The one thing that Elden Ring got wrong that souls got right is the magic system.
Now in DaS, it wasn't perfect. Pyromancey was basically free magic which Miyazaki pretended was balanced by the difficulty of upgraded the Pyromancer's flame and the fact that fire damage was weak by endgame. It was an decent idea, slow clunky fire balls that frick up undead but scoffed at by dragons and knights alike.
Intellect obviously designed around magic damage which bested knight but was also stopped by dragons and having a wide range of different attack options
Then of course you had Lightning, a "rare" damage reserved for the mostly offense lacking Faith, which destroyed everything BUT the gods.
Later souls games improved the formula by ridding Pyromancey of its "free magic" class and making it Magi-quality which should have been the case from the beginning. But then oddly, they also introduced Dark which was also magi quality. Fire scaled differently in DaS II at least, fire scaled with int + Fai with diminishing returns, dark scaled with whichever stat was lowest, so a mage or cleric could use it without being quality. Then in 3 they changed the rules for dark spells for whatever reason.
Dark completed the damage cycle, by being resisted by weak common enemies such as undead but being effective against targets that resisted divine lightning.
The point is, each spec had a dedicated damage type. Elden Ring sort of forgot that, making int 90% magic damage and Fai have every damage type.
Int/fai of course had fire for sorcery and more holy options than pure fai spell wise but for the most part Fai had all the elemental damages.
To make it worse, Holy damage did not take the role of Dark like in other games. It's weak against all major bosses and strong only to specific non-endgame bosses. It's basically a worse version of magic damage despite being readily available in weapon arts for fai.
>not cucking filthy int builds with chadly great magic barrier >not covering your giant swords and clubs with holy light to smite the unworthy >not using the wrath of the gods themselves to repel those who seek to use sheer numbers to overwhelm your path to justice
Strength/faith is the patricians choice and always will be
In DS1 it's for sure pyromancy, miracles and sorceries were really boring in that game. For later games I'd go with sorceries though, with 2 having the sword and shield that let you cast them and 3 adding the sword spells int got a lot more enjoyable to play, and in ER I think they all get really cool shit but I still lean sorcery a bit because I like the space shit.
>heals 360hp (390hp on righthand) for 13fp with a 14faith requirement
got a cleric's sacred chime drop early game, makes it so i can save my estus flasks for the bosses
depends on the game >DS1
Pyromancy >DS2
Faith >DS3
Also Faith >Elden Ring
Magic, honestly. Sure you dont get the based Crucible Knight stuff but magic is cool in Elden Ring
I jumped into Cinders mod before trying spellcasting in DS3
way more options tho it does change every enemy's stats etc so you edit things in relation to vanilla experience
basically DS1+2+BB weapons & armor cramped into DS3
Are you saying the Cinders mod improves Sorcery in DS3?
In my opinion, Dark Souls 3 is, by far, the WORST souls game to do a pure INT build. I mean it's perfectly fine and doable but magic is highly undertuned in ds3 for multiple reasons. Elden Ring is literally an improvement in that regard in literally every way.
I didnt try in vanilla DS3 (unmodded) but in Cinders you get catalysts that serve as competent makeshift weapons & innate FP regen that's as fast as stamina regen & FP flasks were removed in 2.15 afaik
+all armor has innate effects like +2 to a stat for each piece worn or damage reductions etc
+ there are a couple of new bosses that may or may not be worth it, IMO the Trio of Explorers that replace havel are the best fight in Archdragon Peak
Well zippety zamn Anon, I think you just convinced me to give this ds3 Cinders mod a try after all. I've known of it for awhile but just haven't been in the mood to replay ds3 since I played the frick out of it already.
Have you ever heard of the Daughters of Ash mod for Dark Souls 1? it's a bit annoying to install but I recommend it. It's a pretty solid retelling of Dark Souls 1 that, rightfully, saves the romhack-tier shit for the late-game optional content. Because I enjoyed that mod, I'm willing to give ds3's Cinders mod a chance.
