of the same specialist running around rather than the generic soldier games used to do.
DICE believes that the Specialists are better since they are much more versatile, to them the class system is archaic and flawed because it's much more restrictive and map-dependent, for instance in a large map filled with vehicles most players would often play as Engineer while a minority picks the rest, or in a infantry-focused map with less vehicles most players usually pick Assault.
people only pick medic in this crap because it's the most broken class that usually has the best guns and can heal and revive
Engineer is also used because lol vehicles and their guns are good as well
recon and support are joke classes with objectively the worst guns, in comparison, and you pick them if you wanna have fun or whatever
I honestly don't know who the frick gets paid to balance this series
Limiting the game to 4 classes was a mistake.
>to them the class system is archaic and flawed because it's much more restrictive and map-dependent
That part is true. Rigid classes aren't just pigeonholed in their role regarding whatever gadget(s) they have, but it's common that the weapons they're fitted with aren't even all that synergistic. But...
>Specialists are better since they are much more versatile
Aren't the Specialists even more pigeonholed? They have these much more hyper-specific abilities that lend themselves towards a very specific action/role, and most of them have shit abilities compared to a select few blessed ones. In some cases, these abilities not only narrow the scope of what they're going to be doing on the utility side more than any Class of previous games, but also influence what gear they'd be best off carrying anyway.
I can barely remember how 2042 was when it launched, before the sorta-overhaul, but It seems like their reaction to the criticism (was misunderstood, probably intentionally, nobody likes the Specialists as -characters- most of all and want generic soldiers, second of all being the specialists' abilities are hyper niche and narrow in scope) just caused the specialists to be forced to use certain weapons, leading to the worst forced class loadouts in the series.
This has always been BF's issue. They always make the Medic a supersoldier with exclusive self-heal, they always make the Sniper untouchable by making all other weapons shit at a distance, they always make the Engineer prefer to camp on a hill with a tank so he can self-heal and snipe with it. Doing away with fixed class loadouts could have been welcome, but not by replacing it with Specialists.
It makes investors happy for ~~*some*~~ reason.
Sounds like a bad system.
Ok then.
How WERE they supposed to work?
>be me
>want to sell a product
>no one is buying it
>randomly start shouting homosexual at people passing by
>they get pissed but now people eye what Im selling due to all the people getting mad at me
>sell more product than I would have previously
>pander to morons
>morons dont understand your game design
>"wtf morons are morons?!?!"
Not an insult. He's right. Classes were fine back in the day when people still played for fun, but bf4 zoomers are such meta prostitutes that they all only set themselves up for success. You'd have very unbalanced teams with everyone playing medic.
Specialists fix this issue. Even when these zoomers do their esport shit they'll be able to bring a larger amount of variety in tools to the battlefield. Not only that, it even fixes the issue of recontards wasting slots on your team, as they can actually still do something useful now.
>we couldn't balance four classes so everyone wouldn't pick one
>let's just copy hero shooters
They were balanced. The problem is that zoomers only care about personal success.
If the customers are morons it's up to them to explain their game better to morons
>devs
Because since they are in the right side of history, they cannot be wrong. Ideas like "maybe my product wanst that good?" are alien to them, they even have an answer before the question appears in their minds "It didn't sell well? It must be gamers (straight white males) fault".
if other industries could get away with it they would do it in a heartbeat
Hollywood does it all the time they're always eating good on Ganker
Normies buy microtransactions, season passes, battle passes, cosmetic DLC and just about any highly israeli nickle and diming tactic without much resistance unless some games journalist makes a stink
If anything they should call them morons more often
There is nothing wrong with insulting gamers
On one level they're correct. Players are moronic and will grind every game into a miserable boring experiencing. Dark Souls pvp is honestly a perfect example of how players will ruin everything for themselves. Hugo Martin was right, you need to force players to play 'the correct way'.
