This is a fricking goldmine. VGC players are so fricking lazy.

It's a 1/32 chance to get a 0IV in atk, and if you want a trick room 0 spd that goes up to 1/1024 which is still better odds than most shiny hunts. Minus very very specific cases like Cresselia, 0Ivs in attack will be more than enough and a 1/32 chance is hella easy to get.

Is it annoying and a tedious process? Sure, but it's not a full 20 hour issue anymore. You could even do it on an emulator with speedup and then export your save or something and it'd look the exact same.

Then again, even if you let's say use a spread like 4/248/4/0/4/248 because it doesn't matter if 248 EVs or 252, 4 Def and SpDef at Lv.50 won't matter either.
So players will stick to traditional splits.

It's both

I don't care if it's legal or not, that's not what is being discussed.
I'm saying that's the purpose of it, and why people complaining about it are low IQ.
The only real argument that people who are against genning have is that it's against the rules. Which just makes them low IQ individuals who can't think for themselves.

Not at all, you just keep saying that to justify bad behavior
Simulators are OK, but you need to make that theory into an actual Pokémon the legal way, it's the reason why despite having access to simulators I never go for a soft reset on a special Pokémon since my stakataka grind, getting less than 14 defense and 0 speed with brave was maddening but I pulled it off with a 11 Def 0 speed one, it ain't flawless but I love it

You set up a goal that required ungodly amounts of effort then skipped over it, if another trainer pulled it off legit you have an insane advantage over him and that's just not fair for a competition, you just took fairness out of a competition by hacking in a Pokémon that's hard to get, if your brain was fried off on instant gratification you would understand why that's a punishable offense in a competition

It's just time and RNG. Which shouldn't be in consideration of the actual game of competitive pokemon which is about what team you are going to bring in response to what you believe the meta is like. It's basically like a card game. No one considers the part of pulling cards from packs as part of competitive yugioh or magic (aside from draft, but that's literally it's own format)

The rule doesn't make sense and is just a time waster.
If pokemon actually cracked down hard on genning and it became basically impossible, people would probably just start selling pokemon for money.
Would you then consider it unfair if someone just bought their team and skipped the grind entirely?

>People who don't break the rules are low IQ

I can't believe how stupid you are.

>I think people who blindly follow rules are low IQ.

Are you fatherless? Do you not know how the real world works? Their Tournament, their rules you dumb moron. Don't like it, Don't participate.

>TCPI IS LITERALLY HITLER

Twitter is right next door down the hall

>Like, frick, go play a trading card game tournament with crayon-drawn proxy cards

>No it would be like if people used proxies or straight-up counterfeits trying to pass them off as real.
No it wouldn't. See saying stuff like this is why I think you are low IQ. The purpose of genning is to bypass the grind of creating the team, much like how if you want to quickly get a deck ready for a tournament you would just buy a card. The difference between genning a team and training your own team is just a time commitment. You are bypassing a time restriction of pulling cards by just buying them, you could also print proxies, but either way you are bypassing the time restriction. There isn't anything related to the actual games being played by training or by pulling cards, it's just filler.

>Here's what you're not getting though: You are doing exactly that to all of the people who grind and don't gen.
So just pretend that everyone who is genning is just having a large group of people go and breed their pokemon for them?

>aaahh my argument
>myyy brain it hurts
>aiieieeee save me tpc

Yeah, that's a pretty awful take.

>The purpose of genning is to bypass the grind of creating the team, much like how if you want to quickly get a deck ready for a tournament you would just buy a card.

You seem to conveniently ignore the same point that other gen-shillers make when defending against the common point that "it's trivial to just train a Pokemon", in that some Pokemon / cards are intrinsically more difficult to get. If you want a fully-IV'd and trained Dondozo, that takes virtually no effort in-game, and would be roughly equivalent to popping by your local game store and buying a 25-cent card.

If you need that fabled 0 Spe Enamorus that absolutely everyone needs on their team in order to have a chance at competing in an otherwise-unfair VGC tournament, that's understandably more effort to play through an entirely different game, reach that level of progression, and repeatedly reset until you get the stat you need. That could be hours of real time play, which anyone with a job realizes equates to far more than your average 25-cent binder chaff, and might even have you hitting up websites or forums to secure a trade.

>The difference between genning a team and training your own team is just a time commitment.
You are bypassing a time restriction of pulling cards by just buying them, you could also print proxies, but either way you are bypassing the time restriction.

Even they're arguing that proxies are equivalent to buying actual cards and trying to use them in a card tournament. I guess thanks for pointing it out?

>There isn't anything related to the actual games being played by training or by pulling cards, it's just filler.

That'd be a solid argument if we were talking about casual play.

When the actual company that makes the game is paying people to compete in a tournament to play their game, they obviously would want to disincentivize anyone from participating that isn't even a consumer of their product.

>but also the obtaining of the Pokemon

Holy shit they’re unironically shilling for TPC. Just buy more Pokémon products!

