I don’t know if there can be one “best” game of any generation but if there is, Super Metroid is definitely in the conversation.
What makes you think it’s better than Super Mario World, LttP, or Sonic 2?
>What makes you think it’s better than Super Mario World, LttP, or Sonic 2?
I just like it more than those (not a fan of Sonic 2, I prefer 3&K). Super Mario World is a very competent platformer, Zelda is Zelda (fun experiences but never otherworldly). Super Metroid has the edge for me in that it provides both a fun game and a great immersive experience with its audiovisuals and atmosphere, plus it's more groundbreaking that those games you listed. It simply hits the spot.
Really, the only flaw of Super Metroid is that it's fairly easy upon replays when you know where everything is. But that's a pretty minor flaw and goes for most games of its kind, just don't replay it multiple times a year and you'll still have fun revisiting, I certainly do. It's the closest thing to perfect in a 16 bit game IMO, and I'm not generally a Nintendo property dicksucker or uber nostalgic since I didn't even play it as a kid, I didn't have SNES growing up and none of my friends had this game on SNES, so I feel this game has really earned my opinion
Basically agree with this post, as well. When it comes to adventure games of this era, the two generally put at the top are going to be Super Metroid and LttP, but for my money SM is the much more immersive experience. It achieves feeling like you're a space warrior in some remote isolated environment full of hostile lifeforms more than pretty much any Zelda achieves what its trying to do IMO
The advantage of Super Metroid I think is partially its cavernous subterranean setting, it's much easier to make that feel big than trying to make a big world feel big while still keeping it really small
IMO yes, but I think 4th gen is overrated in general. many of the 2D genres got better games later. it is both amazing to play and has ridiculous amount of influence
not him but >SMW
I think it's way overrated, because everyone has played it. weak presentation; barely that much new from SMB3—actually a step back in many regards; a bit underwhelming level design that is clearly quantity over quality; broken cape; yoshi barely tied to the gameplay; awkward spin jump / double jump control… I could go on. it's just "good", but it's no masterpiece. >LttP
not a zeldagay. decent game, but as a whole the "core" mechanics of 2D Zelda are lame IMO. top down view and combat just doesn't feel good to control. it's good because of the dungeons, items—basically, good execution; not because the concept itself is that great. that's why no one plays 2D zelda clones. >Sonic 2
everyone praises it until they get to play Hill Top, Oil Ocean and Metropolis. the overall gameplay relies a tad too much on memorization of good routes (because the game loves sending you to shit routes). bonus stages are fricking shit. super sonic is w/e. overall, it's still very much arcade-style action, when the rest of the genre was moving towards exploration, collecting, and occasionally RPG elements.
>clearly quantity over quality;
don't see that >broken cape;
a lot of the levels are designed so you can't abuse the cape >yoshi barely tied to the gameplay;
that's a good thing that it's treated like a powerup, imagine a level where you NEED the fire flower >awkward spin jump / double jump control
for you
4th gen feels kind of tragic to me, 2d was still the standard of the genre but the tech just wasn't quite there yet, fidelity was exclusive to arcade games. Fully realized games were possible in the 5th but by that point 2d was pigeon holed into a few niche genres and franchises.
yes and no. tech got better with 5th gen, sure, but that wasn't the biggest factor. I think in general few games really took the metroid / collecting / rpg elements yet, when they did you got great games even on GBC / GBA.
like, the whole "metroidvania" concept was PAINFULLY underdeveloped in 4th gen, you only had select few ones like Monster World and those were still way too early. collecting elements were still barely implemented—I think SMW is a great example, because it has dragon coins, but those are not recorded, and the game isn't made with them in mind anyway.
even when we take the rest of the genres, later games simply were more fleshed out. 2D fighters got their golden age around 98-02 with SFIII3S, SFA3, KoF 98 / 02, GGXX, MvC2 and CvS2, making SF2 look kinda backwards. shmups simply got more refined around that era too. RPGs got far more ambitious plots and storytelling, more interesting systems, branching out from basic "press A to win" formula, etc.
4th gen started all of this, but later gens perfected it.
>Fully realized games were possible in the 5th
Lol dumbass zoomer, nothing in 5th surpasses its counterpart in 4th. >But Crash is better than Sonic and Mario >Tekken is better than Street Fighter!
No, you just have garbage taste, your nostalgia is garbage
What has to stop is "late 90s nostalgia" zoomers. If you don't like the early 90s, it's a sure sign you're a zoomer and this board isn't for you. You can talk about 1998-00s trash on /vr/
7 months ago
Anonymous
>If you don't like the early 90s
Code speak for "if you don't like the SNES". Sorry, but there are at least 5 better 4th gen systems that are objectively leagues ahead of the SNES, and we are allowed to say as much. It was a shit console with shit hardware and the library of games reflects that. Conversely, the only ones decrying the PlayStation are the assblasted tendies who really felt the hurt from Nintendo's retreat into irrelevance, it has nothing to do with "late 90s nostalgia".
7 months ago
Anonymous
you forgot your catchphrase and avatar.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>there are at least 5 better 4th gen systems that are objectively leagues ahead of the SNES
What are they?
7 months ago
Anonymous
TurboGrafx-16
Genesis
Neo Geo
Super Famicom
Compact Disc Interactive
7 months ago
Anonymous
>PSX is better than SNES
No it's not, you're deluded objectively. PSX is pretty shit, only was "good" back in the day because of fighting game ports for cheap, these days with arcade emulation being free and easy, it's completely irrelevant, and the early 3D fighters are all dated dog turds >BUT JRPGS
Were better on SNES, and it's not that good a genre either way >MUH MEGA MAN X
Only good game was the first one, and you know what console that was on >MUH RESIDENT EVIL, MUH TOMB RAIDER
All games with tank controls are bad, it's a shit mechanic everybody agrees is shit who isn't nostalgia blind for these games >MUH PLATFORMERS, CRASH, TOMBA, KLONOA, CROC, THE LIST GOES ON
Inferior to most of the 2D platformers
7 months ago
Anonymous
But Tomba is a 2D platformer.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Whatever
7 months ago
Anonymous
>No it's not, you're deluded objectively.
The SNES was a 2.68 mhz piece of shit that could not handle many key genres of it's generation, including shooters, beat em up's, run & gun, and the SNES games that were in these genres had to make serious compromises and cutbacks just in order to run on such shoddy hardware, when compared to the far more arcade-like experiences the far more powerful Mega Drive or PC Engine were able to offer. The PlayStation, conversely, was a highly performant console that was able to perform 3D often at a smooth 60 or 30 FPS, usually outpacing it's Nintendo competitor the N64, despite being 2 years older, and was widely recognised as having the best games on offer in many key genres of it's generation, including RPG's, 2D and 3D platformer, fighting, rhythm, and racing. The SNES struggled to crawl, and is mostly remembered these days for the same handful of trite and overplayed Nintendo IP's, which is all anyone ever talks about on the thing. The PlayStation sprinted with freedom of the wind, and damn near every PlayStation fan has a different selection of favourite games.
The only one "objectively deluded" here is yourself. >BUT JRPGS Were not that good a genre either way
Of course an SNES fan would think that, considering all the SNES had were lifeless RPG Maker shit from before SquareSoft reached their prime on the PlayStation. >MUH MEGA MAN X
It's a damn shame about all the slowdowns in the first game, it slows to a crawl with even the smallest hint of action, should have been a Mega Drive title instead. >OTHER BAD LOUD OPINIONS
It's always the tendies.
7 months ago
Anonymous
He said the catchphrase!
7 months ago
Anonymous
PSX was only good for fighting games, which are all inferior to Saturn and arcade versions, rendering the PSX versions of those games outdated and useless since such emulation became commonplace.
Everything else on PSX was trash.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Shut the frick up troony.
7 months ago
Anonymous
PSX is garbage zoomer. Only 2D games are good, frick off with your gen z bullshit hanging out on the retro board posing.
have a nice day.
Another poser/wanna be trying to LARP as a millennial/gen x. GTFO homosexual.
you're really aggressively misinterpreting what I posted. me saying 2d took a downturn right when the tech had hit a good place for it isn't me sucking off the late 90s.
No. Most overrated game of that gen along with the Sonics and Chrono Trigger.
It's a damn good game. Maybe top 10 for the system, certainly top 20. My problem is the game on replays is pretty boring. It's the same shit for the first few hours no matter what unless you do some hard sequence breaking a normal player isn't going to be able to pull off.
1. The controls were really awkward. As you know, when Samus jumps she either does a somersault or a normal jump. I never figured out how to always do a somersault or normal jump when I wanted. Also, if you accidentally tap a diagonal while somersaulting (which isn't hard on a SNES or Wii Classic D-pad), Samus will unfurl and no longer be able to wall jump. I learned to maintain my somersaults with a bit of practice, but it always required more focus than it should've and never became comfortable. Besides making it harder to wall jump, having two kinds of jumping is annoying because they have different momentum. In Mario, if you tap left while jumping to the right, you'll move right more slowly. If you do this while Samus is in a normal jump, the same thing happens. But if you do this while Samus is in a somersault jump, she immediately snaps left with the same speed she had before. I often found myself getting hit in tight situations because the wrong kind of jump came out, so my inputs carried me to a different spot than I'd intended. It was fricking infuriating.
Using the X-ray beam and cycling through weapons were slow and tedious processes. I don't remember how Fusion handled weapon cycling, but I don't think I had that issue with that game despite it using fewer buttons.