I'm only into DS3 & BB
if you gonna try Cinders be forewarned of Deacons, Yhorm, & Ludex since they are really shit to fight against
the mod devs had in mind that you upgrade your rings from an npc at the shrine (upto +5) & farm for them
What's build would recommend for maximum comfiness?
3 months ago
Anonymous
the class that starts with the lightning infused Lance is really good & has high damage potential w/ le praise the sun covenant (5%-15% lightning damage boost) since covenant emblems now give innate effects & are upgrade by deepening loyalty by collecting their respective tokens from killing enemies, you can even marry, flirt with & divorce NPCs that grant you access to these covenants
even warden twinblades (sellsword's were removed I think & superseded) are applicable
there's just alot of weapons, armor, & spells & it's not mapped out yet since probably it has no speedrunning or a normal community
3 months ago
Anonymous
>you can even marry, flirt with & divorce NPCs that grant you access to these covenants
I literally dont give a frick about any of that (unless its Rosaria) but is there an objective reason to engage with that at all?
I am literally unable to play DS games after Elden Ring
ER combat is just that much superior. This makes me sad, because I've always loved dark souls 1 and 3
I have like triple the amount total hours in DS1-3 compared to ER btw.
this spell + vow of silence + great magic barrier completely shuts down any mage build. casting any of these and seeing mage invaders just give up & quit your world was peak fun.
Definitely pyromancy in dark souls 1.
Hits like a truck, and because pyromancy is improved through the glove and not through your levels except for spell slots you could basically run two builds at the same time for free allowing musclehead builds to hurl fireballs just as effectively as pure casters.
Pyromancy itself wasn't broken, but the system that allowed you to be two builds at the same time sure as hell was.
>ds1
miracles, OP as hell, can do anything with them. >ds2
all magic types are good in 2, but I have a soft spot for pyromancies. >ds3
here its the opposite they all kinda suck. Will take miracles but only for the heals and buffs >ER
sorceries
>ds3 >pyromancies suck
Early game you're only garbage against fire enemies. And that changes the moment you unlock dark pyromancies. Forbidden sun has frickall cast time and combust/black flame are super fast
in all fairness I didn't try pyro in ds3 because I was angry they added stats requirements for so many spells, which went against the logic of pyro established in previous titles, it being a magic type for non-mage characters. They also completely raped warmth (on top of making it a nightmare to acquire) which was my fav spell in ds2.
I understand that. It was definitely weird how they changed it, but on the other hand, the scaling is pretty solid and you get to pick up utility spells from faith/int along the way.
RAW gems are ridiculously strong, so any simple weapon will deal respectable damage to deal with simple enemies, so you can obliterate anything even vaguely annoying with fire. Only the final DLC can get a little annoying because everything has so much health and fire resist.
these homies casting unga bunga
BLACK FLAME
BLACK FLAME
Become unstoppable
wot ring you got b***h?
Only trannies use magic
Hurling bolts of lightning at people is too cool to not pick miracles, but I like using both pyromancies and miracles. And the Dark Hand.
Fire purifies
Fire for the SOUL
ARE YOU READY FOR A MIRACLE?
Big blunt weapon.
The one thing that Elden Ring got wrong that souls got right is the magic system.
Now in DaS, it wasn't perfect. Pyromancey was basically free magic which Miyazaki pretended was balanced by the difficulty of upgraded the Pyromancer's flame and the fact that fire damage was weak by endgame. It was an decent idea, slow clunky fire balls that frick up undead but scoffed at by dragons and knights alike.
Intellect obviously designed around magic damage which bested knight but was also stopped by dragons and having a wide range of different attack options
Then of course you had Lightning, a "rare" damage reserved for the mostly offense lacking Faith, which destroyed everything BUT the gods.