There weren't 0 speed Enamorus in the top cut because it largely wasn't needed. If 0 was THE stat for Enamorus, every one of them would have had 0. The top 16 still hacked their Pokemon, they just were smart enough to not get caught.

Well yeah, but that's not what's being discussed.
It's people who can't think beyond "it's the rules" or why rules exist.

>These rules exist because players openly hacking Pokemon hurts the Pokemon trainer fantasy
I'm pretty sure the rule exists because it has ties to hardware/software hacking since it involves save editing

>These rules exist because players openly hacking Pokemon hurts the Pokemon trainer fantasy
I'm pretty sure the rule exists because it has ties to hardware/software hacking since it involves save editing

Not that anon, but I injected once a Shiny Zacian with Double Iron Bash in 2020 and got obviously DQ'd. If I were allowed to use that Zacian, I would have won VGC2020 for sure.
Even I, as a former cheater, know that rules are important regardless, if you don't follow them, you're no different from CWC crying over TCG tournaments for not including his custom Sonichu card.

>The only real argument that people who are against genning have is that it's against the rules. Which just makes them low IQ individuals who can't think for themselves.
It's funny how you tell others that they can't think for themselves when you can't even inject properly by yourself. Most cheaters like you buy injected mons from e-bay, getting banned from VGC and losing money servers you right, low IQ-kun.

>talks about low IQ
>Nothing more low IQ than believing that a rule is dumb, not following it and then crying when you get caught.
>I think Speed Limits are dumb - a literal time waster, but if I get caught going 10 over I'm not going cry to Twitter about it.
This is probably one of the worst analogies I have heard and I think that everyone who reads this will become dumber as a result.

For one, speed limits have an actual practical reason to exist, the defense of speed limits isn't "they exist", it's "they make it safer for other", there is a legitimate reason to why you can't go 90 miles per hour in a school zone.
Second, if everyone who ever existed thought all rules need to be followed only because of the fact that the rule exist and should never be argued against, nothing would ever change ever. People argue against rules because they disagree with the reason for their existence and the limits they impose. I think in the eyes of politicians, you would be referred to as "a useful idiot".

The defense of not genning pokemon is just "the rule exist", it doesn't give you any actual advantage that you could get through having other people just breed the pokemon for you. It's just the path of least resistance to participate in competitive. If these people weren't moronic and just genned legit mons, then they would never be caught and their pokemon would be the exact same as anyone who spent the time/money/etc to get legal pokemon. The issue is that if someone were to just get a large group of people to go get their pokemon for them, would that be any different if someone were to just gen the exact same pokemon?
No, there would be no difference. Therefore there would be no advantage for any player, and thus the game would be easier for more people to get into.

>you all admit that there is a time advantage
But there isn't a time advantage.
You can practice using simulators.
You can get others to go get the pokemon for you.

Where is the time advantage?

>You still have to wait for someone to do it. It still takes time for it to be done.
>Actually, scratch that - if you think they require the same amount of time then why did you gen instead?
It doesn't take the same amount of time.
Are you dumb? You realize multiple people doing things in parallel go faster right?
Actually don't explicitly answer the are you dumb question, you already technically answered it.

It's more convenient.
Do you think having access to 50+ fanboys/simps go gather your pokemon like Wolfey should be a requirement for playing competitive pokemon?

Why is it more convenient? Name all the ways that it makes it more convenient. If speed of creation is one of the ways then congrats on wasting my time with your shitty argument that I know for sure that you got from reddit.
>50+ fanboys/simps
Black person if you think that's required then you literally don't play the games.
If you think that's required that you have absolutely NO pokemon to offer other people so they don't give you any attention. Probably because they know where you get them from.

>What's the advantage that's being created from genning?
>It's clearly not time.
You're literally saying that it is moron.

>you can get the same result with 50+ people helping you out
Back to this again so I'll ask again
Then why don't you do that if you think it''ll be so helpfuil? Why do you gen?
Dance around it all you want. You're not getting past me.

>If someone can use 50+ people to get a team together as fast as someone just genning.
What is the advantage that's being created by genning?

Oh for frick sake, not the same anon but I'll answer the question for you.
You don't do it because it's way harder to organize, and that's exactly the fricking point.

I did answer the question.
You do have a reading problem.

Also you didn't answer the question.
What is the advantage that's being created by genning?

Answer it, come on. You can do it.

>you would otherwise have to spend playing the game and trading with people.
That's not what I said. You have reading problem.
You aren't "playing the game" if you just say Oh I need So and so with 0 IV. Then you have 50+ people go and find it for you.

So are you just salty someone has fans?

I'm not salty, I'm using it as a point that you aren't creating a time advantage for genning if you can get the same team in the same amount of time if you just have people who can do it for you. Having a group of people isn't "playing pokemon".

I literally have no problem with Wolfey having people to go do that for him. He's literally only doing that because genning is against the rules and he needs to play by those rules to continue playing competitive.