2. Combat just felt like a war of attrition. But maybe that's for the best; I don't think I'd have gotten far if I had to do precise dodging with these controls.
3. Exploration was unrewarding, the game sometimes punished it. Sometimes I see people fawn over the way the game integrates its secrets into the environment. I have no idea what they're talking about. Progression was either locked behind brightly colored doors or behind blocks with pictures of bombs/arrows on them. What kind of natural cave has that? The colored doors were annoying too, since they forced me to stop, (slowly) change weapons, and then fire up to 5 of them just to enter the next room. Why not have the doors open after one shot? That's enough to verify you've unlocked the weapon. And then once you're in the next room, you have to cycle back to the People also hype up the sequence breaks, but I couldn't find any. Early on I mastered the timing for wall jumps and infinite bomb jumps, but every time I pulled off some tricky sequence to get to a high place early, I was greeted by a big orange door I couldn't open. What a waste of time! I picked up a couple E-tanks and missile upgrades early, but that doesn't really change the game, and I ended up returning to those rooms earlier, so it felt like extra work for the same result.
3(b). Even worse than that, I felt like the game punished me for going off the beaten track. First, there were a couple instances where I unlocked a new ability and realized it opened up rooms nearby and in a place I'd been long ago. Thinking I'd discover a secret that most players would overlook, I first went to the faraway room. However, it turned out that this was the intended path, and I'd skipped an upgrade by passing over the nearby room. So I had to go all the way back to where I unlocked the ability, and then return to the older room: two extra trips across the map. Second, there are one way doors you can go through while exploring that force you to take a really long route to get back to where you were. This is what made me drop the game. I got to the area with the quicksand and sand-falls and was exploring. I was actually starting to have a bit of fun, feeling like the game was finally opening up as people promised. Then I went through a one-way gate and ended up in a room that looked familiar. I checked the map and realized it was a room from way earlier. To get back to the sand area, I'd have to cross almost the whole map. No big deal, I had discovered a way to open one-way gates from the wrong side, so I could just return that way, right? Nope. It turns out you can only open one-way gates from the wrong side if the intended way is left-to-right. This was a right-to-left gate. At that point I was fed up with the game.
4. Travel is so slow. It's boring as frick going back and forth through the same rooms whenever you open up a new area at the other end of the map. You should be able to warp between save rooms.
I also just remembered another control issue: you can't run if you have the X-ray goggles equipped, but I would often want to do that because I'd be trying to go through previously visited rooms as quickly as possible to scan them for secrets.
All in all, I really don't know what people see in this game.
Bonus b***hing: even when the exploration worked, it wasn't much fun. You just enter a room, scan it with the X-ray goggles, and bomb/dash through/shoot whatever secret blocks appear.
*And then once you're in the next room, you have to cycle back to the weapon you were using earlier.
Sorry I just woke up and wrote this all down in one go. That's why there are so many typos.
some actual responses
1. I couldn't get used to it either after Fusion. I just got the Super Metroid Redux hack, it only changes the controls. It felt much better, though I felt it made the game a bit easier.
2. for lack of better word, metroid has no "combat". enemies are more like a local fauna that serves as an obstacle and replenishes your health. and yes, your controls are not meant for combat, and the game is built on this. it's not Mega Man or Contra, and neither it tries to be.
3. >Progression was either locked behind brightly colored doors or behind blocks with pictures of bombs/arrows on them. What kind of natural cave has that?
well… you're complaining that Metroid is Metroid? there's ALWAYS some new way to go. and yes, that means some areas are locked. you could just read what red / green / yellow doors mean. >I picked up a couple E-tanks and missile upgrades early, but that doesn't really change the game
yes. and that's how it's supposed to be. upgrade items aren't really essential at all, abilities are. upgrade items are more like collectibles, really. they gradually add up though, but the whole point is about getting 100% of them.
3b. >Thinking I'd discover a secret that most players would overlook, I first went to the faraway room.
so… instead of logically checking up the closest thing and THEN going to check a further thing, you basically got distracted by some "secret" that could be some shitty +10 rockets, basically forcing yourself to take a double trip? sorry but that's your own mistake.
so after reading 3 and 3b, I see you decided to go for ""sequence breaks""?… REALLY? so you don't even understand the game that well, let alone knowing the whole map, and you went for "sequence breaks" like some hot shot? then you get shocked that you randomly decided to make a huge hook for some random old area you just remembered, and there was only a E tank and not a free blowjob or something?
I'm not surprised you got filtered by the game.
I tried sequence breaks because I realized pretty early on that the game would bore me if I didn't try to get things early. Doing things in the intended order wasn't really satisfying, but bypassing obstacles with clever platforming sounded appealing. I was hoping it would let me get to new areas early, not just pick up a few missiles or whatever. Honestly, you're right that some of the extra trips were my fault. I kind of assumed that the nearby rooms would take me further into the game, which is why I didn't go there first, but looking back that wasn't the right assumption. I don't personally have a problem with doors and secrets that don't blend in with the environment, but that's something I've seen people praise that just wasn't true.
>I tried sequence breaks because I realized pretty early on that the game would bore me if I didn't try to get things early.
Sorry but you made your conclusions WAY too soon. It'd be way better if you just went the normal way, the "intended" path first; also way better if you just read the manual.
Yes, SM starts a tad slow. And yes, I'd say you do need a little bit of a "clue" for what to do / how the game works. I beat the game right after Fusion. I knew that rushing to get the upgrades was (near) pointless—before you get bomb + super bomb and X-ray. I also knew the upgrades and what they did—that e.g. you'd get hi-jump boots and screw attack to go higher, that run could break arrow blocks and was generally an easy way to zip through long rooms (also see: shine sparking), that ice beam froze enemies and wave beam shot through doors, that bombs revealed a type of block if it was breakable and super bombs revealed it for the whole screen.
but like 2/3rds of this are in the manual—the rest could be figured out on your own, or by using common sense and trying to go the "intended" way.
and the said "intended" way actually is built to be interesting, it constantly gives you new abilities and stuff to keep you hooked. and you kind of know when you hit a dead end and it's time to go somewhere else; unexplored doors on map are a simple way to tell where to go. in fact, you lose all this when you STRAIN from the path, you just easily end up doing double trips, finding nothing and losing interest.
I just beat SM a week ago—there was VERY little pointless backtracking in there.
7 months ago
Anonymous
The main reason I picked it up was that I'd heard the game gives you a ton of freedom in how to approach it and allows you to "outsmart the devs." I did begrudgingly play it the intended way for a while since the game kept locking me into the main path. It was playable, but with the awkward controls and constantly having to scan/bomb rooms it wasn't something I really enjoyed.
my general rule for any metroid (-vania) is: when you have a fork in the path, briefly check where both go first, before choosing to go on any path. because you risk missing an ability / map room, or something else. even if you discover it's a dead end, even better—you basically rule out one option and now definitely know where to go next.
btw, the quicksand in Maridia was perhaps the only truly annoying moment in the whole game where you're sent far back. this was the only part in the game I had to pointlessly go through 2 times, finally getting it later. really, I wish I knew I'd get morph ball and space jump / screw attack quickly after it, both made it 10x easier to revisit.
That's a good practice. If Maridia is the worst part, maybe I'll give it another shot. The game was at least tolerable till it sent me back. Might as well see the end.
7 months ago
Anonymous
why do people keep playing genres they don't like
hunting for secrets is not a flaw, it's fun. seeing a suspicious looking wall and bombing it and finding a hidden path is what makes Metroid. even better, bombing a perfectly normal looking wall and finding a hidden path. the slow, heavy movement is part of the fun. the backtracking is part of the fun. it is NOT an action game. it is an exploration-adventure, also known as a "Metroidvania".
7 months ago
Anonymous
I've played and enjoyed Ufouria, and I remember Fusion being decent enough. Like I said, I was looking forward to SM because I'd heard it was like Fusion but less linear, allowing players to skip ahead with clever use of their abilities like chaining bomb jumps. I wouldn't have picked it up if I'd known that wasn't true.
>The main reason I picked it up was that I'd heard the game gives you a ton of freedom in how to approach it and allows you to "outsmart the devs."
I think this is largely BS spread by speedrooners who know the game like their 5 fingers. when you ACTUALLY break the sequence, you better know what you're doing, because you obviously may not have upgrades, and it gets ugly very quick.
If you play "normally", there's a pretty obvious order of things, it's almost "linear" save for a few minor alterations you can make.
and really, there's no real "secret doors" in Metroid; when you find a "secret", it's just the intended way to go. the game counts every single item you collect and the idea is to collect all of them. don't be shocked if you beat the game and see you got like 70% of items.
I know "fooling the developers" sounds cool, but while this is doable, this is largely in the realm of speedrunners—i.e. those who know the game through and through and can "break" it intentionally. you absolutely want to at least beat the game first. what you tried to do was like speedrunning a game before you've beaten it. though I don't think it's your fault, the meme that Super Metroid is this "non linear game where you can go anywhere" simply went too far. >If Maridia is the worst part, maybe I'll give it another shot.
Maridia is not far from the ending anyway, you basically go to explore the lava parts of Norfair after it, then go to that room with 4 boss statues and go to the last area that has nothing and is basically a glorified cutscene.
btw, I unironically recommend you try Fusion (if you want more or want to give the game a 2nd try). it holds your hand a bit more, but in the end this is for the better for new players, and its QoL fixes virtually everything you complained about.