Later souls games improved the formula by ridding Pyromancey of its "free magic" class and making it Magi-quality which should have been the case from the beginning. But then oddly, they also introduced Dark which was also magi quality. Fire scaled differently in DaS II at least, fire scaled with int + Fai with diminishing returns, dark scaled with whichever stat was lowest, so a mage or cleric could use it without being quality. Then in 3 they changed the rules for dark spells for whatever reason.
Dark completed the damage cycle, by being resisted by weak common enemies such as undead but being effective against targets that resisted divine lightning.
The point is, each spec had a dedicated damage type. Elden Ring sort of forgot that, making int 90% magic damage and Fai have every damage type.
Int/fai of course had fire for sorcery and more holy options than pure fai spell wise but for the most part Fai had all the elemental damages.
To make it worse, Holy damage did not take the role of Dark like in other games. It's weak against all major bosses and strong only to specific non-endgame bosses. It's basically a worse version of magic damage despite being readily available in weapon arts for fai.
Were the skeleton spells that you couldn't make the best use of until NG+ just magic damage in ER?
Another enormous wall of text for another moronic take
When will it end
He is right needing faith to throw fire? KEK
Well in Demons the fire spell was just sorcery so...
Yeah I see what you mean, most of the time ER is just a matter of picking your favourite color or rock
i usually go with faith but at this point i think ill completely switch to sorcery since its my least used magic class in these games..
I'd rather play a game that is actually fun.
magic and miracles is for b***hes
>not cucking filthy int builds with chadly great magic barrier
>not covering your giant swords and clubs with holy light to smite the unworthy
>not using the wrath of the gods themselves to repel those who seek to use sheer numbers to overwhelm your path to justice
Strength/faith is the patricians choice and always will be
Give me the right and 99 faith
>B-BUT SIR, THE SOFTCAP IS 50
Did I stutter?
In DS1 it's for sure pyromancy, miracles and sorceries were really boring in that game. For later games I'd go with sorceries though, with 2 having the sword and shield that let you cast them and 3 adding the sword spells int got a lot more enjoyable to play, and in ER I think they all get really cool shit but I still lean sorcery a bit because I like the space shit.
I like pyromancy most
a spear is all i need
Spear, Winged Spear, Paritzan, none of the above?
I like Spear -> Dragonslayer Spear.
partizan, silver knight spear
ds1? miracles
luv me some darkmoon blade
>heals 360hp (390hp on righthand) for 13fp with a 14faith requirement
got a cleric's sacred chime drop early game, makes it so i can save my estus flasks for the bosses
Hollow soldier shield +15 prenerf
depends on the game
>DS1
Pyromancy
>DS2
Faith
>DS3
Also Faith
>Elden Ring
Magic, honestly. Sure you dont get the based Crucible Knight stuff but magic is cool in Elden Ring
Wasn't faith in DS2 nerfed to the ground?
Only specific lightning spells and that doesnt even matter, lighting casts were always meme shit. Faith is still incredible in DS2
pyromancy is literally free in dark souls 1 and is objectively the best out of the three, so melee + pyromancy
All three of them of course.
I wont even be looking at my vig
I jumped into Cinders mod before trying spellcasting in DS3
way more options tho it does change every enemy's stats etc so you edit things in relation to vanilla experience
basically DS1+2+BB weapons & armor cramped into DS3
Are you saying the Cinders mod improves Sorcery in DS3?
In my opinion, Dark Souls 3 is, by far, the WORST souls game to do a pure INT build. I mean it's perfectly fine and doable but magic is highly undertuned in ds3 for multiple reasons. Elden Ring is literally an improvement in that regard in literally every way.
I didnt try in vanilla DS3 (unmodded) but in Cinders you get catalysts that serve as competent makeshift weapons & innate FP regen that's as fast as stamina regen & FP flasks were removed in 2.15 afaik
+all armor has innate effects like +2 to a stat for each piece worn or damage reductions etc
+ there are a couple of new bosses that may or may not be worth it, IMO the Trio of Explorers that replace havel are the best fight in Archdragon Peak
Well zippety zamn Anon, I think you just convinced me to give this ds3 Cinders mod a try after all. I've known of it for awhile but just haven't been in the mood to replay ds3 since I played the frick out of it already.