The problem is that should everyone be required to do this?

The issue is that the fixation on whether or not genning should be against the rules is that there creates a time advantage. But there clearly isn't.
No one has given me a reason to why it's against the rules besides "it's a time advantage", which again, it clearly isn't.

>You aren't "playing the game" if you just say Oh I need So and so with 0 IV. Then you have 50+ people go and find it for you.
Asking for trades isn't playing the game. Trading is. And to trade, you need to ask.
>once again being jealous of wolfey
Wolfey gens so idk where your insecurity lies.
>I'm using it as a point that you aren't creating a time advantage for genning if you can get the same team in the same amount of time if you just have people who can do it for you. Having a group of people isn't "playing pokemon".
1. Given that Pokemon is an RPG with social features, asking for trades doesn't have to be playing the game for it to matter. It's literally apart of the game because it's apart of legit Pokemon acquisition. Your point is moot.
2. Even if it wasn't 'playing the game' you would have to play the game to even get to ask for a trade.
So again, if it's not a time advantage like you said, then why not use your effort to build a following of 50+ people (lol) to make your team? I don't understand your logic of having two methods of acquisition and choosing the one that's against the rules. You have never been able to be honest with yourself.
Wolfey doesn't ask 50+ people for Pokemon bc he gens. Someone like NeilVGC probably does. And his discord is helpful to everyone who needs a mon - not just him.

Your mom is hard.

So are you just salty someone has fans?

>it's very time consuming to even create a team.
>What's the advantage that's being created from genning?
>It's clearly not time.

Does thinking cause you physical pain?

Also it isn't time consuming to create a team in 2023, it's more time than genning, but it isn't very time consuming.
And even if it was it wouldn't be a good excuse.

What about all the people who don't gen who spent time they could have been practicing for battles into training their pokemon.

You're treating them no better than how you feel when you're busy crying over Wolfey.
I'm not defending him either, but he's at least working within the set limitations even if that's shit.

I can't believe competitive pokemon is about how many connections you made in the real world instead of actually just playing pokemon. But now I see.

>That makes no sense in the spirit of keeping things fair? You are telling me someone deserves to have an advantage on paper just because they got more lucky than me?
Yes, unironically
This game runs on a fricking RNG generator, we have paralysis, flinch, accuracy, crits and chance to proc moves and you are complaining about getting a roulette of 3/6 and 1 in 32 for a 0 speed legendary, do your work if you want it, otherwise change your team and stop being a b***h

You want "optimal" work for it like the people that don't cheat do

Exactly, you can't control it, you are gambling your time for a competition

Managing your time Is an element you are ignoring

Let's say you have 2 weeks to prepare, no hacks allowed, old Pokémon can be used

You go for an encounter that can't be breed but can be reset in order to get 0 speed

Other player sees how much time that takes while and does the same a third sees it as ridiculous and decides to instead use another Pokémon along one of the USUM dittos that have 0 speed guaranteed for a breeding chain

Either you or the other player will get/not get the legend in time then rearrange your teams hell maybe the other player got it the first day out of dumb luck and you are still sitting in your chair 16 days in reseting the same encounter it's all luck, the player that breed got his shit fast and tested it, the player that got lucky tested his team and has a higher chance of playing an optimal meta team on nothing but luck, no one made a wrong meta call here but that's life and you need to get over it

Wanting to use a Pokémon and actually getting it is part of the competition, even if you are screwed by luck that's part of the competition, frick it I'd say that the player that didn't gamble was the smartest one as he managed his time better despite the lucky one getting a better Pokémon

Stop cutting corners, stop cheating.

This reminds me of the time I won my crush card virus in yugioh

It was a time were the rich got richer and entire teams of people with multiple copies went to events to stomp everyone and prevent them from getting the prize card I'm talking about teams if 9 guys all getting top cut because they lent themselves copies of CCV

I went in fully knowing the situation and build a water deck around it with counters and stun, won the whole thing and sold it for a premium that very day to someone that wasn't from that team of players just to spite them, that guy I sold it won the fricking regional and I'm still proud of him

Read the room and stop complaining of people having nice things, work for them instead, even in card games bullshit happen, Pokémon is a game where time management matters for tournaments learn to live with it

You do not play the games. A 0iv legend is 1/32 and can be done in a few hours tops

Right, it's a 1/2 into a 1/32.

Except its not, because a 1IV in speed will produce the same value as 0 at level 50 (and in some cases, like enamorus-I, you can go even higher). So it's a 1/2 into a 1/16. Which, you guessed it, makes 1/32. Now frick off and go back to not playing the games.

You didn't even read my post, did you?

Tbf, for enamorus-I, there's nothing notable (aside from mirror matchups which are rare cos no one can be fricked getting her) you need to underspeed until all the base 50 mons, so you can actually get away with a speed IV of up to iirc 7. From what I remember, if it shows the minimum grit level for speed, you have about a 1/3 of having a viable iv.