Thanks for the recommendation. I played Fusion up to the spider boss as a teen but haven't revisited it. Hopefully that'll be more enjoyable with the improved controls and more realistic expectations by me.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Fusion is just a more "modern" version of the same. It is easier to get if you didn't read the manual and don't want to read guides. The game gets hate from speedrooners because it has virtually no sequence breaks (or more like it has exactly 1 and the devs know about it and congratulate you on it if you do it). But in reality it's just the same type of game, you just can't clip through 10 walls and beat bosses in reverse order, which upsets some people.
But I'd just say don't force yourself. Main fun in Metroid is getting all the items for the heck of it. There isn't really that much "progression" like in an RPG and no real combat like in, idk, Mega Man X / Zero / metroidvanias. Way too many people come to it expecting exactly that, then get disappointed because Metroid is none of that. now also add those who think this is some "open world" game, and you get a collective choir of people who hate that Metroid for being Metroid.
If you just want a 2D game with big map, but no item collecting 'tism, and where you have some combat / rpg going on, play Aria of Sorrow or SotN.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>The main reason I picked it up was that I'd heard the game gives you a ton of freedom in how to approach it and allows you to "outsmart the devs."
I think this is largely BS spread by speedrooners who know the game like their 5 fingers. when you ACTUALLY break the sequence, you better know what you're doing, because you obviously may not have upgrades, and it gets ugly very quick.
If you play "normally", there's a pretty obvious order of things, it's almost "linear" save for a few minor alterations you can make.
and really, there's no real "secret doors" in Metroid; when you find a "secret", it's just the intended way to go. the game counts every single item you collect and the idea is to collect all of them. don't be shocked if you beat the game and see you got like 70% of items.
I know "fooling the developers" sounds cool, but while this is doable, this is largely in the realm of speedrunners—i.e. those who know the game through and through and can "break" it intentionally. you absolutely want to at least beat the game first. what you tried to do was like speedrunning a game before you've beaten it. though I don't think it's your fault, the meme that Super Metroid is this "non linear game where you can go anywhere" simply went too far. >If Maridia is the worst part, maybe I'll give it another shot.
Maridia is not far from the ending anyway, you basically go to explore the lava parts of Norfair after it, then go to that room with 4 boss statues and go to the last area that has nothing and is basically a glorified cutscene.
btw, I unironically recommend you try Fusion (if you want more or want to give the game a 2nd try). it holds your hand a bit more, but in the end this is for the better for new players, and its QoL fixes virtually everything you complained about.
Also, rereading your comment, I think I might've phrased things poorly earlier. When I went far out of the way for a secret, it actually turned out to be the intended way, meaning that the nearby place I skipped had a new ability. This is what required me to take extra trips: I had to go back to the nearby room that I thought would lead to a new area to grab an upgrade, and then go back to the faraway place to get to the next area. It's still my fault, since I should've briefly checked the nearby room first to make sure. Nevertheless, it kind of took the wind out of my sails, getting excited about a potential secret, rushing to pick up the secret ASAP, then finding out I'd screwed myself.
my general rule for any metroid (-vania) is: when you have a fork in the path, briefly check where both go first, before choosing to go on any path. because you risk missing an ability / map room, or something else. even if you discover it's a dead end, even better—you basically rule out one option and now definitely know where to go next.
btw, the quicksand in Maridia was perhaps the only truly annoying moment in the whole game where you're sent far back. this was the only part in the game I had to pointlessly go through 2 times, finally getting it later. really, I wish I knew I'd get morph ball and space jump / screw attack quickly after it, both made it 10x easier to revisit.
I only applied the main Redux IPS patch, nothing else. Basically it switches to Fusion controls, also X to X-ray and A to walk (you run automatically, there's some option to change that in menu).
forgot to add that it adds a little bit of QoL—you need just 1 rocket to open red / green door, the range of X-ray got wider, power bomb reveals hidden tiles, first intro movie can be skipped by pressing start, some transitions / cutscenes / elevators got sped up, small stuff like that.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Oh I thought you meant the physics
7 months ago
Anonymous
actually I haven't delved into it, but it does change some behaviors, though not physics per se, see https://www.romhacking.net/hacks/3211/ which Redux is based off. e.g. you can
there's a note on the optional patch for Redux: >“Heavy Physics.ips” (From GBA Style): This will make it so that Samus now lands faster and with more gravity to her, similar to that of the GBA Metroids. Bomb jumping has been fixed for the new physics, and also the Title Screen Demos were re-recorded so they work properly with the new physics
7 months ago
Anonymous
>e.g. you can
shit, forgot to end the sentence. you can do stuff like start spinning again in mid-air if you stopped, you roll speed increased, there's auto-fire until you find charge shot… etc.. basically stuff that makes controls less inhibited.
No. And it's a shame how every hipster has elevated it beyond what it actually is: An overly easy game that controls well and has all-time great atmosphere, but not much else.
It's a great game, that I pretty much completely don't enjoy playing at this point.
These days I'd probably go for Pocky and Rocky or Contra Hard Corps. Those games are just pure fun, and minimal bullshit.
The rule for most Metroid games is pretty much great for one playthrough, and then questionable.
This is also just flat out true of adventure games, and games that have adventure game elements. Once you know where everything is, and all of the twists the game is going to pull on you, that's half of the game's appeal gone. What's left is then gameplay systems, which have a tendency to be not as got as a dedicated platformer, or not as good as a dedicated action game.
>This is also just flat out true of adventure games, and games that have adventure game elements. Once you know where everything is, and all of the twists the game is going to pull on you, that's half of the game's appeal gone. What's left is then gameplay systems, which have a tendency to be not as got as a dedicated platformer, or not as good as a dedicated action game.
Eh gonna disagree here. A game like Super Metroid does become less good upon familiarity, but so do action oriented games. I'd rather play Super Metroid where I can still appreciate the environments and progression, as opposed to say idk Mega Man games where the entire thing is just a second nature reflex cause I've beaten it multiple times. How thrilling is it to repeat the same movements over and over that you've got hardwired? I'd say pure action games are less fun than adventure games for repeats
Action that doesn't get old is like fighting games, cause matches can all be different. The fight against Wily or Sigma is always going to be the same and come down to the same muscle memory, because it's a simple AI.
Eh, different game.
It is pretty much a better and more immersive adventure game, and the best part of Metroid is the adventure game part.
The combat is kind of button mashy, and not particularly good.
>The combat is kind of button mashy, and not particularly good.
therefore I will never love the game. unless you mean button mashy in a "super smash bros melee" way but I doubt it.
the soundtrack was probably an S tier
the pixel art was an S tier
the gameplay was pretty good
i wouldn't argue with it being the best game of the 4th gen
Tried to play through this again recently, I love everything except that you have to double tap to run. What a pain in the ass, makes the controls feel so stiff. Otherwise insanely good.
Just the first game I thought of when thinking "what game has a need for constant button pressing these morons probably like"
[...]
I mean you can get away with saying shit like Mario and Kirby is for babies cause it kinda is, but Super Metroid is not, so maybe the hatred comes from that fact.....Nintendo did something cool for once, and that makes people even more mad
But, I only see this hatred for Super Metroid. Zeldas are pretty jerked off to high heaven, so another theory I have is just that Samus is a female so triggers the terminally sexless.
>Super Metroid is impossible to talk about without a barrage of hate comments
Good. This is what you get for decades of memeing it as the "best game EVAR!!" when in fact it's barely even competent as action game. Metroid games are non-challenging empty hallway walking simulators, that sort of thing has very little mass appeal, and you liking it does not make you special.
The level design is shit too.
>random images >hates exploration
why are you even in the metroid thread. at least string together a competent sentence. you sound like an ai bot. is this board that infested?
>anyone who disagrees is an AI BOT!!!
I don't "hate exploration" if there's something to actually FIND. Empty hallways with mindless popcorn enemies that lead to more empty hallways with mindless popcorn enemies are not my idea of enthralling exploration.
My image is obviously related to the level design being shit, as it is 4 standout examples of the complete incompetence behind the map layout. >why are you even in the metroid thread
The topic is "Would you agree if I say [Metroid] is the best game of the 4th gen?". My response is, absolutely not, it's not even in the same ballpark. Sorry but this isn't yet another Nintendo dick sucking thread.
>I don't "hate exploration" if there's something to actually FIND. Empty hallways with mindless popcorn enemies that lead to more empty hallways with mindless popcorn enemies are not my idea of enthralling exploration.
The only thing that validates exploration and treasure hunting is the fact that there ISN'T a reward everywhere you look. If there was, it wouldn't be exploration or hunting. If you don't have to go out of your way, it's not exploring, you absolute low IQ sped.
Just say you need instant gratification, go back to your Mega Baby dogshit.
i think a lot of it is symphony of the night fans too, you'll notice there is a huge cult of castlevania dickwashers on this board and that games gets praised while metroid gets bashed
Super Metroid will always be an all time favorite for me because of its movement. Samus never controls like she does in SM which is a real shame because there is such a high skill ceiling here.
For example, the wall jumping isn't like how it usually is in games. Normally you just jump near a wall, but in SM you have to be near a wall, but also be holding away from the wall. This makes it a little harder to do, but when you get the perfect wall jump it feels amazing. And the player is rewarded for good wall jumps by getting to places they wouldn't normally be able to go to. Like getting to Kraid before the high jump or getting to the top of red tower without ice-beaming the rippers.