Problem is that DICE don't know how to do this, even they admit that their success was entirely by accident.
the real answer is because the people giving those answers don't do real work, it's their "job" to shift the blame on everyone else and suck their boss's dick so that they can keep moving upwards on a legacy of total failure.
The Specialist system is fundamentally broken because players don't want the system in the first place. Dice are being petty homosexuals who, upon realizing that people don't actually want their dumb system, will double down on it and then blame their customers for the fact that Dice are petty talentless homosexuals.
Don't care, playing battlebit
>turn battlefield into hero shooter to copy fotm games
>wait a minute people don't want heros? they just don't understand!
it's the moronic devs that don't understand their game. Classes are supposed to have a rigid battlefield role based on their equipment. BF3 started blurring the lines by making version weapon classes available to every class and it's all been down hill from there. Battlefield was not meant to be cod. It was not meant to be Overwatch. They should have made a new IP if they wanted to copy those games. Battlefield is a big battle game, not a 1v1 kill montage game. They turned it into a somehow even shittier cod.
>it is the fans fault we just added Black folk to WW1 they are racist
>its the fans fault we just added females to front line WW2 they are sexist
>its the fans fault we ruined the games mechanics and tried to add microtransactions everywhere, they dont understand it
Frick EA
>Didn't understand
NO ONE CARED HOW THEY PLAYED
Everyone was complaining about how they were clearly made to sell skins and had the most garbage and unfitting characters ever. They hated how they spammed dumb ass quips at the end of the round and caused the whole game to be nothing but the same player model against eachother on both factions. They hated how there WAS grunt soldier models in the game but we had to be some special snowflake instead. The could have taken the entire specialist system, but made it so you played as a grunt nobody with no special quotes or bio and it'd have been loved.
When people moaned they wanted classes back, no one meant from a gameplay perspective, they just wanted specialists gone. Now we have an even worse hybrid system in place that is worse then launch because they don't want to can their precious R6 knock off heroes.
>ea tell their new devs to make a sci-fi bf game with meme royale elements
>after a year one of the devs ask
>but we already own battlefront, why make a another sci-fi bf title?
>ea says frick, you're right, just make it modern day
>after another year one of the devs ask
>but we already own ape sex legends, why make a another meme royale title?
>ea says frick, you're right, just make a whole new game
>but sir, the deadline is next year
>shut up and release it, marketing got our back
Admitting fault but then just doubling down on the things people criticized turns you into 343. At least they don't pretend to not fricking hate their customer base
Because most devs are no longer players or fans.
During 6th and especially 7th gen companies shed a lot of unnecessary talent. The games that were being put out would, for the most part, play themselves out of sheer necessity because they were designed around controllers that could only vaguely aim at things. In games where your cursor determines what you interact with, that meant that games could only ever rely on the player being able to vaguely press a button in the vicinity of a thing.
This caused a downward spiral for FPS, TPS and some RPGs, where they started attracting players who were specifically enticed by the fact that the game didn't demand too much from them and would constantly throw distractions in their face so that the player did not have to confront the fact that they were practically watching a movie.
It makes sense that incompetent developers would insult their playerbase when they clash with people who are finally developing some kind of taste (even if it is pretty shit taste overall).
That’s a lot of text simply to describe “israeli consolidation”
Because you homos keep buying the goyslop
>because it's MY game and I'M the gameplay design lead and I want you to play this way so i'm gonna MAKE you have to play this way and no i DON'T care what the franchise was like for the last 15 years
>i failed out of every other industry i tried to succeed in btw
So how ARE they supposed to work and what did the players not understand about it? This bullshit corporate speak is useless drivel
I don't know what the context is - from what I read, it could be an admission of their own shortcomings, but whatever the case, the problem IS theirs. Either you communicate what your 'intent' to the player or else you failed.
This is an adventure game. Core classes are fundamental, make sure the player has an idea and is regularly being reinforced by what the 'intent' is behind that class.