Kill the Elden Beast.

Frenzy is obvious Chaos you dirty Lucifer-fricker.

>hurrr it's called chaos so it is
have sex

>melt all creation
>he thinks the golden order created anything when the erdtree is literally a parasite that overthrew the crucible
check out this homosexual he still thinks gwynevere is not an illusion lmoa

>I watch troonytubers therefore everyone that not my fault you cant fricking read or comprehend a basic ass story without homosexuals telling you

the one great is the tree you see except not golden, the elden beast is nothing but a parasite that feats on dead people, greater troony and crucible are memes of the dragons and men respectfully, which is why the crucible knights use those moronic dragon tail magics

>Elden Beast generated life into the world.
t.two fingers

life existed long before that homosexual invaded our planet, it just took over and imposed its "order" meme on everyone using a hot goddess and the strongest tarnished ever to conquer everyone and force their troony religion

that's not what I said, holy cope

it seems you have not beaten the game, come back later

it seems you have not beaten the game, come back later

>The Greater Will created the Elden Ring
>the Elden Ring was in Farum Azula
>Placidusax was Elden Lord
>Ancient Dragons are heavily associated and literally made up of Gold, the same gold that is derived from the Erdtree
>somehow they have zero connection
lol

>all this headcanon and more can be yours if you become a chaos Black person lorelet!

samegay

>it didn't generate life it just made it happen lol
you didn't beat the game

you have not achieved victory

there is a phallacy in your acquisition of success

you will never be a woman

I'm the first post you quoted and I'm not the person you're talking about.
I don't even think I said anything factually wrong in that post.
In the beginning there was only the One Great, then the Greater Will sent his star in the Lands Between and that stimulated the creation of multiple lifeforms, some of them chaotic in nature.
Shabriri, Hyetta and the Three Fingers want the world to go back to its original primordial state.

Oh, and by that I mean a return to the unstimulated One Great.

Lmao no, they want to destroy everything. The 'One Great' horseshit is headcanon. Only Hyetta references it.
>"The words of the Three Fingers. As your maiden, allow me to divine them. All that there is came from the One Great. Then came fractures, and births, and souls. But the Greater Will made a mistake. Torment, despair, affliction... every sin, every curse. Every one, born of the mistake. And so, what was borrowed must be returned. Melt it all away, with the yellow chaos flame. Until all is One again."
>b-bro what do you meaaaaaaan, why would the Three Fingers (who have literally every reason in the world to lie and do in fact lie to you on several occasions to coerce you to destroy everything) ever lie to you about anything?
>"Those who gave me grapes howled without words. Saying they wished they were never born. Become their lord. Take their torment, despair. Their affliction. Every sin, every curse. And melt it all away. As the Lord of Chaos. No more fractures...no more birth"
Hmmmmm, doesn't really sound like they plan on rebirthing anything at all! Not even this 'One Great' you keep rambling about!
>"Seek audience with the Three Fingers and the flame of frenzy. If you inherit the flame of frenzy, your flesh will serve as kindling and the girl can be spared ...setting you on the righteous path of lordship."
Hmmmm, rather convenient that Shabriri lies to you about the reason to inherit the Flame of Frenzy. Why wouldn't he just be honest about it?
>"You are about to sacrifice something precious. The life of a fair maiden, that you would toss into the fiery forge. Only so that you may be Lord. What a horrible thing to ponder. Your ascendency requires her sacrifice, whether she wishes it or not. But how would the Lord, crowned so, be looked upon?"
Wow, why is Shabriri so concerned about one girl's life when it's pretty obvious that the Frenzied Flame ending kills LITERALLY everyone? Oh! Maybe it's because he's lying! Shocking!

>Hmmmmm, doesn't really sound like they plan on rebirthing anything at all! Not even this 'One Great' you keep rambling about!
the one great isnt a deity, its the name of the singular being that used to exist in the world of elden ring before it fractured into every living creature, god and mortal. melting the entire world into living flaming primordial soup is restoring the one great by definition.