One minor shortcoming I think this game has is that there aren't enough satisfying items to collect. A majority of the stuff you find is just another missile upgrade, powerbomb upgrade, etc. and while there are some worthwhile pickups, like the speed booster and the space jump, I can see a rival game like SoTN having a world that feels more full of reasons/secrets to explore.
But I still prefer SM because the amount of speed and precision it gives you is incomparable and on top of that it has a memorable: map, set of monsters, ost, sprites.
So many retro games people jerk off are full of flaws, real technical flaws. Things you can only overlook because of nostalgia, tolerance, or pure cope. This isn't one of those games.
Morrowind is boring nerd shit and Shenmue is gay weeb shit and one of the most overjerked "muh 00s" games of all time along with dogshit like Bully and the GTAs. Let me guess, you also think Nickelback and Limp Bizkit were good cause you're just oh so obsessed with Y2K, go frick off
these zoomer wienersuckers are getting out of control, allowing 6th gen was a fricking mistake
3D gaming is garbage. I'm not a zoomer, you belong on Ganker.
Name a better adventure game than Shenmue. Name better exploration games than Shenmue and Morrowind. Its laughable anyone who thinks Super metroid could even come close to matching. >you're just oh so obsessed with Y2K, go frick off
While not my favourites I do like Limp Bizkit and Offspring.
You're a moron. Bad taste in games, bad taste in music, just the definition of garbage. Anyone who likes nu metal and pop punk can't be considered to have a good opinion about anything. You're a cringe zoomer.
7 months ago
Anonymous
I've asked you to name better but you can't can u without exposing yourself? >Anyone who likes nu metal and pop punk can't be considered to have a good opinion about anything.
You hate THPS as well? Yikes.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>You hate THPS as well? Yikes.
Yeah those games are trash only zoomers LARPing as Millennials like.
WOOOOAH DUDE JNCO JEANS, REMEMBER THOSE? I DONT CAUSE I WAS ONE YEARS OLD. Your opinions are just bad and you like shitty games, frick your fake nostalgia.
7 months ago
Anonymous
This dork never got the video tapes lmao.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>zoomer larping
I hung out with real punks, they listened to Casualties and Skrewdriver and called kids who liked Green Day posers.
Shenmue is extremely boring and that’s not me making a modern revisionist take.
I’ve been playing it on and off since it came out on the Dreamcast all those years ago, I’ve got the steam version now and I still can’t bring myself to finish it. It really is a backwards and forwards walking sim.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Shenmue is extremely boring
Running down corridors in Metroid is better? Refilling health and ammo constantly more fun? Give it up. >and I still can’t bring myself to finish it
Maybe you should try finishing a game before talking smack.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Refilling health and ammo constantly more fun?
Lol this zoomer homosexual can't into Super Metroid. Imagine having to fill your health up.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Metroid is better than Shenmue though why you want to compare them is a valid question. Very different.
You don’t have to finish a game to know it’s not very good. If it’s bad then stop playing it
Occasionally I’ll pick up Shenmue as sometimes I feel like it but finishing it isn’t going to make me think it’s any better. It’s a chore at this point so it’s way down the list.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Searching for sailors is 1000 times more satisfying than searching for space pirates. Searching for anything in suoer metroid is more like blowing up every single wall in Zelda 1. Who on earth wants to do that?
7 months ago
Anonymous
At this point neither sound all that fun.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>is more like blowing up every single wall in Zelda 1.
At this point neither sound all that fun.
Don't take take the standard /vr/ bait at face value. Bombing in Zelda 1 is only monotonous if you're moronic and make it that way. Your bomb supply is renewable, but capped low to begin with (8). This encourages you to try and place bombs where you think a secret might be, not just spamming them one step at a time. Each dungeon room has only four possible wall exits (and one possible floor exit). Already we are down to a room requiring a maximum of 4 bombs to test for secrets. But most rooms already have a door or two, further reducing the possibilities. Finally, you can make judicious use of the map to predict the walls where bombs are most likely to work.
Consider picrel. You can enter the first three rooms freely. The locked door in the north-from-entrance room will tell you that there's a room north of the east-from-entrance room. So before using your key to reach the old man from the west, try bombing in from the south (keys are more valuable than bombs, typically). There's no clue for the western hole in the north-from-entrance room, but if you stumble in here without the ladder you may just drop a bomb there anyway because what else are you going to do? Meanwhile if you do move on, you can confirm the reward for using the key by entering the map room from the east. Then you'll have the dungeon map, which well show you where there are rooms on the other side of walls.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>Don't take the bait
What bait? I'm sure as hell not the only one who got stuck in Zelda and mindlessly went around blowing everything up in the hopes of unlocking progress.
7 months ago
Anonymous
At what point, exactly, did you get stuck?
7 months ago
Anonymous
I'm done with you.
7 months ago
Anonymous
nothing about that looks suspicious to you? two identical stones at the far north end of the map guarded by lynels is just a normal day? i think there's an old man in one of the later dungeons that tells you about it too
the real bomb every wall part is in second quest
7 months ago
Anonymous
Here's your hint bro
7 months ago
Anonymous
I guess kids were just a lot smarter in the 80s.
7 months ago
Anonymous
You're just pretending you figured it out this way
7 months ago
Anonymous
Believe that if that makes you feel better.
No games held your hand, we had to figure everything out by trial and error.
Yes, but it was more than trial and error though. I found the death mountain entrance way before I could even get in because it was such a suspicious location.
7 months ago
Anonymous
>and then I got the world record because it was so much fun
Did you also beat Alex Kidd in Miracle World on your first attempt?
7 months ago
Anonymous
No games held your hand, we had to figure everything out by trial and error.
7 months ago
Anonymous
Another important difference is that we just played Zelda because the gameplay was fun. We didn't have a million other games and social media algorithms pulling our attention. So we'd just fire up Zelda and run around killing shit because it was fun and exploring the world because it was fun. It was a leisure activity. We weren't grinding through a backlog of games just to impress people online.
Sonic and Mario have far superior platforming. Contra and Metal Slug mog Metroids pea shooter shooting and like I just said its not even a good game for exploring as you're forced to ustop in place and use an xray scanner on every single area in the game.
Super Metroid isn't a platformer, and it's not a shooter. You have severe autism if you think so. The only game series it can be compared to is Zelda, it's the same as Zelda but side scrolling instead of top down.
And no, garbage like Centy and Oasis aren't good games. I say this as someone who's a far bigger Sonic fan than you, and only a fan of true Sonic, 2D Sonic.
Super Metroid is a platformer and a shooter just its very bad at both those things. >A far bigger fan than you
Did you ever go to Sega World and meet Sonic in person? Check mate non fan.
late 90s and 00s games suck, as does all things from that era
If your favorite game is Contra or Metal Slug, you're low IQ. Those are the most basic braindead gaming experiences of all time. May as well play Pong.
I don't fricking know but this board has gone downhill because of them, it's a fricking dumpster now. I blame Y2K memestalgia, they flocked here because of it, it might even just be one persistent autist gay pulling this shit
Nah, I was learning to emulate when I was a child because I didn't have any new consoles. Long before the Y2K nostalgia shit. But I'm just here for the webms, game suggestions, and to laugh at shit flinging.
I don't fricking know but this board has gone downhill because of them, it's a fricking dumpster now. I blame Y2K memestalgia, they flocked here because of it, it might even just be one persistent autist gay pulling this shit
We have better reflex's and get paid for winning at competitive and balanced games.
Cause newer games suck ass. I rather just play games that let you be lost and kick my ass than easy. Not only that I enjoy 90s culture more. Compare Doom 2016 with Doom for example: 2016 is nu-metal to Doom's thrash metal, 2016 had cutscenes that took too long while Doom just had text wall that ironically enough, I read and got me pumped because of how infrequent they are, 2016 had very generic looking roster while Doom's enemies and sounds are so iconic everyone recognizes them.
I can go on but my point is that nu-games suck ass, and I don't see why I should follow them.
Based, that's how I got into them when I was a kid. I became Ganker personified, because I was the homosexual to say Call of Duty sucks and Streets of Rage was better game.
>super metroid came out in 1994 >people think super metroid is the best game of its generation >1994 alone saw doom 2, heretic, and x-com, thats not counting other games that came out during the same era
kek
best wilyvania maybe
I don’t know if there can be one “best” game of any generation but if there is, Super Metroid is definitely in the conversation.
What makes you think it’s better than Super Mario World, LttP, or Sonic 2?
>What makes you think it’s better than Super Mario World, LttP, or Sonic 2?
I just like it more than those (not a fan of Sonic 2, I prefer 3&K). Super Mario World is a very competent platformer, Zelda is Zelda (fun experiences but never otherworldly). Super Metroid has the edge for me in that it provides both a fun game and a great immersive experience with its audiovisuals and atmosphere, plus it's more groundbreaking that those games you listed. It simply hits the spot.
I would say so.