Have you ever heard of the Daughters of Ash mod for Dark Souls 1? it's a bit annoying to install but I recommend it. It's a pretty solid retelling of Dark Souls 1 that, rightfully, saves the romhack-tier shit for the late-game optional content. Because I enjoyed that mod, I'm willing to give ds3's Cinders mod a chance.
I'm only into DS3 & BB
if you gonna try Cinders be forewarned of Deacons, Yhorm, & Ludex since they are really shit to fight against
the mod devs had in mind that you upgrade your rings from an npc at the shrine (upto +5) & farm for them
What's build would recommend for maximum comfiness?
the class that starts with the lightning infused Lance is really good & has high damage potential w/ le praise the sun covenant (5%-15% lightning damage boost) since covenant emblems now give innate effects & are upgrade by deepening loyalty by collecting their respective tokens from killing enemies, you can even marry, flirt with & divorce NPCs that grant you access to these covenants
even warden twinblades (sellsword's were removed I think & superseded) are applicable
there's just alot of weapons, armor, & spells & it's not mapped out yet since probably it has no speedrunning or a normal community
>you can even marry, flirt with & divorce NPCs that grant you access to these covenants
I literally dont give a frick about any of that (unless its Rosaria) but is there an objective reason to engage with that at all?
I think they can give you gifts but unsure
I am literally unable to play DS games after Elden Ring
ER combat is just that much superior. This makes me sad, because I've always loved dark souls 1 and 3
I have like triple the amount total hours in DS1-3 compared to ER btw.
FTH, it always ends up broken and needs Daddy From to step in to stop bullying all the INT nerds :~~*
this spell + vow of silence + great magic barrier completely shuts down any mage build. casting any of these and seeing mage invaders just give up & quit your world was peak fun.
in ds1, pyromancy glove, 'cause laurentius is best bro and greater combustion is best lube
Since a regular human can't level up, piromancy
dark magic masterrace
Magic is for pussies.
Miracles, DaS3 was eating well when the Lothric War Banner was introduced. It just mixed too well when shitting out lightning everywhere
>DeS
Magic
>DaS
Sorcery+Pyro
>DaS2
pure int/faith hexer master race.
Definitely pyromancy in dark souls 1.
Hits like a truck, and because pyromancy is improved through the glove and not through your levels except for spell slots you could basically run two builds at the same time for free allowing musclehead builds to hurl fireballs just as effectively as pure casters.
Pyromancy itself wasn't broken, but the system that allowed you to be two builds at the same time sure as hell was.
>ds1
miracles, OP as hell, can do anything with them.
>ds2
all magic types are good in 2, but I have a soft spot for pyromancies.
>ds3
here its the opposite they all kinda suck. Will take miracles but only for the heals and buffs
>ER
sorceries
>ds3
>pyromancies suck
Early game you're only garbage against fire enemies. And that changes the moment you unlock dark pyromancies. Forbidden sun has frickall cast time and combust/black flame are super fast
in all fairness I didn't try pyro in ds3 because I was angry they added stats requirements for so many spells, which went against the logic of pyro established in previous titles, it being a magic type for non-mage characters. They also completely raped warmth (on top of making it a nightmare to acquire) which was my fav spell in ds2.
I understand that. It was definitely weird how they changed it, but on the other hand, the scaling is pretty solid and you get to pick up utility spells from faith/int along the way.
RAW gems are ridiculously strong, so any simple weapon will deal respectable damage to deal with simple enemies, so you can obliterate anything even vaguely annoying with fire. Only the final DLC can get a little annoying because everything has so much health and fire resist.
>right 1: Talisman
>right 2: Pyromancer Flame
>left 1: Catalyst
>left 2: Dark Hand
>Full havel plate
>Cast Iron flesh
All three of them. I also put points into strength and dexterity.