What exactly contradicts what's being said here? And like I said we know the Three Fingers don't lie to you because what they want to happen is exactly what happens when you do the FF ending: all life is incinerated and returned to a primordial nothingness. Are you coping about how the GW is a space parasite or whatever? Because why would the Three Fingers give credence towards it then, it'd be like Satan telling a non-believer that God is actually totally legit and that He created your existence. You're whining anout misinterpretations but not even trying to argue what's being misintrepreted.

the crucible is an aspect of the greater will's power just like the erdtree is. nothing existed before the greater will, its an Abrahamic creation deity. "outer gods" are all subservient and not at all comparable. why do you argue like a little b***h?

How does the Crucible contradict Hyetta? Like when the GW sent the Elden Beast it arrived on a Golden Star, seems pretty plausible that the star would grow into the Crucible, especially with how it's described as a red gold color i.e. the Elden Ring before destined death is removed

>t. dumb Black person that headcanons the Crucible into being the 'One Great' with absolutely no evidence

>he responds with yet more fanfiction when the Crucible is explicitly the source of ALL life
Lol. Lmao. Chaos Black folk, amirite?

>i-it's not! my fanfiction is right!

> they want to destroy everything
Huh? Did I said they don't want to?
They want to destroy everything, as clearly seen in their ending, and melt everything together.
Maybe it's not exactly going to the origin of the world but that wasn't my point.
The beginning of this specific discussion was about whether the Frenzy ending could be considered chaotic or not and I added to that conversation the fact that in the past the Crucible itself, stimulated by the Greater Will, spawned ''chaotic'' life.
All the above stupid shit to say that ''chaos'' isn't easy to categorize in this game.

>he spews more headcanon fanfiction nonsense with nothing to back it up once more
Chaos gays are just too predictable lmao. Wait! You'll mention one line from Hyetta next and extrapolate everything from that with absolutely no basis!

it was actually quite a mellow, well thought thread before you began shitting it up. Do you read the words you write before you spew them out? why willfully choose to lessen the experiences of the posters ITT with your schizo demeanor and baseless understanding of the story? why do you argue like a little b***h?

>it was mellow before we got called out on our sperg fanfiction. Why are you such a meanie? 🙁

>the 2 people blatantly samegayging with the same schizo ramblings and fanfiction talking points are LITERALLY everyone
Quiet, chaos sperg.

>you're stupid because you won't debate my made-up headcanon and fanfiction ad nauseum and just make fun of me instead 🙁
Yawn. Cry more chaos Black person.

Wrong, you dumb Black person. The Black Moon explicitly is tied to Nokron. The Dark Moon is not. The Black Moon is also missing. The Dark Moon is not.
God you fanfiction writing homosexuals are so desperate for attention. It's so sad.

>totally not samegay here, why do you keep BTFOing my moronic fanfiction in every thread? why don't you let me spew my moronic mouth diarrhea without consequence?

>im just here to spew more moronic fanfiction without any actual evidence. why do you keep treating me like a moron?

Nokron is also the shorthand term for the entire civilization of the Eternal City, and the Eternal City was buried underground precisely because of Nokron's Fingerslayer Blade being made and used. The black moon isn't "missing", the Nox were literally cut off from it because they can't see the real sky anymore.

The Dark Moon commands the stars, Ranni even needs Radahn dead to make the stars move again and give her a "fate" to string along her plan. The Nox even used the same Starlight Shards potions that Seluvis does to make "dolls" as slaves. We find Nox "doll" summons in Nokron, showing the practice and the slavery by the stars still existed.

Ranni bows to her Dark Moon and literally summons it as she declares her Age of Stars, the same age the Nox are looking forward to with the exact same name, and said moon controls the stars.

Moon of Nokstella notes that the Dark Moon guided the stars, the same stars the Nox worshiped for their anticipated Age of Stars and Lord of Night (see all three Nox set descriptions), and the celestial Dew notes that the stars guide "fate", so the Dark Moon controlled them like they control people. A Nox Swordstress is also depicted as a statue in the Church of Vows, showing that there was indeed a faith and that the Dark Moon is an outer god, in addition to the Moonlight Altar. The Nightmaiden & Swordstress Puppets reveal that the Nox are a "cold-blooded race", tying in the night to the cold and thereby a link to Ranni's snow witch mentor, who taught her to fear the Dark Moon (ex: Glintstone Icecrag). Furthermore, Ranni's wedding ring tied to her being an empyrean is called the Dark Moon Ring, and we see a similar ring used for ritual purposes with Mohg and Miquella. Ranni has a ring tied to her empyrean status and linked to the Dark Moon, and Mohg likewise has/fashioned a ring for the empyrean Miquella and the Formless Mother outer god. Dark sorceries are also tied to the Eternal City, as noted in Eternal Darkness' description, and Sellia, which mainly excavates and researches the Eternal City, developed Night Sorceries.