Really, the only flaw of Super Metroid is that it's fairly easy upon replays when you know where everything is. But that's a pretty minor flaw and goes for most games of its kind, just don't replay it multiple times a year and you'll still have fun revisiting, I certainly do. It's the closest thing to perfect in a 16 bit game IMO, and I'm not generally a Nintendo property dicksucker or uber nostalgic since I didn't even play it as a kid, I didn't have SNES growing up and none of my friends had this game on SNES, so I feel this game has really earned my opinion
Basically agree with this post, as well. When it comes to adventure games of this era, the two generally put at the top are going to be Super Metroid and LttP, but for my money SM is the much more immersive experience. It achieves feeling like you're a space warrior in some remote isolated environment full of hostile lifeforms more than pretty much any Zelda achieves what its trying to do IMO
The advantage of Super Metroid I think is partially its cavernous subterranean setting, it's much easier to make that feel big than trying to make a big world feel big while still keeping it really small
IMO yes, but I think 4th gen is overrated in general. many of the 2D genres got better games later. it is both amazing to play and has ridiculous amount of influence
not him but
>SMW
I think it's way overrated, because everyone has played it. weak presentation; barely that much new from SMB3—actually a step back in many regards; a bit underwhelming level design that is clearly quantity over quality; broken cape; yoshi barely tied to the gameplay; awkward spin jump / double jump control… I could go on. it's just "good", but it's no masterpiece.
>LttP
not a zeldagay. decent game, but as a whole the "core" mechanics of 2D Zelda are lame IMO. top down view and combat just doesn't feel good to control. it's good because of the dungeons, items—basically, good execution; not because the concept itself is that great. that's why no one plays 2D zelda clones.
>Sonic 2
everyone praises it until they get to play Hill Top, Oil Ocean and Metropolis. the overall gameplay relies a tad too much on memorization of good routes (because the game loves sending you to shit routes). bonus stages are fricking shit. super sonic is w/e. overall, it's still very much arcade-style action, when the rest of the genre was moving towards exploration, collecting, and occasionally RPG elements.
>clearly quantity over quality;
don't see that
>broken cape;
a lot of the levels are designed so you can't abuse the cape
>yoshi barely tied to the gameplay;
that's a good thing that it's treated like a powerup, imagine a level where you NEED the fire flower
>awkward spin jump / double jump control
for you
4th gen feels kind of tragic to me, 2d was still the standard of the genre but the tech just wasn't quite there yet, fidelity was exclusive to arcade games. Fully realized games were possible in the 5th but by that point 2d was pigeon holed into a few niche genres and franchises.
*standard of the industry.
>but the tech just wasn't quite there yet,
That is only true for one 4th gen console.
>2.68 mhz
yes and no. tech got better with 5th gen, sure, but that wasn't the biggest factor. I think in general few games really took the metroid / collecting / rpg elements yet, when they did you got great games even on GBC / GBA.
like, the whole "metroidvania" concept was PAINFULLY underdeveloped in 4th gen, you only had select few ones like Monster World and those were still way too early. collecting elements were still barely implemented—I think SMW is a great example, because it has dragon coins, but those are not recorded, and the game isn't made with them in mind anyway.
even when we take the rest of the genres, later games simply were more fleshed out. 2D fighters got their golden age around 98-02 with SFIII3S, SFA3, KoF 98 / 02, GGXX, MvC2 and CvS2, making SF2 look kinda backwards. shmups simply got more refined around that era too. RPGs got far more ambitious plots and storytelling, more interesting systems, branching out from basic "press A to win" formula, etc.
4th gen started all of this, but later gens perfected it.
>Fully realized games were possible in the 5th
Lol dumbass zoomer, nothing in 5th surpasses its counterpart in 4th.
>But Crash is better than Sonic and Mario
>Tekken is better than Street Fighter!
No, you just have garbage taste, your nostalgia is garbage
playstation is a horrible console people only pretend to like because of nostalgia
/vrn/ tendie containment board NOW. This has to stop.
What has to stop is "late 90s nostalgia" zoomers. If you don't like the early 90s, it's a sure sign you're a zoomer and this board isn't for you. You can talk about 1998-00s trash on /vr/
>If you don't like the early 90s
Code speak for "if you don't like the SNES". Sorry, but there are at least 5 better 4th gen systems that are objectively leagues ahead of the SNES, and we are allowed to say as much. It was a shit console with shit hardware and the library of games reflects that. Conversely, the only ones decrying the PlayStation are the assblasted tendies who really felt the hurt from Nintendo's retreat into irrelevance, it has nothing to do with "late 90s nostalgia".
you forgot your catchphrase and avatar.
>there are at least 5 better 4th gen systems that are objectively leagues ahead of the SNES
What are they?
TurboGrafx-16
Genesis
Neo Geo
Super Famicom
Compact Disc Interactive
>PSX is better than SNES
No it's not, you're deluded objectively. PSX is pretty shit, only was "good" back in the day because of fighting game ports for cheap, these days with arcade emulation being free and easy, it's completely irrelevant, and the early 3D fighters are all dated dog turds
>BUT JRPGS
Were better on SNES, and it's not that good a genre either way
>MUH MEGA MAN X
Only good game was the first one, and you know what console that was on
>MUH RESIDENT EVIL, MUH TOMB RAIDER
All games with tank controls are bad, it's a shit mechanic everybody agrees is shit who isn't nostalgia blind for these games
>MUH PLATFORMERS, CRASH, TOMBA, KLONOA, CROC, THE LIST GOES ON
Inferior to most of the 2D platformers
But Tomba is a 2D platformer.
Whatever
>No it's not, you're deluded objectively.
The SNES was a 2.68 mhz piece of shit that could not handle many key genres of it's generation, including shooters, beat em up's, run & gun, and the SNES games that were in these genres had to make serious compromises and cutbacks just in order to run on such shoddy hardware, when compared to the far more arcade-like experiences the far more powerful Mega Drive or PC Engine were able to offer. The PlayStation, conversely, was a highly performant console that was able to perform 3D often at a smooth 60 or 30 FPS, usually outpacing it's Nintendo competitor the N64, despite being 2 years older, and was widely recognised as having the best games on offer in many key genres of it's generation, including RPG's, 2D and 3D platformer, fighting, rhythm, and racing. The SNES struggled to crawl, and is mostly remembered these days for the same handful of trite and overplayed Nintendo IP's, which is all anyone ever talks about on the thing. The PlayStation sprinted with freedom of the wind, and damn near every PlayStation fan has a different selection of favourite games.
The only one "objectively deluded" here is yourself.
>BUT JRPGS Were not that good a genre either way
Of course an SNES fan would think that, considering all the SNES had were lifeless RPG Maker shit from before SquareSoft reached their prime on the PlayStation.
>MUH MEGA MAN X
It's a damn shame about all the slowdowns in the first game, it slows to a crawl with even the smallest hint of action, should have been a Mega Drive title instead.
>OTHER BAD LOUD OPINIONS
It's always the tendies.
He said the catchphrase!
PSX was only good for fighting games, which are all inferior to Saturn and arcade versions, rendering the PSX versions of those games outdated and useless since such emulation became commonplace.
Everything else on PSX was trash.
Shut the frick up troony.
PSX is garbage zoomer. Only 2D games are good, frick off with your gen z bullshit hanging out on the retro board posing.
Another poser/wanna be trying to LARP as a millennial/gen x. GTFO homosexual.
you're really aggressively misinterpreting what I posted. me saying 2d took a downturn right when the tech had hit a good place for it isn't me sucking off the late 90s.
I think it's way overrated, because everyone has played it.
what kind of logic is that ?
Retro gaming isn't about having fun, it's about hipster cred.
those hipsters are moronic.
it's way better than any of those games, moron
No. Most overrated game of that gen along with the Sonics and Chrono Trigger.
It's a damn good game. Maybe top 10 for the system, certainly top 20. My problem is the game on replays is pretty boring. It's the same shit for the first few hours no matter what unless you do some hard sequence breaking a normal player isn't going to be able to pull off.
No. This was one of the most disappointing games I've ever played. I didn't even bother to finish it.
the frick? how did it disappoint you?
1. The controls were really awkward. As you know, when Samus jumps she either does a somersault or a normal jump. I never figured out how to always do a somersault or normal jump when I wanted. Also, if you accidentally tap a diagonal while somersaulting (which isn't hard on a SNES or Wii Classic D-pad), Samus will unfurl and no longer be able to wall jump. I learned to maintain my somersaults with a bit of practice, but it always required more focus than it should've and never became comfortable. Besides making it harder to wall jump, having two kinds of jumping is annoying because they have different momentum. In Mario, if you tap left while jumping to the right, you'll move right more slowly. If you do this while Samus is in a normal jump, the same thing happens. But if you do this while Samus is in a somersault jump, she immediately snaps left with the same speed she had before. I often found myself getting hit in tight situations because the wrong kind of jump came out, so my inputs carried me to a different spot than I'd intended. It was fricking infuriating.
Using the X-ray beam and cycling through weapons were slow and tedious processes. I don't remember how Fusion handled weapon cycling, but I don't think I had that issue with that game despite it using fewer buttons.
2. Combat just felt like a war of attrition. But maybe that's for the best; I don't think I'd have gotten far if I had to do precise dodging with these controls.
(continued)
3. Exploration was unrewarding, the game sometimes punished it. Sometimes I see people fawn over the way the game integrates its secrets into the environment. I have no idea what they're talking about. Progression was either locked behind brightly colored doors or behind blocks with pictures of bombs/arrows on them. What kind of natural cave has that? The colored doors were annoying too, since they forced me to stop, (slowly) change weapons, and then fire up to 5 of them just to enter the next room. Why not have the doors open after one shot? That's enough to verify you've unlocked the weapon. And then once you're in the next room, you have to cycle back to the People also hype up the sequence breaks, but I couldn't find any. Early on I mastered the timing for wall jumps and infinite bomb jumps, but every time I pulled off some tricky sequence to get to a high place early, I was greeted by a big orange door I couldn't open. What a waste of time! I picked up a couple E-tanks and missile upgrades early, but that doesn't really change the game, and I ended up returning to those rooms earlier, so it felt like extra work for the same result.
(continued)
3(b). Even worse than that, I felt like the game punished me for going off the beaten track. First, there were a couple instances where I unlocked a new ability and realized it opened up rooms nearby and in a place I'd been long ago. Thinking I'd discover a secret that most players would overlook, I first went to the faraway room. However, it turned out that this was the intended path, and I'd skipped an upgrade by passing over the nearby room. So I had to go all the way back to where I unlocked the ability, and then return to the older room: two extra trips across the map. Second, there are one way doors you can go through while exploring that force you to take a really long route to get back to where you were. This is what made me drop the game. I got to the area with the quicksand and sand-falls and was exploring. I was actually starting to have a bit of fun, feeling like the game was finally opening up as people promised. Then I went through a one-way gate and ended up in a room that looked familiar. I checked the map and realized it was a room from way earlier. To get back to the sand area, I'd have to cross almost the whole map. No big deal, I had discovered a way to open one-way gates from the wrong side, so I could just return that way, right? Nope. It turns out you can only open one-way gates from the wrong side if the intended way is left-to-right. This was a right-to-left gate. At that point I was fed up with the game.
4. Travel is so slow. It's boring as frick going back and forth through the same rooms whenever you open up a new area at the other end of the map. You should be able to warp between save rooms.
I also just remembered another control issue: you can't run if you have the X-ray goggles equipped, but I would often want to do that because I'd be trying to go through previously visited rooms as quickly as possible to scan them for secrets.
All in all, I really don't know what people see in this game.
Bonus b***hing: even when the exploration worked, it wasn't much fun. You just enter a room, scan it with the X-ray goggles, and bomb/dash through/shoot whatever secret blocks appear.
*And then once you're in the next room, you have to cycle back to the weapon you were using earlier.
Sorry I just woke up and wrote this all down in one go. That's why there are so many typos.
some actual responses
1. I couldn't get used to it either after Fusion. I just got the Super Metroid Redux hack, it only changes the controls. It felt much better, though I felt it made the game a bit easier.
2. for lack of better word, metroid has no "combat". enemies are more like a local fauna that serves as an obstacle and replenishes your health. and yes, your controls are not meant for combat, and the game is built on this. it's not Mega Man or Contra, and neither it tries to be.
3.
>Progression was either locked behind brightly colored doors or behind blocks with pictures of bombs/arrows on them. What kind of natural cave has that?
well… you're complaining that Metroid is Metroid? there's ALWAYS some new way to go. and yes, that means some areas are locked. you could just read what red / green / yellow doors mean.
>I picked up a couple E-tanks and missile upgrades early, but that doesn't really change the game
yes. and that's how it's supposed to be. upgrade items aren't really essential at all, abilities are. upgrade items are more like collectibles, really. they gradually add up though, but the whole point is about getting 100% of them.
3b.
>Thinking I'd discover a secret that most players would overlook, I first went to the faraway room.
so… instead of logically checking up the closest thing and THEN going to check a further thing, you basically got distracted by some "secret" that could be some shitty +10 rockets, basically forcing yourself to take a double trip? sorry but that's your own mistake.
so after reading 3 and 3b, I see you decided to go for ""sequence breaks""?… REALLY? so you don't even understand the game that well, let alone knowing the whole map, and you went for "sequence breaks" like some hot shot? then you get shocked that you randomly decided to make a huge hook for some random old area you just remembered, and there was only a E tank and not a free blowjob or something?
I'm not surprised you got filtered by the game.
I tried sequence breaks because I realized pretty early on that the game would bore me if I didn't try to get things early. Doing things in the intended order wasn't really satisfying, but bypassing obstacles with clever platforming sounded appealing. I was hoping it would let me get to new areas early, not just pick up a few missiles or whatever. Honestly, you're right that some of the extra trips were my fault. I kind of assumed that the nearby rooms would take me further into the game, which is why I didn't go there first, but looking back that wasn't the right assumption. I don't personally have a problem with doors and secrets that don't blend in with the environment, but that's something I've seen people praise that just wasn't true.
>I tried sequence breaks because I realized pretty early on that the game would bore me if I didn't try to get things early.
Sorry but you made your conclusions WAY too soon. It'd be way better if you just went the normal way, the "intended" path first; also way better if you just read the manual.
Yes, SM starts a tad slow. And yes, I'd say you do need a little bit of a "clue" for what to do / how the game works. I beat the game right after Fusion. I knew that rushing to get the upgrades was (near) pointless—before you get bomb + super bomb and X-ray. I also knew the upgrades and what they did—that e.g. you'd get hi-jump boots and screw attack to go higher, that run could break arrow blocks and was generally an easy way to zip through long rooms (also see: shine sparking), that ice beam froze enemies and wave beam shot through doors, that bombs revealed a type of block if it was breakable and super bombs revealed it for the whole screen.
but like 2/3rds of this are in the manual—the rest could be figured out on your own, or by using common sense and trying to go the "intended" way.
and the said "intended" way actually is built to be interesting, it constantly gives you new abilities and stuff to keep you hooked. and you kind of know when you hit a dead end and it's time to go somewhere else; unexplored doors on map are a simple way to tell where to go. in fact, you lose all this when you STRAIN from the path, you just easily end up doing double trips, finding nothing and losing interest.
I just beat SM a week ago—there was VERY little pointless backtracking in there.
The main reason I picked it up was that I'd heard the game gives you a ton of freedom in how to approach it and allows you to "outsmart the devs." I did begrudgingly play it the intended way for a while since the game kept locking me into the main path. It was playable, but with the awkward controls and constantly having to scan/bomb rooms it wasn't something I really enjoyed.
That's a good practice. If Maridia is the worst part, maybe I'll give it another shot. The game was at least tolerable till it sent me back. Might as well see the end.
why do people keep playing genres they don't like
hunting for secrets is not a flaw, it's fun. seeing a suspicious looking wall and bombing it and finding a hidden path is what makes Metroid. even better, bombing a perfectly normal looking wall and finding a hidden path. the slow, heavy movement is part of the fun. the backtracking is part of the fun. it is NOT an action game. it is an exploration-adventure, also known as a "Metroidvania".
I've played and enjoyed Ufouria, and I remember Fusion being decent enough. Like I said, I was looking forward to SM because I'd heard it was like Fusion but less linear, allowing players to skip ahead with clever use of their abilities like chaining bomb jumps. I wouldn't have picked it up if I'd known that wasn't true.
Thanks for the recommendation. I played Fusion up to the spider boss as a teen but haven't revisited it. Hopefully that'll be more enjoyable with the improved controls and more realistic expectations by me.
Fusion is just a more "modern" version of the same. It is easier to get if you didn't read the manual and don't want to read guides. The game gets hate from speedrooners because it has virtually no sequence breaks (or more like it has exactly 1 and the devs know about it and congratulate you on it if you do it). But in reality it's just the same type of game, you just can't clip through 10 walls and beat bosses in reverse order, which upsets some people.
But I'd just say don't force yourself. Main fun in Metroid is getting all the items for the heck of it. There isn't really that much "progression" like in an RPG and no real combat like in, idk, Mega Man X / Zero / metroidvanias. Way too many people come to it expecting exactly that, then get disappointed because Metroid is none of that. now also add those who think this is some "open world" game, and you get a collective choir of people who hate that Metroid for being Metroid.
If you just want a 2D game with big map, but no item collecting 'tism, and where you have some combat / rpg going on, play Aria of Sorrow or SotN.
>The main reason I picked it up was that I'd heard the game gives you a ton of freedom in how to approach it and allows you to "outsmart the devs."
I think this is largely BS spread by speedrooners who know the game like their 5 fingers. when you ACTUALLY break the sequence, you better know what you're doing, because you obviously may not have upgrades, and it gets ugly very quick.
If you play "normally", there's a pretty obvious order of things, it's almost "linear" save for a few minor alterations you can make.
and really, there's no real "secret doors" in Metroid; when you find a "secret", it's just the intended way to go. the game counts every single item you collect and the idea is to collect all of them. don't be shocked if you beat the game and see you got like 70% of items.
I know "fooling the developers" sounds cool, but while this is doable, this is largely in the realm of speedrunners—i.e. those who know the game through and through and can "break" it intentionally. you absolutely want to at least beat the game first. what you tried to do was like speedrunning a game before you've beaten it. though I don't think it's your fault, the meme that Super Metroid is this "non linear game where you can go anywhere" simply went too far.
>If Maridia is the worst part, maybe I'll give it another shot.
Maridia is not far from the ending anyway, you basically go to explore the lava parts of Norfair after it, then go to that room with 4 boss statues and go to the last area that has nothing and is basically a glorified cutscene.
btw, I unironically recommend you try Fusion (if you want more or want to give the game a 2nd try). it holds your hand a bit more, but in the end this is for the better for new players, and its QoL fixes virtually everything you complained about.