That's my theory as well, given he's the most beloved of Godrick's lineage. It's hard to say how they died though, probably during the shattering given no demi-god could die before Godwyn died and also the fact that for whatever reason their souls are gone and this is a huge deal.

it's still a good weapon.

>The Elden Star? That happened at the beginning of time.
Not quite but a very VERY long time ago. Hence, 'Farum Azula has always been crumbling.'

You're assuming that the elden star was the first time that the greater will intervened in the lands between. It wasn't. After all, the crucible predates the erd tree, and that too was of the Greater Will. Was that the first time? Who knows, but I doubt it.

The elden ring may have been destroyed or lost and needed a replacement. I don't particularly agree with the idea that the erd tree is just a reshaped crucible for a few reasons:
1. While they share a common spiritual theme (the recycling of life), they do so in completely contrary ways, the crucible mixes life together into new forms as if various ingredients poured into a mold, while the erd tree collects life into itself and then blooms new life from the collected bodies and gold.
2. The erd tree is fundamentally vulnerable to fire, while the crucible, at least presumably, would be powered by fire
3. The crucible knights still have their powers and creatures touched by the crucible like misbegotten and omens were still being born well after the erd tree existed, implying that the crucible itself still exists to some extent.

A crucible is a bowl or a cup that you heat up in order to melt stuff inside of it.

>That happened at the beginning of time.
Isn't that the point? Farum Azula is said to be eternally crumbling and it's the one place in the game that exists outside of time in any sense.

>Radagon was a human descendant of giants that fused with Marika?
That's one possibility but what I was hinting at is the fact that there's a possibility (unless things go full Ringed City) that one of the upcoming expansions could clear things up about the Radagon is Marika conundrum.

The giants didn't curse shit. They got completely fricked and Radagon is just such a complete autist for the Golden Order he hates his own hair for not being Golden and perfect but red like those heathen giant homosexuals.

>There is no mention of Radagon existing before the invasion of Liurnia.
C'mon, what kind of argument is that?
And we know that Liurnia got assimilated way before Marika's empire conquered the whole land.
>Radagon's red hair was also suggested to be a curse from the giants.
No, that's false, it isn't suggested anywhere.

>The Elden Star? That happened at the beginning of time.
Not quite but a very VERY long time ago. Hence, 'Farum Azula has always been crumbling.'

Dude, the Elden Star is what disrupted the big one thingie and spawned multiple lifeforms on the planet.

>Giant's red braid.
''Every giant is red of hair, and Radagon was said to have despised his own red locks. Perhaps that was a curse of their kind.''
The above doesn't mean what you think it means.
>The crucible predated it
The crucible didn't predate anything, it was just one of the forms the tree took before the Erdtree established itself.

>It does mean what I think it means
It doesn't meant that, at all.
All the giants have red hair and Ragagon is exactly the same.
That's a curse of their kind, not a curse on Radagon as an individual.
>I'm not sure you know what a crucible is.
In the case of Elden Ring, it was one of the previous ''incarnations'' of the Erdtree.

Northerner

A face found among the hardy people of the unforgiving north. Some say they're descended from giants.

Dung Eater's weapon also suggests that he's also related to the giants.

What if say that Milos is the Dung Eater, not the person used as material for the sword?

okay, so there's a big tree in the center of he lands between. originally its 1 tree called the great tree. it dies, or is burned. after its death, several smaller trees sprout from its root system, creating a chaotic period of growth. thats the crucible. eventually a single stem grows the tallest and the remaining branches are destroyed or encompassed. thats Marika's erdtree.

you can call it whatever but there was an older tree which died, the crucible, and then the current erdtree.

A crucible is also a term for a manifestation of different events, perfectly describing the concept of an entity where all life was "one".

No tree ever did that. The erdtree re-birthing process is much more gentle than the crucible life mixing shit. That's why the nu-Golden Order morons think that crucible touched species are heretical even though they're just the products of a different kind of Greater Will birth recycling. Because they think that the tree itself is the god and not just an arbitrary tool that the actual god sent down to facilitate the cycle of life.

The "elden hierarchy" is the recycling of life I'm talking about, not nu-Golden Order autism regarding trying to tell their own god what kinds of life are allowed to be buried in the erdtree and reborn. The GW probably gave life to the world and then drops down one or more things to establish a cycle by which living things die and then are recycled to give birth to new living things that share a fundamental golden connection. That's all the GW actually cares about, the details don't matter. Melina understands this on at least some level which is why she only throws a fit if you go with frenzied flame, which is the only ending that lets you defy the greater will itself rather than just the golden order.

> I don't think it would for example, be opposed to a Servant of Rot obtaining the ring and ordering the world based on decay and rebirth.
True. But I think it would be mad if someone established a hierarchy in which the life cycle was completely disrupted. I'm not arguing that Gold Mask's ending is exactly what the GW wanted, its desires if anything were extremely broad. Goldmask just set things up in a way that both satisfied the GW and also was least disruptive to the lives of the people who currently exist, and locked it in such a way that it can't be easily altered.

>not to mention no reference at all to a literal crucible.
Well we know there's at least one, though in the present age it has a different purpose. Maybe that was it? It is very close to Farum Azula. Who can say.
>and we knee previous incarnations of the tree used by the GW to make life were also, (duh) trees,
Except we don't know this. There's no sign of a tree older than the erdtree. Like if there was a big ass stump in deeproot depths, sure, but there isn't.
>why the hell would would you assume the crucible is a never yet seen metal bowl?
Because that's what the word crucible means?

The big ass bowl where the flame of ruin currently resides

on the mountaintops? you assume thats the crucible because its literally a crucible and that's the only reason? if it held any significance at all to Godfrey's age then why doesnt anyone actually mention it at the time? why is all the symbology of crucible era branching trees? youre taking the word far too literally and discarding literally all the evidence presented

Yeah man when has from ever used a literal big ass bowl as symbolism for he fiery origin of life. I'm not even saying that it must be true, but it's worth considering.
>if it held any significance at all to Godfrey's age then why doesnt anyone actually mention it at the time?
Because it didn't hold significance during Godfrey's time. By the time he married Marika, the Erdtree was the origin and center of life. By Godfrey's time, if that bowl was once the crucible of life, it certainly is no longer, now supplanted by the flame of ruin.
>why is all the symbology of crucible era branching trees?
What symbology?

The crucible knights predate Godfrey's rule. They joined with him because during his era the golden order was more tolerant of things that were "gold" regardless of whether they jived with the erdtree. That's also how the dragons were made allies, thanks to their golden flesh. After Godfrey's exile the golden order became much less tolerant, exiling the crucible knights, persecuting and slaughtering abhumans, and only making peace with other belief systems as a pretext for subversion when force failed to find purchase.

if THE crucible, the epicenter of worship during Gddfrey's stint as elden lord, was somehow taken over and subsumed by the fell god, subsequently turning into the physical manifestation of heresy against Marika's rule, don't you think someone would have fricking mentioned that?

>There wasn't a previous tree
I, non-maliciously, highly recommend you watching the following videos because they will most likely change your mind on this specific subject.

>I'm not watching purely on the moronation of the first title alone.
Then you're an imbecile, nothing more and nothing less.
I'm not even gonna bother reading the rest of your post.

yeah i never understood why people think that the whip item means that they cursed radagon when that's the most obtuse way you could possibly interpret that sentence. it's far more likely seeming that radagon has giant ancestry.

him being cursed or born of giant blood doesnt even exclude either side of the radagon argument. if he was a separate person and fused later, he could have literally been born to a giant parent, or cursed. and if he was created in marika during the war, he could have been styled after / cursed by the giants at "birth" which could be interpreted as either a curse or a brithright

People are moronic and/or ESL's.

Because we know the tightly held secret that Radagon is Marika. The item description is misleading on purpose.

>O Radagon, leal hound of the Golden Order. Thou'rt yet to become me.
>yet

The Brick Hammer has a description that is probably a reference to Radagon.
>Weapon made from an ordinary stone brick. Wielded by a laborer who lead a rebellion, and later become a champion himself.
>Even among other bludgeons of its size, this weapon is especially weighty. The strength of a giant is required to wield it.

Radagon knows smithing, which could make him a laborer.
He became known as a champion.
His red hair indicates he might be descended from the Giants as opposed to being a curse, which would also line up with the strength of giants being required to wield it.