Also, rereading your comment, I think I might've phrased things poorly earlier. When I went far out of the way for a secret, it actually turned out to be the intended way, meaning that the nearby place I skipped had a new ability. This is what required me to take extra trips: I had to go back to the nearby room that I thought would lead to a new area to grab an upgrade, and then go back to the faraway place to get to the next area. It's still my fault, since I should've briefly checked the nearby room first to make sure. Nevertheless, it kind of took the wind out of my sails, getting excited about a potential secret, rushing to pick up the secret ASAP, then finding out I'd screwed myself.
my general rule for any metroid (-vania) is: when you have a fork in the path, briefly check where both go first, before choosing to go on any path. because you risk missing an ability / map room, or something else. even if you discover it's a dead end, even better—you basically rule out one option and now definitely know where to go next.
btw, the quicksand in Maridia was perhaps the only truly annoying moment in the whole game where you're sent far back. this was the only part in the game I had to pointlessly go through 2 times, finally getting it later. really, I wish I knew I'd get morph ball and space jump / screw attack quickly after it, both made it 10x easier to revisit.
>changes the controls
Does it do that by default or did you have to use the optional patch?
I only applied the main Redux IPS patch, nothing else. Basically it switches to Fusion controls, also X to X-ray and A to walk (you run automatically, there's some option to change that in menu).
forgot to add that it adds a little bit of QoL—you need just 1 rocket to open red / green door, the range of X-ray got wider, power bomb reveals hidden tiles, first intro movie can be skipped by pressing start, some transitions / cutscenes / elevators got sped up, small stuff like that.
Oh I thought you meant the physics
actually I haven't delved into it, but it does change some behaviors, though not physics per se, see https://www.romhacking.net/hacks/3211/ which Redux is based off. e.g. you can
there's a note on the optional patch for Redux:
>“Heavy Physics.ips” (From GBA Style): This will make it so that Samus now lands faster and with more gravity to her, similar to that of the GBA Metroids. Bomb jumping has been fixed for the new physics, and also the Title Screen Demos were re-recorded so they work properly with the new physics
>e.g. you can
shit, forgot to end the sentence. you can do stuff like start spinning again in mid-air if you stopped, you roll speed increased, there's auto-fire until you find charge shot… etc.. basically stuff that makes controls less inhibited.
LttP is superior
its the best game ever made.
No. And it's a shame how every hipster has elevated it beyond what it actually is: An overly easy game that controls well and has all-time great atmosphere, but not much else.
Name top five games, limit it to super nes if you want to, but lets see what "anti hipster" games you like
I found the Strike trilogy more fun and engaging than Super Metriod, and I probably wouldn't put them in top three of the generation.
who the frick talks about "hipsters" in 2023? are you having a stroke?
No.
No, but it is a very cool game and one of the best looking console only games of the 90s.
The "4th gen" does not exist.
I do not acknowledge that classification system.
Super Metroid was not the best SFC game.
best metroid game for sure yes.
best 4th gen game maybe.
I prefer my action games to have, you know, ACTION. Super Empty Hallways Simulator is one of the most boring games I've ever been memed into playing.
>Play exploration game
>"uhhh I expected ACTION"
your fault, anon
>watch Jaws for the first time
>leave mad that there's barely any shark carnage
This is what you sound like right now
?si=wupj9UMVbV9kH16s
It's a great game, that I pretty much completely don't enjoy playing at this point.
These days I'd probably go for Pocky and Rocky or Contra Hard Corps. Those games are just pure fun, and minimal bullshit.
Best game period
The rule for most Metroid games is pretty much great for one playthrough, and then questionable.
This is also just flat out true of adventure games, and games that have adventure game elements. Once you know where everything is, and all of the twists the game is going to pull on you, that's half of the game's appeal gone. What's left is then gameplay systems, which have a tendency to be not as got as a dedicated platformer, or not as good as a dedicated action game.
good thing Super Metroid has amazing gameplay and movement
Not really.
Such amazing movement that someone had to make an improvement hack, right?
never heard of it but it wasn't needed
no u
kek what? you sound like you prefer fusion's dumbed down movements without understanding why SM's additional inputs are superior
>This is also just flat out true of adventure games, and games that have adventure game elements. Once you know where everything is, and all of the twists the game is going to pull on you, that's half of the game's appeal gone. What's left is then gameplay systems, which have a tendency to be not as got as a dedicated platformer, or not as good as a dedicated action game.
Eh gonna disagree here. A game like Super Metroid does become less good upon familiarity, but so do action oriented games. I'd rather play Super Metroid where I can still appreciate the environments and progression, as opposed to say idk Mega Man games where the entire thing is just a second nature reflex cause I've beaten it multiple times. How thrilling is it to repeat the same movements over and over that you've got hardwired? I'd say pure action games are less fun than adventure games for repeats
Action that doesn't get old is like fighting games, cause matches can all be different. The fight against Wily or Sigma is always going to be the same and come down to the same muscle memory, because it's a simple AI.
It's one of my favorite games I've ever played. I only played it for the first time last year and loved it, I just regret now playing it sooner.
This was strictly better in everyway.
for 3d babs
Eh, different game.
It is pretty much a better and more immersive adventure game, and the best part of Metroid is the adventure game part.
The combat is kind of button mashy, and not particularly good.
>The combat is kind of button mashy, and not particularly good.
therefore I will never love the game. unless you mean button mashy in a "super smash bros melee" way but I doubt it.
Worse graphics, so no, that is incorrect.
Literal walking simulator
Is it true that you can't strafe in this game?
Holding down the L shoulder button will allow you to strafe even if you don't have a target to lock on to.
Basically this. It makes the last boss fight annoying af!
You cannot in the traditional sense which made zero sense as all first person shooters allowed you to by that point.
its just turok with a metroid skin
Exactly. I loved Turok.
I enjoyed prime. I didn't care for Nintendos 4th gen 2d games they just were way behind the curve. Lateral thinking with withered technology.
>numeric generation nonsense
kys
is this the new autism australia kun is trying to push?
Maybe if you like wandering around for hours before resorting to a walkthrough
you can say that for every game besides the most moronic of the frickin moronic ones and arcade style games
Probably. The only other game that gives it a run for its money is Rondo of Blood.
I can't see a good reason why people suck its dick so hard.
the soundtrack was probably an S tier
the pixel art was an S tier
the gameplay was pretty good
i wouldn't argue with it being the best game of the 4th gen
out of my way you fricking plebeians
Tried to play through this again recently, I love everything except that you have to double tap to run. What a pain in the ass, makes the controls feel so stiff. Otherwise insanely good.
Many would agree it's the best game of 4th gen OF ALL TIME. Play it BEFORE YOU DIE!!!!
Just the first game I thought of when thinking "what game has a need for constant button pressing these morons probably like"
I mean you can get away with saying shit like Mario and Kirby is for babies cause it kinda is, but Super Metroid is not, so maybe the hatred comes from that fact.....Nintendo did something cool for once, and that makes people even more mad
But, I only see this hatred for Super Metroid. Zeldas are pretty jerked off to high heaven, so another theory I have is just that Samus is a female so triggers the terminally sexless.
>Super Metroid is impossible to talk about without a barrage of hate comments
Good. This is what you get for decades of memeing it as the "best game EVAR!!" when in fact it's barely even competent as action game. Metroid games are non-challenging empty hallway walking simulators, that sort of thing has very little mass appeal, and you liking it does not make you special.
The level design is shit too.
>random images
>hates exploration
why are you even in the metroid thread. at least string together a competent sentence. you sound like an ai bot. is this board that infested?
>anyone who disagrees is an AI BOT!!!
I don't "hate exploration" if there's something to actually FIND. Empty hallways with mindless popcorn enemies that lead to more empty hallways with mindless popcorn enemies are not my idea of enthralling exploration.
My image is obviously related to the level design being shit, as it is 4 standout examples of the complete incompetence behind the map layout.
>why are you even in the metroid thread
The topic is "Would you agree if I say [Metroid] is the best game of the 4th gen?". My response is, absolutely not, it's not even in the same ballpark. Sorry but this isn't yet another Nintendo dick sucking thread.
>I don't "hate exploration" if there's something to actually FIND. Empty hallways with mindless popcorn enemies that lead to more empty hallways with mindless popcorn enemies are not my idea of enthralling exploration.
The only thing that validates exploration and treasure hunting is the fact that there ISN'T a reward everywhere you look. If there was, it wouldn't be exploration or hunting. If you don't have to go out of your way, it's not exploring, you absolute low IQ sped.
Just say you need instant gratification, go back to your Mega Baby dogshit.
i think a lot of it is symphony of the night fans too, you'll notice there is a huge cult of castlevania dickwashers on this board and that games gets praised while metroid gets bashed
Symphony of the Night literally does everything Metroid tries, but way better. It is the far better game categorically. Cope.
>born in the 90s zoomers jockey for playstation garbage
PSX fanboys are some of the most annoying on this board. Weeaboovania (only Classicvania is good) and Tekken fans are a scourge.
it's really just people under 30 who are annoying and have bad opinions of games in general, and a lot of them tend to be the sony dipshits
SotN is basically broken. No way is it a better designed game than Super Metroid.
Now Hollow Knight...
>this ADVENTURE GAME is a bad action game!
Autism alert
Autism alert
It was a great game.
Now all we need is that one moron who compares Super Metroid to Earthworm Jim.
Super Metroid will always be an all time favorite for me because of its movement. Samus never controls like she does in SM which is a real shame because there is such a high skill ceiling here.
For example, the wall jumping isn't like how it usually is in games. Normally you just jump near a wall, but in SM you have to be near a wall, but also be holding away from the wall. This makes it a little harder to do, but when you get the perfect wall jump it feels amazing. And the player is rewarded for good wall jumps by getting to places they wouldn't normally be able to go to. Like getting to Kraid before the high jump or getting to the top of red tower without ice-beaming the rippers.
One minor shortcoming I think this game has is that there aren't enough satisfying items to collect. A majority of the stuff you find is just another missile upgrade, powerbomb upgrade, etc. and while there are some worthwhile pickups, like the speed booster and the space jump, I can see a rival game like SoTN having a world that feels more full of reasons/secrets to explore.
But I still prefer SM because the amount of speed and precision it gives you is incomparable and on top of that it has a memorable: map, set of monsters, ost, sprites.
So many retro games people jerk off are full of flaws, real technical flaws. Things you can only overlook because of nostalgia, tolerance, or pure cope. This isn't one of those games.
banjovania > zeldavania > metroidvania > castlevania
discuss
It is tied with Chrono Ff6 and seiken densetsu 3
Best game of the best console but I'd pick Doom for the generation
it's a good choice. the amount of routes and self imposed challenges you can do keep it fresh. music is baller too
Metroid is a bad platformer, bad shooter and bad exploration game. Play Morrowind or Shenmue is you want great games.
>Play Morrowind
I have sex, so no
>Shenmue
LOL
You honestly have more fun exploring metroids empty hallways over Morrowind and Shenmue? You're either a tendie or a casual.
3D gaming is garbage. I'm not a zoomer, you belong on Ganker.
For me? 3D games in 2D worlds.
Morrowind is boring nerd shit and Shenmue is gay weeb shit and one of the most overjerked "muh 00s" games of all time along with dogshit like Bully and the GTAs. Let me guess, you also think Nickelback and Limp Bizkit were good cause you're just oh so obsessed with Y2K, go frick off
these zoomer wienersuckers are getting out of control, allowing 6th gen was a fricking mistake
Name a better adventure game than Shenmue. Name better exploration games than Shenmue and Morrowind. Its laughable anyone who thinks Super metroid could even come close to matching.
>you're just oh so obsessed with Y2K, go frick off
While not my favourites I do like Limp Bizkit and Offspring.
You're a moron. Bad taste in games, bad taste in music, just the definition of garbage. Anyone who likes nu metal and pop punk can't be considered to have a good opinion about anything. You're a cringe zoomer.
I've asked you to name better but you can't can u without exposing yourself?
>Anyone who likes nu metal and pop punk can't be considered to have a good opinion about anything.
You hate THPS as well? Yikes.
>You hate THPS as well? Yikes.
Yeah those games are trash only zoomers LARPing as Millennials like.
WOOOOAH DUDE JNCO JEANS, REMEMBER THOSE? I DONT CAUSE I WAS ONE YEARS OLD. Your opinions are just bad and you like shitty games, frick your fake nostalgia.
This dork never got the video tapes lmao.
>zoomer larping
I hung out with real punks, they listened to Casualties and Skrewdriver and called kids who liked Green Day posers.
late 90s and 00s games suck, as does all things from that era
have a nice day.
Shenmue is extremely boring and that’s not me making a modern revisionist take.
I’ve been playing it on and off since it came out on the Dreamcast all those years ago, I’ve got the steam version now and I still can’t bring myself to finish it. It really is a backwards and forwards walking sim.
>Shenmue is extremely boring
Running down corridors in Metroid is better? Refilling health and ammo constantly more fun? Give it up.
>and I still can’t bring myself to finish it
Maybe you should try finishing a game before talking smack.
>Refilling health and ammo constantly more fun?
Lol this zoomer homosexual can't into Super Metroid. Imagine having to fill your health up.
Metroid is better than Shenmue though why you want to compare them is a valid question. Very different.
You don’t have to finish a game to know it’s not very good. If it’s bad then stop playing it
Occasionally I’ll pick up Shenmue as sometimes I feel like it but finishing it isn’t going to make me think it’s any better. It’s a chore at this point so it’s way down the list.
Searching for sailors is 1000 times more satisfying than searching for space pirates. Searching for anything in suoer metroid is more like blowing up every single wall in Zelda 1. Who on earth wants to do that?
At this point neither sound all that fun.
>is more like blowing up every single wall in Zelda 1.
Don't take take the standard /vr/ bait at face value. Bombing in Zelda 1 is only monotonous if you're moronic and make it that way. Your bomb supply is renewable, but capped low to begin with (8). This encourages you to try and place bombs where you think a secret might be, not just spamming them one step at a time. Each dungeon room has only four possible wall exits (and one possible floor exit). Already we are down to a room requiring a maximum of 4 bombs to test for secrets. But most rooms already have a door or two, further reducing the possibilities. Finally, you can make judicious use of the map to predict the walls where bombs are most likely to work.
Consider picrel. You can enter the first three rooms freely. The locked door in the north-from-entrance room will tell you that there's a room north of the east-from-entrance room. So before using your key to reach the old man from the west, try bombing in from the south (keys are more valuable than bombs, typically). There's no clue for the western hole in the north-from-entrance room, but if you stumble in here without the ladder you may just drop a bomb there anyway because what else are you going to do? Meanwhile if you do move on, you can confirm the reward for using the key by entering the map room from the east. Then you'll have the dungeon map, which well show you where there are rooms on the other side of walls.
>Don't take the bait
What bait? I'm sure as hell not the only one who got stuck in Zelda and mindlessly went around blowing everything up in the hopes of unlocking progress.
At what point, exactly, did you get stuck?
I'm done with you.
nothing about that looks suspicious to you? two identical stones at the far north end of the map guarded by lynels is just a normal day? i think there's an old man in one of the later dungeons that tells you about it too
the real bomb every wall part is in second quest
Here's your hint bro
I guess kids were just a lot smarter in the 80s.
You're just pretending you figured it out this way
Believe that if that makes you feel better.
Yes, but it was more than trial and error though. I found the death mountain entrance way before I could even get in because it was such a suspicious location.
>and then I got the world record because it was so much fun
Did you also beat Alex Kidd in Miracle World on your first attempt?
No games held your hand, we had to figure everything out by trial and error.
Another important difference is that we just played Zelda because the gameplay was fun. We didn't have a million other games and social media algorithms pulling our attention. So we'd just fire up Zelda and run around killing shit because it was fun and exploring the world because it was fun. It was a leisure activity. We weren't grinding through a backlog of games just to impress people online.
>While not my favourites I do like Limp Bizkit and Offspring.
You're shallow in games and music. Here's something to guide you student
Trash tier opinion
better than the moron that compared Super Metroid to Earthworm Jim.
Earthworm Jim is the superior sci fi platformer. Stay forever mad tendie.
Sonic and Mario have far superior platforming. Contra and Metal Slug mog Metroids pea shooter shooting and like I just said its not even a good game for exploring as you're forced to ustop in place and use an xray scanner on every single area in the game.
Super Metroid isn't a platformer, and it's not a shooter. You have severe autism if you think so. The only game series it can be compared to is Zelda, it's the same as Zelda but side scrolling instead of top down.
And no, garbage like Centy and Oasis aren't good games. I say this as someone who's a far bigger Sonic fan than you, and only a fan of true Sonic, 2D Sonic.
Super Metroid is a platformer and a shooter just its very bad at both those things.
>A far bigger fan than you
Did you ever go to Sega World and meet Sonic in person? Check mate non fan.
All of them?
You don't play fighting games poser. Stick to pretending to like Tekken 3 and other such trash.
If your favorite game is Contra or Metal Slug, you're low IQ. Those are the most basic braindead gaming experiences of all time. May as well play Pong.
why are zoomers here? they weren't even alive in the 90s
I don't fricking know but this board has gone downhill because of them, it's a fricking dumpster now. I blame Y2K memestalgia, they flocked here because of it, it might even just be one persistent autist gay pulling this shit
Nah, I was learning to emulate when I was a child because I didn't have any new consoles. Long before the Y2K nostalgia shit. But I'm just here for the webms, game suggestions, and to laugh at shit flinging.
We have better reflex's and get paid for winning at competitive and balanced games.
>i'm gay
We know
Cause newer games suck ass. I rather just play games that let you be lost and kick my ass than easy. Not only that I enjoy 90s culture more. Compare Doom 2016 with Doom for example: 2016 is nu-metal to Doom's thrash metal, 2016 had cutscenes that took too long while Doom just had text wall that ironically enough, I read and got me pumped because of how infrequent they are, 2016 had very generic looking roster while Doom's enemies and sounds are so iconic everyone recognizes them.
I can go on but my point is that nu-games suck ass, and I don't see why I should follow them.
Because retro games are about the only thing I can play on my shitty laptop.
Based, that's how I got into them when I was a kid. I became Ganker personified, because I was the homosexual to say Call of Duty sucks and Streets of Rage was better game.
>super metroid came out in 1994
>people think super metroid is the best game of its generation
>1994 alone saw doom 2, heretic, and x-com, thats not counting other games that came out during the same era
kek
In zoomer terms Doom in 95' was like Minecraft or Super Mario Maker. Everyone was making their own WADs for better or worse.
I played alot of Earthseige. I would say it is better than Super Metroid. The game had more dimension.
what purpose does the somersault serve? besides making precise platforming more annoying to pull off
If you charge your shot before somersaulting, the jump will kill the first enemy you hit. Somersaults also activate screw attack.
FF6 is better.