No smith can mend a divorce. All he could do was fight to keep the dog.

Aaaand last one.

You were saying?

This one's missing a panel in between where Tarnished says "I hate that guy" and doll Ranni questions if he would still be saying the same if Patches was a cute woman.

Shut up, schizo. Millicent isn't going off of stories, she has innate knowledge of Malenia because she is some mystical rot-birthed spawn of hers and her knowledge grows and memories return to her as she goes about her journey. It's the same reason why she's inexorably drawn to Malenia in the first place, and it's why she knows that the traits she embodies once belonged to Malenia as well and must be returned to her. Malenia during her boss fight is still missing that sense of dignity because you don't return it to her until after the encounter. Your hate-boner is obviously just fueled by some strange fetish, for rot-pussy or shitposting I'm not sure.

You've clearly run out of any actual game-sourced arguments to make so I'll just call you a homosexual some more.

Well the story doesn't fricking tell us why! She went all the way around the world, kicking everyone's asses for literally no explained reason. It's not like the battle was anywhere near the Haligtree or even the Shaded Castle. And given that she also attacks us for literally no reason, we're left to assume that she just loves kicking people's asses and is a salty loser. Some people have said she did it to help Miquella with his plan, that it may have been thwarted by Radahn's halting of the stars. That's not actually stated anywhere, but it is halfway logical. but if we do assume it to be true, it doesn't actually help her character. Marching your whole army to go murder your brother to facilitate a magic ritual isn't a good thing to do, especially when we're not given any evidence she even attempted diplomacy or some sort of trade.

We know she wasn't after great runes, since she declined to fight Godrick until he insulted her and then let him keep his great rune when he validated her ego.

I'm willing to accept the possibility that Radahn was some sort of threat to whatever Miquella had planned. I just don't find that reason enough to justify their decision to invade a country and try to murder him. Everything we know about him makes him seem relatively reasonable compared with Godfrey, the barely contained animal man, or Radagon, the duplicitous golem shithead. We're not even sure Radahn was holding back the stars on purpose, much less why he might have been doing it, and so I can't agree that it would be safe to assume diplpmacy was not an option to get whatever the frick it was Malenia and Miquella even wanted. And that's even assuming they did, and Malenia didn't just decide to kick Radahn's ass just to prove she had the strongest feet.

It's plausible but not well substabtiated. More importantly at least to me, I just don't understand why Radahn would be adverse to allowing Godwyn's revival. Radahn was a golden order fanboy, if anything he would have been completely on board with reviving the coolest guy. Especially if it got rid of those who live in death.

>Radahn used to host one of the colosseum's where slaves would fight each other to the death, a practice which even Godfrey outlawed.
The colosseums were in use during Godfrey's reign, they only stopped during Radagon's reign. Also, that section of Caelid may have been ruled by Godfrey/the Golden Order before Radahn was born, or he was just a young child. The Caelid colosseum also looks more like it was turned into a second fortress a la Redmane Castle to boot. Also, nothing suggests that the ritual at Castle Sol failed because of the stars being frozen, just that it failed in general. Presumably, the sun was too mighty for them to somehow overcome with their weird rituals, or if they were trying to reach some Helphen otherworld sun, they didn't succeed beyond stuff like the Eclipse shotel. Also, if these shards of starlight are the key to brainwashing someone, wouldn't freezing the ability to brainwash people be a good thing?

The potion doesn't work on Ranni, but that's because she might thwart the attempt to make her drink it, can't drink it because she's in a doll's body, or is already ensnared by the Dark Moon, hence her soul being blue like the "dolls" already. If Miquella and Malenia have a "fate" separated from them and discarded in the wilderness, then they no longer care for Radahn freezing the stars, and the stars losing any such influence would only help secure Miquella and Malenia's plans.

The Amber Starlight seems to have been removed though, as opposed to controlling Miquella or Malenia from afar. Since Ranni believes she had to kill her empyrean body to somehow be free of the Two Fingers, presumably any kind of control in Elden Ring is innately born alongside someone at their birth, not distant and applied later. The "fate" after Radahn is defeated is the stars actively sending a meteorite to try to make Ranni become their empyrean, not a natural course of the universe by any means. It's a term for one of the many invested parties of outer gods.